Re: [Pali] Re: Not Concentration
- Fair enough, Lennart. :-)
Lennart Lopin wrote thus at 09:55 11/10/2010:
>Guess everyone has his or her favorite samannya :-)
>For me 'composure' would not do it either, but such are words, its all about
>connotations... It is always more helpful if you know someone who can teach
>you directly, lead you to the experience, then you can use simply 'samadhi'
>and everything is perfectly fine :-)
>On Sun, Oct 10, 2010 at 4:51 AM, Kumara Bhikkhu <kumara.bhikkhu@...>wrote:
>> Thanks, and I agree, since reading Ricardo Sasaki's (a very old Buddhist
>> friend's) note on the Latin etymology of 'concentrate': "con-centrare = to
>> be near or with the center". If concentration is understood that way, I
>> think it's perfectly fine.
>> As I see it, the word just doesn't work well unqualified if the person
>> reading it has already been very conditioned to take it the other way, esp.
>> with the idea of having to penetrate into the ultimate truth of phenomena.
>> Retrospectively, most of the time then I did not do it forcefully. Even
>> when I did , it didn't occur me then that I was straining or using
>> will-power. I was aware of trying to induce a particular state of mind
>> though, so much so that my brain may have physically went 'off-centrare'.
>> You pointed out another translation of samaadhi that didn't work for me
>> too: absorption.
>> It probably works well with the Visuddhimagga's jhaana, but not with the
>> sutta's. In relation to this is what I got among the many responses I
>> received. This is from Ajahn Sucitto:
>> bhikkhu sucitto wrote thus at 13:38 01/10/2010:
>> >Yes I can echo those remarks. Amazing what damage a word can do! Sometimes
>> I use collectedness, or unification for samadhi. It seems to me that people
>> approach it as something to do, rather than keep the qualities of
>> mindfulness, kindness and letting go in good condition. But when we do that
>> (i.e. follow the Buddha's instructions) then there can be an arrival at
>> samadhi without tightening up the nervous system.
>> That part about "something to do" hit the nail on the head. (I instead hit
>> the head on the nail. Doh!) Instead of allowing the mind to settle, I
>> approached it as "something to do". I tried to induce a state of
>> concentration, of absorption, and ended up somewhat wonky.
>> Here's another on a similar note:
>> Ajahn Brahmavamso wrote thus at 08:36 09/10/2010:
>> > Sadhu! I agree with you. "Concentration" is a miserable translation for
>> the Pali word "Samadhi". It makes monasteries and retreat centres become
>> "Concentration Camps"!!! I generally use "Stillness" as my preferred
>> translation for "Samadhi", and "Samatha" is what you do to become still,
>> which is disengaging or letting go.
>> I bear in mind though that his preference for "stillness" is probably based
>> on the kind of jhaana prescribed by the Visuddhimagga. Nonetheless,
>> disengaging is what allows for samatha (settling) and arriving at samaadhi
>> IMO, a translation preferably does not need any qualification. Ideally, the
>> equivalent in the target language captures the meaning, usage, and (if
>> possible) even imagery of the original word. In the case of 'samaadhi',
>> 'composure', for me, is that word.
>> Thanks to all for this interesting discussion. Please feel free to
>> contribute further, if you think it hasn't been beaten to death yet.