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Re[2]: [Pali] about 'accanta'

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  • ������� ���������� ��������� (Dimitry A.
    Dear Tzungkuen, t Thanks for your help very much. Wihtout you and other friends in this group, t I don t know what to do with my question. Why don t you look
    Message 1 of 6 , Nov 6, 2002
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      Dear Tzungkuen,

      t> Thanks for your help very much. Wihtout you and other friends in this group,
      t> I don't know what to do with my question.

      Why don't you look up the commentary?

      t> I still have problem with this verse:
      t> ' Accanta.m mataputtaamhi, purisaa etadantikaa;

      >> As I understand here on the first glance:
      >> - accanta.m is translated as an archaic form of first person participle
      >> 'gotten past';

      t> But PED says that 'accanta' is a noun meaning 'the end', not a participle of
      t> verb.

      Indeed. Bhikkhu Bodhi's interpretation is unusual.

      That's how it is explained in Atthakatha

      Accanta.m mataputtaamhi'iti ettha anta.m atiita.m accanta.m,
      bhaavana'pu.msakam'eta.m. Ida.m vutta.m hoti- yathaa putta'mara.na.m
      anta.m atiita.m hoti, eva.m mata'puttaa aha.m, idaani mama puna
      putta'mara.na.m naama natthi.

      anta - having an end, ended;
      atiita - past, gone by;

      therefore 'accanta.m' here means 'complete, gone by, finished';

      Thus the first half according to commentary is:

      'Gone by is the death of sons'

      >> - purisaa etadantikaa = those men (were) final.
      t> purisaa and antikaa is respectively nominative and plural of purisa and
      t> antika
      t> but etad is singular. Can 'etad' qualify ' purisaa antikaa' ?
      t> And Is it proper to translate ' purisaa antikaa ' as 'Men are of end '?

      There is an explanation in the PED ('antika' article):

      'men are (to me) at the end for that, i.e. men do not exist any more
      for me, for the purpose of begetting sons.'

      The commentary continues:

      Purisaa etadantikaati purisaapi me etadantikaava. Yo me
      puttamara.nassa anto, purisaanampi me esevanto, abhabbaa aha.m idaani
      purisa.m gavesitunti.

      antikaa purisaa - final men;
      'etad' refers to the previous clause.

      Thus the second half is translated by Bhikkhu Bodhi according to
      commentary as:

      'with this, the search for men has ended'.

      With metta,
      Dimitry
    • tzungkuen
      Dear Dimitry Thanks for you explanation and your advice is very helpful to me. Now I know I can look up the commentary first when I encounter some question.
      Message 2 of 6 , Nov 6, 2002
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        Dear Dimitry

        Thanks for you explanation and your advice is very helpful to me. Now I know I can look up the commentary first when I encounter some question.

        With Metta

        Tzungkuen
        ----- Original Message -----
        From: äÍÉÔÒÉÊ áÌÅËÓÅÅ×ÉÞ é×ÁÈÎÅÎËÏ (Dimitry A. Ivakhnenko)
        To: tzungkuen
        Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 5:47 AM
        Subject: Re[2]: [Pali] about 'accanta'


        Dear Tzungkuen,

        t> Thanks for your help very much. Wihtout you and other friends in this group,
        t> I don't know what to do with my question.

        Why don't you look up the commentary?

        t> I still have problem with this verse:
        t> ' Accanta.m mataputtaamhi, purisaa etadantikaa;

        >> As I understand here on the first glance:
        >> - accanta.m is translated as an archaic form of first person participle
        >> 'gotten past';

        t> But PED says that 'accanta' is a noun meaning 'the end', not a participle of
        t> verb.

        Indeed. Bhikkhu Bodhi's interpretation is unusual.

        That's how it is explained in Atthakatha

        Accanta.m mataputtaamhi'iti ettha anta.m atiita.m accanta.m,
        bhaavana'pu.msakam'eta.m. Ida.m vutta.m hoti- yathaa putta'mara.na.m
        anta.m atiita.m hoti, eva.m mata'puttaa aha.m, idaani mama puna
        putta'mara.na.m naama natthi.

        anta - having an end, ended;
        atiita - past, gone by;

        therefore 'accanta.m' here means 'complete, gone by, finished';

        Thus the first half according to commentary is:

        'Gone by is the death of sons'

        >> - purisaa etadantikaa = those men (were) final.
        t> purisaa and antikaa is respectively nominative and plural of purisa and
        t> antika
        t> but etad is singular. Can 'etad' qualify ' purisaa antikaa' ?
        t> And Is it proper to translate ' purisaa antikaa ' as 'Men are of end '?

        There is an explanation in the PED ('antika' article):

        'men are (to me) at the end for that, i.e. men do not exist any more
        for me, for the purpose of begetting sons.'

        The commentary continues:

        Purisaa etadantikaati purisaapi me etadantikaava. Yo me
        puttamara.nassa anto, purisaanampi me esevanto, abhabbaa aha.m idaani
        purisa.m gavesitunti.

        antikaa purisaa - final men;
        'etad' refers to the previous clause.

        Thus the second half is translated by Bhikkhu Bodhi according to
        commentary as:

        'with this, the search for men has ended'.

        With metta,
        Dimitry



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