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Re: [Pali] Pali Book

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  • Jou Smith
    ... From: rahula_80 To: Sent: Friday, November 01, 2002 3:57 PM Subject: [Pali] Pali Book ... Hi ... A New
    Message 1 of 12 , Nov 4, 2002
      ----- Original Message -----
      From: "rahula_80" <rahula_80@...>
      To: <Pali@yahoogroups.com>
      Sent: Friday, November 01, 2002 3:57 PM
      Subject: [Pali] Pali Book


      > Hi,

      Hi

      > I am planning to buy a book to learn Pali next week. (I already have
      > Pali Primer and Elementary Course in Pali).
      >
      > Which would you recommend?
      >
      > 1. Introduction to Pali by AK Warder
      >
      > 2. A Pali Grammar by Wilhelm Geiger

      A New Course In Reading Paali - Entering the Word of hte Buddha
      by James W Gair and W S Krunatillake
      from Motilal Banarsidass Publishers, Delhi

      > Thanks, Rahula

      ----------------------------------------------------
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    • Ong Teng Kee
      the books are saddaniti edited by Smith-75 pounds.It is not a tran but an original pali grammar.you can only get burmese tran and partly in siam,eng and
      Message 2 of 12 , Nov 5, 2002
        the books are saddaniti edited by Smith-75 pounds.It is not a tran but an original pali grammar.you can only get burmese tran and partly in siam,eng and sinhala.Although the dhatu mala and padamala are online and in cdrom,saddamala is not.Also you can get index only from this book.The is another which is a better book compare to geiger-thomas orberlies -pali and prakrit .
        Some said this a the best book on pali grammar but I don't agree because mahanirutti by kaccayana,culanirutti and many other contemporary with ariyavamsa in myanmar also wrote good grammar book like niruttisaramanjusa etc.

        ----- Original Message -----
        From: "rahula_80" <rahula_80@...>
        Date: Mon, 04 Nov 2002 10:13:23 -0000
        To: Pali@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: [Pali] Re: Pali Book


        > Hi,
        >
        > Can you tell me the titles?
        >
        > Also, Warder's and Geiger's are also from PTS. As for Sanskrit, I
        > understand, some university are using Coulson's in their first year.
        >
        > Thanks, Rahula
        >
        >
        >
        >
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      • paulocuana
        Hi Rahula, I hope you got some good replies to this request. There is really only one choice here. Warder s book is the only way to go. If nothing else
        Message 3 of 12 , Nov 7, 2002
          Hi Rahula,

          I hope you got some good replies to this request.
          There is really only one choice here. Warder's
          book is the only way to go. If nothing else Warder
          was a great educator; I hear he's retired now; his
          chapters gradually build knowledge & confidence.
          Be sure to notice when Warder asks for a reading and
          not a translation in the later exercises.
          Just to give you a little comparison the first 66 pages
          of Geiger's book concern phonology, yuck!

          Best Wishes,
          Paul O'Cuana


          --- In Pali@y..., "rahula_80" <rahula_80@y...> wrote:
          > Hi,
          >
          > I am planning to buy a book to learn Pali next week. (I already
          have
          > Pali Primer and Elementary Course in Pali).
          >
          > Which would you recommend?
          >
          > 1. Introduction to Pali by AK Warder
          >
          > 2. A Pali Grammar by Wilhelm Geiger
          >
          > Thanks, Rahula
        • Nina van Gorkom
          Dear Paulocuana, I love Warder, but, it is limited. Gradually one may like to learn more details on compounds, for example. Therefore, I hope that the experts
          Message 4 of 12 , Nov 9, 2002
            Dear Paulocuana,
            I love Warder, but, it is limited. Gradually one may like to learn more
            details on compounds, for example. Therefore, I hope that the experts here
            will publish more on compounds. Saddaniiti is too voluminous for me
            personally to consult, and all in Pali I believe.
            Another subject I like very much: particles, prefixes. They are important.
            Question: kaayaanupassii: contemplating the body. What is the meaning of anu
            in anupassati? In PED I found among others: towards, after, along, in
            conformity with. Can it be like: anugacchati: going towards the
            characteristics of realities?
            Then the ii in kaayaanupassii: I learnt that it can mean: the person who
            contemplates, but also: the meaning of doing something habitually: who
            habitually contemplates. That would be close to the word viharati in this
            connection.

            I am all in for compounds and particles, whenever there is an opportunity,
            but it depends on the time of the experts.
            Nina.

            op 08-11-2002 01:48 schreef paulocuana op paulocuana@...:

            > Hi Rahula,
            >
            > I hope you got some good replies to this request.
            > There is really only one choice here. Warder's
            > book is the only way to go.
          • Paul O Cuana
            Dear Nina, As a novice, I too wish I understood more about these things, particularly prefixes, because It seems that an understanding of these often repeated
            Message 5 of 12 , Nov 10, 2002
              Dear Nina,
              As a novice, I too wish I understood more about these
              things, particularly prefixes, because It seems that
              an understanding of these often repeated items would
              make it easier to navigate around the language.
              On the other hand, I'm impressed by the argument that
              the smallest unit of meaning is the sentence; and even
              so there are times when the meaning of a sentence
              can't be gleaned from the sentence alone but must be
              looked at in a wider context. The recent example
              mentioned in this group where some experts thought the
              Buddha wished for his words to be taught in any and
              all dialects, while other experts thought the Buddha
              permitted only Paali, comes to mind.
              I guess what I'm saying is that it seems the
              particular meaning of a word will change depending on
              the words that immediately precede and follow it.
              This is why I find the practice in this group of
              consulting Sanskrit dictionaries so troublesome. It
              seems our goal should be to find the particular
              meaning in a given Paali text and not the general
              meaning in a related language, although this may be
              helpful too at times.
              My goal for the group would be to see more discussion
              of difficult passages, particularly from the Diigha.
              Best Wishes,
              Paul
              Nina van Gorkom <nilo@...> wrote:
              > Dear Paulocuana,
              > I love Warder, but, it is limited. Gradually one may
              > like to learn more
              > details on compounds, for example. Therefore, I hope
              > that the experts here
              > will publish more on compounds. Saddaniiti is too
              > voluminous for me
              > personally to consult, and all in Pali I believe.
              > Another subject I like very much: particles,
              > prefixes. They are important.
              > Question: kaayaanupassii: contemplating the body.
              > What is the meaning of anu
              > in anupassati? In PED I found among others: towards,
              > after, along, in
              > conformity with. Can it be like: anugacchati: going
              > towards the
              > characteristics of realities?
              > Then the ii in kaayaanupassii: I learnt that it can
              > mean: the person who
              > contemplates, but also: the meaning of doing
              > something habitually: who
              > habitually contemplates. That would be close to the
              > word viharati in this
              > connection.
              >
              > I am all in for compounds and particles, whenever
              > there is an opportunity,
              > but it depends on the time of the experts.
              > Nina.
              >
              > op 08-11-2002 01:48 schreef paulocuana op
              > paulocuana@...:
              >
              > > Hi Rahula,
              > >
              > > I hope you got some good replies to this request.
              > > There is really only one choice here. Warder's
              > > book is the only way to go.
              >
              >


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            • Nina van Gorkom
              Dear Paul, Why don t we set up our beginner s corner, and study prefixes and compounds. For those who also know Skrt they have their own corner, that is fine.
              Message 6 of 12 , Nov 11, 2002
                Dear Paul,
                Why don't we set up our beginner's corner, and study prefixes and compounds.
                For those who also know Skrt they have their own corner, that is fine.
                Beginners helping beginners is useful because it is a kind of reviewing. And
                hopefully, experts will now and then come to our help.
                We can make some collections of difficult words. Nice collections of
                compounds.
                Warder gives examples of different types of compounds, but not easy.
                I am thinking of Rahula's example: brahmabhuuto; is this a kammadhaaraya?
                The first member may be an attribute of the second: a holy being, brahma,
                holy or divine PED gives this word). Someone who has reached perfection.
                Bhuuto: p.p. become, or a being. I did not keep Rahula's post, but it
                seemed some thought it to be nibbaana. But when looking at bhuuto: nibbaana
                is what has not become (See Udaana text).
                op 10-11-2002 17:53 schreef Paul O Cuana op paulocuana@...:

                > As a novice, I too wish I understood more about these
                > things, particularly prefixes, because It seems that
                > an understanding of these often repeated items would
                > make it easier to navigate around the language.

                > My goal for the group would be to see more discussion
                > of difficult passages, particularly from the Diigha.
                N: I would like that, but only in small portions, because time involved is a
                problem. What have you read, could you give an example of a difficult
                passage?
                My favorite is the Dassutara Sutta, and I read the whole Co to this, I
                really enjoyed this.
                Nina.
              • Paul O Cuana
                Dear Nina, If there were world enough and time... I plan to retire in about 18 months so I think I m just warming up until then. Brahmabhuuto is an interesting
                Message 7 of 12 , Nov 12, 2002
                  Dear Nina,
                  If there were world enough and time...
                  I plan to retire in about 18 months so I think I'm
                  just warming up until then.
                  Brahmabhuuto is an interesting compound since it would
                  seem to represent one of those phrases that Buddhists
                  would want to claim as their own. It's a good example
                  of taking an existing religious phrase and giving it
                  new meaning, and as you suggest the result is not very
                  satisfying. I checked Childers and he suggests
                  "excellent or best" in this phrase.
                  Best Wishes,
                  Paul
                  --- Nina van Gorkom <nilo@...> wrote:
                  > Dear Paul,
                  > Why don't we set up our beginner's corner, and study
                  > prefixes and compounds.
                  > For those who also know Skrt they have their own
                  > corner, that is fine.
                  > Beginners helping beginners is useful because it is
                  > a kind of reviewing. And
                  > hopefully, experts will now and then come to our
                  > help.
                  > We can make some collections of difficult words.
                  > Nice collections of
                  > compounds.
                  > Warder gives examples of different types of
                  > compounds, but not easy.
                  > I am thinking of Rahula's example: brahmabhuuto; is
                  > this a kammadhaaraya?
                  > The first member may be an attribute of the second:
                  > a holy being, brahma,
                  > holy or divine PED gives this word). Someone who has
                  > reached perfection.
                  > Bhuuto: p.p. become, or a being. I did not keep
                  > Rahula's post, but it
                  > seemed some thought it to be nibbaana. But when
                  > looking at bhuuto: nibbaana
                  > is what has not become (See Udaana text).
                  > op 10-11-2002 17:53 schreef Paul O Cuana op
                  > paulocuana@...:
                  >
                  > > As a novice, I too wish I understood more about
                  > these
                  > > things, particularly prefixes, because It seems
                  > that
                  > > an understanding of these often repeated items
                  > would
                  > > make it easier to navigate around the language.
                  >
                  > > My goal for the group would be to see more
                  > discussion
                  > > of difficult passages, particularly from the
                  > Diigha.
                  > N: I would like that, but only in small portions,
                  > because time involved is a
                  > problem. What have you read, could you give an
                  > example of a difficult
                  > passage?
                  > My favorite is the Dassutara Sutta, and I read the
                  > whole Co to this, I
                  > really enjoyed this.
                  > Nina.
                  >
                  >


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                • zeb1001
                  ... pali grammar niruttidipani by ledi sayadaw. ... Hi Are any of the ancient Pali grammar books on the Cha.t.tha Sangaayana 3 cd rom? If so what are they
                  Message 8 of 12 , Nov 29, 2002
                    --- In Pali@y..., "Ong Teng Kee" <ongtk@e...> wrote:
                    > > We should start with pali grammar text from the ancient till last
                    pali grammar niruttidipani by ledi sayadaw.
                    > I suggest you buy saddaniti from pts instead of the others.

                    Hi
                    Are any of the ancient Pali grammar books on the Cha.t.tha
                    Sangaayana 3 cd rom? If so what are they listed as?

                    Thank-you
                  • Ong Teng Kee
                    See also those grammar texts in sri lankan tipitaka project.They did put even a very rare book called moggallana pancika tika by sangharakkhita in that cd rom.
                    Message 9 of 12 , Nov 30, 2002
                      See also those grammar texts in sri lankan tipitaka project.They did put even a very rare book called moggallana pancika tika by sangharakkhita in that cd rom.
                      You should buy saddaniti from PTS because one book -suttamala is not listed in the cdrom.Others like moggallana and vutti on it and kaccayana /balavatara ,payogasiddhi along with rupasiddhi are all a must.
                      Unfortunely not even one complete english tran on them available till now.
                      We can only get non english tran on them with at least 6 tran on kaccayana in burmese language (also many tika on it)siam and sinhala /cambodia.
                      No buddhist University spend time to teach students on those 500 pali grammar text as far as I know.



                      ----- Original Message -----
                      From: "zeb1001" <zeb1001@...>
                      Date: Sat, 30 Nov 2002 01:07:47 -0000
                      To: Pali@yahoogroups.com
                      Subject: [Pali] Re: Pali Book


                      > --- In Pali@y..., "Ong Teng Kee" <ongtk@e...> wrote:
                      > > > We should start with pali grammar text from the ancient till last
                      > pali grammar niruttidipani by ledi sayadaw.
                      > > I suggest you buy saddaniti from pts instead of the others.
                      >
                      > Hi
                      > Are any of the ancient Pali grammar books on the Cha.t.tha
                      > Sangaayana 3 cd rom? If so what are they listed as?
                      >
                      > Thank-you
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
                      > Yahoo! Groups members can set their delivery options to daily digest or web only.
                      > [Homepage] http://www.tipitaka.net
                      > [Send Message] pali@yahoogroups.com
                      > [Mailing List] http://groups.yahoo.com/group/pali
                      > [Discussion] http://www.tipitaka.net/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.pl
                      >
                      > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                      >
                      >
                      >

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