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Re: [Pali] translation of paa.nikajaata in Satipatthana sutta

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  • Магубад Бурджан
    Yes, that is right. What I mean was that giving a meaning to a word could follow independently similar ways in a language family even in different cultures
    Message 1 of 14 , Apr 22, 2009
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      Yes, that is right. What I mean was that giving a meaning to a word could follow independently similar ways in a language family even in different cultures without immediate contact between them. Thus we could employ linguistic comparison in order to understand better some shades of the meaning. But you are right - chiefly the context is determinative.

      With metta,
      Ardavarz

      --- On Wed, 4/22/09, Piya Tan <dharmafarer@...> wrote:
      From: Piya Tan <dharmafarer@...>
      Subject: Re: [Pali] translation of paa.nikajaata in Satipatthana sutta
      To: Pali@yahoogroups.com
      Date: Wednesday, April 22, 2009, 7:30 PM

      Dear Ardavarz,

      I think genus, genos and jana are cognates in the Indo-Aryan family.

      We can split hairs over the origins, etymology and meanings of words.
      Ultimately it is the context that decides how to render the word.

      We rarely translate the word, more often we translale the meaning.

      With metta,

      Piya Tan



      2009/4/22 Магубад Бурджан <ardavarz@...>

      >
      >
      > Dear Jim, Mahinda, Piya, Nina and all,
      >
      > I was not aware of the other implications of the words paa.naka and jaata..
      > In Sanskrit (according to Monier-William's Dictionary) praa.naka is
      "living
      > being, animal" and also "a worm". If this is relevant in
      Pali too, it could
      > explain the diversity of translations. Jaata (past participle of
      > janati/janaayati = Pali jaayati) also can mean "living being,
      creature" and
      > also "race, kind, sort, class, species" and "a multitude or
      collection of
      > things forming a class" (Ibid.); and for Pali Buddhadhatta Mahaathera
      also
      > gives "a collection or variety". This seems logical to me if we
      compare the
      > etymology of the word "genus" (from Latin = ancient Greek genos)
      from the
      > Latin verb genere (= ancient Greek gignesthai) "to beget, to
      become". In
      > Indo-Aryan languages the word-formation could follow similar ways.
      > Still, in this case I don't feel competent to decide which
      interpretation
      > is more adequate.
      >
      > Metta,
      > Ardavarz
      >
      > --- On Tue, 4/21/09, Jim Anderson
      <jimanderson.on@...<jimanderson.on%40gmail.com>>
      > wrote:
      > From: Jim Anderson <jimanderson.on@...
      <jimanderson.on%40gmail.com>>
      >
      > Subject: Re: [Pali] translation of paa.nikajaata in Satipatthana sutta
      > To: Pali@yahoogroups.com <Pali%40yahoogroups.com>
      > Date: Tuesday, April 21, 2009, 5:46 PM
      >
      >
      > Dear Piya and Mahinda,
      >
      > Thanks for your helpful comments. The use of -jaata as kind or group
      >
      > makes good sense and fits the context well. Abh 1077a (jaato bhuute
      >
      > caye jaata.m) gives two meanings. Caya refers to collection and one
      >
      > also finds jaata.m listed among the 29 synonyms of samuuho at Abh
      >
      > 629-31.
      >
      > In Ledi Sayadaw's Niruttidiipanii, pp. 44-5, he lists gata, jaata, and
      >
      > anta as aagamas at the end of words (in reference to the Mahaavutti).
      >
      > The two examples given for jaata are atthajaata.m & dhammajaata. m.
      Not
      >
      > sure if this applies in our case though.
      >
      > Best wishes,
      >
      > Jim
      >
      > > Jim,
      >
      > >
      >
      > > I guess the suffix -jaata (since the Comentaries are silent) could
      >
      > > mean something like "-kind" and in "mankind"
      (*manussa,jaata) , thus
      >
      > > referring to a group, kind, etc. It is a generic suffix.
      >
      > >
      >
      > > With metta,
      >
      > >
      >
      > > Piya
      >
      > and from Mahinda:
      >
      > > PTS Dictionary actually mentions that -jaata in some contexts can
      >
      > mean
      >
      > > "kinds of..." Thus gandhajaata: kinds of incense. See PTSD
      under
      >
      > jaata.
      >
      > > vividhehi paa.nakajaatehi khajjamaana must surely mean " being
      >
      > devoured by
      >
      > > various kinds of small creatures".
      >
      > >
      >
      > > Mahinda
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      >
      >
      >



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