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Re: [Pali] Re: Pali Day by Day G041 Question + Cosmic Smile

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  • Piya Tan
    Mahinda has misquoted me. WhatI said was that the word chamhi is problematic and I don t think it should be broken up as cha + mhi and unlike nha, it is not
    Message 1 of 134 , Dec 7, 2008
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      Mahinda has misquoted me. WhatI said was that the word chamhi is
      problematic and I don't think it should be broken up as cha + mhi and
      unlike nha, it is not initial. I don't think we can break it up as cha +
      mhi,
      but as cham+hi when we articulate it.

      I think even in the case of nha and similar forms, when in final sandhi,
      it is easier to pronounce with the n following the preceding syllable,
      eg pa~n + ha, ta.n + haa etc,

      Piya Tan


      On Sat, Dec 6, 2008 at 11:51 AM, mahipaliha <mahipal6@...> wrote:

      > Dear Florent, Jim and Piya
      >
      > To address a few points in this discourse:
      > (1) Our problem related to words ferom a verse found in a cluster of
      > texts having the interesting story of a family of ascetics who lived
      > on lotus roots, how Sakka tested them by hiding the chief ascetic's
      > sahre and how each one plus a friendly elephant tried to show his
      > innocence- by making a binding declaration or sapatha. The verse
      > gives the elephant's sapatha, appropriate to a lover of the delights
      > of the forest."Let him who stole the the revered ascetic's food be
      > taken from the lovely forest, tied hundreds of times with ropes,and
      > prodded with spikes, to suffer the travails of living among human
      > beings."
      >
      > (2) We had the question about chamhi. Other versions have chabbhi. It
      > was asked whether chabbhi is the right form or chahi? Actually words
      > for six include chahi/chabbhi, chasu/chassu. Chabbhi and chassu are
      > phonetic evolutions from older Indo-Aryan words .sa.dbhi.h
      > and .sa.t.su, whereas chahi and chasu are 'adjustments'
      > or 'corrections' done in order to suit the grammatical rules that
      > were enunciated much later, which assume stems and endings: stem cha-
      > must give chahi and chasu. And this theory held. So we have thousands
      > of such 'corrections' in the extant Pali texts. This is why some
      > scholars would think that Pali is an artificail language.Yet,
      > historical remnants of earlier more 'natural' forms are also legion.
      >
      > (1b) Skt version in Jaatakamaalaa has ".sa.dbhir d.r.dhai.h paaSa-
      > 'satai.h sa bandham", whose first word is the equivalent of sabbhi.
      >
      > (2) Metre: The metre here is Indravajraa, which is a metre more
      > familiar in ornate poetry. In this kind of Pali text, the metres are
      > not perfectly followed. So we have short syllables where long ones
      > would be regular. Also, since verses were, in oral tradition, simply
      > recited, the reciter could always adjust the reading to make short
      > look like long. In particular the last syllable would almost always
      > be recited long, whether written long or not.
      >
      > (3) Piya thinks we don't have -mh- in Pali. amhe, tumhe, amhaaka.m,
      > tumhaaka.m, tamhi, yamhi, gimha, gimhaana etc. etc.??
      >
      > Regards.
      >
      > Mahinda
      >
      >
      >



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    • Ong Yong Peng
      Dear friends, below is the link to NPC2 study guide, if you are looking for it. metta, Yong Peng. ... http://www.tipitaka.net/palicourseguide2.pdf
      Message 134 of 134 , Feb 23, 2010
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        Dear friends,

        below is the link to NPC2 study guide, if you are looking for it.


        metta,
        Yong Peng.



        --- In Pali@yahoogroups.com, Ong Yong Peng wrote:

        http://www.tipitaka.net/palicourseguide2.pdf
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