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Re: [Pali] sammaditthi

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  • Kumaara Bhikkhu
    I agree that right is not the best translation for samma . It s rather stuck though. :-) For samma , I prefer perfect, complete, full, etc. just as in
    Message 1 of 9 , Sep 1, 2007
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      I agree that 'right' is not the best translation for 'samma'. It's rather stuck though. :-)

      For 'samma', I prefer perfect, complete, full, etc.
      just as in sammaasambuddha: perfectly, completely, or fully self-enlightened one.

      kb

      mahasangha2000 wrote thus at 02:58 PM 28-08-07:
      >Greetings, I am new to this e-group. I am researching the concept
      >of "sammaditthi" which I understand often to be translated into "Right
      >Understanding" or "Right View." From the Buddha's teachings, Right
      >View is often associated with the Four Noble Truths. I do not know
      >Pali, and am not an etymologist or linguist. But since Pali is no
      >longer a living language, I am assuming that the English meanings that
      >we put onto Pali terms might have an accuracy that can be quite fluid.
      >Is anyone expert enough to have comments on the range and breadth of
      >possible meanings that "sammaditthi" might connote. For example, the
      >translation of "samma" into "right" feels like a dualistic term that
      >connotes good/evil, right/wrong, etc. that feels more like a Judeo-
      >Christian interpretation—a modern mapping onto an ancient word; is
      >this an appropriate interpretation? The translation of "ditthi"
      >into "understanding" or "view" seems to indicate a meaning of a
      >cognitive or intellectual knowledge—I am wondering if the Pali is
      >indicating this, or does it mean an experiential knowledge that is
      >beyond verbal concepts? Or does the Pali term indicate something else?
      >
      >Many thanks for any info that is available.
      >Larry
    • DC Wijeratna
      Here are some more thoughs on samma. 1. The basic sense of sammaa comes from the prefix sa or sam 2. Sa is derived from sad or sat meaning true; real and
      Message 2 of 9 , Sep 2, 2007
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        Here are some more thoughs on samma.

        1. The basic sense of sammaa comes from the prefix 'sa' or 'sam'

        2. Sa is derived from sad or sat meaning true; real and the other meaning is 'one's own'

        3. Thus the meaning of samma in the most general sense is true and false

        4. In English there are many ways of representing this. True, False, Right, Wrong, Complete, incomplete and 1 and zero, What belongs to one what does not belong to you and so on; the collection and what is not the collection

        5. In Buddhism, samma is used virtually all the above senses.

        6. The shade of meaning that has to be used has to be determined from the context.

        7. Words have meanings only within a context

        8. Usage in Dhamma can be broadly classified under: real and unreal (ontological), right and wrong (ethical) or skilful and unskilful

        9. The Sanskrit equivalent of sammaa is 'samyak'

        10. Meanings are given in Monier Williams

        With Metta

        D. C. Wijeratna

        D. G. D. C. Wijeratna



        ----- Original Message ----
        From: Gunnar Gällmo <gunnargallmo@...>
        To: Pali@yahoogroups.com
        Sent: Saturday, September 1, 2007 5:44:06 PM
        Subject: SV: RE: [Pali] sammaditthi

        --- Mike Stelmach <mfstelmach@ieee. org> skrev:

        > Below are some more tips on Sammaditthi:
        >
        > 1. For 21st century English, the translation of
        > "samma" as "right" may be
        > very misleading. Samma does not convey a sense of
        > right/wrong, good/evil as
        > mentioned.

        As sammaa is in some texts opposed to micchaa - e. g.
        micchaa-di.t. thi, "wrong view", and so on with the
        other factors of the path - I think it does indeed
        convey "a sense of right/wrong" , although other
        meanings may also be included.

        Gunnar

        http://metrobloggen .se/esperanto




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      • Ong Yong Peng
        Dear Larry and friends, what I understand is that the N8P (Noble Eightfold Path) transcends right and wrong. It is often known to be aryan or noble. On the
        Message 3 of 9 , Sep 3, 2007
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          Dear Larry and friends,

          what I understand is that the N8P (Noble Eightfold Path) transcends
          right and wrong. It is often known to be aryan or noble. On the
          practicality of N8P, it avoids the extremes, it is neither "left" nor
          "right", but "middle", hence it is also known as the Middle Way.
          However, that is when the entire N8P is taken as a whole.

          When we break it into components, such as "sammaditthi", 'right' is a
          good translation for 'sammaa', as Gunnar has explained.

          metta,
          Yong Peng.


          --- In Pali@yahoogroups.com, mahasangha2000 wrote:

          I am researching the concept of "sammaditthi" which I understand often
          to be translated into "Right Understanding" or "Right View."
        • joseph
          ... rather stuck though. :-) ... enlightened one. ... Hello friends Samma and the idea of the wholesome is off course, in our case, the Indian thought
          Message 4 of 9 , Sep 21, 2007
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            --- In Pali@yahoogroups.com, Kumaara Bhikkhu <yg@...> wrote:
            >
            > I agree that 'right' is not the best translation for 'samma'. It's
            rather stuck though. :-)
            >
            > For 'samma', I prefer perfect, complete, full, etc.
            > just as in sammaasambuddha: perfectly, completely, or fully self-
            enlightened one.
            >
            Hello friends
            Samma and the idea of the wholesome is off course, in our case, the
            Indian thought expression.
            Now there is an emphasis not on originality or subjective
            interpretation of what is right or even of what is the path, but an
            exact confrontation with the reality of one's approach which (and it
            will sound strange to western ears), consists of the key
            word `conformity'.
            That is one finds exactly the same moral and
            psychological `perfection',
            The same understanding, the same Dhamma.

            Although the twentieth centaury taught us the dangers of `blind
            obeisance', we must bear in mind the context of a life of a Bhikkhu,
            and the utter dismissal of any other kind of identification, most
            notably the complete absence of any national or group preference
            apart being a follower of the Buddha,
            Seems that there is an enormous amount of transparency in everything
            we think nowadays.
            I do believe the same goes for the lay followers as well.
            I may sound tedious, but
            About two years back mentioned the subject and, again ,
            conforming, the 'same' in the Indian context does mean perfecting as
            the path is found'
            so the SammaSambudho' 'matches the requirements of the lineage of the
            Buddha, just as the path limbs are exact, complete, special
            phenomena, see the 'forty' in the lesson of the great forty'
            MahaCatarisakaSutta'.

            Metta
            Bhikkhu Jothiko
          • joseph
            ... Hello friends 1. the path must begin with a tandem development of mundane right view which include good Kamma, I guess as merit making and right intention
            Message 5 of 9 , Oct 13, 2007
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              --- In Pali@yahoogroups.com, "Ong Yong Peng" <pali.smith@...> wrote:
              > what I understand is that the N8P (Noble Eightfold Path) transcends
              > right and wrong.

              Hello friends

              1. the path must begin with a tandem development of mundane right
              view
              which include good Kamma, I guess as merit making and right
              intention including Metta = friendship.

              it all seems to me to suggest goodness, even reading Metta as
              nothing different than 'love your friend as yourself'.
              if it doesnt ring well,
              there's 'the lesson on the similie of the saw' KakucupamaSutta'
              which may also serve as a definition of how by 'taking care of
              others,
              one takes care of himself',
              if it all sound as the religeon you have tried to avoid as
              hypocratic,
              please remember that 'any religeon
              that include the eight fold path is a good religeon'

              2. there's an article by J.R. Carter: 'beyond 'beyond good and evil''
              in Buddhist Studies -SaddhaTissa memorial 84,
              where he analyses this expression.
              a notable feature in the article is the distinction, based on a
              quote of Prof. Pemasiri, between Kussala and Punna,
              mainly that an Arahat will neither
              generate merit= punna even by good deeds,
              nor can path attainment be conceived directly
              as an intended result = vipaka.
              but the wholesome =kussala certainly serves as a definition.
              the article conclude that , indeed, it is more of a difficulty of
              english language and western tradition then a theravada one.
              it is dangerous to separate the Blessed one and the Dhamma from a
              notion of goodness.

              Metta
              Jothiko Bhikkhu
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