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Re: Yogavacaro

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  • ruwanr2003
    Dear Sir As far as my knowledge in Pali canon is concerned, bhikkus always called Buddha, Bagava . There is no reference where anyone calling Buddha guru or
    Message 1 of 43 , Aug 6, 2007
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      Dear Sir

      As far as my knowledge in Pali canon is concerned, bhikkus always
      called Buddha, "Bagava". There is no reference where anyone calling
      Buddha guru or yogi. Bagava is translated to English as "Venerable
      Sir". Top Pali scholars like Nina could eliminate us on this issue.

      Thanks

      Ruwan


      --- In Pali@yahoogroups.com, "Lotsawanet" <lotsawanet@...> wrote:
      >
      > Dear Yong Peng and Nina.
      >
      >
      >
      > I have been studying the meaning of yogi in Buddhist tradition, its
      relation
      > with the term bhikku and guru, as in the culture and time where
      Buddha born,
      > it was used this term to designate the ascetics in that time.
      >
      >
      >
      > I did not find the term yogi in the pali texts until now, but I did
      find the
      > term yogavacaro.
      >
      > Does it have a definition? In wich context we found this term?
      >
      > Does it designate a bhikku?
      >
      >
      >
      > As we know that in the hindu tradition the teachers are called
      gurus also in
      > the time of Buddha, does the buddhist teachers including Buddha
      himself were
      > called in this way?
      > Is there in the pali canon references about this?
      >
      >
      >
      > I found the following passage in pali canon mentioned in a book:
      >
      > "Yogavacaro panca indriya ni avikkhepe patitthapeti..."
      > (Patisambhida. 1.4.4.17.62).
      >
      > Does it verify? What would be the translation of it?
      > The term vacaro seems to mean "person", so in the term yogavacaro,
      is seems
      > to mean "a person [who practice] yoga", or "a yoga practioner".
      > As for "panca indriya", it seems to mean the "five Indryas" or "the
      five
      > [acts of control of mind through] rules".
      >
      > There are five indriya.
      > They are: 1. Saddhindriya (faith and confidence)
      > 2. Viriyindriya (enthusiasm and perseverance)
      > 3. Satindriya (the setting up of the mind)
      > 4. Samadhindriya (the training in Samadhi)
      > 5. Pannadriya. (the training in panna)
      >
      > I think the phrase is showing a relation with the "yogavacaro" with
      this
      > practices, or it is indicating that a "yogavacaro" is endowed with
      the
      > attainments of this trainings.
      > Is that right?
      >
      > I could not find the meaning of the following words in any pali
      dictionary -
      > avikkhepe patitthapeti...
      >
      > Thanks since now for any suggestion and help.
      > Gabriel
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      >
    • Lotsawanet
      Dear Yong Peng. Thank you for your continuous attention and kindness. Regarding my question, it since the strictly begging related to pali canon, pali language
      Message 43 of 43 , Aug 24, 2007
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        Dear Yong Peng.



        Thank you for your continuous attention and kindness.

        Regarding my question, it since the strictly begging related to pali canon,
        pali language and Nikaya-centrik.

        From my first email my question was simply:

        "What does the term "yogavacaro" means in pali language and pali canon?

        Also I showed a passage in the pali where it appears:

        Yogavacaro panca indriya ni avikkhepe patitthapeti..."
        (Patisambhida. 1.4.4.17.62)



        In this passage it was translated by a member as:

        "The one who courses in yoga (yogaavacaaro) causes the five senses (panca
        indriya) to be
        established in calmness/non-disturbance (avikkhepa)."



        So my question was: "Does this passage in the "pali canon" defines the term
        in the pali canon?

        Does a Bhikkhu which is coursing in yoga as mentioned above could be called
        a yogavacaro in the pali canon?

        Or the passage means someone else (not a bhikkhu or a Buddhist) that does
        this kind of practice (as the hindu yogis)?

        Then I mentioned that in Hindu the word is defined in a similar way by
        Patanjali, and in the Mahayana Buddhism too there is a definition where it
        implies someone abiding in samata and vipassana.



        Would be great if in the vast literature of pali someone well learned could
        give a direction or suggestion of reading where I can find the meaning and
        use of the word yogavacaro.



        I thank you for the list of Buddhism that you suggest, but my question here
        are strictly regarding the terms and how they are defined and related in the
        pali language.

        I am truly sorry for any confusion that maybe raised by cited other related
        terms that are used in a different context. That was just in order to show
        how this terms are not just used in the Hindu tradition but were also
        adopted by the Indian Mahayana Buddhism.



        My best wishes and regards.

        Gabriel



        From: Pali@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Pali@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ong
        Yong Peng
        Sent: 24 August 2007 17:29
        To: Pali@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: [Pali] Re: Yogavacaro



        Dear Gabriel,

        thank you for sharing your thoughts. The group welcomes open-minded
        discussions if the topic is closely related to Pali Tipitaka study.

        On the other hand, you may also like to look at other broad-base
        online resources which offers discussion beyond our scope, such as the
        E-sangha forum: <http://www.lioncity.net/buddhism/>
        http://www.lioncity.net/buddhism/

        This mailing list emphasizes more on the Pali Tipitaka, and our
        activities are mainly Pali-focused and Nikaya-centric.

        metta,
        Yong Peng.

        --- In <mailto:Pali%40yahoogroups.com> Pali@yahoogroups.com, Lotsawanet
        wrote:

        I find interesting this kind of studies where we find interconnections
        between the traditions and the etymologies of the their dharma terms.





        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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