Re: AN2.1.1 Vajja Sutta (1/1)
- -Dear Yong Peng
I see. Unfortunately I think you are veering in a dangerous
WE are lost in view, hence the Dhamma is not about about interpreting
suttas depending on our feeling about what they mean, if we do so we
are giving full rein to deeply held wrong views that are innate to
Even scholars in the PTS understand the neccessity of relying on
IB Horner writes
""The prime object of every Commentary is to make the meanings of the
phrases in the canonical passages it is elucidating abundantly clear,
definite, definitive even....This is to preserve the Teachings of the
Buddha as nearly as possible in the sense intended, and as conveyed
by the succession of teachers, acariyaparama. Always there were
detractors, always there were and still are "improvers" ready with
their own notions. Through friends and enemies alike deleterous
change and deterioration in the word of the Buddha might intervene
for an indefinite length of time. The Commentaries are the armour and
protection against such an eventuality. AS they hold a unique
position as preservers and interpreters of true Dhamma, it is
essential not only to follow them carefully and adopt the meaning
they ascribe to a word or phrase each time they commnet on it. They
are as closed now as is the Pali canon. No aditions to their corpus
or subtractions from it are to contemplated, and no commentary
written in later days could be included in it.""endquote Horner.
pxiii Clarifier of the Sweet Meaning" PAli Text Society 1978.
As for the Kalama sutta note what the Kalamas said after the Buddha
finished his discourse:
@@@Magnificent, lord! Magnificent! Just as if he were to place
upright what was overturned, to reveal what was hidden, to show the
way to one who was lost, or to carry a lamp into the dark so that
those with eyes could see forms, in the same way has the Blessed One
through many lines of reasoning made the Dhamma clear. We go to
the Blessed One for refuge, to the Dhamma, and to the Sangha of
monks. May the Blessed One remember us as lay followers who have gone
to him for refuge, from this day forward, for life."
I think you will find no references to these same kalamas doubting
or disagreeing with the Dhamma after this first meeting.
In Pali@yahoogroups.com, "Ong Yong Peng" <pali.smith@...> wrote:
> Dear Robert,
> thanks. There are two points I like to raise here.
> 1. As Buddha mentioned in the Kalama sutta on how we should exercise
> proper examination on the suttas ourselves, the commentary can be
> taken as the result of that exercise by someone before us. Of
> we can always use it as a guide or reference, but ultimately theachieve
> understanding of the Buddha's teachings depends on ourselves.
> 2. The commentary explains the teachings. It may use a phrase for a
> word, a sentence for a phrase, a paragraph for a sentence, to
> that. Or, it may omit a section of the text completely, as it seesnot
> fit. Therefore, incorporating the commentary into a translation is
> advisable. Furthermore, by changing a word, a translator may have tosutta.
> change a sentence; by changing a sentence, he may have to alter a
> paragraph; by altering a paragraph, he may have to rewrite the
> We have to remember that we are translating the sutta, not writing
> what we think the sutta is about. Both have their own merits, but
> completely different.of
> Yong Peng.
> --- In Pali@yahoogroups.com, rjkjp1 wrote:
> I see, I thought your earlier meant we don't need to take account
> the Commentaries explanation of the meaning, now I understand.
> > Allow me to explain my position by replying to your first
> > two sentences.
- Dear friends,
according to our plans, we will be having a sutta translation exercise
next weekend. The exercise will go on as planned. We will be working
through three suttas from AN2, namely,
AN2.1.2 Padhaana Sutta
AN2.1.3 Tapaniiya Sutta
AN2.1.4 Atapaniiya Sutta
Since these are three individual suttas, I will be posting them in
three separate mails, rather than one. I shall look forward to your
--- In Pali@yahoogroups.com, Ong Yong Peng wrote:
as planned, we begin with our translation exercise of AN2.