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Re: Digest Number 1262

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  • Charles P. Arnold
    ... is. ... Let me jump in here if I may. The Second Amendment was created specifically to keep government honest. It was designed specifically so that
    Message 1 of 8 , Feb 15, 2008
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      --- In Pagan-Headstone-Campaign@yahoogroups.com, "Morgan"
      <pierceheart@...> wrote:
      >
      > --- In Pagan-Headstone-Campaign@yahoogroups.com, "Angie"
      > <Ladyhawker@> wrote:
      > >
      > > [Quote:] "So long as we have a second amendment, my first amendment
      > rights
      > > are secure. Morgan" [End Quote]
      > >
      > >
      > > I sure hope you were trying to be funny here (you failed miserably)
      > because
      > > this is a more dangerous statement to me than the House Resolution
      is.
      >
      > How?
      >
      > How is the idea that I should stand up and fight for my rights as
      > enumerated in the Constitution dangerous?
      >
      > George Washington and company tried words.
      > They tried peaceful protest.
      >
      > What worked?
      > Force of arms.
      >
      > THAT'S why they created the second amendment - to give the people the
      > ability to protect their rights from usurpation by a tyrannical
      > government, the same way they ensured them in the 18th Century.
      >
      > Morgan
      >
      Let me jump in here if I may. The Second Amendment was created
      specifically to keep government honest. It was designed specifically
      so that citizens could protect their well-being individually and
      protect themselves as a group from a government that lost its way. It
      is there specifically, no matter what others or later laws say, to
      allow the general citizenry to raise an armed rebellion against their
      government. I am not suggesting such an action, merely clarifying what
      the framers of the Constitution had in mind. I can provide specific
      supporting quotes if anyone wishes.

      Charles
    • Morgan
      ... I so wish, Charles! Morgan
      Message 2 of 8 , Feb 21, 2008
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        --- In Pagan-Headstone-Campaign@yahoogroups.com, "Charles P. Arnold"
        <charlesparnold@...> wrote:

        > It
        > is there specifically, no matter what others or later laws say, to
        > allow the general citizenry to raise an armed rebellion against their
        > government. I am not suggesting such an action, merely clarifying what
        > the framers of the Constitution had in mind. I can provide specific
        > supporting quotes if anyone wishes.

        I so wish, Charles!

        Morgan
      • Charles P. Arnold
        ... Give me a week or so to get home (am in British Columbia at the moment) and I will. I also recommend a small booklet on the Second Amendment that is
        Message 3 of 8 , Feb 22, 2008
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          --- In Pagan-Headstone-Campaign@yahoogroups.com, "Morgan"
          <pierceheart@...> wrote:
          >
          > --- In Pagan-Headstone-Campaign@yahoogroups.com, "Charles P. Arnold"
          > <charlesparnold@> wrote:
          >
          > > It
          > > is there specifically, no matter what others or later laws say, to
          > > allow the general citizenry to raise an armed rebellion against their
          > > government. I am not suggesting such an action, merely clarifying what
          > > the framers of the Constitution had in mind. I can provide specific
          > > supporting quotes if anyone wishes.
          >
          > I so wish, Charles!
          >
          > Morgan
          >

          Give me a week or so to get home (am in British Columbia at the
          moment) and I will. I also recommend a small booklet on the Second
          Amendment that is available from the NRA.

          Charles
        • Charles P. Arnold
          ... is. ... If you read the Bill of Rights you will notice that the term, rights of the people, appears in the First, Second, Fourth, Ninth and Tenth
          Message 4 of 8 , Feb 22, 2008
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            --- In Pagan-Headstone-Campaign@yahoogroups.com, "Morgan"
            <pierceheart@...> wrote:
            >
            > --- In Pagan-Headstone-Campaign@yahoogroups.com, "Angie"
            > <Ladyhawker@> wrote:
            > >
            > > [Quote:] "So long as we have a second amendment, my first amendment
            > rights
            > > are secure. Morgan" [End Quote]
            > >
            > >
            > > I sure hope you were trying to be funny here (you failed miserably)
            > because
            > > this is a more dangerous statement to me than the House Resolution
            is.
            >
            > How?
            >
            > How is the idea that I should stand up and fight for my rights as
            > enumerated in the Constitution dangerous?
            >
            > George Washington and company tried words.
            > They tried peaceful protest.
            >
            > What worked?
            > Force of arms.
            >
            > THAT'S why they created the second amendment - to give the people the
            > ability to protect their rights from usurpation by a tyrannical
            > government, the same way they ensured them in the 18th Century.
            >
            > Morgan
            >

            If you read the Bill of Rights you will notice that the term, "rights
            of the people,' appears in the First, Second, Fourth, Ninth and Tenth
            Amendments. The only attacks on that term, attempts to make it read
            other than it does, is in regard to the Second. The term has been
            ruled repeatedly that is refers to the general citizenry, not to the
            government or specific limited groups.

            If we were to interpret the Second Amendment directly, not trying to
            change the meanings of the words we would wind up having to
            acknowledge that it is not only the right but the responsibility of
            every citizen to possess a modern firearm or military quality and this
            would include semi- and full automatic weapons for national defense,
            self defense and to prevent rule by unlawful government.
          • Charles P. Arnold
            ... Governments are instituted among men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed. That whenever any form of government becomes
            Message 5 of 8 , Feb 23, 2008
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              --- In Pagan-Headstone-Campaign@yahoogroups.com, "Charles P. Arnold"
              <charlesparnold@...> wrote:
              >
              > --- In Pagan-Headstone-Campaign@yahoogroups.com, "Morgan"
              > <pierceheart@> wrote:
              > >
              > > --- In Pagan-Headstone-Campaign@yahoogroups.com, "Angie"
              > > <Ladyhawker@> wrote:
              > > >
              > > > [Quote:] "So long as we have a second amendment, my first amendment
              > > rights
              > > > are secure. Morgan" [End Quote]
              > > >
              > > >
              > > > I sure hope you were trying to be funny here (you failed miserably)
              > > because
              > > > this is a more dangerous statement to me than the House Resolution
              > is.
              > >
              > > How?
              > >
              > > How is the idea that I should stand up and fight for my rights as
              > > enumerated in the Constitution dangerous?
              > >
              > > George Washington and company tried words.
              > > They tried peaceful protest.
              > >
              > > What worked?
              > > Force of arms.
              > >
              > > THAT'S why they created the second amendment - to give the people the
              > > ability to protect their rights from usurpation by a tyrannical
              > > government, the same way they ensured them in the 18th Century.
              > >
              > > Morgan
              > >
              >
              "Governments are instituted among men, deriving their just powers from
              the consent of the governed. That whenever any form of government
              becomes destructive of these ends, it is the right of the people to
              alter or abolish it." George Mason, Second Amendment to the Constitution

              "They that can give up essential liberty to purchase a little
              temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." Benjamin Franklin

              "The National Rifle Association is perhaps correct and certainly is
              plausible in its 'strong' reading of the Second Amendment protection
              of private gun ownership. Therefore gun control advocates who want to
              square their policy preference with the Constitution should squarely
              face the need to deconstitutionalize the subject by repealing the
              embarrassing amendment." George F. Will in The Washington Post

              "I submit to you that the right to own firearms, and by that I mean
              any pistol or rifle, is equal to the right to speak ones mind freely,
              the right of individuals to join together to form organizations or the
              right to worship the gods of one's own choosing or to refrain from
              worshipping any gods whatsoever. Each and all of these rights are
              equal, one to another and to attack or attempt to destroy one of these
              is to attempt to destroy all of them." Charles P. Arnold
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