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Re: [PPLetterpress] Further plate concerns....

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  • Harold Kyle
    Your exposure is probably too short. What happens when you try a 5 minute exposure? As others have said a Stouffer gauge would help. Harold -- . . . . . . . .
    Message 1 of 15 , Feb 8, 2008
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      Your exposure is probably too short. What happens when you try a 5
      minute exposure? As others have said a Stouffer gauge would help.

      Harold

      --
      . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
      Boxcar Press: Letterpress for the 21st Century
      501 West Fayette Street, Studio 222
      Syracuse, New York 13204
      (315) 473-0930 phone
      (315) 473-0967 fax
      http://www.boxcarpress.com
      . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
    • letterpress_man
      First thing you need to do is get the manufactures spec s on the plate and follow it as written except for exposure time, you need to get a Stouffer gauge and
      Message 2 of 15 , Feb 8, 2008
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        First thing you need to do is get the manufactures spec's on the
        plate and follow it as written except for exposure time, you need to
        get a Stouffer gauge and use it to gauge your exposure and not a time
        limit. The manufacture should have this on there sheet. Once you
        get that right, expose your plates to that time and not to the time
        on the sheet as different machines will be different and bulb life
        makes a great differance. You also need to check this from time to
        time as bulbs decrease in output with age. The Stoufer Gauge will be
        well worth the investment and will eliminate a lot of problems.




        --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, "pfraterdeus" <peterf@...>
        wrote:
        >
        > Would excessive washout cause 'i-dots' and apostrophes to actually
        move around on the
        > plate??
        >
        > This is with K95 on Interflex A4
        >
        > 3.5 minute exposure
        > 5 min wash
        >
        > It's very odd. The dot over one 'i' will move while another in the
        same line stays where it
        > should be.
        >
        > ???
        >
        > thx
        > p
        >
      • Peter Fraterdeus
        Gerald Many thanks for the info. Indeed, I was working off the info provided apocryphally with the plate maker, and the anonymous bits of polymer which came
        Message 3 of 15 , Feb 8, 2008
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          Gerald

          Many thanks for the info.
          Indeed, I was working off the info provided apocryphally with the plate maker, and the anonymous bits of polymer which came along with it. Which, it will be apparent, are not the same type (mfr, scale, whatever) as the K95, et al.

          Must have just been lucky with the first handful I made in Dec and January, as all this trouble began in the past couple weeks.

          Practice makes perfect...
          Or as my musician friends say "Perfect practice makes perfect. If you practice the wrong things you just learn how to do it wrong"

          P

          At 6:19 AM +0000 8 02 08, Gerald Lange wrote:
          >Peter
          >
          >You might want to go here and read the information about setting
          >exposure using the Stouffer Scale
          >
          >http://bielerpressxi.blogspot.com/
          >
          >read the book I sent you
          >
          >and go to the reference files here and download the PDF on Toyobo
          >instructions for processing their plates.
          >
          >I suspect this information will save you a lot of grief.
          >
          >There is no magic to photopolymer processing, just follow the
          >procedures as laid out by the industry. You really should not be
          >experiencing all these problems.
          >
          >Gerald
          >http://BielerPress.blogspot.com
          >

          --
          AzByCx DwEvFu GtHsIr JqKpLo MnNmOl PkQjRi ShTgUf VeWdXc YbZa&@
          {ARTQ: Help stop in-box bloat! Always Remember to Trim the Quote!}

          ExquisiteLetterpress http://www.exquisiteletterpress.com

          -:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*
          Peter Fraterdeus http://www.alphabets.com : Sign up for "MiceType"!
          Galena, Illinois Design Philosophy Fonts Lettering Letterpress Wood Type
          Dubuque, Iowa http://www.fraterdeus.com
          Photography Irish Fiddle Political Observation
          http://flickr.com/photos/pfraterdeus
          http://youtube.com/user/pfraterdeus
        • Peter Fraterdeus
          Thanks All for the tips. I have a Stouffer gauge, will try it again to see what the issue is. Cheers pf ... -- AzByCx DwEvFu GtHsIr JqKpLo MnNmOl PkQjRi ShTgUf
          Message 4 of 15 , Feb 8, 2008
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            Thanks All for the tips.
            I have a Stouffer gauge, will try it again to see what the issue is.

            Cheers
            pf


            >First thing you need to do is get the manufactures spec's on the
            >plate and follow it as written except for exposure time, you need to
            >get a Stouffer gauge and use it to gauge your exposure and not a time
            >limit. The manufacture should have this on there sheet. Once you
            >get that right, expose your plates to that time and not to the time
            >on the sheet as different machines will be different and bulb life
            >makes a great differance. You also need to check this from time to
            >time as bulbs decrease in output with age. The Stoufer Gauge will be
            >well worth the investment and will eliminate a lot of problems.

            --
            AzByCx DwEvFu GtHsIr JqKpLo MnNmOl PkQjRi ShTgUf VeWdXc YbZa&@
            {ARTQ: Help stop in-box bloat! Always Remember to Trim the Quote!}

            ExquisiteLetterpress http://www.exquisiteletterpress.com

            -:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*
            Peter Fraterdeus http://www.alphabets.com : Sign up for "MiceType"!
            Galena, Illinois Design Philosophy Fonts Lettering Letterpress Wood Type
            Dubuque, Iowa http://www.fraterdeus.com
            Photography Irish Fiddle Political Observation
            http://flickr.com/photos/pfraterdeus
            http://youtube.com/user/pfraterdeus
          • Peter Fraterdeus
            Hi Harold, et list Yep, 5 minutes give 14-15 on the Sto. scale. I think my post-exposure was therefore short also. (maybe 7-9 minutes?) Is there a pdf of the
            Message 5 of 15 , Feb 8, 2008
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              Hi Harold, et list

              Yep, 5 minutes give 14-15 on the Sto. scale.
              I think my post-exposure was therefore short also. (maybe 7-9 minutes?)

              Is there a pdf of the Toyobo KF95 "TIPS FOR PRINTIGHT" which they refer to on their site?

              I sure can't find the specifics for exposure etc on the site for this material!

              Thanks a million!
              Peter

              >Your exposure is probably too short. What happens when you try a 5
              >minute exposure? As others have said a Stouffer gauge would help.
              >
              >Harold

              --
              AzByCx DwEvFu GtHsIr JqKpLo MnNmOl PkQjRi ShTgUf VeWdXc YbZa&@
              {ARTQ: Help stop in-box bloat! Always Remember to Trim the Quote!}

              ExquisiteLetterpress http://www.exquisiteletterpress.com

              -:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*
              Peter Fraterdeus http://www.alphabets.com : Sign up for "MiceType"!
              Galena, Illinois Design Philosophy Fonts Lettering Letterpress Wood Type
              Dubuque, Iowa http://www.fraterdeus.com
              Photography Irish Fiddle Political Observation
              http://flickr.com/photos/pfraterdeus
              http://youtube.com/user/pfraterdeus
            • Gerald Lange
              Peter As I mentioned not more that three posts earlier, the Toyobo PDF is on site here (here meaning the PPLetterpress group site). Not sure how much more
              Message 6 of 15 , Feb 8, 2008
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                Peter

                As I mentioned not more that three posts earlier, the Toyobo PDF is on
                site here (here meaning the PPLetterpress group site). Not sure how
                much more clearer I can make this. Go to the Files section.
                Files>Reference materials>Toyobo Tips for Printight.pdf. Click on the
                file and it will open.

                Gerald
                http://BielerPress.blogspot.com

                --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, Peter Fraterdeus <peterf@...> wrote:
                >
                > Hi Harold, et list
                >
                > Yep, 5 minutes give 14-15 on the Sto. scale.
                > I think my post-exposure was therefore short also. (maybe 7-9 minutes?)
                >
                > Is there a pdf of the Toyobo KF95 "TIPS FOR PRINTIGHT" which they
                refer to on their site?
                >
                > I sure can't find the specifics for exposure etc on the site for
                this material!
                >
                > Thanks a million!
                > Peter
                >
                > >Your exposure is probably too short. What happens when you try a 5
                > >minute exposure? As others have said a Stouffer gauge would help.
                > >
                > >Harold
                >
                > --
                > AzByCx DwEvFu GtHsIr JqKpLo MnNmOl PkQjRi ShTgUf VeWdXc YbZa&@
                > {ARTQ: Help stop in-box bloat! Always Remember to Trim the Quote!}
                >
                > ExquisiteLetterpress http://www.exquisiteletterpress.com
                >
                >
                -:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*
                > Peter Fraterdeus http://www.alphabets.com : Sign up for "MiceType"!
                > Galena, Illinois Design Philosophy Fonts Lettering Letterpress Wood Type
                > Dubuque, Iowa http://www.fraterdeus.com
                > Photography Irish Fiddle Political Observation
                > http://flickr.com/photos/pfraterdeus
                > http://youtube.com/user/pfraterdeus
                >
              • Peter Fraterdeus
                Ah, THERE it is. Thanks Gerald. I was looking in Links. Ciao P ... -- AzByCx DwEvFu GtHsIr JqKpLo MnNmOl PkQjRi ShTgUf VeWdXc YbZa&@ {ARTQ: Help stop in-box
                Message 7 of 15 , Feb 8, 2008
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                  Ah, THERE it is.
                  Thanks Gerald.

                  I was looking in Links.

                  Ciao
                  P

                  At 9:47 PM +0000 8 02 08, Gerald Lange wrote:
                  >Peter
                  >
                  >As I mentioned not more that three posts earlier, the Toyobo PDF is on
                  >site here (here meaning the PPLetterpress group site). Not sure how
                  >much more clearer I can make this. Go to the Files section.
                  >Files>Reference materials>Toyobo Tips for Printight.pdf. Click on the
                  >file and it will open.
                  >
                  >Gerald
                  >http://BielerPress.blogspot.com

                  --
                  AzByCx DwEvFu GtHsIr JqKpLo MnNmOl PkQjRi ShTgUf VeWdXc YbZa&@
                  {ARTQ: Help stop in-box bloat! Always Remember to Trim the Quote!}

                  ExquisiteLetterpress http://www.exquisiteletterpress.com

                  -:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*
                  Peter Fraterdeus http://www.alphabets.com : Sign up for "MiceType"!
                  Galena, Illinois Design Philosophy Fonts Lettering Letterpress Wood Type
                  Dubuque, Iowa http://www.fraterdeus.com
                  Photography Irish Fiddle Political Observation
                  http://flickr.com/photos/pfraterdeus
                  http://youtube.com/user/pfraterdeus
                • Peter Fraterdeus
                  Following up here. It finally occurred to me to check some of the negatives I received before all the problems started. Of course, the recent ones are half the
                  Message 8 of 15 , Feb 8, 2008
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                    Following up here.
                    It finally occurred to me to check some of the negatives I received before all the problems started.
                    Of course, the recent ones are half the density.
                    I'm going to have a little chat with my local film bureau.
                    Thanks to all for the tips all around.
                    Cheers
                    Peter


                    At 9:10 AM -0500 8 02 08, Harold Kyle wrote:
                    >Your exposure is probably too short. What happens when you try a 5
                    >minute exposure? As others have said a Stouffer gauge would help.
                    >
                    >Harold
                    --
                    AzByCx DwEvFu GtHsIr JqKpLo MnNmOl PkQjRi ShTgUf VeWdXc YbZa&@
                    {ARTQ: Help stop in-box bloat! Always Remember to Trim the Quote!}

                    ExquisiteLetterpress http://www.exquisiteletterpress.com

                    -:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*
                    Peter Fraterdeus http://www.alphabets.com : Sign up for "MiceType"!
                    Galena, Illinois Design Philosophy Fonts Lettering Letterpress Wood Type
                    Dubuque, Iowa http://www.fraterdeus.com
                    Photography Irish Fiddle Political Observation
                    http://flickr.com/photos/pfraterdeus
                    http://youtube.com/user/pfraterdeus
                  • Lisa Davidson
                    Still, why do you get the grid pattern? I don t understand that part. Lisa ... [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    Message 9 of 15 , Feb 9, 2008
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                      Still, why do you get the grid pattern? I don't understand that part.
                      Lisa


                      On Feb 8, 2008, at 4:52 PM, Peter Fraterdeus wrote:

                      > Following up here.
                      > It finally occurred to me to check some of the negatives I received
                      > before all the problems started.
                      > Of course, the recent ones are half the density.
                      > I'm going to have a little chat with my local film bureau.
                      > Thanks to all for the tips all around.
                      > Cheers
                      > Peter
                      >
                      > At 9:10 AM -0500 8 02 08, Harold Kyle wrote:
                      > >Your exposure is probably too short. What happens when you try a 5
                      > >minute exposure? As others have said a Stouffer gauge would help.
                      > >
                      > >Harold
                      > --
                      > AzByCx DwEvFu GtHsIr JqKpLo MnNmOl PkQjRi ShTgUf VeWdXc YbZa&@
                      > {ARTQ: Help stop in-box bloat! Always Remember to Trim the Quote!}
                      >
                      > ExquisiteLetterpresshttp://www.exquisiteletterpress.com
                      >
                      > -:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-
                      > *-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*-:-*
                      > Peter Fraterdeus http://www.alphabets.com : Sign up for "MiceType"!
                      > Galena, Illinois Design Philosophy Fonts Lettering Letterpress Wood
                      > Type
                      > Dubuque, Iowa http://www.fraterdeus.com
                      > Photography Irish Fiddle Political Observation
                      > http://flickr.com/photos/pfraterdeus
                      > http://youtube.com/user/pfraterdeus
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >



                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    • Peter Fraterdeus
                      ... Hi Lisa I think what s happening is that the negative is at the very very edge of blocking the UV, so, much of the floor (unexposed areas) of the plate is
                      Message 10 of 15 , Feb 9, 2008
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                        On 9 Feb 2008, at 4:10 PM, Lisa Davidson wrote:

                        > Still, why do you get the grid pattern? I don't understand that part.
                        > Lisa



                        Hi Lisa

                        I think what's happening is that the negative is at the very very edge
                        of blocking the UV, so, much of the floor (unexposed areas) of the
                        plate is in fact removed in the washout. However, there's some
                        interaction between the film and the 'creases' in the kreene (I don't
                        know what it could be, but it's gotta be there) which correspond to
                        where the grid is below. This interaction -- perhaps the kreene is
                        slightly thinner there, or slightly stretched or the creases act as a
                        UV lens and focus it just enough(???) -- creates an optical path which
                        is enough less opaque to the UV that the polymer reaches the exposure
                        threshold.

                        Other than that thought experiment, ya got me.

                        It's a head scratcher. I ordered some negs from Boxcar, which should
                        put at least that part of the question to rest ;-)
                        I also ordered some fresh kreene (straight from the Kow, I expect).
                        We shall see... I'll be back from the Chicago area toward the end of
                        the week, and will post results then.

                        Peter Fraterdeus
                        http://ExquisiteLetterpress.com
                        http://dubuquebookarts.com
                        >
                      • Lisa Davidson
                        Peter -- Wow. I guess you could use glass instead of kreene. It would lengthen your exposure times but not crease anyway. Lisa ... [Non-text portions of this
                        Message 11 of 15 , Feb 9, 2008
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                          Peter -- Wow. I guess you could use glass instead of kreene. It
                          would lengthen your exposure times but not crease anyway.

                          Lisa


                          On Feb 9, 2008, at 3:46 PM, Peter Fraterdeus wrote:

                          >
                          >
                          > On 9 Feb 2008, at 4:10 PM, Lisa Davidson wrote:
                          >
                          > > Still, why do you get the grid pattern? I don't understand that
                          > part.
                          > > Lisa
                          >
                          > Hi Lisa
                          >
                          > I think what's happening is that the negative is at the very very edge
                          > of blocking the UV, so, much of the floor (unexposed areas) of the
                          > plate is in fact removed in the washout. However, there's some
                          > interaction between the film and the 'creases' in the kreene (I don't
                          > know what it could be, but it's gotta be there) which correspond to
                          > where the grid is below. This interaction -- perhaps the kreene is
                          > slightly thinner there, or slightly stretched or the creases act as a
                          > UV lens and focus it just enough(???) -- creates an optical path which
                          > is enough less opaque to the UV that the polymer reaches the exposure
                          > threshold.
                          >
                          > Other than that thought experiment, ya got me.
                          >
                          > It's a head scratcher. I ordered some negs from Boxcar, which should
                          > put at least that part of the question to rest ;-)
                          > I also ordered some fresh kreene (straight from the Kow, I expect).
                          > We shall see... I'll be back from the Chicago area toward the end of
                          > the week, and will post results then.
                          >
                          > Peter Fraterdeus
                          > http://ExquisiteLetterpress.com
                          > http://dubuquebookarts.com
                          > >
                          >
                          >



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