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Re: [PPLetterpress] Ink prefs

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  • David Glover
    So, how can you tell if you have a heavy bodied ink. If you use a grind guage, what readings does it have to show? Am I making too much of this?
    Message 1 of 14 , Sep 5, 2001
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      So, how can you tell if you have a "heavy bodied" ink.
      If you use a grind guage, what readings does it have to show?

      Am I making too much of this?
    • bjorn@bjornpress.com
      David and list, In my personal experience there is a huge difference in offset inks and letterpress inks--there is another issue about the vibrancy of the
      Message 2 of 14 , Sep 5, 2001
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        David and list,

        In my personal experience there is a huge difference in offset inks
        and letterpress inks--there is another issue about the vibrancy of
        the colors--which I'm still researching, but so far I favor pigmented
        inks rather than mixed ink for pms colors for example.

        Back to the difference between offset and letterpress inks.
        Letterpress inks should be "heavy bodied" as it says in the
        heidelberg windmill manual. I've had designers bring me ink from the
        offset printers so that I could match colors. Most offset ink is way
        too thin and runny thus resulting in more slur and "fuzzy" printing.
        Some ink I've used has been for offset and it is tolerably thick,
        others too thin. It all depends on the ink. All the old letterpress
        inks, so I've heard and seen a little, were called something like
        "heavy bond . . . ." For example, heavy bond black.

        Personally I can't tell the difference between oil or acrylic. The
        local ink company Gans Ink says that the acrylic is meant to behave
        like rubber based in that it doesn't dry as fast on press as oil
        based. I've run the same form using oil and acrylic and can't tell
        the difference.

        If you are using polymer, rubber based ink won't stick to the
        surface, so I've always avoided it. But I've heard from a friend that
        if you get the matte surface plates that rubber will work, or if you
        coat the surface of the plate and then let it dry.

        I've found a few inks that work well, and I'm forgetting the
        manufacturer . . . but I'm still looking for ink companies that know
        the "old formulas" for heavy bodied pigmented inks. I hope this is
        of some help.

        Bryce Knudson
        Bjorn Press






        >Most everything I read says that there is very little difference between
        >letterpress and offset ink. No one has really made an issue between
        >oil-based, acrylic, and rubber based inks either. THERE HAS GOT TO BE A\/*
        >DIFFERENCE! Any insight or just plain bias?
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

        .
      • Joel Benson
        Well, sure there is a difference. The body of the different inks is different. Oil base is usually looser than rubber base and this affects how it
        Message 3 of 14 , Sep 5, 2001
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          Well, sure there is a difference. The "body" of the different inks is
          different. Oil base is usually "looser" than rubber base and this
          affects how it behaves on press. Rubberbase stays tacky on press a lot
          longer, which is a valuable asset at times.

          I've also noticed that rubberbase ink doesn't lay down nicely over other
          inks. Tends to break up or look uneven. Oil base looks fine printed
          over other inks, so I always use it when overprinting.

          I don't know about letterpress inks vs. offset inks, and I don't think
          I've ever used acrylic ink. Probably any ink will "work" on a
          letterpress, to some degree, but each has it's strengths and weaknesses.


          Joel Benson
          Dependable Letterpress
          San Francisco

          -----Original Message-----
          From: David Glover [mailto:dglover@...]
          Sent: Wednesday, September 05, 2001 1:22 PM
          To: PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: [PPLetterpress] Ink prefs


          Most everything I read says that there is very little difference between
          letterpress and offset ink. No one has really made an issue between
          oil-based, acrylic, and rubber based inks either. THERE HAS GOT TO BE A
          DIFFERENCE! Any insight or just plain bias?





          Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
          http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
        • Gerald Lange
          ... Dear David I m not sure that you can make too much of anything here. If you have a question there is a need to know. I don t know what a grind gauge is
          Message 4 of 14 , Sep 6, 2001
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            --- In PPLetterpress@y..., "David Glover" <dglover@g...> wrote:
            > So, how can you tell if you have a "heavy bodied" ink.
            > If you use a grind guage, what readings does it have to show?
            >
            > Am I making too much of this?

            Dear David

            I'm not sure that you can make "too much" of anything here. If you
            have a question there is a need to know. I don't know what a grind
            gauge is or actually how useful that may be in non-industrial usage
            (just guessing).

            As an advocate of "normative principles," I'm all for some gadget that
            will guarantee this or that but I'm not sure that any answer here is a
            quick fix.

            After all the PP, you are still left with the basics of letterpress. I
            suspect we are a bit heavy on the prepress aspect here but somewhat
            ignore presswork. From the get go I wondered if we'd ever talk about
            "letterpress" here because its somewhat assumed that anyone exploring
            PP and other techniques already knows their stuff.

            In this regard, I am concerned about a new generation of letterpress
            printing "advocates" who do not know their "stuff," and lets say, who
            will never have set metal type by hand. I talked to the head of a
            letterpress studio (which had a photopolymer plate processing machine)
            and I was told offhandedly that the students only use the metal type
            to initially set their names in a composing stick. Then on to the
            computer. This is a mistake. Here the process is not seen as the
            "saving grace" of letterpress, it is seen as the easy way out. Make
            the plate, smash it into the paper. Presto. Letterpress. Is this its
            artificial end?

            But...ink (let's get back to that Ger), I can explain a heavy bodied
            ink as opposed to a thin bodied ink etc but ultimately, its an
            experiential thing. I could tell you this or that and so what?. As can
            anyone else. What you might want to do is check out the work of
            printers you admire. What do they use? And more importantly, how do
            they use it? Personally, I want to know what ink Victor Hammer used.
            The additional problem, of course, is how does one emulate the craft
            concerns of Victor Hammer when one is not Victor Hammer?

            Good night
          • Gerald Lange
            ... Dear Bryce How do you coat the polymer for rubber based inks? What do you use to do this? I d never heard this before—that rubber based inks won t
            Message 5 of 14 , Sep 6, 2001
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              bjorn@b... wrote:

              > ....If you are using polymer, rubber based ink won't stick to the
              > surface, so I've always avoided it. But I've heard from a friend that
              > if you get the matte surface plates that rubber will work, or if you
              > coat the surface of the plate and then let it dry....
              >

              > Bryce Knudson
              > Bjorn Press
              >

              Dear Bryce

              How do you "coat" the polymer for rubber based inks? What do you use
              to do this?


              I'd never heard this before—that rubber based inks won't stick to
              photopolymer. By rubber-based inks are you talking about the older Van
              Son type formulation? Most inks being produced today are hybrids of
              sorts. Hard to say if any one ink consists solely of rubber or oil.
              Unless you go back to old formula.

              Recently I had Handschy make up a batch of collotype ink from an old
              formula. They hadn't made the ink in over ten years. So ink companies
              can do this for you, but, of course, you pay a very steep price.
              Normally I've always avoided mixing inks based on different formula
              but for the collotype we had to use a variety of inks to give us an
              immediate fix for viscosity alteration (needed to counteract
              fluctuation in atmospheric pressure/temperature/humidity—bit of a
              different animal) during the print run, and one of these was the old
              tried and true Van Son rubber base 10850.

              I got so used to using it for altering viscosity that when I recently
              printed a broadside I mixed the Van Son with a stone litho ink
              (heavily pigmented/high viscosity), which I use for most of my work,
              and noticed odd "splinters" of ink on the polymer printing surface. I
              assume this is a failure of the inks to coalesce. Or perhaps, as you
              suggest, rubber based inks react differently to photopolymer? The
              pick-up to the printed sheet didn't reveal the "splinters" but there
              was an odd sparkle to the black.


              Anyone know a bit more about this?


              [Wonder if some company somewhere holds the formula for the Mandlik
              black that was labeled for letterpress printing on dampened paper?
              This was the ink Lewis Allen recommended in Printing With the
              Handpress.]


              Ger> .
            • Gerald Lange
              Hi Mark Well, you have me sitting on my hands with this one. Do you know what the ingredients are? Who is the manufacturer, and what is the brand name?
              Message 6 of 14 , Sep 6, 2001
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                Hi Mark

                Well, you have me sitting on my hands with this one. Do you know what the
                ingredients are? Who is the manufacturer, and what is the brand name?
                Especially interested because you use it for hand-litho. Don't do hand-litho
                myself, but find the ink formulations are much better for studio-letterpress
                applications. Thanks!

                All best

                G


                Mark Attwood wrote:
                >
                > Hi Gerald,
                >
                > I don't know if anyone else has used this, but I use aerosol (I hope the
                > spelling is correct) a lot, as a modifyer in the ink, both for
                > hand-lithography and letterpress.
                >
                > It is a white powder, extremely light and fluffy, a bit like magnesium
                > carbonate, but makes the ink more bodied than mag. It is apparently so fine
                > that if you breathe it in it will end up in your blood! so what I do to
                > avoid breathing it in, is ask the ink manufacturer to mix it with tinting
                > medium until it is about the consistency of window putty, and then I use
                > that to body any ink I print with, and it really seems to work well.
                >
                > Mark.
                >
                > Mark Attwood
                >
                > The Artists' Press
                > Box 623
                > Newtown
                > 2113
                > South Africa
                >
                > Tel. +27 11 836 5474
                > fax. +27 11 836 6858
                > mark@...
              • Mark Attwood
                Hi Gerald, I don t know if anyone else has used this, but I use aerosol (I hope the spelling is correct) a lot, as a modifyer in the ink, both for
                Message 7 of 14 , Sep 7, 2001
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                  Hi Gerald,

                  I don't know if anyone else has used this, but I use aerosol (I hope the
                  spelling is correct) a lot, as a modifyer in the ink, both for
                  hand-lithography and letterpress.

                  It is a white powder, extremely light and fluffy, a bit like magnesium
                  carbonate, but makes the ink more bodied than mag. It is apparently so fine
                  that if you breathe it in it will end up in your blood! so what I do to
                  avoid breathing it in, is ask the ink manufacturer to mix it with tinting
                  medium until it is about the consistency of window putty, and then I use
                  that to body any ink I print with, and it really seems to work well.

                  Mark.


                  Mark Attwood

                  The Artists' Press
                  Box 623
                  Newtown
                  2113
                  South Africa

                  Tel. +27 11 836 5474
                  fax. +27 11 836 6858
                  mark@...


                  ----------
                  >From: "Gerald Lange" <bieler@...>
                  >To: PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com
                  >Subject: [PPLetterpress] Re: Ink prefs
                  >Date: Thu, Sep 6, 2001, 5:47 pm
                  >

                  > bjorn@b... wrote:
                  >
                  >> ....If you are using polymer, rubber based ink won't stick to the
                  >> surface, so I've always avoided it. But I've heard from a friend that
                  >> if you get the matte surface plates that rubber will work, or if you
                  >> coat the surface of the plate and then let it dry....
                  >>
                  >
                  >> Bryce Knudson
                  >> Bjorn Press
                  >>
                  >
                  > Dear Bryce
                  >
                  > How do you "coat" the polymer for rubber based inks? What do you use
                  > to do this?
                  >
                  >
                  > I'd never heard this before—that rubber based inks won't stick to
                  > photopolymer. By rubber-based inks are you talking about the older Van
                  > Son type formulation? Most inks being produced today are hybrids of
                  > sorts. Hard to say if any one ink consists solely of rubber or oil.
                  > Unless you go back to old formula.
                  >
                  > Recently I had Handschy make up a batch of collotype ink from an old
                  > formula. They hadn't made the ink in over ten years. So ink companies
                  > can do this for you, but, of course, you pay a very steep price.
                  > Normally I've always avoided mixing inks based on different formula
                  > but for the collotype we had to use a variety of inks to give us an
                  > immediate fix for viscosity alteration (needed to counteract
                  > fluctuation in atmospheric pressure/temperature/humidity—bit of a
                  > different animal) during the print run, and one of these was the old
                  > tried and true Van Son rubber base 10850.
                  >
                  > I got so used to using it for altering viscosity that when I recently
                  > printed a broadside I mixed the Van Son with a stone litho ink
                  > (heavily pigmented/high viscosity), which I use for most of my work,
                  > and noticed odd "splinters" of ink on the polymer printing surface. I
                  > assume this is a failure of the inks to coalesce. Or perhaps, as you
                  > suggest, rubber based inks react differently to photopolymer? The
                  > pick-up to the printed sheet didn't reveal the "splinters" but there
                  > was an odd sparkle to the black.
                  >
                  >
                  > Anyone know a bit more about this?
                  >
                  >
                  > [Wonder if some company somewhere holds the formula for the Mandlik
                  > black that was labeled for letterpress printing on dampened paper?
                  > This was the ink Lewis Allen recommended in Printing With the
                  > Handpress.]
                  >
                  >
                  > Ger> .
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                  >
                • Mark Attwood
                  Hi Gerald, I don t know what the ingredients of aerosol/Arosil? are, but I first heard about it from someone at Smith College, USA, and when I spoke to the
                  Message 8 of 14 , Sep 7, 2001
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                    Hi Gerald,

                    I don't know what the ingredients of aerosol/Arosil? are, but I first heard
                    about it from someone at Smith College, USA, and when I spoke to the local
                    Johannesburg ink manufacturers (two different ones), they knew exactly what
                    I was talking about, and could give me what I wanted.

                    Let me know if you find out the correct name!

                    regards,
                    Mark.



                    Mark Attwood

                    The Artists' Press
                    Box 623
                    Newtown
                    2113
                    South Africa

                    Tel. +27 11 836 5474
                    fax. +27 11 836 6858
                    mark@...


                    ----------
                    >From: Gerald Lange <bieler@...>
                    >To: PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com
                    >Subject: Re: [PPLetterpress] Re: Ink prefs
                    >Date: Fri, Sep 7, 2001, 6:21 am
                    >

                    > Hi Mark
                    >
                    > Well, you have me sitting on my hands with this one. Do you know what the
                    > ingredients are? Who is the manufacturer, and what is the brand name?
                    > Especially interested because you use it for hand-litho. Don't do hand-litho
                    > myself, but find the ink formulations are much better for studio-letterpress
                    > applications. Thanks!
                    >
                    > All best
                    >
                    > G
                    >
                    >
                    > Mark Attwood wrote:
                    >>
                    >> Hi Gerald,
                    >>
                    >> I don't know if anyone else has used this, but I use aerosol (I hope the
                    >> spelling is correct) a lot, as a modifyer in the ink, both for
                    >> hand-lithography and letterpress.
                    >>
                    >> It is a white powder, extremely light and fluffy, a bit like magnesium
                    >> carbonate, but makes the ink more bodied than mag. It is apparently so fine
                    >> that if you breathe it in it will end up in your blood! so what I do to
                    >> avoid breathing it in, is ask the ink manufacturer to mix it with tinting
                    >> medium until it is about the consistency of window putty, and then I use
                    >> that to body any ink I print with, and it really seems to work well.
                    >>
                    >> Mark.
                    >>
                    >> Mark Attwood
                    >>
                    >> The Artists' Press
                    >> Box 623
                    >> Newtown
                    >> 2113
                    >> South Africa
                    >>
                    >> Tel. +27 11 836 5474
                    >> fax. +27 11 836 6858
                    >> mark@...
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                    >
                  • Katie Harper
                    Dear Mark and Chris: I m used to mag carbonate but have not heard about the products that you like that add extra body to inks. My question is this: do they
                    Message 9 of 14 , Sep 9, 2001
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                      Dear Mark and Chris:

                      I'm used to mag carbonate but have not heard about the products that you
                      like that add extra body to inks. My question is this: do they add any color
                      at all? Seems like something like the white Chris describes or even the
                      "window putty" that Mark likes would also tend to change the color of the
                      ink that it is mixed with.

                      I just purchased an entire letterpress shop that includes, among many other
                      wonderful things, cans and cans and cans of ink, mostly in 5# cans, all
                      sealed as new. I have no idea what type of ink they contain, but I suspect
                      that the guy who owned the shop I purchased probably himself purchased
                      another letterpress shop going out of business, although these could well be
                      offset inks. Most were packed about 1990-91. One description, for example,
                      from the Wickoff Color Corporation, is for PMS 279 Blue Wax Free. Does
                      anyone know what type of ink this is?

                      Katie Harper




                      Remember: Book arts will save the world!



                      > From: "Mark Attwood" <mark@...>
                      > Reply-To: PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com
                      > Date: Fri, 07 Sep 2001 14:37:31 +0000
                      > To: PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com
                      > Subject: Re: [PPLetterpress] Re: Ink prefs
                      >
                      > Hi Gerald,
                      >
                      > I don't know what the ingredients of aerosol/Arosil? are, but I first heard
                      > about it from someone at Smith College, USA, and when I spoke to the local
                      > Johannesburg ink manufacturers (two different ones), they knew exactly what
                      > I was talking about, and could give me what I wanted.
                      >
                      > Let me know if you find out the correct name!
                      >
                      > regards,
                      > Mark.
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > Mark Attwood
                      >
                      > The Artists' Press
                      > Box 623
                      > Newtown
                      > 2113
                      > South Africa
                      >
                      > Tel. +27 11 836 5474
                      > fax. +27 11 836 6858
                      > mark@...
                      >
                      >
                      > ----------
                      >> From: Gerald Lange <bieler@...>
                      >> To: PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com
                      >> Subject: Re: [PPLetterpress] Re: Ink prefs
                      >> Date: Fri, Sep 7, 2001, 6:21 am
                      >>
                      >
                      >> Hi Mark
                      >>
                      >> Well, you have me sitting on my hands with this one. Do you know what the
                      >> ingredients are? Who is the manufacturer, and what is the brand name?
                      >> Especially interested because you use it for hand-litho. Don't do hand-litho
                      >> myself, but find the ink formulations are much better for studio-letterpress
                      >> applications. Thanks!
                      >>
                      >> All best
                      >>
                      >> G
                      >>
                      >>
                      >> Mark Attwood wrote:
                      >>>
                      >>> Hi Gerald,
                      >>>
                      >>> I don't know if anyone else has used this, but I use aerosol (I hope the
                      >>> spelling is correct) a lot, as a modifyer in the ink, both for
                      >>> hand-lithography and letterpress.
                      >>>
                      >>> It is a white powder, extremely light and fluffy, a bit like magnesium
                      >>> carbonate, but makes the ink more bodied than mag. It is apparently so fine
                      >>> that if you breathe it in it will end up in your blood! so what I do to
                      >>> avoid breathing it in, is ask the ink manufacturer to mix it with tinting
                      >>> medium until it is about the consistency of window putty, and then I use
                      >>> that to body any ink I print with, and it really seems to work well.
                      >>>
                      >>> Mark.
                      >>>
                      >>> Mark Attwood
                      >>>
                      >>> The Artists' Press
                      >>> Box 623
                      >>> Newtown
                      >>> 2113
                      >>> South Africa
                      >>>
                      >>> Tel. +27 11 836 5474
                      >>> fax. +27 11 836 6858
                      >>> mark@...
                      >>
                      >>
                      >>
                      >>
                      >>
                      >> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                      >>
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                      >
                      >
                    • flywheel@premier1.net
                      Katie Yes, the LCC (Letterpress Conversion Compound) does change the color of the ink as well, but that s good. When you re trying to mix a PMS color, we
                      Message 10 of 14 , Sep 9, 2001
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                        Katie

                        Yes, the LCC (Letterpress Conversion Compound) does change the color of the
                        ink as well, but that's good. When you're trying to mix a PMS color, we
                        almost always have to add opaque white to the mix in order to get the exact
                        match we want. We never use the trans. white that the formulas call for
                        because that only thins the ink to the point where the color isn't anywhere
                        at all what we want. The LCC was designed to bring the mixed color back to
                        where it should be for letterpress. If you follow the formula exactly as
                        written in the PMS books, you will never get your color match. Those PMS
                        colors as designed for offset printing which, obviously, puts ink down in a
                        whole different way than letterpress. The LCC works similarly to straight
                        opaque white only it's got ten times the body which makes for a wonderful
                        letterpress printing ink.

                        My guess about the PMS 279 BLue Wax Free ink would be that it's just regular
                        old oil base ink without wax (an additive that was put into ink in order to
                        reduce its tack and increase its flow). At least I think that's what it was
                        for. I am in no way an expert on ink, but I know what works when I see it,
                        and I've been looking for this LCC for years. I never had much luck with
                        magnesium carbonate and it doesn't work nearly as well as this LCC.

                        The reason I've been going on and on about this LCC is that I want to try
                        and help develop a market for it so that it will be around when next I need
                        to order it. The more people who buy it, the likelier its survival.

                        Chris Stern
                        Stern & Faye, Printers
                        Sedro-Woolley, WA
                        98284


                        ----------
                        >From: Katie Harper <knharper@...>
                        >To: <PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com>
                        >Subject: Re: [PPLetterpress] Re: Ink prefs
                        >Date: Sun, Sep 9, 2001, 6:07 AM
                        >

                        > Dear Mark and Chris:
                        >
                        > I'm used to mag carbonate but have not heard about the products that you
                        > like that add extra body to inks. My question is this: do they add any color
                        > at all? Seems like something like the white Chris describes or even the
                        > "window putty" that Mark likes would also tend to change the color of the
                        > ink that it is mixed with.
                        >
                        > I just purchased an entire letterpress shop that includes, among many other
                        > wonderful things, cans and cans and cans of ink, mostly in 5# cans, all
                        > sealed as new. I have no idea what type of ink they contain, but I suspect
                        > that the guy who owned the shop I purchased probably himself purchased
                        > another letterpress shop going out of business, although these could well be
                        > offset inks. Most were packed about 1990-91. One description, for example,
                        > from the Wickoff Color Corporation, is for PMS 279 Blue Wax Free. Does
                        > anyone know what type of ink this is?
                        >
                        > Katie Harper
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > Remember: Book arts will save the world!
                        >
                        >
                      • Mark Attwood
                        Hi Katie, theoretically whatever additive you put in the ink should affect the colour, but I guess the amount is so small compared to the amount of pigment in
                        Message 11 of 14 , Sep 10, 2001
                        • 0 Attachment
                          Hi Katie,

                          theoretically whatever additive you put in the ink should affect the colour,
                          but I guess the amount is so small compared to the amount of pigment in the
                          ink that it is not noticeable, except for perhaps really light or
                          transparent colours.

                          Mark.



                          Mark Attwood

                          The Artists' Press
                          Box 623
                          Newtown
                          2113
                          South Africa

                          Tel. +27 11 836 5474
                          fax. +27 11 836 6858
                          mark@...


                          ----------
                          >From: Katie Harper <knharper@...>
                          >To: <PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com>
                          >Subject: Re: [PPLetterpress] Re: Ink prefs
                          >Date: Sun, Sep 9, 2001, 1:07 pm
                          >

                          > Dear Mark and Chris:
                          >
                          > I'm used to mag carbonate but have not heard about the products that you
                          > like that add extra body to inks. My question is this: do they add any color
                          > at all? Seems like something like the white Chris describes or even the
                          > "window putty" that Mark likes would also tend to change the color of the
                          > ink that it is mixed with.
                          >
                          > I just purchased an entire letterpress shop that includes, among many other
                          > wonderful things, cans and cans and cans of ink, mostly in 5# cans, all
                          > sealed as new. I have no idea what type of ink they contain, but I suspect
                          > that the guy who owned the shop I purchased probably himself purchased
                          > another letterpress shop going out of business, although these could well be
                          > offset inks. Most were packed about 1990-91. One description, for example,
                          > from the Wickoff Color Corporation, is for PMS 279 Blue Wax Free. Does
                          > anyone know what type of ink this is?
                          >
                          > Katie Harper
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > Remember: Book arts will save the world!
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >> From: "Mark Attwood" <mark@...>
                          >> Reply-To: PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com
                          >> Date: Fri, 07 Sep 2001 14:37:31 +0000
                          >> To: PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com
                          >> Subject: Re: [PPLetterpress] Re: Ink prefs
                          >>
                          >> Hi Gerald,
                          >>
                          >> I don't know what the ingredients of aerosol/Arosil? are, but I first heard
                          >> about it from someone at Smith College, USA, and when I spoke to the local
                          >> Johannesburg ink manufacturers (two different ones), they knew exactly what
                          >> I was talking about, and could give me what I wanted.
                          >>
                          >> Let me know if you find out the correct name!
                          >>
                          >> regards,
                          >> Mark.
                          >>
                          >>
                          >>
                          >> Mark Attwood
                          >>
                          >> The Artists' Press
                          >> Box 623
                          >> Newtown
                          >> 2113
                          >> South Africa
                          >>
                          >> Tel. +27 11 836 5474
                          >> fax. +27 11 836 6858
                          >> mark@...
                          >>
                          >>
                          >> ----------
                          >>> From: Gerald Lange <bieler@...>
                          >>> To: PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com
                          >>> Subject: Re: [PPLetterpress] Re: Ink prefs
                          >>> Date: Fri, Sep 7, 2001, 6:21 am
                          >>>
                          >>
                          >>> Hi Mark
                          >>>
                          >>> Well, you have me sitting on my hands with this one. Do you know what the
                          >>> ingredients are? Who is the manufacturer, and what is the brand name?
                          >>> Especially interested because you use it for hand-litho. Don't do hand-litho
                          >>> myself, but find the ink formulations are much better for studio-letterpress
                          >>> applications. Thanks!
                          >>>
                          >>> All best
                          >>>
                          >>> G
                          >>>
                          >>>
                          >>> Mark Attwood wrote:
                          >>>>
                          >>>> Hi Gerald,
                          >>>>
                          >>>> I don't know if anyone else has used this, but I use aerosol (I hope the
                          >>>> spelling is correct) a lot, as a modifyer in the ink, both for
                          >>>> hand-lithography and letterpress.
                          >>>>
                          >>>> It is a white powder, extremely light and fluffy, a bit like magnesium
                          >>>> carbonate, but makes the ink more bodied than mag. It is apparently so fine
                          >>>> that if you breathe it in it will end up in your blood! so what I do to
                          >>>> avoid breathing it in, is ask the ink manufacturer to mix it with tinting
                          >>>> medium until it is about the consistency of window putty, and then I use
                          >>>> that to body any ink I print with, and it really seems to work well.
                          >>>>
                          >>>> Mark.
                          >>>>
                          >>>> Mark Attwood
                          >>>>
                          >>>> The Artists' Press
                          >>>> Box 623
                          >>>> Newtown
                          >>>> 2113
                          >>>> South Africa
                          >>>>
                          >>>> Tel. +27 11 836 5474
                          >>>> fax. +27 11 836 6858
                          >>>> mark@...
                          >>>
                          >>>
                          >>>
                          >>>
                          >>>
                          >>> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                          >>>
                          >>
                          >>
                          >>
                          >>
                          >> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                          >>
                          >>
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                          >
                        • Katie Harper
                          Thanks to all who responded to my query about ink additives. When I was in graduate school as a printmaker, I once had a half day workshop on ink additives...
                          Message 12 of 14 , Sep 10, 2001
                          • 0 Attachment
                            Thanks to all who responded to my query about ink additives. When I was in
                            graduate school as a printmaker, I once had a half day workshop on ink
                            additives... I confess I wasn't as enthralled as I might have been, not
                            thinking it probably would be useful one day...

                            I also got another reply offline from Dan at Indian Hill press, and am
                            posting it here for those of you who were curious, as I was, about "Wax-free
                            inks."

                            Dear Katie:

                            Just got your bulletin on the Letterpress list.

                            Wax-free inks are important to printers who to do hot foil-stamping
                            on top of a printed surface. If the ink contains wax, the heat will
                            melt it and the foil will not adhere. Wax-free ink generally dries
                            very quickly, so don't leave it on your press overnight. It is also a
                            specialty ink, and more expensive than general job inks.

                            Best,
                            Dan Waters
                            Indian Hill Press





                            Remember: Book arts will save the world!



                            > From: "Mark Attwood" <mark@...>
                            > Reply-To: PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com
                            > Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2001 10:29:29 +0000
                            > To: PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com
                            > Subject: Re: [PPLetterpress] Re: Ink prefs
                            >
                            > Hi Katie,
                            >
                            > theoretically whatever additive you put in the ink should affect the colour,
                            > but I guess the amount is so small compared to the amount of pigment in the
                            > ink that it is not noticeable, except for perhaps really light or
                            > transparent colours.
                            >
                            > Mark.
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            > Mark Attwood
                            >
                            > The Artists' Press
                            > Box 623
                            > Newtown
                            > 2113
                            > South Africa
                            >
                            > Tel. +27 11 836 5474
                            > fax. +27 11 836 6858
                            > mark@...
                            >
                            >
                            > ----------
                            >> From: Katie Harper <knharper@...>
                            >> To: <PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com>
                            >> Subject: Re: [PPLetterpress] Re: Ink prefs
                            >> Date: Sun, Sep 9, 2001, 1:07 pm
                            >>
                            >
                            >> Dear Mark and Chris:
                            >>
                            >> I'm used to mag carbonate but have not heard about the products that you
                            >> like that add extra body to inks. My question is this: do they add any color
                            >> at all? Seems like something like the white Chris describes or even the
                            >> "window putty" that Mark likes would also tend to change the color of the
                            >> ink that it is mixed with.
                            >>
                            >> I just purchased an entire letterpress shop that includes, among many other
                            >> wonderful things, cans and cans and cans of ink, mostly in 5# cans, all
                            >> sealed as new. I have no idea what type of ink they contain, but I suspect
                            >> that the guy who owned the shop I purchased probably himself purchased
                            >> another letterpress shop going out of business, although these could well be
                            >> offset inks. Most were packed about 1990-91. One description, for example,
                            >> from the Wickoff Color Corporation, is for PMS 279 Blue Wax Free. Does
                            >> anyone know what type of ink this is?
                            >>
                            >> Katie Harper
                            >>
                            >>
                            >>
                            >>
                            >> Remember: Book arts will save the world!
                            >>
                            >>
                            >>
                            >>> From: "Mark Attwood" <mark@...>
                            >>> Reply-To: PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com
                            >>> Date: Fri, 07 Sep 2001 14:37:31 +0000
                            >>> To: PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com
                            >>> Subject: Re: [PPLetterpress] Re: Ink prefs
                            >>>
                            >>> Hi Gerald,
                            >>>
                            >>> I don't know what the ingredients of aerosol/Arosil? are, but I first heard
                            >>> about it from someone at Smith College, USA, and when I spoke to the local
                            >>> Johannesburg ink manufacturers (two different ones), they knew exactly what
                            >>> I was talking about, and could give me what I wanted.
                            >>>
                            >>> Let me know if you find out the correct name!
                            >>>
                            >>> regards,
                            >>> Mark.
                            >>>
                            >>>
                            >>>
                            >>> Mark Attwood
                            >>>
                            >>> The Artists' Press
                            >>> Box 623
                            >>> Newtown
                            >>> 2113
                            >>> South Africa
                            >>>
                            >>> Tel. +27 11 836 5474
                            >>> fax. +27 11 836 6858
                            >>> mark@...
                            >>>
                            >>>
                            >>> ----------
                            >>>> From: Gerald Lange <bieler@...>
                            >>>> To: PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com
                            >>>> Subject: Re: [PPLetterpress] Re: Ink prefs
                            >>>> Date: Fri, Sep 7, 2001, 6:21 am
                            >>>>
                            >>>
                            >>>> Hi Mark
                            >>>>
                            >>>> Well, you have me sitting on my hands with this one. Do you know what the
                            >>>> ingredients are? Who is the manufacturer, and what is the brand name?
                            >>>> Especially interested because you use it for hand-litho. Don't do
                            >>>> hand-litho
                            >>>> myself, but find the ink formulations are much better for
                            >>>> studio-letterpress
                            >>>> applications. Thanks!
                            >>>>
                            >>>> All best
                            >>>>
                            >>>> G
                            >>>>
                            >>>>
                            >>>> Mark Attwood wrote:
                            >>>>>
                            >>>>> Hi Gerald,
                            >>>>>
                            >>>>> I don't know if anyone else has used this, but I use aerosol (I hope the
                            >>>>> spelling is correct) a lot, as a modifyer in the ink, both for
                            >>>>> hand-lithography and letterpress.
                            >>>>>
                            >>>>> It is a white powder, extremely light and fluffy, a bit like magnesium
                            >>>>> carbonate, but makes the ink more bodied than mag. It is apparently so
                            >>>>> fine
                            >>>>> that if you breathe it in it will end up in your blood! so what I do to
                            >>>>> avoid breathing it in, is ask the ink manufacturer to mix it with tinting
                            >>>>> medium until it is about the consistency of window putty, and then I use
                            >>>>> that to body any ink I print with, and it really seems to work well.
                            >>>>>
                            >>>>> Mark.
                            >>>>>
                            >>>>> Mark Attwood
                            >>>>>
                            >>>>> The Artists' Press
                            >>>>> Box 623
                            >>>>> Newtown
                            >>>>> 2113
                            >>>>> South Africa
                            >>>>>
                            >>>>> Tel. +27 11 836 5474
                            >>>>> fax. +27 11 836 6858
                            >>>>> mark@...
                            >>>>
                            >>>>
                            >>>>
                            >>>>
                            >>>>
                            >>>> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                            >>>>
                            >>>
                            >>>
                            >>>
                            >>>
                            >>> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                            >>>
                            >>>
                            >>
                            >>
                            >>
                            >>
                            >>
                            >>
                            >> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                            >>
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                            >
                            >
                          • Terrence Chouinard
                            ... Chris I m guessing the LCC doesn t dry out your ink as fast as magnesium carbonate does. Any sense if this is the case or not? Terry Terrence Chouinard the
                            Message 13 of 14 , Sep 10, 2001
                            • 0 Attachment
                              > I never had much luck with
                              > magnesium carbonate and it doesn't work nearly as well as this LCC.


                              Chris
                              I'm guessing the LCC doesn't dry out your ink as fast as magnesium carbonate
                              does. Any sense if this is the case or not?

                              Terry


                              Terrence Chouinard
                              the Wing & the Wheel Press
                              Box 216
                              Aurora, New York 13026
                              315-364-6920
                              tpc@...
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