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Re: [PPLetterpress] Problem with plate outline showing up on deep impression

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  • Peter Fraterdeus
    Hi Karen, Why not just all it what it is ;-)! Client education is always appropriate! In traditional engravings, there s always a plate-mark, since the paper
    Message 1 of 6 , Apr 8, 2007
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      Hi Karen,

      Why not just all it what it is ;-)!
      Client education is always appropriate!

      In traditional engravings, there's always a plate-mark, since the paper and plate are run through the rollers together.

      Otherwise, you may need a deep-engraved mag plate instead of PP...
      Just my first thoughts...

      I do feel somewhat concerned for your C&P. How much coverage on that plate? (Just a few lines, I'm sure it's fine...)

      PF

      At 8:54 AM -0700 9 07 07, Karen Mortenson wrote:
      >Hello All,
      >
      >I am printing with my C & P 10x15 on 4-ply museum board usuing photopolymer plates. The client wants a very deep impression but when I woud get the impression she wanted, the outline of the plate would make an impression as well. I know this paper is particularly thick and squishy.
      >
      >Any suggestions?
      >
      >Many thanks!
      >
      >Karen

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    • Gerald Lange
      Karen, Peter I d agree that the way to go for deep impression is via photomechanical engravings rather than photopolymer, preferably with copper though
      Message 2 of 6 , Apr 8, 2007
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        Karen, Peter

        I'd agree that the way to go for "deep impression" is via
        photomechanical engravings rather than photopolymer, preferably with
        copper though rather than magnesium - better relief, sharper
        definition, longer lasting...

        I think it more than client education though; these days it's fast
        becoming printer education. I just use different terminology with
        clients and students to steer them. Words like elegant, delicate,
        refined... and contrast these with heavy, bold, squished, brutal...
        This seems to work for the most part, or at least, it puts the idea of
        appropriateness in mind, especially if deep impression can be
        demonstrated to contribute negatively to the intent of the design.

        In old printer terminology (Moxon) presswork was deemed negatively
        either as "beat fat" or "beat lean." No apparent word for appropriate
        presswork. Probably no need.

        Gerald
        http://BielerPress.blogspot.com


        >
        > Hi Karen,
        >
        > Why not just all it what it is ;-)!
        > Client education is always appropriate!
        >
        > In traditional engravings, there's always a plate-mark, since the
        paper and plate are run through the rollers together.
        >
        > Otherwise, you may need a deep-engraved mag plate instead of PP...
        > Just my first thoughts...
        >
        > I do feel somewhat concerned for your C&P. How much coverage on that
        plate? (Just a few lines, I'm sure it's fine...)
        >
        > PF
        >
        >
        > >I am printing with my C & P 10x15 on 4-ply museum board usuing
        photopolymer plates. The client wants a very deep impression but when
        I woud get the impression she wanted, the outline of the plate would
        make an impression as well. I know this paper is particularly thick
        and squishy.
        > >
        > >Any suggestions?
        > >
        > >Many thanks!
        > >
        > >Karen
        >
      • nagraph1
        I d agree with Peter, but magnesium doesn t have a clean etch on the sidewalls of the letters like photopolymer, so zinc would be better, and copper would be
        Message 3 of 6 , Apr 8, 2007
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          I'd agree with Peter, but magnesium doesn't have a clean etch on the
          sidewalls of the letters like photopolymer, so zinc would be better,
          and copper would be best. It is easily sourced from Owosso or Metal
          Magic in Phoenix. The best engraving, and avoiding the almost always
          inaccurate wood bases, is to use quarter inch thick dies mounted on
          a base using toggle hooks. Bases are made by Sterling. The same
          files used for photopolymer can be used for traditional
          photoengravings--photopolymer is not the answer for all letterpress
          printing situations.

          I would disagree with Peter on steel die engraving work, like on
          business cards and letterheads, that the plate or die mark is never
          seen unless done by an inexperienced press operator. Plate marks are
          seen on etchings and the like, but not on commercial engraving.

          Fritz

          >> Why not just all it what it is ;-)!
          > Client education is always appropriate!
          >
          > In traditional engravings, there's always a plate-mark, since the
          paper and plate are run through the rollers together.
          >
          > Otherwise, you may need a deep-engraved mag plate instead of PP...
          > Just my first thoughts...
          >
          > I do feel somewhat concerned for your C&P. How much coverage on
          that plate? (Just a few lines, I'm sure it's fine...)
          >
          > PF
          >
          > At 8:54 AM -0700 9 07 07, Karen Mortenson wrote:
          > >Hello All,
          > >
          > >I am printing with my C & P 10x15 on 4-ply museum board usuing
          photopolymer plates. The client wants a very deep impression but
          when I woud get the impression she wanted, the outline of the plate
          would make an impression as well. I know this paper is particularly
          thick and squishy.
          > >Karen
        • Kayle Simon
          Karen, Deep magnesium plates might help. And, if you are getting not just impressions where you don t want them, but ink there as well, your rollers are
          Message 4 of 6 , Apr 8, 2007
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            Karen,

            Deep magnesium plates might help.

            And, if you are getting not just impressions where you don't want
            them, but ink there
            as well, your rollers are running too close to the plate and you
            could try putting tape on the rails to raise the rollers a bit.

            I'm no expert but when I had a similar problem, those were my
            solutions. Raising the rails was the most important; mine were quite
            worn down, apparently.

            Kayle





            On Jul 9, 2007, at 11:54 AM, Karen Mortenson wrote:

            > Hello All,
            >
            > I am printing with my C & P 10x15 on 4-ply museum board usuing
            > photopolymer plates. The client wants a very deep impression but
            > when I woud get the impression she wanted, the outline of the plate
            > would make an impression as well. I know this paper is particularly
            > thick and squishy.
            >
            > Any suggestions?
            >
            > Many thanks!
            >
            > Karen
            >
            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            >
            >
            >



            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • Russell Maret
            HI Karen, I have done a lot of printing on 4-ply museum board and am familiar with the problem you are encountering. Assuming you are working for a client who
            Message 5 of 6 , Apr 9, 2007
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              HI Karen,

              I have done a lot of printing on 4-ply museum board and am familiar
              with the problem you are encountering. Assuming you are working for a
              client who is not interested in being educated on the finer points of
              beat fat/beat lean (although it's hard to imagine such a person),
              here are some suggestions:

              1) Remove all the packing from the tympan, pull an impression and see
              if you are still getting a plate impression.

              1a) If you still see the plate without any packing, you will need to
              back off the platen prior to proceeding with the steps below.

              2) If without any packing you are NOT getting a plate impression,
              progressively build up the packing until you start to see the
              impression. Once you do reduce the packing by 2 mil.

              3) Trace an outline of your plate onto a sheet of packing material (I
              usually use 6 mil tympan paper) and cut it out just inside the line
              (ie. the packing should be slightly smaller than your plate so that
              the plate edge does not contact the paper).

              4) Due to possible shift in the packing, I would mount this packing
              directly onto the tympan using either a spray adhesive, or carefully
              positioned dots of pva. You can usually increase the packing within
              the perimeter of the plate by at least 8 mil before you will
              encounter the next problem which will be getting an impression of the
              packing material.

              Good Luck,
              Russell Maret
            • Karen Mortenson
              Hello All, I am printing with my C & P 10x15 on 4-ply museum board usuing photopolymer plates. The client wants a very deep impression but when I woud get the
              Message 6 of 6 , Jul 9, 2007
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                Hello All,

                I am printing with my C & P 10x15 on 4-ply museum board usuing photopolymer plates. The client wants a very deep impression but when I woud get the impression she wanted, the outline of the plate would make an impression as well. I know this paper is particularly thick and squishy.

                Any suggestions?

                Many thanks!

                Karen

                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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