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Re: [PPLetterpress] Aging plates?

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  • Gerald Lange
    ... Dear Ed I d be guessing that point-of-focus or whatever it is called is less useful than a rack of lamps, though some folks report good results with
    Message 1 of 26 , May 13, 2002
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      Ed Inman wrote:
      >
      > I think Brian once wrote something to that effect on the Letpresss group
      > too.
      >
      > I'd be willing to give it a try but I'm admittedly skeptical. Regular
      > 20-watt blacklights?? How long would you have to expose with such low
      > wattage? I once tried using a series of old style Argon lamps that someone
      > told me had good UV output and they just barely hardened the plate even
      > after three hours of exposure. I didn't have much better luck with a
      > 175-watt mercury lamp--another supposedly-good UV source.
      >
      > My 650-watt halogen Sun Gun will burn a harder plate in 15 minutes than
      > either of these would in a whole afternoon--even though I typically let the
      > plate expose for a full half-hour. I don't think there is a better $10
      > platemaking system anywhere, haha.
      >
      > What replacement lamps and ballasts are called for in professional
      > platemaking machines? This might be the best setup for a serious
      > do-it-yourselfer.
      >


      Dear Ed

      I'd be guessing that point-of-focus or whatever it is called is less useful
      than a rack of lamps, though some folks report good results with halftones.

      I know that Inge Bruggeman and Chip Shilling (both members here) have portable
      suitcase like set ups that they use for workshops and the like. Also I think
      Gene Becker sells some similar type of "relatively" inexpensive stand-alone
      exposure unit.

      Gerald
    • Ed Inman
      I think Brian once wrote something to that effect on the Letpresss group too. I d be willing to give it a try but I m admittedly skeptical. Regular 20-watt
      Message 2 of 26 , May 13, 2002
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        I think Brian once wrote something to that effect on the Letpresss group
        too.

        I'd be willing to give it a try but I'm admittedly skeptical. Regular
        20-watt blacklights?? How long would you have to expose with such low
        wattage? I once tried using a series of old style Argon lamps that someone
        told me had good UV output and they just barely hardened the plate even
        after three hours of exposure. I didn't have much better luck with a
        175-watt mercury lamp--another supposedly-good UV source.

        My 650-watt halogen Sun Gun will burn a harder plate in 15 minutes than
        either of these would in a whole afternoon--even though I typically let the
        plate expose for a full half-hour. I don't think there is a better $10
        platemaking system anywhere, haha.

        What replacement lamps and ballasts are called for in professional
        platemaking machines? This might be the best setup for a serious
        do-it-yourselfer.

        Ed

        Gerald wrote:
        > Today I received the Ampersand Resource Guide and there is an article in
        there
        > by member Brian Allen titled "Home-made photopolymer plate-making system."
        In
        > this he indicates he used a rack of 18" UV fluorescent bulbs (five are
        > pictured in a sketch) of "20 watt GE or Slyvania blacklight tubes."
        >
      • Brian Allen
        My homemade platemaking system was an attempt to mimic the expensive machines as closely as possible. The fluorescent units I used were single bulb ones, wired
        Message 3 of 26 , May 13, 2002
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          My homemade platemaking system was an attempt to mimic the expensive
          machines as closely as possible. The fluorescent units I used were single
          bulb ones, wired together and fit as closely as possible (clearance between
          bulbs is about 1/2 inch) to get even exposure, just like the machines. I
          think the double units put the bulbs too far apart. I got the bulbs from a
          large lightbulb supply company in Denver. Big cities would have at least one
          such place. Clearance to the vacuum frame was 1.5 - 2 inches.

          My article is in the PCBA (Pacific Center for the Book Arts) journal
          "Ampersand" Resource Issue, which comes out every few years. I also put
          together the letterpress resource section. There are sections for
          bookbinding, paper, conservation, typography, and so on - 52 pages of
          addresses/links info for the book arts. Edited by Alastair Johnston.

          I'll see about putting my article in the PPL resource area, but you'd do
          better to buy the issue, for all the other great stuff in there - $15
          includes postage, and you can get one by sending a check made out to: PCBA,
          300 De Haro St., San Francisco, CA 94103. It's a volunteer organization, so
          be patient.

          Brian Allen
          Mountain View, California
          ----------
          on 5/13/02 10:21 AM, Gerald Lange at bieler@... wrote:

          > Ed Inman wrote:
          >>
          >> You expose polymer with 40 Watt lamps? What exposure times do you use with
          >> this setup, Joel? Are you referring to regular purple looking
          >> "blacklights?" I didn't think such a low wattage setup would work very well
          >> even with hours of exposure. Can you give us a product descritption as
          >> printed on the bulbs you use and a little more detail as to your process?
          >>
          >> For what it's worth my cheapo homemade lamp setup is just a Sylvania "Sun
          >> Gun" that uses a 650 watt "DWY" halogen photo optic lamp. The lamps come
          >> with a warning that the bulb emits UV radiation and that you should not look
          >> directly into the fixture. You can usually find these used on ebay for $10
          >> to $15 and they will expose polymer very nicely in about 30 minutes time
          >> from about four feet back. I think both the original Sylvania Sun Gun and
          >> the Sun Gun 2 both use the same DWY lamp.
          >>
          >> Ed
          >>
          >> Joel wrote:
          >>>>> The UV bulbs can go into standard flourescent fixtures. The unit I have
          >> has four standard, 24", straight-from-the-hardware-store, two-bulb fixtures
          >> mounted in it and wired up so they all come on together. I think the bulbs
          >> are 40W.<<<
          >
          > Today I received the Ampersand Resource Guide and there is an article in there
          > by member Brian Allen titled "Home-made photopolymer plate-making system." In
          > this he indicates he used a rack of 18" UV fluorescent bulbs (five are
          > pictured in a sketch) of "20 watt GE or Slyvania blacklight tubes."
          >
          > Gerald
          >
          >
          >
          > To respond to this message or post a message to the membership:
          > PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com
          >
          > Encountering problems?
          > PPLetterpress-owner@yahoogroups.com
          >
          > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
          >
        • Silver MayKitten
          20 W. lamps may be small wattage, and only 24 long, but if your vacuum frame is only 23x33 any more length is wasted. You put one lamp every 6 of the width
          Message 4 of 26 , May 14, 2002
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            20 W. lamps may be small wattage, and only 24" long, but if your
            vacuum frame is only 23x33" any more length is wasted. You put one
            lamp every 6" of the width of the frame about a foot away from the
            glass, and you get good coverage.

            MayKitten
            --- Gerald Lange <bieler@...> wrote:
            > Ed Inman wrote:
            > >
            > > I think Brian once wrote something to that effect on the
            > Letpresss group
            > > too.
            > >
            > > I'd be willing to give it a try but I'm admittedly skeptical.
            > Regular
            > > 20-watt blacklights?? How long would you have to expose with
            > such low
            > > wattage? I once tried using a series of old style Argon lamps
            > that someone
            > > told me had good UV output and they just barely hardened the
            > plate even
            > > after three hours of exposure. I didn't have much better luck
            > with a
            > > 175-watt mercury lamp--another supposedly-good UV source.
            > >
            > > My 650-watt halogen Sun Gun will burn a harder plate in 15
            > minutes than
            > > either of these would in a whole afternoon--even though I
            > typically let the
            > > plate expose for a full half-hour. I don't think there is a
            > better $10
            > > platemaking system anywhere, haha.
            > >
            > > What replacement lamps and ballasts are called for in
            > professional
            > > platemaking machines? This might be the best setup for a
            > serious
            > > do-it-yourselfer.
            > >
            >
            >
            > Dear Ed
            >
            > I'd be guessing that point-of-focus or whatever it is called is
            > less useful
            > than a rack of lamps, though some folks report good results with
            > halftones.
            >
            > I know that Inge Bruggeman and Chip Shilling (both members here)
            > have portable
            > suitcase like set ups that they use for workshops and the like.
            > Also I think
            > Gene Becker sells some similar type of "relatively" inexpensive
            > stand-alone
            > exposure unit.
            >
            > Gerald
            >
            >


            =====
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            Yours is the road that winds lonely and far,
            Strange are the shadows that round you come creeping,
            Still through the clouds is the glint of a star!

            From the book, Charge of the Goddess
            BY: Doreen Valiente

            __________________________________________________
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            LAUNCH - Your Yahoo! Music Experience
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          • Katie Harper
            While we re on the subject of home lamp setups, I have another question for those who use such setups. I would like to set up something for quick n dirty
            Message 5 of 26 , May 14, 2002
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              While we're on the subject of home lamp setups, I have another question for
              those who use such setups. I would like to set up something for quick 'n
              dirty platemaking--I will still use the pros for the important work, but
              occasionally need to have a plate right away, and if it doesn't contain
              small type or fine detail, would like to be able to make it here in my shop.

              I inherited a small NuArc vacuum frame a couple of weeks ago, but it has no
              vacuum pump. Can I get one somewhere and hook it up?


              Katie Harper
              Ars Brevis Press
              Cincinnati, OH
              513-233-9588
            • Lee and Barbara Mason
              Katie, My vacuun failed to work for awhile, turned out I had moved the machine and it was no longer perfectly level....so simple and so hard to figure out what
              Message 6 of 26 , May 14, 2002
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                Katie,
                My vacuun failed to work for awhile, turned out I had moved the machine and
                it was no longer perfectly level....so simple and so hard to figure out what
                was wrong. However in the mean time, I used a piece of foam with the plate
                on top and glass on top of the plate..the contact was as good as the vacuum
                and it worked well as the glass was pretty heavy. Of course this would not
                work for units that flip over.
                Barbara
                ----- Original Message -----
                From: "Katie Harper" <knharper@...>
                To: <PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com>
                Sent: Tuesday, May 14, 2002 6:17 AM
                Subject: [PPLetterpress] Home Setups/Vacuum


                > While we're on the subject of home lamp setups, I have another question
                for
                > those who use such setups. I would like to set up something for quick 'n
                > dirty platemaking--I will still use the pros for the important work, but
                > occasionally need to have a plate right away, and if it doesn't contain
                > small type or fine detail, would like to be able to make it here in my
                shop.
                >
                > I inherited a small NuArc vacuum frame a couple of weeks ago, but it has
                no
                > vacuum pump. Can I get one somewhere and hook it up?
                >
                >
                > Katie Harper
                > Ars Brevis Press
                > Cincinnati, OH
                > 513-233-9588
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                > To respond to this message or post a message to the membership:
                > PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com
                >
                > Encountering problems?
                > PPLetterpress-owner@yahoogroups.com
                >
                > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                >
                >
                >
              • Harold Kyle
                ... Katie: I have several used vacuum pumps laying around here. If you d like more info you can contact me off-list. Harold ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ Boxcar Press Fine
                Message 7 of 26 , May 14, 2002
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                  On 5/14/02 9:17 AM, "Katie Harper" <knharper@...> wrote:
                  > I inherited a small NuArc vacuum frame a couple of weeks ago, but it has no
                  > vacuum pump. Can I get one somewhere and hook it up?

                  Katie:

                  I have several used vacuum pumps laying around here. If you'd like more info
                  you can contact me off-list.

                  Harold

                  ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
                  Boxcar Press
                  Fine Printing and Binding ~ Digital Letterpress Supplies
                  640 Fellows Avenue ~ Syracuse, NY 13210
                  315-473-0930 ~ phone and fax
                  www.boxcarpress.com
                  ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
                • Joel Benson
                  Hi Ed, Sorry for the slow reply here- yes, they are called Blacklights on the bulbs, but they aren t purple-looking like the incandescent blacklights. They
                  Message 8 of 26 , May 14, 2002
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                    Hi Ed,

                    Sorry for the slow reply here- yes, they are called "Blacklights" on the bulbs, but they aren't purple-looking like the incandescent blacklights. They cost me about $15 each, I think. I'll look at the product numbers when I get home- though I think it is a pretty standard Phillips bulb. I use about a 4 minute exposure time for fine type, 30 to 45 seconds for big solids or halftone screens.

                    I don't think it is the wattage that makes the difference so much as the specific wavelength of UV that the bulb gives off. I think the lamps you are using probably emit a large amount of light at one end of the UV spectrum and a lesser amount at the other end, which happens to be the end that the polymer is sensitive to. I remember a discussion of this with details about the wavelengths on either this list or LETPRESS, but I don't have it saved anywhere.

                    It sounds like there is a lot of leeway in exactly how far the bulbs need to be from the plate material. Silver May Kitten has the bulbs a foot away, Brian Allen has his 1.5-2" away and much closer together. That seems to define a range of acceptability. Using a Stouffer scale would tell you how long your exposure needs to be for whatever set up you construct.

                    Joel

                    Joel Benson
                    Dependable Letterpress
                    San Francisco

                    -----Original Message-----
                    From: Ed Inman [mailto:edinman@...]
                    Sent: Monday, May 13, 2002 5:15 PM
                    To: PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com
                    Subject: Re: [PPLetterpress] Aging plates?


                    You expose polymer with 40 Watt lamps? What exposure times do you use with
                    this setup, Joel? Are you referring to regular purple looking
                    "blacklights?" I didn't think such a low wattage setup would work very well
                    even with hours of exposure. Can you give us a product descritption as
                    printed on the bulbs you use and a little more detail as to your process?

                    For what it's worth my cheapo homemade lamp setup is just a Sylvania "Sun
                    Gun" that uses a 650 watt "DWY" halogen photo optic lamp. The lamps come
                    with a warning that the bulb emits UV radiation and that you should not look
                    directly into the fixture. You can usually find these used on ebay for $10
                    to $15 and they will expose polymer very nicely in about 30 minutes time
                    from about four feet back. I think both the original Sylvania Sun Gun and
                    the Sun Gun 2 both use the same DWY lamp.

                    Ed

                    Joel wrote:
                    >>> The UV bulbs can go into standard flourescent fixtures. The unit I have
                    has four standard, 24", straight-from-the-hardware-store, two-bulb fixtures
                    mounted in it and wired up so they all come on together. I think the bulbs
                    are 40W.<<<




                    To respond to this message or post a message to the membership:
                    PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com

                    Encountering problems?
                    PPLetterpress-owner@yahoogroups.com

                    Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                  • David Goodrich
                    Vivian, You are wise in inquiring before trying the Morgan Expansion Trucks. I tried some on my Columbian No 2 and found there was not enough space for them.
                    Message 9 of 26 , May 18, 2002
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                      Vivian,
                      You are wise in inquiring before trying the Morgan Expansion Trucks. I
                      tried some on my Columbian No 2 and found there was not enough space for
                      them.
                      I suggest you contact Fritz Klinke at NA Graphics, who stocks them. He
                      can be reached at nagraph@.... He can probably tell you whether or
                      not they will fit. If they fit, they will solve your problem.
                      You also might want to post an inquiry to the Letpress Discussion Group.
                      I suspect more of their people use platen presses than the PPL group.

                      Sorry not to have responded sooner. I have been away the past week.

                      David

                      -----Original Message-----
                      From: 9 Spotmonk Design [mailto:vivian@...]
                      Sent: Sunday, May 12, 2002 12:57 PM
                      To: PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com
                      Subject: [PPLetterpress] Expandable Trucks


                      Hi Everyone,

                      I'm new to the PPLetpress List.

                      I have a Craftsman 6 x 10 and was wondering if anyone has experience
                      with using/converting expandable trucks. Two main problems at hand: I
                      need to lower the the noise the press makes when the rollers leave
                      the rail and move to the inking plate and back; and my rollers are
                      about 1/8 inch (the circumference) larger than my trucks. What I'm
                      doing now is putting a piece of pressboard behind the chase but don't
                      know if this is a good long term solution.

                      Thanks in advance for your responses.

                      Vivian



                      Vivian Leung
                      9 Spotmonk Design
                      vivian@...
                      T 201 795 1668
                      C 201 925 3168

                      <http://www.9spotmonk.com>


                      To respond to this message or post a message to the membership:
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                      Encountering problems?
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