Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Re: [PPLetterpress] Re: Washed out...

Expand Messages
  • Gerald Lange
    Dear Ed Probably a poor choice of words on my part. As is your use of the word logic. Working with craft in this day and age is not illogical behavior. I can
    Message 1 of 7 , Mar 31, 2002
    • 0 Attachment
      Dear Ed

      Probably a poor choice of words on my part. As is your use of the word logic.
      Working with craft in this day and age is not illogical behavior. I can
      appreciate the Dard Hunter approach: make your own paper, design and cast your
      own type, print on an iron handpress, bind your own books, etc.

      However. One is not working at the preliminary stage of technique when one is
      hand processing a photopolymer plate (as an economic shortcut) as one would be
      if he/she were cutting a punch or cutting a woodengraving. In either case one
      would want the best tools available to them to engage in the task. Technology
      cannot improve on the skilled punchcutter or woodengraver. The "craft" in
      regard to processing photopolymer plates, however, belongs to the engineers
      who figured it out, and the technicians who enabled it to be mass-produced.

      David Pye, in his _The Nature and Art of Workmanship_ has a wonderful term for
      this which I cannot now remember. But I do remember this: In his _Printing
      with the Handpress_, Lewis Allen wrote, "inferior tools corrode the spirit."
      There is a difference.

      I knew an enthusiastic young printer, who, rather than buy used typecases at
      the going rate of $4 to $12 dependent upon how lucky you were, decided he'd
      rather make his own. As far as I know, he never actually made a typecase, or
      for that matter, ever got around to printing anything either.

      Gerald


      Ed Inman wrote:
      >
      > Gerald wrote:
      > >>>Processing without a machine... ? I can't image why anyone would want
      > > to go through that lunacy . . .
      > > Life can be so much easier.<<<
      >
      > Using this logic why would anyone want to go through the "lunacy" of
      > letterpress printing to begin with in an age of high speed, high quality
      > digital and offset imaging?
      >
      > I believe that art is partly about learning things that can be learned and
      > doing things than can be done--and compared to many processes, reliable hand
      > washout of photopolymer plates really isn't that difficult to master for
      > artists willing to experiment and learn.
      >
      > Ed
    • Jessica
      Pye calls it workmanship of risk versus workmanship of certainty. --Jessica ... Springtide Press Graphic Design and Letterpress Printing 773.465.8636
      Message 2 of 7 , Apr 1, 2002
      • 0 Attachment
        Pye calls it "workmanship of risk" versus "workmanship of certainty."
        --Jessica

        --------------------------------------------------
        Springtide Press
        Graphic Design and Letterpress Printing
        773.465.8636
        www.springtidepress.com
        --------------------------------------------------


        From: Gerald Lange <bieler@...>
        Organization: Bieler Press
        Reply-To: PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com
        Date: Sun, 31 Mar 2002 23:13:02 +0000
        To: PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: Re: [PPLetterpress] Re: Washed out...


        Dear Ed

        Probably a poor choice of words on my part. As is your use of the word
        logic.
        Working with craft in this day and age is not illogical behavior. I can
        appreciate the Dard Hunter approach: make your own paper, design and cast
        your
        own type, print on an iron handpress, bind your own books, etc.

        However. One is not working at the preliminary stage of technique when one
        is
        hand processing a photopolymer plate (as an economic shortcut) as one would
        be
        if he/she were cutting a punch or cutting a woodengraving. In either case
        one
        would want the best tools available to them to engage in the task.
        Technology
        cannot improve on the skilled punchcutter or woodengraver. The "craft" in
        regard to processing photopolymer plates, however, belongs to the engineers
        who figured it out, and the technicians who enabled it to be mass-produced.

        David Pye, in his _The Nature and Art of Workmanship_ has a wonderful term
        for
        this which I cannot now remember. But I do remember this: In his _Printing
        with the Handpress_, Lewis Allen wrote, "inferior tools corrode the spirit."
        There is a difference.

        I knew an enthusiastic young printer, who, rather than buy used typecases at
        the going rate of $4 to $12 dependent upon how lucky you were, decided he'd
        rather make his own. As far as I know, he never actually made a typecase, or
        for that matter, ever got around to printing anything either.

        Gerald


        Ed Inman wrote:
        >
        > Gerald wrote:
        > >>>Processing without a machine... ? I can't image why anyone would want
        > > to go through that lunacy . . .
        > > Life can be so much easier.<<<
        >
        > Using this logic why would anyone want to go through the "lunacy" of
        > letterpress printing to begin with in an age of high speed, high quality
        > digital and offset imaging?
        >
        > I believe that art is partly about learning things that can be learned and
        > doing things than can be done--and compared to many processes, reliable hand
        > washout of photopolymer plates really isn't that difficult to master for
        > artists willing to experiment and learn.
        >
        > Ed

        Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT

        To respond to this message or post a message to the membership:
        PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com

        Encountering problems?
        PPLetterpress-owner@yahoogroups.com

        Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service
        <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> .




        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Ed Inman
        ... is ... would be ... Agreed. I m not an absolutist about doing everything at a preliminary stage. Nor do I have anything against machines for those who can
        Message 3 of 7 , Apr 1, 2002
        • 0 Attachment
          Gerald wrote:

          > However. One is not working at the preliminary stage of technique when one
          is
          > hand processing a photopolymer plate (as an economic shortcut) as one
          would be
          > if he/she were cutting a punch or cutting a woodengraving.

          Agreed. I'm not an absolutist about doing everything at a preliminary
          stage. Nor do I have anything against machines for those who can justify
          their cost.

          > In his _Printing
          > with the Handpress_, Lewis Allen wrote, "inferior tools corrode the
          spirit."
          > There is a difference.

          I'm not sure in what context Mr. Allen was making this point, but if I may
          be allowed a counterpoint it would be that tools, no matter how
          sophisticated or primitive, are only as good as how they are used.

          Saying that only people who can afford platemakers can make good plates is
          sort of like saying only people who can afford Hasselblads can take good
          pictures.

          Such a position no doubt makes very good sense to those who own platemakers
          and Hasselblads, but I'm not sure how helpful it is to those who can
          appreciate making the most out of more modest tools.

          Hand washout takes some practice and may not always be perfect, no doubt,
          but for some people that is part of the challenge and part of the fun.

          Ed
        • bielerpr
          Dear EdGood come-back—though now when someone s got problems with hand washout I m going to expect YOU to respond and guide them along!!!All best
          Message 4 of 7 , Apr 1, 2002
          • 0 Attachment
            Dear Ed

            Good come-back—though now when someone's got problems with hand
            washout I'm going to expect YOU to respond and guide them along!!!

            All best

            Gerald

            --- In PPLetterpress@y..., "Ed Inman" <edinman@e...> wrote:
            > Gerald wrote:
            >
            > > However. One is not working at the preliminary stage of technique when =
            one
            > is
            > > hand processing a photopolymer plate (as an economic shortcut) as one
            > would be
            > > if he/she were cutting a punch or cutting a woodengraving.
            >
            > Agreed. I'm not an absolutist about doing everything at a preliminary
            > stage. Nor do I have anything against machines for those who can justify
            > their cost.
            >
            > > In his _Printing
            > > with the Handpress_, Lewis Allen wrote, "inferior tools corrode the
            > spirit."
            > > There is a difference.
            >
            > I'm not sure in what context Mr. Allen was making this point, but if I ma=
            y
            > be allowed a counterpoint it would be that tools, no matter how
            > sophisticated or primitive, are only as good as how they are used.
            >
            > Saying that only people who can afford platemakers can make good plates i=
            s
            > sort of like saying only people who can afford Hasselblads can take good
            > pictures.
            >
            > Such a position no doubt makes very good sense to those who own platemake=
            rs
            > and Hasselblads, but I'm not sure how helpful it is to those who can
            > appreciate making the most out of more modest tools.
            >
            > Hand washout takes some practice and may not always be perfect, no doubt,=

            > but for some people that is part of the challenge and part of the fun.
            >
            > Ed
          Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.