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RE: [PPLetterpress] 3 phase to single, help please.

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  • Michael T. Metz
    Hi Joel, Sorry about how that turned out. I think you should talk to the guy that set you up with the 2hp motor. It doesn t sound like he did his job. Does the
    Message 1 of 21 , Nov 4, 2005
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      Hi Joel,

      Sorry about how that turned out. I think
      you should talk to the guy that set you
      up with the 2hp motor. It doesn't sound
      like he did his job.

      Does the motor bog down when you engage
      the clutch? What are the other specs on
      the motor? RPM, etc.

      Mike



      -----Original Message-----
      From: PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com
      [mailto:PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Joel at D.L.
      Sent: Friday, November 04, 2005 4:58 PM
      To: PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: Re: [PPLetterpress] 3 phase to single, help please.


      Michael T. Metz wrote:

      >Or, a bigger (more hp) single phase motor.
      >Folks have told me that the HP rating on
      >a single phase motor won't pull what the
      >same rating on a 3ph. What HP is your
      >motor?
      >
      >
      >
      The single phase motor is 2 hp, the three phase one was 1-1/2. I had a
      press mechanic source it for me, and assume he knew what he was doing.
      Maybe bigger motors require other kinds of monkeying around to make them
      fit...

      I saved my three-phase motor, and I'm looking forward to the day I can
      put it back on.

      Joel




      Yahoo! Groups Links
    • Michael T. Metz
      My Heidelberg parts book talks about the different motors to use with different electricity setups. The single current setup has a caveat. Granted this book
      Message 2 of 21 , Nov 4, 2005
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        My Heidelberg parts book talks about the different
        motors to use with different electricity setups.
        The single current setup has a caveat. Granted
        this book was written in the 50s, and motor technology
        has probably changed.

        For Single-phase Alternating Current:

        One single phase alternating current motor, 1.1kW=1.5 HP rated
        output, 1400 to 1500 rpm. Drip proof. Standard base motor with
        free shaft end. ...

        Then it continues, and this might be your problem.

        "This applies only to the repulsion motor with commutator.
        Induction motors are not suitable, because of their inability to
        start under load. The repulsion motor, on the other hand, has
        a high starting torque; however, it has the characteristic of
        racing (increasing the speed to a dangerous extent) when
        started without load. Therefore, it is necessary to arrange a single-
        phase switch which is attached to the bracket carrying the
        sucker bar movement in such a way that if the machine is stopped
        by means of the handle the curcuit is also broken."

        I personally couldn't tell you the difference between a repulsion
        and an induction motor, or know if there is a third kind out
        there that would work better. The point of all this: I shouldn't
        be giving advice on what to do. Do you hear that Mable?

        Mike

        -----Original Message-----
        From: PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com
        [mailto:PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Joel at D.L.
        Sent: Friday, November 04, 2005 4:58 PM
        To: PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: Re: [PPLetterpress] 3 phase to single, help please.


        Michael T. Metz wrote:

        >Or, a bigger (more hp) single phase motor.
        >Folks have told me that the HP rating on
        >a single phase motor won't pull what the
        >same rating on a 3ph. What HP is your
        >motor?
        >
        >
        >
        The single phase motor is 2 hp, the three phase one was 1-1/2. I had a
        press mechanic source it for me, and assume he knew what he was doing.
        Maybe bigger motors require other kinds of monkeying around to make them
        fit...

        I saved my three-phase motor, and I'm looking forward to the day I can
        put it back on.

        Joel




        Yahoo! Groups Links
      • Joel at D.L.
        ... It s 1750 RPM, as I recall. The other specs meet or exceed the Heidelberg requirements as posted earlier. The motor doesn t bog down or cause other
        Message 3 of 21 , Nov 6, 2005
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          Michael T. Metz wrote:

          >Does the motor bog down when you engage
          >the clutch? What are the other specs on
          >the motor? RPM, etc.
          >
          >

          It's 1750 RPM, as I recall. The other specs meet or exceed the
          Heidelberg requirements as posted earlier. The motor doesn't bog down
          or cause other problems- it's only when running a heavy forme on a long
          run at high speed that it pops the breaker. And even then, it's like
          every 8 or 9 hundred it shuts off, unless I crank the speed down. Which
          I do- I like it to keep running and anyway someone told me it's bad to
          keep popping a breaker.

          It's all on the level of minor annoyance, but as a believer in Doing It
          Right I aspire to restoring the three-phase power. Now I feel like a
          bit of a whiner; but in the great internet tradition of maximum
          information, there is my experience with single phase.

          Heidelberg may have accomodated the need to use single-phase power, but
          I'm sure the machines were engineered with three-phase in mind. It's
          standand, for industrial applications.

          Joel
        • chuck sumner
          I recall a thread on the letpress list that may be useful and inexpensive https://listserv.unb.ca/cgi-bin/wa?
          Message 4 of 21 , Nov 6, 2005
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            I recall a thread on the letpress list that may be useful and
            inexpensive

            https://listserv.unb.ca/cgi-bin/wa?
            A2=ind0407&L=LETPRESS&P=R33002&D=0&H=0&I=-3&O=T&T=0

            or: http://tinyurl.com/7jqmv

            Good luck


            On Nov 3, 2005, at 8:36 AM, mableylee wrote:

            > Hi, I've recently acquired two presses (12x18 Heidelberg platen and
            > 12x18 C&P NS). Both
            > are three phase powered and were hardwired into the building of the
            > printing company I
            > purchased them from . They will soon be moved into another
            > building with only single
            > phase power. Any suggestions on how to get these machines
            > running? (A few have
            > suggested investing in a costly Temco 3 phase converter, others
            > have advised replacing
            > the motors to single phase.) Any suggestions or advice would
            > greatly be appreciated!
            > Much thanks, Mable
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
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          • Fritz Klinke
            If you are referring to the breaker on the motor control switch that is on the press, then the same thing happened with our press using a rotary converter. We
            Message 5 of 21 , Nov 7, 2005
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              If you are referring to the breaker on the motor control switch that is on
              the press, then the same thing happened with our press using a rotary
              converter. We consulted with our local electrician who is a master licensed
              guy, and he suggested that we needed a new motor control switch or to change
              the heater links in the control that trip the breaker. We never tripped the
              main breaker in the electric panel that this press runs off. So, we just
              eliminated the breaker in the motor starter switch and it has run well since
              on many thousands of impressions. We couldn't figure if it had something to
              do with the use of the converter, or something else. I don't think it is a
              safety issue with the motor overheating because I am always present when the
              press is running and the motor never seems to get that hot. I cleaned out
              years of accumulated dust, lint, and crud inside the motor that was blocking
              air flow, and it just hums along.

              Fritz

              ----- Original Message -----
              From: "Joel at D.L." <dep.letterpress@...>
              To: <PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com>
              Sent: Sunday, November 06, 2005 11:37 AM
              Subject: Re: [PPLetterpress] 3 phase to single, help please.


              > Michael T. Metz wrote:
              >
              >>Does the motor bog down when you engage
              >>the clutch? What are the other specs on
              >>the motor? RPM, etc.
              >>
              >>
              >
              > It's 1750 RPM, as I recall. The other specs meet or exceed the
              > Heidelberg requirements as posted earlier. The motor doesn't bog down
              > or cause other problems- it's only when running a heavy forme on a long
              > run at high speed that it pops the breaker. And even then, it's like
              > every 8 or 9 hundred it shuts off, unless I crank the speed down. Which
              > I do- I like it to keep running and anyway someone told me it's bad to
              > keep popping a breaker.
              >
              > It's all on the level of minor annoyance, but as a believer in Doing It
              > Right I aspire to restoring the three-phase power. Now I feel like a
              > bit of a whiner; but in the great internet tradition of maximum
              > information, there is my experience with single phase.
              >
              > Heidelberg may have accomodated the need to use single-phase power, but
              > I'm sure the machines were engineered with three-phase in mind. It's
              > standand, for industrial applications.
              >
              > Joel
              >
            • Michael T. Metz
              Bingo Fritz. I think you scored on that one. That s a $25 fix. ... From: PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com [mailto:PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Fritz
              Message 6 of 21 , Nov 7, 2005
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                Bingo Fritz. I think you scored on that one.
                That's a $25 fix.

                -----Original Message-----
                From: PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com
                [mailto:PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Fritz Klinke
                Sent: Monday, November 07, 2005 10:19 AM
                To: PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com
                Subject: Re: [PPLetterpress] 3 phase to single, help please.


                If you are referring to the breaker on the motor control switch that is on
                the press, then the same thing happened with our press using a rotary
                converter. We consulted with our local electrician who is a master licensed
                guy, and he suggested that we needed a new motor control switch or to change
                the heater links in the control that trip the breaker. We never tripped the
                main breaker in the electric panel that this press runs off. So, we just
                eliminated the breaker in the motor starter switch and it has run well since
                on many thousands of impressions. We couldn't figure if it had something to
                do with the use of the converter, or something else. I don't think it is a
                safety issue with the motor overheating because I am always present when the
                press is running and the motor never seems to get that hot. I cleaned out
                years of accumulated dust, lint, and crud inside the motor that was blocking
                air flow, and it just hums along.

                Fritz

                ----- Original Message -----
                From: "Joel at D.L." <dep.letterpress@...>
                To: <PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com>
                Sent: Sunday, November 06, 2005 11:37 AM
                Subject: Re: [PPLetterpress] 3 phase to single, help please.


                > Michael T. Metz wrote:
                >
                >>Does the motor bog down when you engage
                >>the clutch? What are the other specs on
                >>the motor? RPM, etc.
                >>
                >>
                >
                > It's 1750 RPM, as I recall. The other specs meet or exceed the
                > Heidelberg requirements as posted earlier. The motor doesn't bog down
                > or cause other problems- it's only when running a heavy forme on a long
                > run at high speed that it pops the breaker. And even then, it's like
                > every 8 or 9 hundred it shuts off, unless I crank the speed down. Which
                > I do- I like it to keep running and anyway someone told me it's bad to
                > keep popping a breaker.
                >
                > It's all on the level of minor annoyance, but as a believer in Doing It
                > Right I aspire to restoring the three-phase power. Now I feel like a
                > bit of a whiner; but in the great internet tradition of maximum
                > information, there is my experience with single phase.
                >
                > Heidelberg may have accomodated the need to use single-phase power, but
                > I'm sure the machines were engineered with three-phase in mind. It's
                > standand, for industrial applications.
                >
                > Joel
                >






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              • Joel at D.L.
                Hi Fritz- I never considered the breaker being the problem- maybe you re right. I am indeed referring to the breaker on the motor control switch. It came
                Message 7 of 21 , Nov 7, 2005
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                  Hi Fritz-
                  I never considered the breaker being the problem- maybe you're right. I
                  am indeed referring to the breaker on the motor control switch. It came
                  with the press and is not new. I've never tripped the main breaker in
                  the electrical panel either. Thanks!

                  Joel

                  Fritz Klinke wrote:

                  >If you are referring to the breaker on the motor control switch that is on
                  >the press, then the same thing happened with our press using a rotary
                  >converter.
                  >
                  >
                  >
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