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Re: Toyoba Printight 152 / Rigilon MX II 145 / BASF WS 152

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  • elumdesigns
    I am a believer that we are all in this together, regardless of competition and any information that people can learn from each other is only beneficial. I
    Message 1 of 19 , Sep 3, 2005
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      I am a believer that we are all in this together, regardless of
      competition and any information that people can learn from each other
      is only beneficial. I have gone to competitors in my industry when i
      have had issues and problems that i needed help solving. We a very
      young company so learning from mistakes and from other was vital. My
      peers (competition) have helped me tremendously and it has been
      invaluable.


      --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, "Gerald Lange" <bieler@w...> wrote:
      > Thanks Brad
      >
      > This is great. Rather than lose this info in the archives I thought
      > I'd set up a table in the Database section for this. I've already
      > added my entry. Hope you will do the same with your information. Its
      > relatively painless and easy to do.
      >
      > I think it really useful that members contribute to the reference
      > resources of the list: Files, Photos, Links, Database. We've got over
      > 790 members now and have been around for over four years but so far
      > there has been very little willingness on the part of members to share
      > vital information. Somewhat unfortunate given the potential.
      >
      > Gerald
      >
      > --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, "elumdesigns" <bhfoster@g...>
      wrote:
      > > I am using the Orbital X as well:
      > > Rigilon MX II 145
      > > Exposure 1 min 20 sec
      > > 4.5 to 5 minute washout @ 90 degrees
      > > 10 minutes drying time @ 165 degrees (need to check temp to be exact.)
      > > 10 minute postexposure
      > >
      > > Rigilon HX 145
      > > Exposure 2 - 3 minutes depending on application and how much shoulder
      > > we need
      > > 4 minute washout @ 90 degrees
      > > 10 minutes drying time @ 165 degrees (need to check temp to be exact.)
      > > 15 minute postexposure
      > >
      > > Miraclon MS 145
      > > Exposure 1 min 45 sec
      > > 5 minute washout @ 90 degrees
      > > 10 minutes drying time @ 165 degrees (need to check temp to be exact.)
      > > 10 minute postexposure
      > >
      > > BASF WS152
      > > Exposure 2 min 30 sec
      > > 10 minute washout @ 90 degrees
      > > 10 minutes drying time @ 165 degrees (need to check temp to be exact.)
      > > 15 minute postexposure
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, "Gerald Lange" <bieler@w...>
      > wrote:
      > > > Brad
      > > >
      > > > What is the sequence you use for the Rigilon? I think it would be
      > > > useful for folks to provide their "successful" sequences here. Of
      > > > course they would need to be very specific to be of any use to
      others:
      > > > Machine. Manufacturer/Brand/Formulation Code. Exposure time, washout
      > > > time, drying time, post-exposure time. Purpose. Even sources
      would be
      > > > good.
      > > >
      > > > For instance (with my A&V Orbital machine) running Toyobo Printight
      > > > 152 GRs (steel-backed), which I buy from A&V, I have a generic
      > > > sequence for deep impression as 6 minutes exposure, 5 minutes
      washout
      > > > (90 degrees F), 15 minutes drying time (150 degrees F) and 12
      minutes
      > > > post-exposure. I modify this a bit per client dependent upon their
      > > > intended use and practices.
      > > >
      > > > Gerald
    • elumdesigns
      ... assist ... it work. ... with. ... in the ... some ... on the ... image with ... But we ... - by the ... someone is ... I agree as well however we are in a
      Message 2 of 19 , Sep 3, 2005
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        --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, Mark Bauder
        <sonomaprinters@a...> wrote:
        > on 8/31/05 11:14 PM, Gerald Lange at bieler@w... wrote:
        >
        > > Brad
        > >
        > > The Toyobos are fairly hard as far as letterpress photopolymer plates
        > > go. But hardness rating per se is not a guarantee of "solidity." More
        > > like the hardness rating of an inking roller where it is used as an
        > > indicator of transfer qualities.
        > >
        > > You mention "our style of printing." I'm assuming deep impression? I
        > > think you are going to experience splay with probably any photopolymer
        > > plate under these conditions. Though I am not experienced with the
        > > Rigilon. Photopolymer plates aren't really designed for this. And
        > > thicker plates are going to splay more than thinner plates.
        > >
        > > I'd suggest using traditional copper engravings on a patent or
        > > magnesium base for really deep impression. Most of the suppliers
        > > accept computer files via email these days. I know Owosso does.
        > > Copper is a bit more expensive but likely worth it as they will give
        > > you what you want, which photopolymer likely cannot.
        > >
        > > Gerald
        > >
        > >
        > > --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, "elumdesigns" <bhfoster@g...>
        > > wrote:
        > >> I have been processing plates, testing and using the above mentioned
        > >> polymers for the past 8 months. We are looking for a polymer that is
        > >> hard and one that will hold the cleanest type/impression.
        > >>
        > >> We have found that the Printight is a very soft polymer compared to
        > >> the rest and it does not hold up to our style of printing. The type
        > >> just smashes after a few impressions. Has anyone else had this
        > >> problem? I even went as far as to have the A&V rep come down to
        assist
        > >> us with exposing the plates to see if we were doing anything wrong.
        > >> He was surprised at what was happening. Has anyone experienced this?
        > >>
        > >> The BASF polymer by far had the cleanest impression and looked the
        > >> best but the washout smelled real bad, the washout time was extremely
        > >> long and the parent size plate was not a good size for us and we were
        > >> wasting a lot of polymer. This plate was a bit harder than the
        > >> Printight but we still had to back off on the preassure to make
        it work.
        > >>
        > >> The Rigilon seemed to be the plates that we had the best results
        with.
        > >> Short exposure times, fast washout, holds type very well, clean
        > >> impressions, great shoulder on the type, excellent ink release
        > >> properties and its relatively hard and stable.
        > >>
        > >> Can anyone recommend something that might work for us that they have
        > >> had good results with? Should I stop looking and just use the
        > >> Rigilon? I have learned a lot about photopolymer and processing
        in the
        > >> past 8 months but I feel that I have reached a point where I need
        some
        > >> expert advice on which polymer will work best. Hard and clean....
        > >>
        > >> Thanks for reading.
        > >> Brad
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > > Yahoo! Groups Links
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > Hi Gerald,
        >
        > I agree with you. Copper is by far the better way to go. The walls
        on the
        > letters can be made almost vertical and will make a crisp, clean
        image with
        > a deep impression. The old letterpressman would be rolling over in their
        > graves if they saw what is now the "in vogue" letterpress printing.
        But we
        > can offer something unique that can't be reproduced with a computer
        - by the
        > way, I have a couple of magnetic bases that were used twice if
        someone is
        > interested. E-mail me direct.
        >
        > Cheers,
        > Mark Bauder
        > Sonoma Printers


        I agree as well however we are in a very high production situation and
        we are making anywhere fom 75 - 100 plates a week and during our busy
        season, this number can double. We were using Owosso and spending more
        than $700.00 a month in UPS fees alone.
      • elumdesigns
        I double, sometimes triple the pre-exposure time. It tends to harden the plates more.
        Message 3 of 19 , Sep 3, 2005
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          I double, sometimes triple the pre-exposure time. It tends to harden
          the plates more.

          --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, "John G. Henry" <JohnH@i...> wrote:
          > I notice that (in the details posted) the postexposures are
          > exceedingly longer than the imaging exposure. Why is this? When
          > setting up my exposure/washout system, I got the impression that the
          > post exposure should be about half the length of the imaging exposure.
          >
          > Can anyone shed some light on this (pardon the pun).
          >
          > John H.
        • elumdesigns
          I dont see the table that you created on polymer processing times.... ... would be ... washout ... minutes
          Message 4 of 19 , Sep 8, 2005
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            I dont see the table that you created on polymer processing times....

            --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, "Gerald Lange" <bieler@w...> wrote:
            > Thanks Brad
            >
            > This is great. Rather than lose this info in the archives I thought
            > I'd set up a table in the Database section for this. I've already
            > added my entry. Hope you will do the same with your information. Its
            > relatively painless and easy to do.
            >
            > I think it really useful that members contribute to the reference
            > resources of the list: Files, Photos, Links, Database. We've got over
            > 790 members now and have been around for over four years but so far
            > there has been very little willingness on the part of members to share
            > vital information. Somewhat unfortunate given the potential.
            >
            > Gerald
            >
            > --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, "elumdesigns" <bhfoster@g...>
            wrote:
            > > I am using the Orbital X as well:
            > > Rigilon MX II 145
            > > Exposure 1 min 20 sec
            > > 4.5 to 5 minute washout @ 90 degrees
            > > 10 minutes drying time @ 165 degrees (need to check temp to be exact.)
            > > 10 minute postexposure
            > >
            > > Rigilon HX 145
            > > Exposure 2 - 3 minutes depending on application and how much shoulder
            > > we need
            > > 4 minute washout @ 90 degrees
            > > 10 minutes drying time @ 165 degrees (need to check temp to be exact.)
            > > 15 minute postexposure
            > >
            > > Miraclon MS 145
            > > Exposure 1 min 45 sec
            > > 5 minute washout @ 90 degrees
            > > 10 minutes drying time @ 165 degrees (need to check temp to be exact.)
            > > 10 minute postexposure
            > >
            > > BASF WS152
            > > Exposure 2 min 30 sec
            > > 10 minute washout @ 90 degrees
            > > 10 minutes drying time @ 165 degrees (need to check temp to be exact.)
            > > 15 minute postexposure
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > > --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, "Gerald Lange" <bieler@w...>
            > wrote:
            > > > Brad
            > > >
            > > > What is the sequence you use for the Rigilon? I think it would be
            > > > useful for folks to provide their "successful" sequences here. Of
            > > > course they would need to be very specific to be of any use to
            others:
            > > > Machine. Manufacturer/Brand/Formulation Code. Exposure time, washout
            > > > time, drying time, post-exposure time. Purpose. Even sources
            would be
            > > > good.
            > > >
            > > > For instance (with my A&V Orbital machine) running Toyobo Printight
            > > > 152 GRs (steel-backed), which I buy from A&V, I have a generic
            > > > sequence for deep impression as 6 minutes exposure, 5 minutes
            washout
            > > > (90 degrees F), 15 minutes drying time (150 degrees F) and 12
            minutes
            > > > post-exposure. I modify this a bit per client dependent upon their
            > > > intended use and practices.
            > > >
            > > > Gerald
          • Gerald Lange
            Brad Sorry, a couple of the database tables were removed during routine housekeeping. It is now back in place. Gerald ... [Non-text portions of this message
            Message 5 of 19 , Sep 8, 2005
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              Brad

              Sorry, a couple of the database tables were removed during routine
              housekeeping. It is now back in place.

              Gerald

              elumdesigns wrote:

              >I dont see the table that you created on polymer processing times....
              >
              >--- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, "Gerald Lange" <bieler@w...> wrote:
              >
              >
              >>Thanks Brad
              >>
              >>This is great. Rather than lose this info in the archives I thought
              >>I'd set up a table in the Database section for this. I've already
              >>added my entry. Hope you will do the same with your information. Its
              >>relatively painless and easy to do.
              >>
              >>I think it really useful that members contribute to the reference
              >>resources of the list: Files, Photos, Links, Database. We've got over
              >>790 members now and have been around for over four years but so far
              >>there has been very little willingness on the part of members to share
              >>vital information. Somewhat unfortunate given the potential.
              >>
              >>Gerald
              >>
              >>--- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, "elumdesigns" <bhfoster@g...>
              >>
              >>
              >wrote:
              >
              >
              >>>I am using the Orbital X as well:
              >>>Rigilon MX II 145
              >>>Exposure 1 min 20 sec
              >>>4.5 to 5 minute washout @ 90 degrees
              >>>10 minutes drying time @ 165 degrees (need to check temp to be exact.)
              >>>10 minute postexposure
              >>>
              >>>Rigilon HX 145
              >>>Exposure 2 - 3 minutes depending on application and how much shoulder
              >>>we need
              >>>4 minute washout @ 90 degrees
              >>>10 minutes drying time @ 165 degrees (need to check temp to be exact.)
              >>>15 minute postexposure
              >>>
              >>>Miraclon MS 145
              >>>Exposure 1 min 45 sec
              >>>5 minute washout @ 90 degrees
              >>>10 minutes drying time @ 165 degrees (need to check temp to be exact.)
              >>>10 minute postexposure
              >>>
              >>>BASF WS152
              >>>Exposure 2 min 30 sec
              >>>10 minute washout @ 90 degrees
              >>>10 minutes drying time @ 165 degrees (need to check temp to be exact.)
              >>>15 minute postexposure
              >>>
              >>>
              >>>
              >>>



              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • Chad Pastotnik
              I m looking for a chase for a tabletop lever Hohner press with the following specs: outside dimensions - 11 3/8 x 7+ inches (at least this is the size of the
              Message 6 of 19 , Oct 25, 2005
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                I'm looking for a chase for a tabletop lever Hohner press with the
                following specs:

                outside dimensions - 11 3/8 x 7+ inches (at least this is the size of
                the bed)
                inside dimensions - 10 x 6 1/2 inches (according to old American
                Printing Equip. & Supply catalogs)

                C&P Pilot chases fit inside the bed between the rails but seem just a
                little to tall. The chase for this particular Hohner (don't know about
                others) requires a recessed area in the outside of the frame to accept
                "ears" that protrude 1/8" from the bed frame and rails as shown in this
                crude illustration where the left margin of the page is the bed of the
                press:
                /]
                / ] 1 1/16"
                / ]
                1/2" [__]

                5/8"

                If anyone can help me out here I'd greatly appreciate it.

                Chad

                _____________________________

                Chad Pastotnik
                Deep Wood Press 231.587.0506
                www.deepwoodpress.com
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