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Re: [PPLetterpress] Re: kluge

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  • Fritz Klinke
    Lance--This sounds like a reasonable approach and I ll be curious to see what Kluge and Heidelberg say. I once approached Heidelberg about taking over some of
    Message 1 of 7 , Jan 2, 2005
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      Lance--This sounds like a reasonable approach and I'll be curious to see what
      Kluge and Heidelberg say. I once approached Heidelberg about taking over some of
      the parts they were dropping for some of their letterpress machines and got as
      far as a vice president who emphatically said no. When parts stop selling and
      they deplete their world-wide inventory for something, after a suitable time
      period, the part is removed from production and even the blueprints are
      destroyed. The only reason we get any parts support from them is because of
      demand, and that there are tens of thousands of the various letterpress machines
      still in use world-wide. BUT, to buy from them one has to sign a waiver of
      liability, and go through intensive scrutiny before they'll sell even a screw.
      For mere owners of a machine, the serial number has to be registered, and then
      they will sell only parts for the machine listed in their records. It all boils
      down to liability--the Linotype suits I told you about were taking place in 2003
      and the amounts in contention were several million dollars--I think Dave Seat
      ended up being a key witness for them, so they protect themselves very closely.

      On another note, Vandercook did furnish copies of primarily assembly drawings to
      customers, but they never gave out blueprints for the actual parts. I think the
      assembly drawings are far superior to anything they ever put out in the form of
      a manual and on these, every screw, bolt, spring etc are referenced to as to
      size or part number. I have correspondence from the US Army who purchased a
      Universal I in the 1960s and they rejected the manual as being "insufficient"
      and Vandercook had to provide a custom manual that listed every part. The Army
      was a lot more demanding than the average printer--and I feel that's why so many
      presses ended up with make-shift repairs over the years because people couldn't
      figure out what parts to order. Back up support has always been available for
      Vandercooks which is why I still have the guts of the company today.

      Thanks,

      Fritz

      ----- Original Message -----
      From: "Lance Williams" <lwwill7999@...>
      To: <PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com>
      Sent: Sunday, January 02, 2005 12:46 PM
      Subject: RE: [PPLetterpress] Re: kluge


      >
      > Gerald,
      >
      > Thanks for the comments, and you and Fritz have certainly given me some
      things to think about.... I certainly do not want to do anything illegal as far
      as copyright is concerned, and until this point had considered all of the
      manuals of the older equipment as having their copyright protection long
      expired... Never gave a thought to the fact that some of these companies are
      still in business and might still publish the manuals and such... For now, I
      think I will remove the Heidelberg and Kluge information from the CD, and
      contact them for distribution permission for the copies I currently have. The
      Vandercook information is up to Fritz... If he says Ok, it will stay on the CD,
      otherwise, it is gone as well....
      >
      > And, Yes, I did download the bulk of the information from Boxcar Press,
      and I will have to talk to Kyle tomorrow and see if he actually has permissions
      from anyone other than Fritz for posting these files for download. I don't want
      to get him in trouble, either....
      >
      > Happy New Year!
      >
      > - Lance
      >
      > (Sent this earlier, but it was send from the wrong email address..... Since
      writing, I have left a contact form with a request for permission with both
      Kluge and Heidelberg... Now we just have to see what they say....)
      >
      >
      > ----- Original Message -----
      > From: Gerald Lange
      > To: PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com
      > Sent: 1/2/2005 3:45:21 AM
      > Subject: [PPLetterpress] Re: kluge
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > Lance
      >
      > I really don't want to step into the mess that is copyright law but in
      > essence copyrighted materials are not only protected against "copying"
      > but also against unauthorized "distribution." Doesn't matter if they
      > are sold or not.
      >
      > Think of it this way. If you wrote something and sold it in published
      > form for $20 and someone copied it and gave it away for free, they
      > would be taking away from your income since whoever got it from them
      > would have no need to buy it from you. You have the right to protect
      > how your copyrighted material is distributed, even if you give it away
      > for free.
      >
      > I assume you got most of these materials from Flywheel & Cylinder.
      > Perhaps, since Boxcar has put them up, they do have permission, and
      > further distribution, since they are available online in downloadable
      > form without charge, is thereby extended with the permission of the
      > copyright holders.
      >
      > Gerald
      >
      >
      > > But, then again, I have not actually copied any of these manuals
      > myself, I
      > > ave just collected them off the web from other sources... I'll have to
      > > check with the manufactures, I guess before I mail out any more of the
      > > CD's...... I had just figured that most of the file were long into the
      > > public domain, but don't really know what copyright limitations are....
      > > You know where assumptions get you..... Thanks for the heads up,
      > though,
      > > and I will check with the sources....
      > >
      > > - Lance
      > >
      >
      >
      >
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