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  • joe@sarabande.com
    Hi, I still print occasionally but most of my time is spent making toys and paper pop-ups. Its time to start selling off my typographic library. Most dealers
    Message 1 of 11 , Sep 1, 2012
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      Hi,

      I still print occasionally but most of my time is spent making toys
      and paper pop-ups. Its time to start selling off my typographic
      library. Most dealers don't want to buy books anymore--as in 'we pay
      zero for any book less than $100'--so I thought I'd put them up on
      ebay. My starting price is around 30-40% of comparable dealer pricing.
      Books like 'Practical Typecasting'for $45, copies of Matrix from 1 to
      16 from $110 up, some Fleurons and Goudy and DB Updike, a Grabhorn or
      two. Many are not in immaculate condition but are good research tools
      for letterpress printers and designer. If the sale goes well I'll put
      up type specimens (ATF from 1900; BB&S, etc.)

      Sorry for posting a commercial thing but I did get the ok from the
      moderator first.

      Link is:

      http://www.ebay.com/sch/Books-/267/i.html?_ipg=50&_ssn=sarabandepress&_sop=1

      Best

      Joe

      ps I would like to think that this might be a good way for people to
      get useful books.
    • Incline Press
      Trying to bid, the machinery tells me that you are unwilling to mail to the UK. Surely that canĀ¹t be right, so long as the USPS maintains desks in post
      Message 2 of 11 , Sep 2, 2012
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        Re: [PPLetterpress] Book Sale list Trying to bid, the machinery tells me that you are unwilling to mail to the UK.

        Surely that can’t be right, so long as the USPS maintains desks in post offices!

        What’s the story?


        Graham Moss
        Incline Press
        36 Bow Street
        Oldham OL1 1SJ  England

        http://www.inclinepress.com






      • Christian Morrison
        I had the same humbling experience up here in the icy north. Christian Morrison Pantry Press Inc. 148 Pearson Avenue Toronto, Ontario M6R 1G5 e:
        Message 3 of 11 , Sep 3, 2012
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          I had the same humbling experience up here in the icy north.

          Christian Morrison

          Pantry Press Inc.
          148 Pearson Avenue
          Toronto, Ontario M6R 1G5

          e: christian@...
          t: 416-537-9977 | toll-free in North America 1-800-511-4767

          w: www.pantrypress.com
        • PPLetterpress-owner@yahoogroups.com
          Graham and Christian Technically, if you want to reply to a sale please do it privately. There are a number of reasons why someone in the US would not want to
          Message 4 of 11 , Sep 3, 2012
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            Graham and Christian

            Technically, if you want to reply to a sale please do it privately.

            There are a number of reasons why someone in the US would not want to sell internationally. Primarily, the USPS itself, lordy, hell on earth. Secondarily, no security of receipt, at least, not one that anyone whats to pay for. Sometimes you are better off just throwing the stuff in the dumpster. You'd save money.

            Gerald


            --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, Christian Morrison <christian@...> wrote:
            >
            > I had the same humbling experience up here in the icy north.
            >
            > Christian Morrison
            >
            > Pantry Press Inc.
            > 148 Pearson Avenue
            > Toronto, Ontario M6R 1G5
            >
            > e: christian@...
            > t: 416-537-9977 | toll-free in North America 1-800-511-4767
            >
            > w: www.pantrypress.com
            >
          • Graham and Kathy
            One cannot do as you suggest with the configuration of the List - everything goes through the moderator and there is no option of Reply to sender other than
            Message 5 of 11 , Sep 4, 2012
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              One cannot do as you suggest with the configuration of the List - everything
              goes through the moderator and there is no option of "Reply to sender" other
              than the one this email has gone to.

              Incidentally ebay gives international shipping as an option for the seller,
              but the seller has to know that to make the choice. Most of the refusals
              don't realise that and have simply not ticked the box. Generally I have
              found that there is nothing else to it such as a deliberate intention not to
              offer the goods to anyone who will bid. Such was the case this time too.


              Graham Moss
              Incline Press
              36 Bow Street
              Oldham OL1 1SJ England

              http://www.inclinepress.com






              On 4/9/12 05:06, "PPLetterpress-owner@yahoogroups.com"
              <PPLetterpress-owner@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

              > Technically, if you want to reply to a sale please do it privately.
            • joe@sarabande.com
              ... This hurts especially since I ve been thinking about doing this for some books that I have lots of multiple copies of (Linotype Specimen books from the
              Message 6 of 11 , Sep 4, 2012
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                > Sometimes you are better off just throwing the stuff in the
                > dumpster. You'd save money.
                >

                This hurts especially since I've been thinking about doing this for
                some books that I have lots of multiple copies of (Linotype Specimen
                books from the 1990s, some books that I've published like Directory of
                Type Designers, etc.). I worry that the dealer framework isn't working
                for book dealers or users. Without a pricing framework there is just a
                rush to the bottom with books selling for a penny on Amazon. While
                this should be good for readers I think its decimated the field and
                removed any incentive for bothering to sell books. This actually
                lessens the marketplace. Why bother to sell books when its more
                profitable to throw them away?

                Its a strange time for books. I'm trying to design a new Hansel &
                Gretel book with lasercut shadow cutouts. Its meant to be read or
                projected as a shadow theatre. I've had it in the works for over a
                year and can't figure out the appropriate format. There are 5 very
                detailed laser cuts which take 21 minutes per book to cut. If I add
                letterpress type, a slipcase, and a Maglite flashlight I'll be looking
                at a cost of around $60 a piece to produce it. This turns into a very
                expensive book at retail. I'm more inclined to make just the lasercuts
                without the slipcase and letterpress to reduce the cost. I don't want
                to produce some big magnum opus. At this point I'd just like to make
                some little things that will live quietly on a shelf and not get
                dumpsterized.

                Best

                Joe
              • Scott Rubel
                Race to the bottom is right. I was excited about ebay when it first came out. It seemed like the perfect way to get every object into the right hands. I was
                Message 7 of 11 , Sep 4, 2012
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                  "Race to the bottom" is right. I was excited about ebay when it first came out. It seemed like the perfect way to get every object into the right hands.

                  I was right, but what I couldn't see then was that, in making this so easy, it (not just ebay, but the internet in general) is causing almost everything to reach its bottom value. This is probably most distinguished in the book category. Perhaps this is because everyone perceived a book as a vehicle of knowledge, which they think can all be had online now.

                  Sad, but I am hardly motivated to try and sell a book anymore. It's got to be pretty remarkable and rare to be worth considering the 15 minutes it will take to pack and ship it.

                  So, us book lovers should welcome the eventual pole shift or solar flares or whatever it is that's going to knock out the internet for a while. We may lose our vehicle for selling, but at least the values may eventually start going up again.

                  --Scott

                  On Sep 4, 2012, at 8:42 AM, joe@... wrote:

                  >> Sometimes you are better off just throwing the stuff in the
                  >> dumpster. You'd save money.
                  >>
                  >
                  > This hurts especially since I've been thinking about doing this for
                  > some books that I have lots of multiple copies of (Linotype Specimen
                  > books from the 1990s, some books that I've published like Directory of
                  > Type Designers, etc.). I worry that the dealer framework isn't working
                  > for book dealers or users. Without a pricing framework there is just a
                  > rush to the bottom with books selling for a penny on Amazon. While
                  > this should be good for readers I think its decimated the field and
                  > removed any incentive for bothering to sell books. This actually
                  > lessens the marketplace. Why bother to sell books when its more
                  > profitable to throw them away?
                  >
                  > Its a strange time for books. I'm trying to design a new Hansel &
                  > Gretel book with lasercut shadow cutouts. Its meant to be read or
                  > projected as a shadow theatre. I've had it in the works for over a
                  > year and can't figure out the appropriate format. There are 5 very
                  > detailed laser cuts which take 21 minutes per book to cut. If I add
                  > letterpress type, a slipcase, and a Maglite flashlight I'll be looking
                  > at a cost of around $60 a piece to produce it. This turns into a very
                  > expensive book at retail. I'm more inclined to make just the lasercuts
                  > without the slipcase and letterpress to reduce the cost. I don't want
                  > to produce some big magnum opus. At this point I'd just like to make
                  > some little things that will live quietly on a shelf and not get
                  > dumpsterized.
                  >
                  > Best
                  >
                  > Joe
                  >
                  >
                  > ------------------------------------
                  >
                  > Yahoo! Groups Links
                  >
                  >
                  >
                • Gerald Lange
                  Joe In the 37 years I ve been involved in the letterpress printing of books this has been a continuous refrain from book dealers. Fine press books are no
                  Message 8 of 11 , Sep 4, 2012
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                    Joe

                    In the 37 years I've been involved in the letterpress printing of books this has been a continuous refrain from book dealers. Fine press books are no longer salable, etc. Ever been to CODEX?

                    I do believe though that the market has significantly changed but I suspect that is not necessarily a bad thing. And there is ample opportunity on the internet to market your wares. You just have to get it out there.

                    If you don't make something that anyone else wants, well, that is your thing. Not necessarily a bad thing, unless of course, you really are hoping to make a living at it. No free lunch.

                    Well, there is always Kickstarter and the like. Didn't Meg Whitman use Fundly to help fund her California gubernatorial campaign? something like $23 million. You can do it too!

                    She lost by the way.

                    Gerald
                    http://BielerPress.blogspot.com



                    --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, "joe@..." <joe@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > > Sometimes you are better off just throwing the stuff in the
                    > > dumpster. You'd save money.
                    > >
                    >
                    > This hurts especially since I've been thinking about doing this for
                    > some books that I have lots of multiple copies of (Linotype Specimen
                    > books from the 1990s, some books that I've published like Directory of
                    > Type Designers, etc.). I worry that the dealer framework isn't working
                    > for book dealers or users. Without a pricing framework there is just a
                    > rush to the bottom with books selling for a penny on Amazon. While
                    > this should be good for readers I think its decimated the field and
                    > removed any incentive for bothering to sell books. This actually
                    > lessens the marketplace. Why bother to sell books when its more
                    > profitable to throw them away?
                    >
                    > Its a strange time for books. I'm trying to design a new Hansel &
                    > Gretel book with lasercut shadow cutouts. Its meant to be read or
                    > projected as a shadow theatre. I've had it in the works for over a
                    > year and can't figure out the appropriate format. There are 5 very
                    > detailed laser cuts which take 21 minutes per book to cut. If I add
                    > letterpress type, a slipcase, and a Maglite flashlight I'll be looking
                    > at a cost of around $60 a piece to produce it. This turns into a very
                    > expensive book at retail. I'm more inclined to make just the lasercuts
                    > without the slipcase and letterpress to reduce the cost. I don't want
                    > to produce some big magnum opus. At this point I'd just like to make
                    > some little things that will live quietly on a shelf and not get
                    > dumpsterized.
                    >
                    > Best
                    >
                    > Joe
                    >
                  • joe@sarabande.com
                    Gerald, ... We did that back in May. http://kck.st/KxbEw5 Our project exceeded its goal. My primary hope--besides getting money-- was to get new people aware
                    Message 9 of 11 , Sep 4, 2012
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                      Gerald,
                      > Well, there is always Kickstarter and the like.
                      >

                      We did that back in May.

                      http://kck.st/KxbEw5

                      Our project exceeded its goal. My primary hope--besides getting money--
                      was to get new people aware of our work. Something like 52% of our
                      backers were people who were new to me. We also managed to get
                      software developed for use with the animation toy which we could not
                      have done without the kickstarter base. In hindsight our major failing
                      was that we actually shipped the promised rewards. The big projects
                      seem to take a year to ship. I knew that I was doing something wrong.
                      > If you don't make something that anyone else wants, well, that is
                      > your thing.
                      >
                      Its not just about making things that no one wants; I've always done
                      that. The question is the size of the market and the price point that
                      people are willing to pay.

                      Best

                      Joe
                    • Gerald Lange
                      Joe That s kind of a difficult question. Likely one you actually do not want to know the answer to. If you can hype or market your art or work as if it were
                      Message 10 of 11 , Sep 4, 2012
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                        Joe

                        That's kind of a difficult question. Likely one you actually do not want
                        to know the answer to. If you can hype or market your art or work as if
                        it were some kind of widget or incredible collectible, well, you might
                        be able to do that (though you might not like the taste in your mouth).

                        Probably not though, and probably good for you in the long run. Just do
                        it, like Walter Hamady said, because "you have to."

                        W. A. Dwiggins probably did his greatest and most incredible work with
                        his marionettes. Did he make any money doing that? Is he remembered for
                        that? One book, The Dwiggins Marionettes, published belatedly, details
                        this, and for years it sat unsold by the publisher. I dearly admire WAD,
                        for his early illustration work (which he remorsefully abandoned) and
                        his typeface design directive, but most humanly for his great passion as
                        shown in that book. I was absolutely astounded when I found it,
                        remaindered by the publisher after so many years.

                        Gerald
                        http://BielerPress.blogspot.com


                        On 9/4/12 10:01 PM, joe@... wrote:
                        > Gerald,
                        >
                        >> If you don't make something that anyone else wants, well, that is
                        >> your thing.
                        >>
                        > Its not just about making things that no one wants; I've always done
                        > that. The question is the size of the market and the price point that
                        > people are willing to pay.
                        >
                        > Best
                        >
                        > Joe
                      • Barbara Hauser
                        Difficult question indeed. I ll have a booth at the Los Angeles Printers Fair this year, mostly to pass on type that I m culling from my collection but also to
                        Message 11 of 11 , Sep 5, 2012
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                          Difficult question indeed. I'll have a booth at the Los Angeles Printers Fair this year, mostly to pass on type that I'm culling from my collection but also to distribute some of the prints I've created because "I had to." How to price them? Too high and someone who really appreciates and wants a print might need to walk away. Too low and not only will my print be devalued, but it will alter the value of letterpress prints in general. Then there's the issue of whether I'm looking for "a good home" for my prints. If someone pays $30 for a print they may frame it; if they pay $5 it may get thumbtacked to the wall and then trashed when the grandkid's doodle replaces it. The question here is, do I really care what happens? If simple appreciation is the goal, then maybe I should ask potential purchasers to state in 25 words or less why they want the print, and adjust the price depending on the answer. Or perhaps I should ask them to point out five features that they especially like about the print, and if one of their answers is "I love how you kerned the W and o in `World,'" then bingo, a free print for you, madam. I suppose I'll have to look at a lot of print prices and consider the things that affect value: The rarity? The size? The paper? The number of colors? The complexity? The intellectual depth? The overall design? The typography? The presswork? The renown of the printer? Extra points if it's signed by a poet laureate. As for any undistributed prints that remain at the end of my days, I truly don't care whether they end up in the dumpster of some heir down the line. They served their purpose just getting created, and perhaps just enabling letterpress to survive for one more generation.

                          --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, Gerald Lange <Bieler@...> wrote:
                          >
                          > Joe
                          >
                          > That's kind of a difficult question. Likely one you actually do not want
                          > to know the answer to. If you can hype or market your art or work as if
                          > it were some kind of widget or incredible collectible, well, you might
                          > be able to do that (though you might not like the taste in your mouth).
                          >
                          > Probably not though, and probably good for you in the long run. Just do
                          > it, like Walter Hamady said, because "you have to."...
                          >
                          > On 9/4/12 10:01 PM, joe@... wrote:
                          > > Gerald,
                          > >
                          > >> If you don't make something that anyone else wants, well, that is
                          > >> your thing.
                          > >>
                          > > Its not just about making things that no one wants; I've always done
                          > > that. The question is the size of the market and the price point that
                          > > people are willing to pay.
                          > >
                          > > Best
                          > >
                          > > Joe
                          >
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