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Re: [PPLetterpress] Re: Photopolymer versus linoleum block

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  • Gerald Lange
    Hi Scott I m asking how it is done. Doesn t do anyone any good if the explanation is always, I did and it worked out great. Gerald
    Message 1 of 21 , Sep 19, 2011
    • 0 Attachment
      Hi Scott

      I'm asking how it is done. Doesn't do anyone any good if the explanation
      is always, I did and it worked out great.

      Gerald



      On 9/19/11 7:45 PM, Scott Rubel wrote:
      > Gerald,
      >
      > This may be my ignorance, but I just printed on dampened paper on my
      > C&P a few days ago.
      >
      > What is supposed to go wrong?
      >
      > --Scott
      >
      > On Sep 19, 2011, at 7:30 PM, Gerald Lange wrote:
      >
      >> Bryan
      >>
      >> I think you are correct about the separate question.
      >>
      >> Note that impression does NOT have to be the same for each element,
      >> and often benefits by not being the same.
      >>
      >> I do know that photopolymer will give you a better solid than a
      >> linocut, hands down.
      >>
      >> What I don't know is how one manages to print dampened paper on a
      >> C&P. So enlighten me on this. Honest question.
      >>
      >> Gerald
      >> http://BielerPress.blogspot.com
      >>
      >> --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, "bryan kring"<bryan@...> wrote:
      >>> Thanks,
      >>>
      >>> My press is a platen, a 10x15 C&P.
      >>>
      >>> The largest shape is about 5"x5". In a separate color, there are
      >>> several 1"x1" shapes that will print on top of the larger solid.
      >>> line art will print over all of the solids.
      >>>
      >>> The paper will be heavyweight (285 gsm) printmaking paper and I
      >>> plan on dampening it before printing.
      >>>
      >>>
      >>> As a separate question:
      >>>
      >>> In the past, my designs have usually been detailed work with tight
      >>> registration. I am trying to learn to use more overprinting. I
      >>> searched the web but didn't see any good sources of info on this. I
      >>> would be interested in reading about overprinting text or line art
      >>> on top of solids. For example, the difference in printing line art
      >>> on top of a printed solid versus printing onto blank paper and the
      >>> challenges of printing text or line partially on and partially off
      >>> of a solid shape. I think I will learn a lot as I try to print this
      >>> project. My initial assumption is to print the solid shapes first
      >>> with a light impression so that when I print the line art on top of
      >>> it I have some cushion to press into.
      >>>
      >>> Any other advice or links to more info or good examples on
      >>> overprinting would be very much appreciated.
      >>>
      >>> bryan kring
      >>>
      >>>
      >>>
      >>> --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, Peter Fraterdeus<peterf@>
      >>> wrote:
      >>>> Hi Bryan
      >>>>
      >>>> Are you working on a cylinder press or platen?
      >>>>
      >>>> I'm not sure if there's a lot of difference in which surface will
      >>>> print better.
      >>>> Certainly it's as much about the press, the ink and the paper as
      >>>> about the relief material.
      >>>>
      >>>>>> a few areas of large simple solid shapes
      >>>> How large is large?
      >>>>
      >>>> If you're doing really substantial areas, dampen the stock. It
      >>>> makes all the difference!
      >>>>
      >>>> P
      >>>>
      >>>>
      >>>> Peter Fraterdeus
      >>>> Exquisite letterpress takes time™
      >>>> http://slowprint.com/
      >>>> tweet: @slowprint
      >>>>
      >>>> IdeasWords : Idea Swords
      >>>> Communication Strategy
      >>>> Semiotx.com @ideaswords
      >>>>
      >>>> On 19 Sep 2011, at 5:08 PM, bryan kring wrote:
      >>>>
      >>>>> Hello,
      >>>>>
      >>>>> Does anyone have an opinion on which material would print solids
      >>>>> better, linoleum block or photopolymer?
      >>>>>
      >>>>> I have some artwork that I am preparing to send out for
      >>>>> processing into photopolymer. The artwork has a few areas of
      >>>>> large simple solid shapes. If linoleum would get better ink
      >>>>> transfer then I would try it. If they are the same or if
      >>>>> photopolymer is better then I would save the carving time and buy
      >>>>> the plates.
      >>>>>
      >>>>> thanks,
      >>>>> bryan
      >>>>>
      >>>>>
      >>>>>
      >>>>> ------------------------------------
      >>>>>
      >>>>> Yahoo! Groups Links
      >>>>>
      >>>>>
      >>>>>
      >>
      >>
      >>
      >> ------------------------------------
      >>
      >> Yahoo! Groups Links
      >>
      >>
      >>
      >
      >
      > ------------------------------------
      >
      > Yahoo! Groups Links
      >
      >
      >
      >
    • David McNamara
      The way I ve done it is: I have an old mini-fridge. I got some of those green foam-ish blocks that you can get from craft stores that florists use for
      Message 2 of 21 , Sep 19, 2011
      • 0 Attachment
        The way I've done it is:

        I have an old mini-fridge. I got some of those green foam-ish blocks that
        you can get from craft stores that florists use for arrangements. And then I
        got some of those disposable food storage bins (by Glad and the like; think
        cheap Tupperware).

        Fill the bins with water, soak the green stuff (cut to fit) in it until
        they're saturated. Empty the excess water. Stick about four of these in the
        doors of the mini-fridge.

        Load the paper into the mini-fridge, ideally on something that will prevent
        the shelving from marking the paper.

        Close the door. Wait two or three days. Paper is perfectly damp for
        impression. (You're safe up until six or seven days, at what point you risk
        mold.)

        (And you can use any air-tight container, I suppose. I find that the old
        fridge offers plenty of space and keeps the moisture-providing foam away
        from the paper.)

        (I also bought an inexpensive digital hygrometer, but that's pretty much
        overkill.)

        Hope that helps.
        __

        David
        ----- Original Message -----
        From: "Gerald Lange" <Bieler@...>
        To: <PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com>
        Sent: Monday, September 19, 2011 10:51 PM
        Subject: Re: [PPLetterpress] Re: Photopolymer versus linoleum block


        Hi Scott

        I'm asking how it is done. Doesn't do anyone any good if the explanation
        is always, I did and it worked out great.

        Gerald



        On 9/19/11 7:45 PM, Scott Rubel wrote:
        > Gerald,
        >
        > This may be my ignorance, but I just printed on dampened paper on my
        > C&P a few days ago.
        >
        > What is supposed to go wrong?
        >
        > --Scott
        >
        > On Sep 19, 2011, at 7:30 PM, Gerald Lange wrote:
        >
        >> Bryan
        >>
        >> I think you are correct about the separate question.
        >>
        >> Note that impression does NOT have to be the same for each element,
        >> and often benefits by not being the same.
        >>
        >> I do know that photopolymer will give you a better solid than a
        >> linocut, hands down.
        >>
        >> What I don't know is how one manages to print dampened paper on a
        >> C&P. So enlighten me on this. Honest question.
        >>
        >> Gerald
        >> http://BielerPress.blogspot.com
        >>
        >> --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, "bryan kring"<bryan@...> wrote:
        >>> Thanks,
        >>>
        >>> My press is a platen, a 10x15 C&P.
        >>>
        >>> The largest shape is about 5"x5". In a separate color, there are
        >>> several 1"x1" shapes that will print on top of the larger solid.
        >>> line art will print over all of the solids.
        >>>
        >>> The paper will be heavyweight (285 gsm) printmaking paper and I
        >>> plan on dampening it before printing.
        >>>
        >>>
        >>> As a separate question:
        >>>
        >>> In the past, my designs have usually been detailed work with tight
        >>> registration. I am trying to learn to use more overprinting. I
        >>> searched the web but didn't see any good sources of info on this. I
        >>> would be interested in reading about overprinting text or line art
        >>> on top of solids. For example, the difference in printing line art
        >>> on top of a printed solid versus printing onto blank paper and the
        >>> challenges of printing text or line partially on and partially off
        >>> of a solid shape. I think I will learn a lot as I try to print this
        >>> project. My initial assumption is to print the solid shapes first
        >>> with a light impression so that when I print the line art on top of
        >>> it I have some cushion to press into.
        >>>
        >>> Any other advice or links to more info or good examples on
        >>> overprinting would be very much appreciated.
        >>>
        >>> bryan kring
        >>>
        >>>
        >>>
        >>> --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, Peter Fraterdeus<peterf@>
        >>> wrote:
        >>>> Hi Bryan
        >>>>
        >>>> Are you working on a cylinder press or platen?
        >>>>
        >>>> I'm not sure if there's a lot of difference in which surface will
        >>>> print better.
        >>>> Certainly it's as much about the press, the ink and the paper as
        >>>> about the relief material.
        >>>>
        >>>>>> a few areas of large simple solid shapes
        >>>> How large is large?
        >>>>
        >>>> If you're doing really substantial areas, dampen the stock. It
        >>>> makes all the difference!
        >>>>
        >>>> P
        >>>>
        >>>>
        >>>> Peter Fraterdeus
        >>>> Exquisite letterpress takes time™
        >>>> http://slowprint.com/
        >>>> tweet: @slowprint
        >>>>
        >>>> IdeasWords : Idea Swords
        >>>> Communication Strategy
        >>>> Semiotx.com @ideaswords
        >>>>
        >>>> On 19 Sep 2011, at 5:08 PM, bryan kring wrote:
        >>>>
        >>>>> Hello,
        >>>>>
        >>>>> Does anyone have an opinion on which material would print solids
        >>>>> better, linoleum block or photopolymer?
        >>>>>
        >>>>> I have some artwork that I am preparing to send out for
        >>>>> processing into photopolymer. The artwork has a few areas of
        >>>>> large simple solid shapes. If linoleum would get better ink
        >>>>> transfer then I would try it. If they are the same or if
        >>>>> photopolymer is better then I would save the carving time and buy
        >>>>> the plates.
        >>>>>
        >>>>> thanks,
        >>>>> bryan
        >>>>>
        >>>>>
        >>>>>
        >>>>> ------------------------------------
        >>>>>
        >>>>> Yahoo! Groups Links
        >>>>>
        >>>>>
        >>>>>
        >>
        >>
        >>
        >> ------------------------------------
        >>
        >> Yahoo! Groups Links
        >>
        >>
        >>
        >
        >
        > ------------------------------------
        >
        > Yahoo! Groups Links
        >
        >
        >
        >




        ------------------------------------

        Yahoo! Groups Links
      • Scott Rubel
        Sorry about that. I thought there was something about the C&P that made this difficult. How I ve done it in the old days is to spritz every other sheet or two
        Message 3 of 21 , Sep 19, 2011
        • 0 Attachment
          Sorry about that. I thought there was something about the C&P that
          made this difficult.

          How I've done it in the old days is to spritz every other sheet or two
          of paper and stack it all. After a fairly short while all sheets are
          about the same softness or moisture.

          You can tell I'm not a scientist, but since I do mostly commercial
          work I really don't want to dampen any paper at all because I'm in a
          hurry. The other day I had to do it in a hurry. I was printing on an
          unfamiliar deckled sheet that had so much gelatin in it that it would
          not make much of an impression. I had not planned on it or charged for
          it, but I ended up having to take the extra time to moisten it and I
          did it by the method mentioned above. Happy customer with no idea how
          it had to get done.

          --Scott

          On Sep 19, 2011, at 7:51 PM, Gerald Lange wrote:

          > Hi Scott
          >
          > I'm asking how it is done. Doesn't do anyone any good if the
          > explanation
          > is always, I did and it worked out great.
          >
          > Gerald
          >
          >
          >
          > On 9/19/11 7:45 PM, Scott Rubel wrote:
          >> Gerald,
          >>
          >> This may be my ignorance, but I just printed on dampened paper on my
          >> C&P a few days ago.
          >>
          >> What is supposed to go wrong?
          >>
          >> --Scott
          >>
          >> On Sep 19, 2011, at 7:30 PM, Gerald Lange wrote:
          >>
          >>> Bryan
          >>>
          >>> I think you are correct about the separate question.
          >>>
          >>> Note that impression does NOT have to be the same for each element,
          >>> and often benefits by not being the same.
          >>>
          >>> I do know that photopolymer will give you a better solid than a
          >>> linocut, hands down.
          >>>
          >>> What I don't know is how one manages to print dampened paper on a
          >>> C&P. So enlighten me on this. Honest question.
          >>>
          >>> Gerald
          >>> http://BielerPress.blogspot.com
          >>>
          >>> --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, "bryan kring"<bryan@...>
          >>> wrote:
          >>>> Thanks,
          >>>>
          >>>> My press is a platen, a 10x15 C&P.
          >>>>
          >>>> The largest shape is about 5"x5". In a separate color, there are
          >>>> several 1"x1" shapes that will print on top of the larger solid.
          >>>> line art will print over all of the solids.
          >>>>
          >>>> The paper will be heavyweight (285 gsm) printmaking paper and I
          >>>> plan on dampening it before printing.
          >>>>
          >>>>
          >>>> As a separate question:
          >>>>
          >>>> In the past, my designs have usually been detailed work with tight
          >>>> registration. I am trying to learn to use more overprinting. I
          >>>> searched the web but didn't see any good sources of info on this. I
          >>>> would be interested in reading about overprinting text or line art
          >>>> on top of solids. For example, the difference in printing line art
          >>>> on top of a printed solid versus printing onto blank paper and the
          >>>> challenges of printing text or line partially on and partially off
          >>>> of a solid shape. I think I will learn a lot as I try to print this
          >>>> project. My initial assumption is to print the solid shapes first
          >>>> with a light impression so that when I print the line art on top of
          >>>> it I have some cushion to press into.
          >>>>
          >>>> Any other advice or links to more info or good examples on
          >>>> overprinting would be very much appreciated.
          >>>>
          >>>> bryan kring
          >>>>
          >>>>
          >>>>
          >>>> --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, Peter Fraterdeus<peterf@>
          >>>> wrote:
          >>>>> Hi Bryan
          >>>>>
          >>>>> Are you working on a cylinder press or platen?
          >>>>>
          >>>>> I'm not sure if there's a lot of difference in which surface will
          >>>>> print better.
          >>>>> Certainly it's as much about the press, the ink and the paper as
          >>>>> about the relief material.
          >>>>>
          >>>>>>> a few areas of large simple solid shapes
          >>>>> How large is large?
          >>>>>
          >>>>> If you're doing really substantial areas, dampen the stock. It
          >>>>> makes all the difference!
          >>>>>
          >>>>> P
          >>>>>
          >>>>>
          >>>>> Peter Fraterdeus
          >>>>> Exquisite letterpress takes time™
          >>>>> http://slowprint.com/
          >>>>> tweet: @slowprint
          >>>>>
          >>>>> IdeasWords : Idea Swords
          >>>>> Communication Strategy
          >>>>> Semiotx.com @ideaswords
          >>>>>
          >>>>> On 19 Sep 2011, at 5:08 PM, bryan kring wrote:
          >>>>>
          >>>>>> Hello,
          >>>>>>
          >>>>>> Does anyone have an opinion on which material would print solids
          >>>>>> better, linoleum block or photopolymer?
          >>>>>>
          >>>>>> I have some artwork that I am preparing to send out for
          >>>>>> processing into photopolymer. The artwork has a few areas of
          >>>>>> large simple solid shapes. If linoleum would get better ink
          >>>>>> transfer then I would try it. If they are the same or if
          >>>>>> photopolymer is better then I would save the carving time and buy
          >>>>>> the plates.
          >>>>>>
          >>>>>> thanks,
          >>>>>> bryan
          >>>>>>
          >>>>>>
          >>>>>>
          >>>>>> ------------------------------------
          >>>>>>
          >>>>>> Yahoo! Groups Links
          >>>>>>
          >>>>>>
          >>>>>>
          >>>
          >>>
          >>>
          >>> ------------------------------------
          >>>
          >>> Yahoo! Groups Links
          >>>
          >>>
          >>>
          >>
          >>
          >> ------------------------------------
          >>
          >> Yahoo! Groups Links
          >>
          >>
          >>
          >>
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > ------------------------------------
          >
          > Yahoo! Groups Links
          >
          >
          >
        • Gerald Lange
          Hi David Thanks for your explanation. Yes, there are many ways of successfully preparing the paper. I guess I should clarify my question. My query is how is
          Message 4 of 21 , Sep 19, 2011
          • 0 Attachment
            Hi David

            Thanks for your explanation. Yes, there are many ways of successfully preparing the paper. I guess I should clarify my question. My query is how is the paper kept at statis (hydration control) while printing on an press that is motor driven? I guess as opposed to a hand press or Vandercook where there is more the luxury of operator timing.

            Gerald



            --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, "David McNamara" <david@...> wrote:
            >
            > The way I've done it is:
            >
            > I have an old mini-fridge. I got some of those green foam-ish blocks that
            > you can get from craft stores that florists use for arrangements. And then I
            > got some of those disposable food storage bins (by Glad and the like; think
            > cheap Tupperware).
            >
            > Fill the bins with water, soak the green stuff (cut to fit) in it until
            > they're saturated. Empty the excess water. Stick about four of these in the
            > doors of the mini-fridge.
            >
            > Load the paper into the mini-fridge, ideally on something that will prevent
            > the shelving from marking the paper.
            >
            > Close the door. Wait two or three days. Paper is perfectly damp for
            > impression. (You're safe up until six or seven days, at what point you risk
            > mold.)
            >
            > (And you can use any air-tight container, I suppose. I find that the old
            > fridge offers plenty of space and keeps the moisture-providing foam away
            > from the paper.)
            >
            > (I also bought an inexpensive digital hygrometer, but that's pretty much
            > overkill.)
            >
            > Hope that helps.
            > __
            >
            > David
            > ----- Original Message -----
            > From: "Gerald Lange" <Bieler@...>
            > To: <PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com>
            > Sent: Monday, September 19, 2011 10:51 PM
            > Subject: Re: [PPLetterpress] Re: Photopolymer versus linoleum block
            >
            >
            > Hi Scott
            >
            > I'm asking how it is done. Doesn't do anyone any good if the explanation
            > is always, I did and it worked out great.
            >
            > Gerald
            >
            >
            >
            > On 9/19/11 7:45 PM, Scott Rubel wrote:
            > > Gerald,
            > >
            > > This may be my ignorance, but I just printed on dampened paper on my
            > > C&P a few days ago.
            > >
            > > What is supposed to go wrong?
            > >
            > > --Scott
            > >
            > > On Sep 19, 2011, at 7:30 PM, Gerald Lange wrote:
            > >
            > >> Bryan
            > >>
            > >> I think you are correct about the separate question.
            > >>
            > >> Note that impression does NOT have to be the same for each element,
            > >> and often benefits by not being the same.
            > >>
            > >> I do know that photopolymer will give you a better solid than a
            > >> linocut, hands down.
            > >>
            > >> What I don't know is how one manages to print dampened paper on a
            > >> C&P. So enlighten me on this. Honest question.
            > >>
            > >> Gerald
            > >> http://BielerPress.blogspot.com
            > >>
            > >> --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, "bryan kring"<bryan@> wrote:
            > >>> Thanks,
            > >>>
            > >>> My press is a platen, a 10x15 C&P.
            > >>>
            > >>> The largest shape is about 5"x5". In a separate color, there are
            > >>> several 1"x1" shapes that will print on top of the larger solid.
            > >>> line art will print over all of the solids.
            > >>>
            > >>> The paper will be heavyweight (285 gsm) printmaking paper and I
            > >>> plan on dampening it before printing.
            > >>>
            > >>>
            > >>> As a separate question:
            > >>>
            > >>> In the past, my designs have usually been detailed work with tight
            > >>> registration. I am trying to learn to use more overprinting. I
            > >>> searched the web but didn't see any good sources of info on this. I
            > >>> would be interested in reading about overprinting text or line art
            > >>> on top of solids. For example, the difference in printing line art
            > >>> on top of a printed solid versus printing onto blank paper and the
            > >>> challenges of printing text or line partially on and partially off
            > >>> of a solid shape. I think I will learn a lot as I try to print this
            > >>> project. My initial assumption is to print the solid shapes first
            > >>> with a light impression so that when I print the line art on top of
            > >>> it I have some cushion to press into.
            > >>>
            > >>> Any other advice or links to more info or good examples on
            > >>> overprinting would be very much appreciated.
            > >>>
            > >>> bryan kring
            > >>>
            > >>>
            > >>>
            > >>> --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, Peter Fraterdeus<peterf@>
            > >>> wrote:
            > >>>> Hi Bryan
            > >>>>
            > >>>> Are you working on a cylinder press or platen?
            > >>>>
            > >>>> I'm not sure if there's a lot of difference in which surface will
            > >>>> print better.
            > >>>> Certainly it's as much about the press, the ink and the paper as
            > >>>> about the relief material.
            > >>>>
            > >>>>>> a few areas of large simple solid shapes
            > >>>> How large is large?
            > >>>>
            > >>>> If you're doing really substantial areas, dampen the stock. It
            > >>>> makes all the difference!
            > >>>>
            > >>>> P
            > >>>>
            > >>>>
            > >>>> Peter Fraterdeus
            > >>>> Exquisite letterpress takes time™
            > >>>> http://slowprint.com/
            > >>>> tweet: @slowprint
            > >>>>
            > >>>> IdeasWords : Idea Swords
            > >>>> Communication Strategy
            > >>>> Semiotx.com @ideaswords
            > >>>>
            > >>>> On 19 Sep 2011, at 5:08 PM, bryan kring wrote:
            > >>>>
            > >>>>> Hello,
            > >>>>>
            > >>>>> Does anyone have an opinion on which material would print solids
            > >>>>> better, linoleum block or photopolymer?
            > >>>>>
            > >>>>> I have some artwork that I am preparing to send out for
            > >>>>> processing into photopolymer. The artwork has a few areas of
            > >>>>> large simple solid shapes. If linoleum would get better ink
            > >>>>> transfer then I would try it. If they are the same or if
            > >>>>> photopolymer is better then I would save the carving time and buy
            > >>>>> the plates.
            > >>>>>
            > >>>>> thanks,
            > >>>>> bryan
            > >>>>>
            > >>>>>
            > >>>>>
            > >>>>> ------------------------------------
            > >>>>>
            > >>>>> Yahoo! Groups Links
            > >>>>>
            > >>>>>
            > >>>>>
            > >>
            > >>
            > >>
            > >> ------------------------------------
            > >>
            > >> Yahoo! Groups Links
            > >>
            > >>
            > >>
            > >
            > >
            > > ------------------------------------
            > >
            > > Yahoo! Groups Links
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > ------------------------------------
            >
            > Yahoo! Groups Links
            >
          • David McNamara
            Gerald, I didn t suspect that you needed a primer on paper dampening, ha. So I guess I too quickly jumped to explaining a simple setup for those who might
            Message 5 of 21 , Sep 19, 2011
            • 0 Attachment
              Gerald,
               
              I didn't suspect that you needed a primer on paper dampening, ha. So I guess I too quickly jumped to explaining a simple setup for those who might benefit.
               
              As for feeding, except for fairly light stock, I've never had a problem with it. It handles largely like un-dampened paper. In fact, if anything, I think there's a little more grip and easier sheet separation. Anything 70#t or higher is stiff enough to stand like a regular sheet (except maybe for larger sheets). If the paper is too flimsy at that weight, I'd propose it's probably too damp...
              __

              David
              ----- Original Message -----
              Sent: Monday, September 19, 2011 11:15 PM
              Subject: [PPLetterpress] Re: Photopolymer versus linoleum block

               

              Hi David

              Thanks for your explanation. Yes, there are many ways of successfully preparing the paper. I guess I should clarify my question. My query is how is the paper kept at statis (hydration control) while printing on an press that is motor driven? I guess as opposed to a hand press or Vandercook where there is more the luxury of operator timing.

              Gerald

              --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, "David McNamara" <david@...> wrote:
              >
              > The way I've done it is:
              >
              > I have an old mini-fridge. I got some of those green foam-ish blocks that
              > you can get from craft stores that florists use for arrangements. And then I
              > got some of those disposable food storage bins (by Glad and the like; think
              > cheap Tupperware).
              >
              > Fill the bins with water, soak the green stuff (cut to fit) in it until
              > they're saturated. Empty the excess water. Stick about four of these in the
              > doors of the mini-fridge.
              >
              > Load the paper into the mini-fridge, ideally on something that will prevent
              > the shelving from marking the paper.
              >
              > Close the door. Wait two or three days. Paper is perfectly damp for
              > impression. (You're safe up until six or seven days, at what point you risk
              > mold.)
              >
              > (And you can use any air-tight container, I suppose. I find that the old
              > fridge offers plenty of space and keeps the moisture-providing foam away
              > from the paper.)
              >
              > (I also bought an inexpensive digital hygrometer, but that's pretty much
              > overkill.)
              >
              > Hope that helps.
              > __
              >
              > David
              > ----- Original Message -----
              > From: "Gerald Lange" <Bieler@...>
              > To: <PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com>
              > Sent: Monday, September 19, 2011 10:51 PM
              > Subject: Re: [PPLetterpress] Re: Photopolymer versus linoleum block
              >
              >
              > Hi Scott
              >
              > I'm asking how it is done. Doesn't do anyone any good if the explanation
              > is always, I did and it worked out great.
              >
              > Gerald
              >
              >
              >
              > On 9/19/11 7:45 PM, Scott Rubel wrote:
              > > Gerald,
              > >
              > > This may be my ignorance, but I just printed on dampened paper on my
              > > C&P a few days ago.
              > >
              > > What is supposed to go wrong?
              > >
              > > --Scott
              > >
              > > On Sep 19, 2011, at 7:30 PM, Gerald Lange wrote:
              > >
              > >> Bryan
              > >>
              > >> I think you are correct about the separate question.
              > >>
              > >> Note that impression does NOT have to be the same for each element,
              > >> and often benefits by not being the same.
              > >>
              > >> I do know that photopolymer will give you a better solid than a
              > >> linocut, hands down.
              > >>
              > >> What I don't know is how one manages to print dampened paper on a
              > >> C&P. So enlighten me on this. Honest question.
              > >>
              > >> Gerald
              > >> http://BielerPress.blogspot.com
              > >>
              > >> --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, "bryan kring"<bryan@> wrote:
              > >>> Thanks,
              > >>>
              > >>> My press is a platen, a 10x15 C&P.
              > >>>
              > >>> The largest shape is about 5"x5". In a separate color, there are
              > >>> several 1"x1" shapes that will print on top of the larger solid.
              > >>> line art will print over all of the solids.
              > >>>
              > >>> The paper will be heavyweight (285 gsm) printmaking paper and I
              > >>> plan on dampening it before printing.
              > >>>
              > >>>
              > >>> As a separate question:
              > >>>
              > >>> In the past, my designs have usually been detailed work with tight
              > >>> registration. I am trying to learn to use more overprinting. I
              > >>> searched the web but didn't see any good sources of info on this. I
              > >>> would be interested in reading about overprinting text or line art
              > >>> on top of solids. For example, the difference in printing line art
              > >>> on top of a printed solid versus printing onto blank paper and the
              > >>> challenges of printing text or line partially on and partially off
              > >>> of a solid shape. I think I will learn a lot as I try to print this
              > >>> project. My initial assumption is to print the solid shapes first
              > >>> with a light impression so that when I print the line art on top of
              > >>> it I have some cushion to press into.
              > >>>
              > >>> Any other advice or links to more info or good examples on
              > >>> overprinting would be very much appreciated.
              > >>>
              > >>> bryan kring
              > >>>
              > >>>
              > >>>
              > >>> --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, Peter Fraterdeus<peterf@>
              > >>> wrote:
              > >>>> Hi Bryan
              > >>>>
              > >>>> Are you working on a cylinder press or platen?
              > >>>>
              > >>>> I'm not sure if there's a lot of difference in which surface will
              > >>>> print better.
              > >>>> Certainly it's as much about the press, the ink and the paper as
              > >>>> about the relief material.
              > >>>>
              > >>>>>> a few areas of large simple solid shapes
              > >>>> How large is large?
              > >>>>
              > >>>> If you're doing really substantial areas, dampen the stock. It
              > >>>> makes all the difference!
              > >>>>
              > >>>> P
              > >>>>
              > >>>>
              > >>>> Peter Fraterdeus
              > >>>> Exquisite letterpress takes time™
              > >>>> http://slowprint.com/
              > >>>> tweet: @slowprint
              > >>>>
              > >>>> IdeasWords : Idea Swords
              > >>>> Communication Strategy
              > >>>> Semiotx.com @ideaswords
              > >>>>
              > >>>> On 19 Sep 2011, at 5:08 PM, bryan kring wrote:
              > >>>>
              > >>>>> Hello,
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>> Does anyone have an opinion on which material would print solids
              > >>>>> better, linoleum block or photopolymer?
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>> I have some artwork that I am preparing to send out for
              > >>>>> processing into photopolymer. The artwork has a few areas of
              > >>>>> large simple solid shapes. If linoleum would get better ink
              > >>>>> transfer then I would try it. If they are the same or if
              > >>>>> photopolymer is better then I would save the carving time and buy
              > >>>>> the plates.
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>> thanks,
              > >>>>> bryan
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>> ------------------------------------
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>> Yahoo! Groups Links
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>
              > >>
              > >>
              > >>
              > >> ------------------------------------
              > >>
              > >> Yahoo! Groups Links
              > >>
              > >>
              > >>
              > >
              > >
              > > ------------------------------------
              > >
              > > Yahoo! Groups Links
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > ------------------------------------
              >
              > Yahoo! Groups Links
              >

            • Gerald Lange
              Hi Scott Email certainly sucks as a communication method, huh? What was the paper? I ve generally found that sized paper does not work at all for dampening. I
              Message 6 of 21 , Sep 19, 2011
              • 0 Attachment
                Hi Scott

                Email certainly sucks as a communication method, huh?

                What was the paper? I've generally found that sized paper does not work at all for dampening. I guess I am thinking of externally sized watercolor papers. Stonehenge comes to mind. Total piece of crap if dampened, but give it a good whack when dry, all is good!!!!

                Gerald



                --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, Scott Rubel <scott@...> wrote:
                >
                > Sorry about that. I thought there was something about the C&P that
                > made this difficult.
                >
                > How I've done it in the old days is to spritz every other sheet or two
                > of paper and stack it all. After a fairly short while all sheets are
                > about the same softness or moisture.
                >
                > You can tell I'm not a scientist, but since I do mostly commercial
                > work I really don't want to dampen any paper at all because I'm in a
                > hurry. The other day I had to do it in a hurry. I was printing on an
                > unfamiliar deckled sheet that had so much gelatin in it that it would
                > not make much of an impression. I had not planned on it or charged for
                > it, but I ended up having to take the extra time to moisten it and I
                > did it by the method mentioned above. Happy customer with no idea how
                > it had to get done.
                >
                > --Scott
                >
                > On Sep 19, 2011, at 7:51 PM, Gerald Lange wrote:
                >
                > > Hi Scott
                > >
                > > I'm asking how it is done. Doesn't do anyone any good if the
                > > explanation
                > > is always, I did and it worked out great.
                > >
                > > Gerald
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > > On 9/19/11 7:45 PM, Scott Rubel wrote:
                > >> Gerald,
                > >>
                > >> This may be my ignorance, but I just printed on dampened paper on my
                > >> C&P a few days ago.
                > >>
                > >> What is supposed to go wrong?
                > >>
                > >> --Scott
                > >>
                > >> On Sep 19, 2011, at 7:30 PM, Gerald Lange wrote:
                > >>
                > >>> Bryan
                > >>>
                > >>> I think you are correct about the separate question.
                > >>>
                > >>> Note that impression does NOT have to be the same for each element,
                > >>> and often benefits by not being the same.
                > >>>
                > >>> I do know that photopolymer will give you a better solid than a
                > >>> linocut, hands down.
                > >>>
                > >>> What I don't know is how one manages to print dampened paper on a
                > >>> C&P. So enlighten me on this. Honest question.
                > >>>
                > >>> Gerald
                > >>> http://BielerPress.blogspot.com
                > >>>
                > >>> --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, "bryan kring"<bryan@>
                > >>> wrote:
                > >>>> Thanks,
                > >>>>
                > >>>> My press is a platen, a 10x15 C&P.
                > >>>>
                > >>>> The largest shape is about 5"x5". In a separate color, there are
                > >>>> several 1"x1" shapes that will print on top of the larger solid.
                > >>>> line art will print over all of the solids.
                > >>>>
                > >>>> The paper will be heavyweight (285 gsm) printmaking paper and I
                > >>>> plan on dampening it before printing.
                > >>>>
                > >>>>
                > >>>> As a separate question:
                > >>>>
                > >>>> In the past, my designs have usually been detailed work with tight
                > >>>> registration. I am trying to learn to use more overprinting. I
                > >>>> searched the web but didn't see any good sources of info on this. I
                > >>>> would be interested in reading about overprinting text or line art
                > >>>> on top of solids. For example, the difference in printing line art
                > >>>> on top of a printed solid versus printing onto blank paper and the
                > >>>> challenges of printing text or line partially on and partially off
                > >>>> of a solid shape. I think I will learn a lot as I try to print this
                > >>>> project. My initial assumption is to print the solid shapes first
                > >>>> with a light impression so that when I print the line art on top of
                > >>>> it I have some cushion to press into.
                > >>>>
                > >>>> Any other advice or links to more info or good examples on
                > >>>> overprinting would be very much appreciated.
                > >>>>
                > >>>> bryan kring
                > >>>>
                > >>>>
                > >>>>
                > >>>> --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, Peter Fraterdeus<peterf@>
                > >>>> wrote:
                > >>>>> Hi Bryan
                > >>>>>
                > >>>>> Are you working on a cylinder press or platen?
                > >>>>>
                > >>>>> I'm not sure if there's a lot of difference in which surface will
                > >>>>> print better.
                > >>>>> Certainly it's as much about the press, the ink and the paper as
                > >>>>> about the relief material.
                > >>>>>
                > >>>>>>> a few areas of large simple solid shapes
                > >>>>> How large is large?
                > >>>>>
                > >>>>> If you're doing really substantial areas, dampen the stock. It
                > >>>>> makes all the difference!
                > >>>>>
                > >>>>> P
                > >>>>>
                > >>>>>
                > >>>>> Peter Fraterdeus
                > >>>>> Exquisite letterpress takes time™
                > >>>>> http://slowprint.com/
                > >>>>> tweet: @slowprint
                > >>>>>
                > >>>>> IdeasWords : Idea Swords
                > >>>>> Communication Strategy
                > >>>>> Semiotx.com @ideaswords
                > >>>>>
                > >>>>> On 19 Sep 2011, at 5:08 PM, bryan kring wrote:
                > >>>>>
                > >>>>>> Hello,
                > >>>>>>
                > >>>>>> Does anyone have an opinion on which material would print solids
                > >>>>>> better, linoleum block or photopolymer?
                > >>>>>>
                > >>>>>> I have some artwork that I am preparing to send out for
                > >>>>>> processing into photopolymer. The artwork has a few areas of
                > >>>>>> large simple solid shapes. If linoleum would get better ink
                > >>>>>> transfer then I would try it. If they are the same or if
                > >>>>>> photopolymer is better then I would save the carving time and buy
                > >>>>>> the plates.
                > >>>>>>
                > >>>>>> thanks,
                > >>>>>> bryan
                > >>>>>>
                > >>>>>>
                > >>>>>>
                > >>>>>> ------------------------------------
                > >>>>>>
                > >>>>>> Yahoo! Groups Links
                > >>>>>>
                > >>>>>>
                > >>>>>>
                > >>>
                > >>>
                > >>>
                > >>> ------------------------------------
                > >>>
                > >>> Yahoo! Groups Links
                > >>>
                > >>>
                > >>>
                > >>
                > >>
                > >> ------------------------------------
                > >>
                > >> Yahoo! Groups Links
                > >>
                > >>
                > >>
                > >>
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > > ------------------------------------
                > >
                > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                > >
                > >
                > >
                >
              • Gerald Lange
                Hi David Looks like we are having a night. Okay, let me rephrase this. Are you pulling from a humidor or bag? or is the paper just stacked up, naked as a
                Message 7 of 21 , Sep 19, 2011
                • 0 Attachment
                  Hi David

                  Looks like we are having a night. Okay, let me rephrase this. Are you pulling from a humidor or bag? or is the paper just stacked up, naked as a jaybird in the prevailing winds? If so, is there a noticeable difference in the hydration from beginning to end? I guess this is a puzzlement to me because someone once proclaimed they were able to print dampened paper on a Heidelberg and I'm thinking what!?! I thought Wm Everson must be turning in his grave!!!

                  Gerald

                  --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, "David McNamara" <david@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > Gerald,
                  >
                  > I didn't suspect that you needed a primer on paper dampening, ha. So I guess I too quickly jumped to explaining a simple setup for those who might benefit.
                  >
                  > As for feeding, except for fairly light stock, I've never had a problem with it. It handles largely like un-dampened paper. In fact, if anything, I think there's a little more grip and easier sheet separation. Anything 70#t or higher is stiff enough to stand like a regular sheet (except maybe for larger sheets). If the paper is too flimsy at that weight, I'd propose it's probably too damp...
                  > __
                  >
                  > David
                  > ----- Original Message -----
                  > From: Gerald Lange
                  > To: PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com
                  > Sent: Monday, September 19, 2011 11:15 PM
                  > Subject: [PPLetterpress] Re: Photopolymer versus linoleum block
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > Hi David
                  >
                  > Thanks for your explanation. Yes, there are many ways of successfully preparing the paper. I guess I should clarify my question. My query is how is the paper kept at statis (hydration control) while printing on an press that is motor driven? I guess as opposed to a hand press or Vandercook where there is more the luxury of operator timing.
                  >
                  > Gerald
                  >
                  > --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, "David McNamara" <david@> wrote:
                  > >
                  > > The way I've done it is:
                  > >
                  > > I have an old mini-fridge. I got some of those green foam-ish blocks that
                  > > you can get from craft stores that florists use for arrangements. And then I
                  > > got some of those disposable food storage bins (by Glad and the like; think
                  > > cheap Tupperware).
                  > >
                  > > Fill the bins with water, soak the green stuff (cut to fit) in it until
                  > > they're saturated. Empty the excess water. Stick about four of these in the
                  > > doors of the mini-fridge.
                  > >
                  > > Load the paper into the mini-fridge, ideally on something that will prevent
                  > > the shelving from marking the paper.
                  > >
                  > > Close the door. Wait two or three days. Paper is perfectly damp for
                  > > impression. (You're safe up until six or seven days, at what point you risk
                  > > mold.)
                  > >
                  > > (And you can use any air-tight container, I suppose. I find that the old
                  > > fridge offers plenty of space and keeps the moisture-providing foam away
                  > > from the paper.)
                  > >
                  > > (I also bought an inexpensive digital hygrometer, but that's pretty much
                  > > overkill.)
                  > >
                  > > Hope that helps.
                  > > __
                  > >
                  > > David
                  > > ----- Original Message -----
                  > > From: "Gerald Lange" <Bieler@>
                  > > To: <PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com>
                  > > Sent: Monday, September 19, 2011 10:51 PM
                  > > Subject: Re: [PPLetterpress] Re: Photopolymer versus linoleum block
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > Hi Scott
                  > >
                  > > I'm asking how it is done. Doesn't do anyone any good if the explanation
                  > > is always, I did and it worked out great.
                  > >
                  > > Gerald
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > On 9/19/11 7:45 PM, Scott Rubel wrote:
                  > > > Gerald,
                  > > >
                  > > > This may be my ignorance, but I just printed on dampened paper on my
                  > > > C&P a few days ago.
                  > > >
                  > > > What is supposed to go wrong?
                  > > >
                  > > > --Scott
                  > > >
                  > > > On Sep 19, 2011, at 7:30 PM, Gerald Lange wrote:
                  > > >
                  > > >> Bryan
                  > > >>
                  > > >> I think you are correct about the separate question.
                  > > >>
                  > > >> Note that impression does NOT have to be the same for each element,
                  > > >> and often benefits by not being the same.
                  > > >>
                  > > >> I do know that photopolymer will give you a better solid than a
                  > > >> linocut, hands down.
                  > > >>
                  > > >> What I don't know is how one manages to print dampened paper on a
                  > > >> C&P. So enlighten me on this. Honest question.
                  > > >>
                  > > >> Gerald
                  > > >> http://BielerPress.blogspot.com
                  > > >>
                  > > >> --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, "bryan kring"<bryan@> wrote:
                  > > >>> Thanks,
                  > > >>>
                  > > >>> My press is a platen, a 10x15 C&P.
                  > > >>>
                  > > >>> The largest shape is about 5"x5". In a separate color, there are
                  > > >>> several 1"x1" shapes that will print on top of the larger solid.
                  > > >>> line art will print over all of the solids.
                  > > >>>
                  > > >>> The paper will be heavyweight (285 gsm) printmaking paper and I
                  > > >>> plan on dampening it before printing.
                  > > >>>
                  > > >>>
                  > > >>> As a separate question:
                  > > >>>
                  > > >>> In the past, my designs have usually been detailed work with tight
                  > > >>> registration. I am trying to learn to use more overprinting. I
                  > > >>> searched the web but didn't see any good sources of info on this. I
                  > > >>> would be interested in reading about overprinting text or line art
                  > > >>> on top of solids. For example, the difference in printing line art
                  > > >>> on top of a printed solid versus printing onto blank paper and the
                  > > >>> challenges of printing text or line partially on and partially off
                  > > >>> of a solid shape. I think I will learn a lot as I try to print this
                  > > >>> project. My initial assumption is to print the solid shapes first
                  > > >>> with a light impression so that when I print the line art on top of
                  > > >>> it I have some cushion to press into.
                  > > >>>
                  > > >>> Any other advice or links to more info or good examples on
                  > > >>> overprinting would be very much appreciated.
                  > > >>>
                  > > >>> bryan kring
                  > > >>>
                  > > >>>
                  > > >>>
                  > > >>> --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, Peter Fraterdeus<peterf@>
                  > > >>> wrote:
                  > > >>>> Hi Bryan
                  > > >>>>
                  > > >>>> Are you working on a cylinder press or platen?
                  > > >>>>
                  > > >>>> I'm not sure if there's a lot of difference in which surface will
                  > > >>>> print better.
                  > > >>>> Certainly it's as much about the press, the ink and the paper as
                  > > >>>> about the relief material.
                  > > >>>>
                  > > >>>>>> a few areas of large simple solid shapes
                  > > >>>> How large is large?
                  > > >>>>
                  > > >>>> If you're doing really substantial areas, dampen the stock. It
                  > > >>>> makes all the difference!
                  > > >>>>
                  > > >>>> P
                  > > >>>>
                  > > >>>>
                  > > >>>> Peter Fraterdeus
                  > > >>>> Exquisite letterpress takes timeT
                  > > >>>> http://slowprint.com/
                  > > >>>> tweet: @slowprint
                  > > >>>>
                  > > >>>> IdeasWords : Idea Swords
                  > > >>>> Communication Strategy
                  > > >>>> Semiotx.com @ideaswords
                  > > >>>>
                  > > >>>> On 19 Sep 2011, at 5:08 PM, bryan kring wrote:
                  > > >>>>
                  > > >>>>> Hello,
                  > > >>>>>
                  > > >>>>> Does anyone have an opinion on which material would print solids
                  > > >>>>> better, linoleum block or photopolymer?
                  > > >>>>>
                  > > >>>>> I have some artwork that I am preparing to send out for
                  > > >>>>> processing into photopolymer. The artwork has a few areas of
                  > > >>>>> large simple solid shapes. If linoleum would get better ink
                  > > >>>>> transfer then I would try it. If they are the same or if
                  > > >>>>> photopolymer is better then I would save the carving time and buy
                  > > >>>>> the plates.
                  > > >>>>>
                  > > >>>>> thanks,
                  > > >>>>> bryan
                  > > >>>>>
                  > > >>>>>
                  > > >>>>>
                  > > >>>>> ------------------------------------
                  > > >>>>>
                  > > >>>>> Yahoo! Groups Links
                  > > >>>>>
                  > > >>>>>
                  > > >>>>>
                  > > >>
                  > > >>
                  > > >>
                  > > >> ------------------------------------
                  > > >>
                  > > >> Yahoo! Groups Links
                  > > >>
                  > > >>
                  > > >>
                  > > >
                  > > >
                  > > > ------------------------------------
                  > > >
                  > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                  > > >
                  > > >
                  > > >
                  > > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > ------------------------------------
                  > >
                  > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                  > >
                  >
                • David McNamara
                  Gerald, I ve only done fairly short runs, so I ve just taken a good pinch at a time and placed it on the feeding board. (Since the fridge is small and needs no
                  Message 8 of 21 , Sep 19, 2011
                  • 0 Attachment
                    Gerald,
                     
                    I've only done fairly short runs, so I've just taken a good pinch at a time and placed it on the feeding board. (Since the fridge is small and needs no outlet, it's easily positioned not-too-far from the press.) So for the longer/bigger runs and commercial work, I'll defer to those with more experience--I'm firmly in the hobby category when it comes to paper dampening.
                    __

                    David
                    ----- Original Message -----
                    Sent: Monday, September 19, 2011 11:40 PM
                    Subject: [PPLetterpress] Re: Photopolymer versus linoleum block

                     

                    Hi David

                    Looks like we are having a night. Okay, let me rephrase this. Are you pulling from a humidor or bag? or is the paper just stacked up, naked as a jaybird in the prevailing winds? If so, is there a noticeable difference in the hydration from beginning to end? I guess this is a puzzlement to me because someone once proclaimed they were able to print dampened paper on a Heidelberg and I'm thinking what!?! I thought Wm Everson must be turning in his grave!!!

                    Gerald

                    --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, "David McNamara" <david@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > Gerald,
                    >
                    > I didn't suspect that you needed a primer on paper dampening, ha. So I guess I too quickly jumped to explaining a simple setup for those who might benefit.
                    >
                    > As for feeding, except for fairly light stock, I've never had a problem with it. It handles largely like un-dampened paper. In fact, if anything, I think there's a little more grip and easier sheet separation. Anything 70#t or higher is stiff enough to stand like a regular sheet (except maybe for larger sheets). If the paper is too flimsy at that weight, I'd propose it's probably too damp...
                    > __
                    >
                    > David
                    > ----- Original Message -----
                    > From: Gerald Lange
                    > To: PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com
                    > Sent: Monday, September 19, 2011 11:15 PM
                    > Subject: [PPLetterpress] Re: Photopolymer versus linoleum block
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > Hi David
                    >
                    > Thanks for your explanation. Yes, there are many ways of successfully preparing the paper. I guess I should clarify my question. My query is how is the paper kept at statis (hydration control) while printing on an press that is motor driven? I guess as opposed to a hand press or Vandercook where there is more the luxury of operator timing.
                    >
                    > Gerald
                    >
                    > --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, "David McNamara" <david@> wrote:
                    > >
                    > > The way I've done it is:
                    > >
                    > > I have an old mini-fridge. I got some of those green foam-ish blocks that
                    > > you can get from craft stores that florists use for arrangements. And then I
                    > > got some of those disposable food storage bins (by Glad and the like; think
                    > > cheap Tupperware).
                    > >
                    > > Fill the bins with water, soak the green stuff (cut to fit) in it until
                    > > they're saturated. Empty the excess water. Stick about four of these in the
                    > > doors of the mini-fridge.
                    > >
                    > > Load the paper into the mini-fridge, ideally on something that will prevent
                    > > the shelving from marking the paper.
                    > >
                    > > Close the door. Wait two or three days. Paper is perfectly damp for
                    > > impression. (You're safe up until six or seven days, at what point you risk
                    > > mold.)
                    > >
                    > > (And you can use any air-tight container, I suppose. I find that the old
                    > > fridge offers plenty of space and keeps the moisture-providing foam away
                    > > from the paper.)
                    > >
                    > > (I also bought an inexpensive digital hygrometer, but that's pretty much
                    > > overkill.)
                    > >
                    > > Hope that helps.
                    > > __
                    > >
                    > > David
                    > > ----- Original Message -----
                    > > From: "Gerald Lange" <Bieler@>
                    > > To: <PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com>
                    > > Sent: Monday, September 19, 2011 10:51 PM
                    > > Subject: Re: [PPLetterpress] Re: Photopolymer versus linoleum block
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > Hi Scott
                    > >
                    > > I'm asking how it is done. Doesn't do anyone any good if the explanation
                    > > is always, I did and it worked out great.
                    > >
                    > > Gerald
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > On 9/19/11 7:45 PM, Scott Rubel wrote:
                    > > > Gerald,
                    > > >
                    > > > This may be my ignorance, but I just printed on dampened paper on my
                    > > > C&P a few days ago.
                    > > >
                    > > > What is supposed to go wrong?
                    > > >
                    > > > --Scott
                    > > >
                    > > > On Sep 19, 2011, at 7:30 PM, Gerald Lange wrote:
                    > > >
                    > > >> Bryan
                    > > >>
                    > > >> I think you are correct about the separate question.
                    > > >>
                    > > >> Note that impression does NOT have to be the same for each element,
                    > > >> and often benefits by not being the same.
                    > > >>
                    > > >> I do know that photopolymer will give you a better solid than a
                    > > >> linocut, hands down.
                    > > >>
                    > > >> What I don't know is how one manages to print dampened paper on a
                    > > >> C&P. So enlighten me on this. Honest question.
                    > > >>
                    > > >> Gerald
                    > > >> http://BielerPress.blogspot.com
                    > > >>
                    > > >> --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, "bryan kring"<bryan@> wrote:
                    > > >>> Thanks,
                    > > >>>
                    > > >>> My press is a platen, a 10x15 C&P.
                    > > >>>
                    > > >>> The largest shape is about 5"x5". In a separate color, there are
                    > > >>> several 1"x1" shapes that will print on top of the larger solid.
                    > > >>> line art will print over all of the solids.
                    > > >>>
                    > > >>> The paper will be heavyweight (285 gsm) printmaking paper and I
                    > > >>> plan on dampening it before printing.
                    > > >>>
                    > > >>>
                    > > >>> As a separate question:
                    > > >>>
                    > > >>> In the past, my designs have usually been detailed work with tight
                    > > >>> registration. I am trying to learn to use more overprinting. I
                    > > >>> searched the web but didn't see any good sources of info on this. I
                    > > >>> would be interested in reading about overprinting text or line art
                    > > >>> on top of solids. For example, the difference in printing line art
                    > > >>> on top of a printed solid versus printing onto blank paper and the
                    > > >>> challenges of printing text or line partially on and partially off
                    > > >>> of a solid shape. I think I will learn a lot as I try to print this
                    > > >>> project. My initial assumption is to print the solid shapes first
                    > > >>> with a light impression so that when I print the line art on top of
                    > > >>> it I have some cushion to press into.
                    > > >>>
                    > > >>> Any other advice or links to more info or good examples on
                    > > >>> overprinting would be very much appreciated.
                    > > >>>
                    > > >>> bryan kring
                    > > >>>
                    > > >>>
                    > > >>>
                    > > >>> --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, Peter Fraterdeus<peterf@>
                    > > >>> wrote:
                    > > >>>> Hi Bryan
                    > > >>>>
                    > > >>>> Are you working on a cylinder press or platen?
                    > > >>>>
                    > > >>>> I'm not sure if there's a lot of difference in which surface will
                    > > >>>> print better.
                    > > >>>> Certainly it's as much about the press, the ink and the paper as
                    > > >>>> about the relief material.
                    > > >>>>
                    > > >>>>>> a few areas of large simple solid shapes
                    > > >>>> How large is large?
                    > > >>>>
                    > > >>>> If you're doing really substantial areas, dampen the stock. It
                    > > >>>> makes all the difference!
                    > > >>>>
                    > > >>>> P
                    > > >>>>
                    > > >>>>
                    > > >>>> Peter Fraterdeus
                    > > >>>> Exquisite letterpress takes timeT
                    > > >>>> http://slowprint.com/
                    > > >>>> tweet: @slowprint
                    > > >>>>
                    > > >>>> IdeasWords : Idea Swords
                    > > >>>> Communication Strategy
                    > > >>>> Semiotx.com @ideaswords
                    > > >>>>
                    > > >>>> On 19 Sep 2011, at 5:08 PM, bryan kring wrote:
                    > > >>>>
                    > > >>>>> Hello,
                    > > >>>>>
                    > > >>>>> Does anyone have an opinion on which material would print solids
                    > > >>>>> better, linoleum block or photopolymer?
                    > > >>>>>
                    > > >>>>> I have some artwork that I am preparing to send out for
                    > > >>>>> processing into photopolymer. The artwork has a few areas of
                    > > >>>>> large simple solid shapes. If linoleum would get better ink
                    > > >>>>> transfer then I would try it. If they are the same or if
                    > > >>>>> photopolymer is better then I would save the carving time and buy
                    > > >>>>> the plates.
                    > > >>>>>
                    > > >>>>> thanks,
                    > > >>>>> bryan
                    > > >>>>>
                    > > >>>>>
                    > > >>>>>
                    > > >>>>> ------------------------------------
                    > > >>>>>
                    > > >>>>> Yahoo! Groups Links
                    > > >>>>>
                    > > >>>>>
                    > > >>>>>
                    > > >>
                    > > >>
                    > > >>
                    > > >> ------------------------------------
                    > > >>
                    > > >> Yahoo! Groups Links
                    > > >>
                    > > >>
                    > > >>
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > > > ------------------------------------
                    > > >
                    > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > ------------------------------------
                    > >
                    > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                    > >
                    >

                  • Scott Rubel
                    It s called Khadi paper C5. 100% cotton rag. I wouldn t say the situation was ideal, and the paper buckled a bit with the moisture, but that added to the sort
                    Message 9 of 21 , Sep 19, 2011
                    • 0 Attachment
                      It's called Khadi paper C5. 100% cotton rag. I wouldn't say the
                      situation was ideal, and the paper buckled a bit with the moisture,
                      but that added to the sort of look the customer wanted anyway.
                      Printing it dry was barely holding an impression, even when I had so
                      much pressure the little press wouldn't cycle through. I could have
                      reset up on a larger press and probably done it, but with only 100 to
                      do, this seemed fast and a little fun.

                      http://www.khadi.com

                      --Scott


                      On Sep 19, 2011, at 8:31 PM, Gerald Lange wrote:

                      > Hi Scott
                      >
                      > Email certainly sucks as a communication method, huh?
                      >
                      > What was the paper? I've generally found that sized paper does not
                      > work at all for dampening. I guess I am thinking of externally
                      > sized watercolor papers. Stonehenge comes to mind. Total piece of
                      > crap if dampened, but give it a good whack when dry, all is good!!!!
                      >
                      > Gerald
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, Scott Rubel <scott@...> wrote:
                      >>
                      >> Sorry about that. I thought there was something about the C&P that
                      >> made this difficult.
                      >>
                      >> How I've done it in the old days is to spritz every other sheet or
                      >> two
                      >> of paper and stack it all. After a fairly short while all sheets are
                      >> about the same softness or moisture.
                      >>
                      >> You can tell I'm not a scientist, but since I do mostly commercial
                      >> work I really don't want to dampen any paper at all because I'm in a
                      >> hurry. The other day I had to do it in a hurry. I was printing on an
                      >> unfamiliar deckled sheet that had so much gelatin in it that it would
                      >> not make much of an impression. I had not planned on it or charged
                      >> for
                      >> it, but I ended up having to take the extra time to moisten it and I
                      >> did it by the method mentioned above. Happy customer with no idea how
                      >> it had to get done.
                      >>
                      >> --Scott
                      >>
                      >> On Sep 19, 2011, at 7:51 PM, Gerald Lange wrote:
                      >>
                      >>> Hi Scott
                      >>>
                      >>> I'm asking how it is done. Doesn't do anyone any good if the
                      >>> explanation
                      >>> is always, I did and it worked out great.
                      >>>
                      >>> Gerald
                      >>>
                      >>>
                      >>>
                      >>> On 9/19/11 7:45 PM, Scott Rubel wrote:
                      >>>> Gerald,
                      >>>>
                      >>>> This may be my ignorance, but I just printed on dampened paper
                      >>>> on my
                      >>>> C&P a few days ago.
                      >>>>
                      >>>> What is supposed to go wrong?
                      >>>>
                      >>>> --Scott
                      >>>>
                      >>>> On Sep 19, 2011, at 7:30 PM, Gerald Lange wrote:
                      >>>>
                      >>>>> Bryan
                      >>>>>
                      >>>>> I think you are correct about the separate question.
                      >>>>>
                      >>>>> Note that impression does NOT have to be the same for each
                      >>>>> element,
                      >>>>> and often benefits by not being the same.
                      >>>>>
                      >>>>> I do know that photopolymer will give you a better solid than a
                      >>>>> linocut, hands down.
                      >>>>>
                      >>>>> What I don't know is how one manages to print dampened paper on a
                      >>>>> C&P. So enlighten me on this. Honest question.
                      >>>>>
                      >>>>> Gerald
                      >>>>> http://BielerPress.blogspot.com
                      >>>>>
                      >>>>> --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, "bryan kring"<bryan@>
                      >>>>> wrote:
                      >>>>>> Thanks,
                      >>>>>>
                      >>>>>> My press is a platen, a 10x15 C&P.
                      >>>>>>
                      >>>>>> The largest shape is about 5"x5". In a separate color, there are
                      >>>>>> several 1"x1" shapes that will print on top of the larger solid.
                      >>>>>> line art will print over all of the solids.
                      >>>>>>
                      >>>>>> The paper will be heavyweight (285 gsm) printmaking paper and I
                      >>>>>> plan on dampening it before printing.
                      >>>>>>
                      >>>>>>
                      >>>>>> As a separate question:
                      >>>>>>
                      >>>>>> In the past, my designs have usually been detailed work with
                      >>>>>> tight
                      >>>>>> registration. I am trying to learn to use more overprinting. I
                      >>>>>> searched the web but didn't see any good sources of info on
                      >>>>>> this. I
                      >>>>>> would be interested in reading about overprinting text or line
                      >>>>>> art
                      >>>>>> on top of solids. For example, the difference in printing line
                      >>>>>> art
                      >>>>>> on top of a printed solid versus printing onto blank paper and
                      >>>>>> the
                      >>>>>> challenges of printing text or line partially on and partially
                      >>>>>> off
                      >>>>>> of a solid shape. I think I will learn a lot as I try to print
                      >>>>>> this
                      >>>>>> project. My initial assumption is to print the solid shapes first
                      >>>>>> with a light impression so that when I print the line art on
                      >>>>>> top of
                      >>>>>> it I have some cushion to press into.
                      >>>>>>
                      >>>>>> Any other advice or links to more info or good examples on
                      >>>>>> overprinting would be very much appreciated.
                      >>>>>>
                      >>>>>> bryan kring
                      >>>>>>
                      >>>>>>
                      >>>>>>
                      >>>>>> --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, Peter Fraterdeus<peterf@>
                      >>>>>> wrote:
                      >>>>>>> Hi Bryan
                      >>>>>>>
                      >>>>>>> Are you working on a cylinder press or platen?
                      >>>>>>>
                      >>>>>>> I'm not sure if there's a lot of difference in which surface
                      >>>>>>> will
                      >>>>>>> print better.
                      >>>>>>> Certainly it's as much about the press, the ink and the paper as
                      >>>>>>> about the relief material.
                      >>>>>>>
                      >>>>>>>>> a few areas of large simple solid shapes
                      >>>>>>> How large is large?
                      >>>>>>>
                      >>>>>>> If you're doing really substantial areas, dampen the stock. It
                      >>>>>>> makes all the difference!
                      >>>>>>>
                      >>>>>>> P
                      >>>>>>>
                      >>>>>>>
                      >>>>>>> Peter Fraterdeus
                      >>>>>>> Exquisite letterpress takes time™
                      >>>>>>> http://slowprint.com/
                      >>>>>>> tweet: @slowprint
                      >>>>>>>
                      >>>>>>> IdeasWords : Idea Swords
                      >>>>>>> Communication Strategy
                      >>>>>>> Semiotx.com @ideaswords
                      >>>>>>>
                      >>>>>>> On 19 Sep 2011, at 5:08 PM, bryan kring wrote:
                      >>>>>>>
                      >>>>>>>> Hello,
                      >>>>>>>>
                      >>>>>>>> Does anyone have an opinion on which material would print
                      >>>>>>>> solids
                      >>>>>>>> better, linoleum block or photopolymer?
                      >>>>>>>>
                      >>>>>>>> I have some artwork that I am preparing to send out for
                      >>>>>>>> processing into photopolymer. The artwork has a few areas of
                      >>>>>>>> large simple solid shapes. If linoleum would get better ink
                      >>>>>>>> transfer then I would try it. If they are the same or if
                      >>>>>>>> photopolymer is better then I would save the carving time
                      >>>>>>>> and buy
                      >>>>>>>> the plates.
                      >>>>>>>>
                      >>>>>>>> thanks,
                      >>>>>>>> bryan
                      >>>>>>>>
                      >>>>>>>>
                      >>>>>>>>
                      >>>>>>>> ------------------------------------
                      >>>>>>>>
                      >>>>>>>> Yahoo! Groups Links
                      >>>>>>>>
                      >>>>>>>>
                      >>>>>>>>
                      >>>>>
                      >>>>>
                      >>>>>
                      >>>>> ------------------------------------
                      >>>>>
                      >>>>> Yahoo! Groups Links
                      >>>>>
                      >>>>>
                      >>>>>
                      >>>>
                      >>>>
                      >>>> ------------------------------------
                      >>>>
                      >>>> Yahoo! Groups Links
                      >>>>
                      >>>>
                      >>>>
                      >>>>
                      >>>
                      >>>
                      >>>
                      >>>
                      >>> ------------------------------------
                      >>>
                      >>> Yahoo! Groups Links
                      >>>
                      >>>
                      >>>
                      >>
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > ------------------------------------
                      >
                      > Yahoo! Groups Links
                      >
                      >
                      >
                    • Peter Fraterdeus
                      Hi all Mea Culpa. That would have been me that prints damp on the Heidelberg ;-) And why not? There have been a number of occasions that it s been extremely
                      Message 10 of 21 , Sep 19, 2011
                      • 0 Attachment
                        Hi all

                        Mea Culpa.
                        That would have been me that prints damp on the Heidelberg ;-)
                        And why not?

                        There have been a number of occasions that it's been extremely helpful, such as when the prevailing temperature is below 5 degrees (F) and no amount of room humidifier will bring the relative humidity over about 10%

                        Works great. No problem. Lettra, or what have you. Here in three-colors on an 4x6 folded card.
                        http://slowprint.com/2010-koch-optima-cards

                        There's not much problem with maintaining humidity, since the stock is kept under wraps until all makeready is done, and returned to the wrapper after each lift is printed. Certainly I wouldn't want to process 1000s of pieces like this, but for 500 or 1000, not a problem.

                        I just printed a 13x20 broadsheet on the Vandercook 219 (an unusual job here).
                        There's a bold 96 point cap headline at the top of the piece which was not going to give sufficient coverage without overloading it with ink, so I stopped after a dozen sheets, and dampened the rest.

                        My method, which is modified from Lewis Allen's and works well for heavier stock (it may be fine for light book papers, but I haven't done much book printing)

                        Standing Press
                        Large Black Garbage Bag
                        |
                        | Exterior Plywood
                        | Blotter
                        | Blotter
                        | Press stock soaked in water, by immersion in a large photo tray.
                        | ....
                        | {continue to complete stack}
                        | ...
                        | Press stock, soaked in water, by immersion in a large photo tray.
                        | Press stock dry
                        | Press stock dry (4 - 6 or so sheets depending on weight)
                        | Press stock dry
                        | Press stock soaked in water, by immersion in a large photo tray.
                        | Blotter
                        | Blotter (larger than press stock)
                        | Exterior Plywood sheet (larger than press stock)
                        |
                        Large Black Garbage Bag
                        Standing Press

                        Leave under moderate pressure in standing press overnight.

                        Return next day. All is perfect.

                        On the Vandercook I pull the press sheet from the stack under the top blotter, and stack the printed sheet back on a new stack beginning with the plywood and blotter. The big plastic bag is wrapped across the stack as needed. This maintains humidity for a couple of days no problem.

                        I haven't had trouble with buckling. I try to keep the stack covered, and then when finished, lay the sheets out in small lifts, and rotate these a couple of times over the next day or so. Finishing off back in the standing press for some hours.

                        P

                        Peter Fraterdeus
                        Exquisite letterpress takes time™
                        http://slowprint.com/
                        tweet: @slowprint

                        IdeasWords : Idea Swords
                        Communication Strategy
                        Semiotx.com @ideaswords

                        On 19 Sep 2011, at 10:40 PM, Gerald Lange wrote:

                        > Hi David
                        >
                        > Looks like we are having a night. Okay, let me rephrase this. Are you pulling from a humidor or bag? or is the paper just stacked up, naked as a jaybird in the prevailing winds? If so, is there a noticeable difference in the hydration from beginning to end? I guess this is a puzzlement to me because someone once proclaimed they were able to print dampened paper on a Heidelberg and I'm thinking what!?! I thought Wm Everson must be turning in his grave!!!
                        >
                        > Gerald
                        >
                        > --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, "David McNamara" <david@...> wrote:
                        >>
                        >> Gerald,
                        >>
                        >> I didn't suspect that you needed a primer on paper dampening, ha. So I guess I too quickly jumped to explaining a simple setup for those who might benefit.
                        >>
                        >> As for feeding, except for fairly light stock, I've never had a problem with it. It handles largely like un-dampened paper. In fact, if anything, I think there's a little more grip and easier sheet separation. Anything 70#t or higher is stiff enough to stand like a regular sheet (except maybe for larger sheets). If the paper is too flimsy at that weight, I'd propose it's probably too damp...
                        >> __
                        >>
                        >> David
                        >> ----- Original Message -----
                        >> From: Gerald Lange
                        >> To: PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com
                        >> Sent: Monday, September 19, 2011 11:15 PM
                        >> Subject: [PPLetterpress] Re: Photopolymer versus linoleum block
                        >>
                        >>
                        >>
                        >> Hi David
                        >>
                        >> Thanks for your explanation. Yes, there are many ways of successfully preparing the paper. I guess I should clarify my question. My query is how is the paper kept at statis (hydration control) while printing on an press that is motor driven? I guess as opposed to a hand press or Vandercook where there is more the luxury of operator timing.
                        >>
                        >> Gerald
                        >>
                        >> --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, "David McNamara" <david@> wrote:
                        >>>
                        >>> The way I've done it is:
                        >>>
                        >>> I have an old mini-fridge. I got some of those green foam-ish blocks that
                        >>> you can get from craft stores that florists use for arrangements. And then I
                        >>> got some of those disposable food storage bins (by Glad and the like; think
                        >>> cheap Tupperware).
                        >>>
                        >>> Fill the bins with water, soak the green stuff (cut to fit) in it until
                        >>> they're saturated. Empty the excess water. Stick about four of these in the
                        >>> doors of the mini-fridge.
                        >>>
                        >>> Load the paper into the mini-fridge, ideally on something that will prevent
                        >>> the shelving from marking the paper.
                        >>>
                        >>> Close the door. Wait two or three days. Paper is perfectly damp for
                        >>> impression. (You're safe up until six or seven days, at what point you risk
                        >>> mold.)
                        >>>
                        >>> (And you can use any air-tight container, I suppose. I find that the old
                        >>> fridge offers plenty of space and keeps the moisture-providing foam away
                        >>> from the paper.)
                        >>>
                        >>> (I also bought an inexpensive digital hygrometer, but that's pretty much
                        >>> overkill.)
                        >>>
                        >>> Hope that helps.
                        >>> __
                        >>>
                        >>> David
                        >>> ----- Original Message -----
                        >>> From: "Gerald Lange" <Bieler@>
                        >>> To: <PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com>
                        >>> Sent: Monday, September 19, 2011 10:51 PM
                        >>> Subject: Re: [PPLetterpress] Re: Photopolymer versus linoleum block
                        >>>
                        >>>
                        >>> Hi Scott
                        >>>
                        >>> I'm asking how it is done. Doesn't do anyone any good if the explanation
                        >>> is always, I did and it worked out great.
                        >>>
                        >>> Gerald
                        >>>
                        >>>
                        >>>
                        >>> On 9/19/11 7:45 PM, Scott Rubel wrote:
                        >>>> Gerald,
                        >>>>
                        >>>> This may be my ignorance, but I just printed on dampened paper on my
                        >>>> C&P a few days ago.
                        >>>>
                        >>>> What is supposed to go wrong?
                        >>>>
                        >>>> --Scott
                        >>>>
                        >>>> On Sep 19, 2011, at 7:30 PM, Gerald Lange wrote:
                        >>>>
                        >>>>> Bryan
                        >>>>>
                        >>>>> I think you are correct about the separate question.
                        >>>>>
                        >>>>> Note that impression does NOT have to be the same for each element,
                        >>>>> and often benefits by not being the same.
                        >>>>>
                        >>>>> I do know that photopolymer will give you a better solid than a
                        >>>>> linocut, hands down.
                        >>>>>
                        >>>>> What I don't know is how one manages to print dampened paper on a
                        >>>>> C&P. So enlighten me on this. Honest question.
                        >>>>>
                        >>>>> Gerald
                        >>>>> http://BielerPress.blogspot.com
                        >>>>>
                        >>>>> --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, "bryan kring"<bryan@> wrote:
                        >>>>>> Thanks,
                        >>>>>>
                        >>>>>> My press is a platen, a 10x15 C&P.
                        >>>>>>
                        >>>>>> The largest shape is about 5"x5". In a separate color, there are
                        >>>>>> several 1"x1" shapes that will print on top of the larger solid.
                        >>>>>> line art will print over all of the solids.
                        >>>>>>
                        >>>>>> The paper will be heavyweight (285 gsm) printmaking paper and I
                        >>>>>> plan on dampening it before printing.
                        >>>>>>
                        >>>>>>
                        >>>>>> As a separate question:
                        >>>>>>
                        >>>>>> In the past, my designs have usually been detailed work with tight
                        >>>>>> registration. I am trying to learn to use more overprinting. I
                        >>>>>> searched the web but didn't see any good sources of info on this. I
                        >>>>>> would be interested in reading about overprinting text or line art
                        >>>>>> on top of solids. For example, the difference in printing line art
                        >>>>>> on top of a printed solid versus printing onto blank paper and the
                        >>>>>> challenges of printing text or line partially on and partially off
                        >>>>>> of a solid shape. I think I will learn a lot as I try to print this
                        >>>>>> project. My initial assumption is to print the solid shapes first
                        >>>>>> with a light impression so that when I print the line art on top of
                        >>>>>> it I have some cushion to press into.
                        >>>>>>
                        >>>>>> Any other advice or links to more info or good examples on
                        >>>>>> overprinting would be very much appreciated.
                        >>>>>>
                        >>>>>> bryan kring
                        >>>>>>
                        >>>>>>
                        >>>>>>
                        >>>>>> --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, Peter Fraterdeus<peterf@>
                        >>>>>> wrote:
                        >>>>>>> Hi Bryan
                        >>>>>>>
                        >>>>>>> Are you working on a cylinder press or platen?
                        >>>>>>>
                        >>>>>>> I'm not sure if there's a lot of difference in which surface will
                        >>>>>>> print better.
                        >>>>>>> Certainly it's as much about the press, the ink and the paper as
                        >>>>>>> about the relief material.
                        >>>>>>>
                        >>>>>>>>> a few areas of large simple solid shapes
                        >>>>>>> How large is large?
                        >>>>>>>
                        >>>>>>> If you're doing really substantial areas, dampen the stock. It
                        >>>>>>> makes all the difference!
                        >>>>>>>
                        >>>>>>> P
                        >>>>>>>
                        >>>>>>>
                        >>>>>>> Peter Fraterdeus
                        >>>>>>> Exquisite letterpress takes timeT
                        >>>>>>> http://slowprint.com/
                        >>>>>>> tweet: @slowprint
                        >>>>>>>
                        >>>>>>> IdeasWords : Idea Swords
                        >>>>>>> Communication Strategy
                        >>>>>>> Semiotx.com @ideaswords
                        >>>>>>>
                        >>>>>>> On 19 Sep 2011, at 5:08 PM, bryan kring wrote:
                        >>>>>>>
                        >>>>>>>> Hello,
                        >>>>>>>>
                        >>>>>>>> Does anyone have an opinion on which material would print solids
                        >>>>>>>> better, linoleum block or photopolymer?
                        >>>>>>>>
                        >>>>>>>> I have some artwork that I am preparing to send out for
                        >>>>>>>> processing into photopolymer. The artwork has a few areas of
                        >>>>>>>> large simple solid shapes. If linoleum would get better ink
                        >>>>>>>> transfer then I would try it. If they are the same or if
                        >>>>>>>> photopolymer is better then I would save the carving time and buy
                        >>>>>>>> the plates.
                        >>>>>>>>
                        >>>>>>>> thanks,
                        >>>>>>>> bryan
                        >>>>>>>>
                        >>>>>>>>
                        >>>>>>>>
                        >>>>>>>> ------------------------------------
                        >>>>>>>>
                        >>>>>>>> Yahoo! Groups Links
                        >>>>>>>>
                        >>>>>>>>
                        >>>>>>>>
                        >>>>>
                        >>>>>
                        >>>>>
                        >>>>> ------------------------------------
                        >>>>>
                        >>>>> Yahoo! Groups Links
                        >>>>>
                        >>>>>
                        >>>>>
                        >>>>
                        >>>>
                        >>>> ------------------------------------
                        >>>>
                        >>>> Yahoo! Groups Links
                        >>>>
                        >>>>
                        >>>>
                        >>>>
                        >>>
                        >>>
                        >>>
                        >>>
                        >>> ------------------------------------
                        >>>
                        >>> Yahoo! Groups Links
                        >>>
                        >>
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > ------------------------------------
                        >
                        > Yahoo! Groups Links
                        >
                        >
                        >
                      • Gerald Lange
                        Hi Peter This doesn t sound at all like it could be based on Lewis Allen s methodology, more like Gabriel Rummonds. ? I don t recall Lewis Allen advocating
                        Message 11 of 21 , Sep 19, 2011
                        • 0 Attachment
                          Hi Peter

                          This doesn't sound at all like it could be based on Lewis Allen's
                          methodology, more like Gabriel Rummonds. ?

                          I don't recall Lewis Allen advocating soaking paper, using garbage bags,
                          or blotters (per se), whereas Rummonds does.

                          Gerald


                          On 9/19/11 9:56 PM, Peter Fraterdeus wrote:
                          > Hi all
                          >
                          > Mea Culpa.
                          > That would have been me that prints damp on the Heidelberg ;-)
                          > And why not?
                          >
                          > There have been a number of occasions that it's been extremely helpful, such as when the prevailing temperature is below 5 degrees (F) and no amount of room humidifier will bring the relative humidity over about 10%
                          >
                          > Works great. No problem. Lettra, or what have you. Here in three-colors on an 4x6 folded card.
                          > http://slowprint.com/2010-koch-optima-cards
                          >
                          > There's not much problem with maintaining humidity, since the stock is kept under wraps until all makeready is done, and returned to the wrapper after each lift is printed. Certainly I wouldn't want to process 1000s of pieces like this, but for 500 or 1000, not a problem.
                          >
                          > I just printed a 13x20 broadsheet on the Vandercook 219 (an unusual job here).
                          > There's a bold 96 point cap headline at the top of the piece which was not going to give sufficient coverage without overloading it with ink, so I stopped after a dozen sheets, and dampened the rest.
                          >
                          > My method, which is modified from Lewis Allen's and works well for heavier stock (it may be fine for light book papers, but I haven't done much book printing)
                          >
                          > Standing Press
                          > Large Black Garbage Bag
                          > |
                          > | Exterior Plywood
                          > | Blotter
                          > | Blotter
                          > | Press stock soaked in water, by immersion in a large photo tray.
                          > | ....
                          > | {continue to complete stack}
                          > | ...
                          > | Press stock, soaked in water, by immersion in a large photo tray.
                          > | Press stock dry
                          > | Press stock dry (4 - 6 or so sheets depending on weight)
                          > | Press stock dry
                          > | Press stock soaked in water, by immersion in a large photo tray.
                          > | Blotter
                          > | Blotter (larger than press stock)
                          > | Exterior Plywood sheet (larger than press stock)
                          > |
                          > Large Black Garbage Bag
                          > Standing Press
                          >
                          > Leave under moderate pressure in standing press overnight.
                          >
                          > Return next day. All is perfect.
                          >
                          > On the Vandercook I pull the press sheet from the stack under the top blotter, and stack the printed sheet back on a new stack beginning with the plywood and blotter. The big plastic bag is wrapped across the stack as needed. This maintains humidity for a couple of days no problem.
                          >
                          > I haven't had trouble with buckling. I try to keep the stack covered, and then when finished, lay the sheets out in small lifts, and rotate these a couple of times over the next day or so. Finishing off back in the standing press for some hours.
                          >
                          > P
                          >
                          > Peter Fraterdeus
                          > Exquisite letterpress takes time™
                          > http://slowprint.com/
                          > tweet: @slowprint
                          >
                          > IdeasWords : Idea Swords
                          > Communication Strategy
                          > Semiotx.com @ideaswords
                          >
                          > On 19 Sep 2011, at 10:40 PM, Gerald Lange wrote:
                          >
                          >> Hi David
                          >>
                          >> Looks like we are having a night. Okay, let me rephrase this. Are you pulling from a humidor or bag? or is the paper just stacked up, naked as a jaybird in the prevailing winds? If so, is there a noticeable difference in the hydration from beginning to end? I guess this is a puzzlement to me because someone once proclaimed they were able to print dampened paper on a Heidelberg and I'm thinking what!?! I thought Wm Everson must be turning in his grave!!!
                          >>
                          >> Gerald
                          >>
                          >> --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, "David McNamara"<david@...> wrote:
                          >>> Gerald,
                          >>>
                          >>> I didn't suspect that you needed a primer on paper dampening, ha. So I guess I too quickly jumped to explaining a simple setup for those who might benefit.
                          >>>
                          >>> As for feeding, except for fairly light stock, I've never had a problem with it. It handles largely like un-dampened paper. In fact, if anything, I think there's a little more grip and easier sheet separation. Anything 70#t or higher is stiff enough to stand like a regular sheet (except maybe for larger sheets). If the paper is too flimsy at that weight, I'd propose it's probably too damp...
                          >>> __
                          >>>
                          >>> David
                          >>> ----- Original Message -----
                          >>> From: Gerald Lange
                          >>> To: PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com
                          >>> Sent: Monday, September 19, 2011 11:15 PM
                          >>> Subject: [PPLetterpress] Re: Photopolymer versus linoleum block
                          >>>
                          >>>
                          >>>
                          >>> Hi David
                          >>>
                          >>> Thanks for your explanation. Yes, there are many ways of successfully preparing the paper. I guess I should clarify my question. My query is how is the paper kept at statis (hydration control) while printing on an press that is motor driven? I guess as opposed to a hand press or Vandercook where there is more the luxury of operator timing.
                          >>>
                          >>> Gerald
                          >>>
                          >>> --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, "David McNamara"<david@> wrote:
                          >>>> The way I've done it is:
                          >>>>
                          >>>> I have an old mini-fridge. I got some of those green foam-ish blocks that
                          >>>> you can get from craft stores that florists use for arrangements. And then I
                          >>>> got some of those disposable food storage bins (by Glad and the like; think
                          >>>> cheap Tupperware).
                          >>>>
                          >>>> Fill the bins with water, soak the green stuff (cut to fit) in it until
                          >>>> they're saturated. Empty the excess water. Stick about four of these in the
                          >>>> doors of the mini-fridge.
                          >>>>
                          >>>> Load the paper into the mini-fridge, ideally on something that will prevent
                          >>>> the shelving from marking the paper.
                          >>>>
                          >>>> Close the door. Wait two or three days. Paper is perfectly damp for
                          >>>> impression. (You're safe up until six or seven days, at what point you risk
                          >>>> mold.)
                          >>>>
                          >>>> (And you can use any air-tight container, I suppose. I find that the old
                          >>>> fridge offers plenty of space and keeps the moisture-providing foam away
                          >>>> from the paper.)
                          >>>>
                          >>>> (I also bought an inexpensive digital hygrometer, but that's pretty much
                          >>>> overkill.)
                          >>>>
                          >>>> Hope that helps.
                          >>>> __
                          >>>>
                          >>>> David
                          >>>> ----- Original Message -----
                          >>>> From: "Gerald Lange"<Bieler@>
                          >>>> To:<PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com>
                          >>>> Sent: Monday, September 19, 2011 10:51 PM
                          >>>> Subject: Re: [PPLetterpress] Re: Photopolymer versus linoleum block
                          >>>>
                          >>>>
                          >>>> Hi Scott
                          >>>>
                          >>>> I'm asking how it is done. Doesn't do anyone any good if the explanation
                          >>>> is always, I did and it worked out great.
                          >>>>
                          >>>> Gerald
                          >>>>
                          >>>>
                          >>>>
                          >>>> On 9/19/11 7:45 PM, Scott Rubel wrote:
                          >>>>> Gerald,
                          >>>>>
                          >>>>> This may be my ignorance, but I just printed on dampened paper on my
                          >>>>> C&P a few days ago.
                          >>>>>
                          >>>>> What is supposed to go wrong?
                          >>>>>
                          >>>>> --Scott
                          >>>>>
                          >>>>> On Sep 19, 2011, at 7:30 PM, Gerald Lange wrote:
                          >>>>>
                          >>>>>> Bryan
                          >>>>>>
                          >>>>>> I think you are correct about the separate question.
                          >>>>>>
                          >>>>>> Note that impression does NOT have to be the same for each element,
                          >>>>>> and often benefits by not being the same.
                          >>>>>>
                          >>>>>> I do know that photopolymer will give you a better solid than a
                          >>>>>> linocut, hands down.
                          >>>>>>
                          >>>>>> What I don't know is how one manages to print dampened paper on a
                          >>>>>> C&P. So enlighten me on this. Honest question.
                          >>>>>>
                          >>>>>> Gerald
                          >>>>>> http://BielerPress.blogspot.com
                          >>>>>>
                          >>>>>> --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, "bryan kring"<bryan@> wrote:
                          >>>>>>> Thanks,
                          >>>>>>>
                          >>>>>>> My press is a platen, a 10x15 C&P.
                          >>>>>>>
                          >>>>>>> The largest shape is about 5"x5". In a separate color, there are
                          >>>>>>> several 1"x1" shapes that will print on top of the larger solid.
                          >>>>>>> line art will print over all of the solids.
                          >>>>>>>
                          >>>>>>> The paper will be heavyweight (285 gsm) printmaking paper and I
                          >>>>>>> plan on dampening it before printing.
                          >>>>>>>
                          >>>>>>>
                          >>>>>>> As a separate question:
                          >>>>>>>
                          >>>>>>> In the past, my designs have usually been detailed work with tight
                          >>>>>>> registration. I am trying to learn to use more overprinting. I
                          >>>>>>> searched the web but didn't see any good sources of info on this. I
                          >>>>>>> would be interested in reading about overprinting text or line art
                          >>>>>>> on top of solids. For example, the difference in printing line art
                          >>>>>>> on top of a printed solid versus printing onto blank paper and the
                          >>>>>>> challenges of printing text or line partially on and partially off
                          >>>>>>> of a solid shape. I think I will learn a lot as I try to print this
                          >>>>>>> project. My initial assumption is to print the solid shapes first
                          >>>>>>> with a light impression so that when I print the line art on top of
                          >>>>>>> it I have some cushion to press into.
                          >>>>>>>
                          >>>>>>> Any other advice or links to more info or good examples on
                          >>>>>>> overprinting would be very much appreciated.
                          >>>>>>>
                          >>>>>>> bryan kring
                          >>>>>>>
                          >>>>>>>
                          >>>>>>>
                          >>>>>>> --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, Peter Fraterdeus<peterf@>
                          >>>>>>> wrote:
                          >>>>>>>> Hi Bryan
                          >>>>>>>>
                          >>>>>>>> Are you working on a cylinder press or platen?
                          >>>>>>>>
                          >>>>>>>> I'm not sure if there's a lot of difference in which surface will
                          >>>>>>>> print better.
                          >>>>>>>> Certainly it's as much about the press, the ink and the paper as
                          >>>>>>>> about the relief material.
                          >>>>>>>>
                          >>>>>>>>>> a few areas of large simple solid shapes
                          >>>>>>>> How large is large?
                          >>>>>>>>
                          >>>>>>>> If you're doing really substantial areas, dampen the stock. It
                          >>>>>>>> makes all the difference!
                          >>>>>>>>
                          >>>>>>>> P
                          >>>>>>>>
                          >>>>>>>>
                          >>>>>>>> Peter Fraterdeus
                          >>>>>>>> Exquisite letterpress takes timeT
                          >>>>>>>> http://slowprint.com/
                          >>>>>>>> tweet: @slowprint
                          >>>>>>>>
                          >>>>>>>> IdeasWords : Idea Swords
                          >>>>>>>> Communication Strategy
                          >>>>>>>> Semiotx.com @ideaswords
                          >>>>>>>>
                          >>>>>>>> On 19 Sep 2011, at 5:08 PM, bryan kring wrote:
                          >>>>>>>>
                          >>>>>>>>> Hello,
                          >>>>>>>>>
                          >>>>>>>>> Does anyone have an opinion on which material would print solids
                          >>>>>>>>> better, linoleum block or photopolymer?
                          >>>>>>>>>
                          >>>>>>>>> I have some artwork that I am preparing to send out for
                          >>>>>>>>> processing into photopolymer. The artwork has a few areas of
                          >>>>>>>>> large simple solid shapes. If linoleum would get better ink
                          >>>>>>>>> transfer then I would try it. If they are the same or if
                          >>>>>>>>> photopolymer is better then I would save the carving time and buy
                          >>>>>>>>> the plates.
                          >>>>>>>>>
                          >>>>>>>>> thanks,
                          >>>>>>>>> bryan
                        • Peter Fraterdeus
                          Hmm. I ve never read Rummonds, must have absorbed this method along the way... I did read Allen in the 1980s, and at one time had built a humidor as he
                          Message 12 of 21 , Sep 20, 2011
                          • 0 Attachment
                            Hmm. I've never read Rummonds, must have absorbed this method along the way...

                            I did read Allen in the 1980s, and at one time had built a humidor as he describes. Perhaps (probably) I'm conflating my sources.

                            The blotter mostly serves to keep the plywood texture from impressing on the stock...

                            Thanks for the correction!

                            •=^=•=^=•=^=•=^=•=^=•=^=
                            Peter Fraterdeus
                            Slowprint.com
                            Semiotx.com

                            On Sep 20, 2011, at 1:46 AM, Gerald Lange <Bieler@...> wrote:

                            > Hi Peter
                            >
                            > This doesn't sound at all like it could be based on Lewis Allen's
                            > methodology, more like Gabriel Rummonds. ?
                            >
                            > I don't recall Lewis Allen advocating soaking paper, using garbage bags,
                            > or blotters (per se), whereas Rummonds does.
                            >
                            > Gerald
                            >
                            >
                            > On 9/19/11 9:56 PM, Peter Fraterdeus wrote:
                            >> Hi all
                            >>
                            >> Mea Culpa.
                            >> That would have been me that prints damp on the Heidelberg ;-)
                            >> And why not?
                            >>
                            >> There have been a number of occasions that it's been extremely helpful, such as when the prevailing temperature is below 5 degrees (F) and no amount of room humidifier will bring the relative humidity over about 10%
                            >>
                            >> Works great. No problem. Lettra, or what have you. Here in three-colors on an 4x6 folded card.
                            >> http://slowprint.com/2010-koch-optima-cards
                            >>
                            >> There's not much problem with maintaining humidity, since the stock is kept under wraps until all makeready is done, and returned to the wrapper after each lift is printed. Certainly I wouldn't want to process 1000s of pieces like this, but for 500 or 1000, not a problem.
                            >>
                            >> I just printed a 13x20 broadsheet on the Vandercook 219 (an unusual job here).
                            >> There's a bold 96 point cap headline at the top of the piece which was not going to give sufficient coverage without overloading it with ink, so I stopped after a dozen sheets, and dampened the rest.
                            >>
                            >> My method, which is modified from Lewis Allen's and works well for heavier stock (it may be fine for light book papers, but I haven't done much book printing)
                            >>
                            >> Standing Press
                            >> Large Black Garbage Bag
                            >> |
                            >> | Exterior Plywood
                            >> | Blotter
                            >> | Blotter
                            >> | Press stock soaked in water, by immersion in a large photo tray.
                            >> | ....
                            >> | {continue to complete stack}
                            >> | ...
                            >> | Press stock, soaked in water, by immersion in a large photo tray.
                            >> | Press stock dry
                            >> | Press stock dry (4 - 6 or so sheets depending on weight)
                            >> | Press stock dry
                            >> | Press stock soaked in water, by immersion in a large photo tray.
                            >> | Blotter
                            >> | Blotter (larger than press stock)
                            >> | Exterior Plywood sheet (larger than press stock)
                            >> |
                            >> Large Black Garbage Bag
                            >> Standing Press
                            >>
                            >> Leave under moderate pressure in standing press overnight.
                            >>
                            >> Return next day. All is perfect.
                            >>
                            >> On the Vandercook I pull the press sheet from the stack under the top blotter, and stack the printed sheet back on a new stack beginning with the plywood and blotter. The big plastic bag is wrapped across the stack as needed. This maintains humidity for a couple of days no problem.
                            >>
                            >> I haven't had trouble with buckling. I try to keep the stack covered, and then when finished, lay the sheets out in small lifts, and rotate these a couple of times over the next day or so. Finishing off back in the standing press for some hours.
                            >>
                            >> P
                            >>
                            >> Peter Fraterdeus
                            >> Exquisite letterpress takes time™
                            >> http://slowprint.com/
                            >> tweet: @slowprint
                            >>
                            >> IdeasWords : Idea Swords
                            >> Communication Strategy
                            >> Semiotx.com @ideaswords
                            >>
                            >> On 19 Sep 2011, at 10:40 PM, Gerald Lange wrote:
                            >>
                            >>> Hi David
                            >>>
                            >>> Looks like we are having a night. Okay, let me rephrase this. Are you pulling from a humidor or bag? or is the paper just stacked up, naked as a jaybird in the prevailing winds? If so, is there a noticeable difference in the hydration from beginning to end? I guess this is a puzzlement to me because someone once proclaimed they were able to print dampened paper on a Heidelberg and I'm thinking what!?! I thought Wm Everson must be turning in his grave!!!
                            >>>
                            >>> Gerald
                            >>>
                            >>> --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, "David McNamara"<david@...> wrote:
                            >>>> Gerald,
                            >>>>
                            >>>> I didn't suspect that you needed a primer on paper dampening, ha. So I guess I too quickly jumped to explaining a simple setup for those who might benefit.
                            >>>>
                            >>>> As for feeding, except for fairly light stock, I've never had a problem with it. It handles largely like un-dampened paper. In fact, if anything, I think there's a little more grip and easier sheet separation. Anything 70#t or higher is stiff enough to stand like a regular sheet (except maybe for larger sheets). If the paper is too flimsy at that weight, I'd propose it's probably too damp...
                            >>>> __
                            >>>>
                            >>>> David
                            >>>> ----- Original Message -----
                            >>>> From: Gerald Lange
                            >>>> To: PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com
                            >>>> Sent: Monday, September 19, 2011 11:15 PM
                            >>>> Subject: [PPLetterpress] Re: Photopolymer versus linoleum block
                            >>>>
                            >>>>
                            >>>>
                            >>>> Hi David
                            >>>>
                            >>>> Thanks for your explanation. Yes, there are many ways of successfully preparing the paper. I guess I should clarify my question. My query is how is the paper kept at statis (hydration control) while printing on an press that is motor driven? I guess as opposed to a hand press or Vandercook where there is more the luxury of operator timing.
                            >>>>
                            >>>> Gerald
                            >>>>
                            >>>> --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, "David McNamara"<david@> wrote:
                            >>>>> The way I've done it is:
                            >>>>>
                            >>>>> I have an old mini-fridge. I got some of those green foam-ish blocks that
                            >>>>> you can get from craft stores that florists use for arrangements. And then I
                            >>>>> got some of those disposable food storage bins (by Glad and the like; think
                            >>>>> cheap Tupperware).
                            >>>>>
                            >>>>> Fill the bins with water, soak the green stuff (cut to fit) in it until
                            >>>>> they're saturated. Empty the excess water. Stick about four of these in the
                            >>>>> doors of the mini-fridge.
                            >>>>>
                            >>>>> Load the paper into the mini-fridge, ideally on something that will prevent
                            >>>>> the shelving from marking the paper.
                            >>>>>
                            >>>>> Close the door. Wait two or three days. Paper is perfectly damp for
                            >>>>> impression. (You're safe up until six or seven days, at what point you risk
                            >>>>> mold.)
                            >>>>>
                            >>>>> (And you can use any air-tight container, I suppose. I find that the old
                            >>>>> fridge offers plenty of space and keeps the moisture-providing foam away
                            >>>>> from the paper.)
                            >>>>>
                            >>>>> (I also bought an inexpensive digital hygrometer, but that's pretty much
                            >>>>> overkill.)
                            >>>>>
                            >>>>> Hope that helps.
                            >>>>> __
                            >>>>>
                            >>>>> David
                            >>>>> ----- Original Message -----
                            >>>>> From: "Gerald Lange"<Bieler@>
                            >>>>> To:<PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com>
                            >>>>> Sent: Monday, September 19, 2011 10:51 PM
                            >>>>> Subject: Re: [PPLetterpress] Re: Photopolymer versus linoleum block
                            >>>>>
                            >>>>>
                            >>>>> Hi Scott
                            >>>>>
                            >>>>> I'm asking how it is done. Doesn't do anyone any good if the explanation
                            >>>>> is always, I did and it worked out great.
                            >>>>>
                            >>>>> Gerald
                            >>>>>
                            >>>>>
                            >>>>>
                            >>>>> On 9/19/11 7:45 PM, Scott Rubel wrote:
                            >>>>>> Gerald,
                            >>>>>>
                            >>>>>> This may be my ignorance, but I just printed on dampened paper on my
                            >>>>>> C&P a few days ago.
                            >>>>>>
                            >>>>>> What is supposed to go wrong?
                            >>>>>>
                            >>>>>> --Scott
                            >>>>>>
                            >>>>>> On Sep 19, 2011, at 7:30 PM, Gerald Lange wrote:
                            >>>>>>
                            >>>>>>> Bryan
                            >>>>>>>
                            >>>>>>> I think you are correct about the separate question.
                            >>>>>>>
                            >>>>>>> Note that impression does NOT have to be the same for each element,
                            >>>>>>> and often benefits by not being the same.
                            >>>>>>>
                            >>>>>>> I do know that photopolymer will give you a better solid than a
                            >>>>>>> linocut, hands down.
                            >>>>>>>
                            >>>>>>> What I don't know is how one manages to print dampened paper on a
                            >>>>>>> C&P. So enlighten me on this. Honest question.
                            >>>>>>>
                            >>>>>>> Gerald
                            >>>>>>> http://BielerPress.blogspot.com
                            >>>>>>>
                            >>>>>>> --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, "bryan kring"<bryan@> wrote:
                            >>>>>>>> Thanks,
                            >>>>>>>>
                            >>>>>>>> My press is a platen, a 10x15 C&P.
                            >>>>>>>>
                            >>>>>>>> The largest shape is about 5"x5". In a separate color, there are
                            >>>>>>>> several 1"x1" shapes that will print on top of the larger solid.
                            >>>>>>>> line art will print over all of the solids.
                            >>>>>>>>
                            >>>>>>>> The paper will be heavyweight (285 gsm) printmaking paper and I
                            >>>>>>>> plan on dampening it before printing.
                            >>>>>>>>
                            >>>>>>>>
                            >>>>>>>> As a separate question:
                            >>>>>>>>
                            >>>>>>>> In the past, my designs have usually been detailed work with tight
                            >>>>>>>> registration. I am trying to learn to use more overprinting. I
                            >>>>>>>> searched the web but didn't see any good sources of info on this. I
                            >>>>>>>> would be interested in reading about overprinting text or line art
                            >>>>>>>> on top of solids. For example, the difference in printing line art
                            >>>>>>>> on top of a printed solid versus printing onto blank paper and the
                            >>>>>>>> challenges of printing text or line partially on and partially off
                            >>>>>>>> of a solid shape. I think I will learn a lot as I try to print this
                            >>>>>>>> project. My initial assumption is to print the solid shapes first
                            >>>>>>>> with a light impression so that when I print the line art on top of
                            >>>>>>>> it I have some cushion to press into.
                            >>>>>>>>
                            >>>>>>>> Any other advice or links to more info or good examples on
                            >>>>>>>> overprinting would be very much appreciated.
                            >>>>>>>>
                            >>>>>>>> bryan kring
                            >>>>>>>>
                            >>>>>>>>
                            >>>>>>>>
                            >>>>>>>> --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, Peter Fraterdeus<peterf@>
                            >>>>>>>> wrote:
                            >>>>>>>>> Hi Bryan
                            >>>>>>>>>
                            >>>>>>>>> Are you working on a cylinder press or platen?
                            >>>>>>>>>
                            >>>>>>>>> I'm not sure if there's a lot of difference in which surface will
                            >>>>>>>>> print better.
                            >>>>>>>>> Certainly it's as much about the press, the ink and the paper as
                            >>>>>>>>> about the relief material.
                            >>>>>>>>>
                            >>>>>>>>>>> a few areas of large simple solid shapes
                            >>>>>>>>> How large is large?
                            >>>>>>>>>
                            >>>>>>>>> If you're doing really substantial areas, dampen the stock. It
                            >>>>>>>>> makes all the difference!
                            >>>>>>>>>
                            >>>>>>>>> P
                            >>>>>>>>>
                            >>>>>>>>>
                            >>>>>>>>> Peter Fraterdeus
                            >>>>>>>>> Exquisite letterpress takes timeT
                            >>>>>>>>> http://slowprint.com/
                            >>>>>>>>> tweet: @slowprint
                            >>>>>>>>>
                            >>>>>>>>> IdeasWords : Idea Swords
                            >>>>>>>>> Communication Strategy
                            >>>>>>>>> Semiotx.com @ideaswords
                            >>>>>>>>>
                            >>>>>>>>> On 19 Sep 2011, at 5:08 PM, bryan kring wrote:
                            >>>>>>>>>
                            >>>>>>>>>> Hello,
                            >>>>>>>>>>
                            >>>>>>>>>> Does anyone have an opinion on which material would print solids
                            >>>>>>>>>> better, linoleum block or photopolymer?
                            >>>>>>>>>>
                            >>>>>>>>>> I have some artwork that I am preparing to send out for
                            >>>>>>>>>> processing into photopolymer. The artwork has a few areas of
                            >>>>>>>>>> large simple solid shapes. If linoleum would get better ink
                            >>>>>>>>>> transfer then I would try it. If they are the same or if
                            >>>>>>>>>> photopolymer is better then I would save the carving time and buy
                            >>>>>>>>>> the plates.
                            >>>>>>>>>>
                            >>>>>>>>>> thanks,
                            >>>>>>>>>> bryan
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            > ------------------------------------
                            >
                            > Yahoo! Groups Links
                            >
                            >
                            >
                          • bryan kring
                            I learned to dampen paper from info that I found in this group (which led me to Lewis Allen s book). It has worked great and now I always dampen my paper when
                            Message 13 of 21 , Sep 20, 2011
                            • 0 Attachment
                              I learned to dampen paper from info that I found in this group (which led me to Lewis Allen's book). It has worked great and now I always dampen my paper when printing on unsized paper.

                              I use "dampening boxes" to hold the paper between print runs. I am able to pull out a stack of about 10-15 sheets at a time to set on the feed board. The press moves fast enough that I can feed and print the stack without any noticeable drying. I usually print on heavy printmaking papers which seem to dry fairly slowly.

                              Bryan
                            • Gerald Lange
                              Hi again If you switched from wood to 3/8 inch acetate sheets you would not get the wood texture. I just start and end with three or four sheets of the stock
                              Message 14 of 21 , Sep 20, 2011
                              • 0 Attachment
                                Hi again

                                If you switched from wood to 3/8 inch acetate sheets you would not get
                                the wood texture. I just start and end with three or four sheets of the
                                stock and let that do the absorption. I haven't had issue with buckling
                                or cocking. At one time I was using asbestos sheeting, through the
                                recommendation of a papermaker. It has a smooth side and absorbs and
                                retains the dampness well. I eventually tossed these because, well, they
                                were asbestos. The acetate seemed an adequate replacement.

                                Gerald


                                On 9/20/11 7:14 AM, Peter Fraterdeus wrote:
                                > Hmm. I've never read Rummonds, must have absorbed this method along the way...
                                >
                                > I did read Allen in the 1980s, and at one time had built a humidor as he describes. Perhaps (probably) I'm conflating my sources.
                                >
                                > The blotter mostly serves to keep the plywood texture from impressing on the stock...
                                >
                                > Thanks for the correction!
                                >
                                > •=^=•=^=•=^=•=^=•=^=•=^=
                                > Peter Fraterdeus
                                > Slowprint.com
                                > Semiotx.com
                                >
                                > On Sep 20, 2011, at 1:46 AM, Gerald Lange<Bieler@...> wrote:
                                >
                                >> Hi Peter
                                >>
                                >> This doesn't sound at all like it could be based on Lewis Allen's
                                >> methodology, more like Gabriel Rummonds. ?
                                >>
                                >> I don't recall Lewis Allen advocating soaking paper, using garbage bags,
                                >> or blotters (per se), whereas Rummonds does.
                                >>
                                >> Gerald
                                >>
                                >>
                                >> On 9/19/11 9:56 PM, Peter Fraterdeus wrote:
                                >>> Hi all
                                >>>
                                >>> Mea Culpa.
                                >>> That would have been me that prints damp on the Heidelberg ;-)
                                >>> And why not?
                                >>>
                                >>> There have been a number of occasions that it's been extremely helpful, such as when the prevailing temperature is below 5 degrees (F) and no amount of room humidifier will bring the relative humidity over about 10%
                                >>>
                                >>> Works great. No problem. Lettra, or what have you. Here in three-colors on an 4x6 folded card.
                                >>> http://slowprint.com/2010-koch-optima-cards
                                >>>
                                >>> There's not much problem with maintaining humidity, since the stock is kept under wraps until all makeready is done, and returned to the wrapper after each lift is printed. Certainly I wouldn't want to process 1000s of pieces like this, but for 500 or 1000, not a problem.
                                >>>
                                >>> I just printed a 13x20 broadsheet on the Vandercook 219 (an unusual job here).
                                >>> There's a bold 96 point cap headline at the top of the piece which was not going to give sufficient coverage without overloading it with ink, so I stopped after a dozen sheets, and dampened the rest.
                                >>>
                                >>> My method, which is modified from Lewis Allen's and works well for heavier stock (it may be fine for light book papers, but I haven't done much book printing)
                                >>>
                                >>> Standing Press
                                >>> Large Black Garbage Bag
                                >>> |
                                >>> | Exterior Plywood
                                >>> | Blotter
                                >>> | Blotter
                                >>> | Press stock soaked in water, by immersion in a large photo tray.
                                >>> | ....
                                >>> | {continue to complete stack}
                                >>> | ...
                                >>> | Press stock, soaked in water, by immersion in a large photo tray.
                                >>> | Press stock dry
                                >>> | Press stock dry (4 - 6 or so sheets depending on weight)
                                >>> | Press stock dry
                                >>> | Press stock soaked in water, by immersion in a large photo tray.
                                >>> | Blotter
                                >>> | Blotter (larger than press stock)
                                >>> | Exterior Plywood sheet (larger than press stock)
                                >>> |
                                >>> Large Black Garbage Bag
                                >>> Standing Press
                                >>>
                                >>> Leave under moderate pressure in standing press overnight.
                                >>>
                                >>> Return next day. All is perfect.
                                >>>
                                >>> On the Vandercook I pull the press sheet from the stack under the top blotter, and stack the printed sheet back on a new stack beginning with the plywood and blotter. The big plastic bag is wrapped across the stack as needed. This maintains humidity for a couple of days no problem.
                                >>>
                                >>> I haven't had trouble with buckling. I try to keep the stack covered, and then when finished, lay the sheets out in small lifts, and rotate these a couple of times over the next day or so. Finishing off back in the standing press for some hours.
                                >>>
                                >>> P
                                >>>
                                >>> Peter Fraterdeus
                                >>> Exquisite letterpress takes time™
                                >>> http://slowprint.com/
                                >>> tweet: @slowprint
                                >>>
                                >>> IdeasWords : Idea Swords
                                >>> Communication Strategy
                                >>> Semiotx.com @ideaswords
                                >>>
                                >>> On 19 Sep 2011, at 10:40 PM, Gerald Lange wrote:
                                >>>
                                >>>> Hi David
                                >>>>
                                >>>> Looks like we are having a night. Okay, let me rephrase this. Are you pulling from a humidor or bag? or is the paper just stacked up, naked as a jaybird in the prevailing winds? If so, is there a noticeable difference in the hydration from beginning to end? I guess this is a puzzlement to me because someone once proclaimed they were able to print dampened paper on a Heidelberg and I'm thinking what!?! I thought Wm Everson must be turning in his grave!!!
                                >>>>
                                >>>> Gerald
                                >>>>
                                >>>> --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, "David McNamara"<david@...> wrote:
                                >>>>> Gerald,
                                >>>>>
                                >>>>> I didn't suspect that you needed a primer on paper dampening, ha. So I guess I too quickly jumped to explaining a simple setup for those who might benefit.
                                >>>>>
                                >>>>> As for feeding, except for fairly light stock, I've never had a problem with it. It handles largely like un-dampened paper. In fact, if anything, I think there's a little more grip and easier sheet separation. Anything 70#t or higher is stiff enough to stand like a regular sheet (except maybe for larger sheets). If the paper is too flimsy at that weight, I'd propose it's probably too damp...
                                >>>>> __
                                >>>>>
                                >>>>> David
                                >>>>> ----- Original Message -----
                                >>>>> From: Gerald Lange
                                >>>>> To: PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com
                                >>>>> Sent: Monday, September 19, 2011 11:15 PM
                                >>>>> Subject: [PPLetterpress] Re: Photopolymer versus linoleum block
                                >>>>>
                                >>>>>
                                >>>>>
                                >>>>> Hi David
                                >>>>>
                                >>>>> Thanks for your explanation. Yes, there are many ways of successfully preparing the paper. I guess I should clarify my question. My query is how is the paper kept at statis (hydration control) while printing on an press that is motor driven? I guess as opposed to a hand press or Vandercook where there is more the luxury of operator timing.
                                >>>>>
                                >>>>> Gerald
                                >>>>>
                                >>>>> --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, "David McNamara"<david@> wrote:
                                >>>>>> The way I've done it is:
                                >>>>>>
                                >>>>>> I have an old mini-fridge. I got some of those green foam-ish blocks that
                                >>>>>> you can get from craft stores that florists use for arrangements. And then I
                                >>>>>> got some of those disposable food storage bins (by Glad and the like; think
                                >>>>>> cheap Tupperware).
                                >>>>>>
                                >>>>>> Fill the bins with water, soak the green stuff (cut to fit) in it until
                                >>>>>> they're saturated. Empty the excess water. Stick about four of these in the
                                >>>>>> doors of the mini-fridge.
                                >>>>>>
                                >>>>>> Load the paper into the mini-fridge, ideally on something that will prevent
                                >>>>>> the shelving from marking the paper.
                                >>>>>>
                                >>>>>> Close the door. Wait two or three days. Paper is perfectly damp for
                                >>>>>> impression. (You're safe up until six or seven days, at what point you risk
                                >>>>>> mold.)
                                >>>>>>
                                >>>>>> (And you can use any air-tight container, I suppose. I find that the old
                                >>>>>> fridge offers plenty of space and keeps the moisture-providing foam away
                                >>>>>> from the paper.)
                                >>>>>>
                                >>>>>> (I also bought an inexpensive digital hygrometer, but that's pretty much
                                >>>>>> overkill.)
                                >>>>>>
                                >>>>>> Hope that helps.
                                >>>>>> __
                                >>>>>>
                                >>>>>> David
                                >>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
                                >>>>>> From: "Gerald Lange"<Bieler@>
                                >>>>>> To:<PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com>
                                >>>>>> Sent: Monday, September 19, 2011 10:51 PM
                                >>>>>> Subject: Re: [PPLetterpress] Re: Photopolymer versus linoleum block
                                >>>>>>
                                >>>>>>
                                >>>>>> Hi Scott
                                >>>>>>
                                >>>>>> I'm asking how it is done. Doesn't do anyone any good if the explanation
                                >>>>>> is always, I did and it worked out great.
                                >>>>>>
                                >>>>>> Gerald
                                >>>>>>
                                >>>>>>
                                >>>>>>
                                >>>>>> On 9/19/11 7:45 PM, Scott Rubel wrote:
                                >>>>>>> Gerald,
                                >>>>>>>
                                >>>>>>> This may be my ignorance, but I just printed on dampened paper on my
                                >>>>>>> C&P a few days ago.
                                >>>>>>>
                                >>>>>>> What is supposed to go wrong?
                                >>>>>>>
                                >>>>>>> --Scott
                                >>>>>>>
                                >>>>>>> On Sep 19, 2011, at 7:30 PM, Gerald Lange wrote:
                                >>>>>>>
                                >>>>>>>> Bryan
                                >>>>>>>>
                                >>>>>>>> I think you are correct about the separate question.
                                >>>>>>>>
                                >>>>>>>> Note that impression does NOT have to be the same for each element,
                                >>>>>>>> and often benefits by not being the same.
                                >>>>>>>>
                                >>>>>>>> I do know that photopolymer will give you a better solid than a
                                >>>>>>>> linocut, hands down.
                                >>>>>>>>
                                >>>>>>>> What I don't know is how one manages to print dampened paper on a
                                >>>>>>>> C&P. So enlighten me on this. Honest question.
                                >>>>>>>>
                                >>>>>>>> Gerald
                                >>>>>>>> http://BielerPress.blogspot.com
                                >>>>>>>>
                                >>>>>>>> --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, "bryan kring"<bryan@> wrote:
                                >>>>>>>>> Thanks,
                                >>>>>>>>>
                                >>>>>>>>> My press is a platen, a 10x15 C&P.
                                >>>>>>>>>
                                >>>>>>>>> The largest shape is about 5"x5". In a separate color, there are
                                >>>>>>>>> several 1"x1" shapes that will print on top of the larger solid.
                                >>>>>>>>> line art will print over all of the solids.
                                >>>>>>>>>
                                >>>>>>>>> The paper will be heavyweight (285 gsm) printmaking paper and I
                                >>>>>>>>> plan on dampening it before printing.
                                >>>>>>>>>
                                >>>>>>>>>
                                >>>>>>>>> As a separate question:
                                >>>>>>>>>
                                >>>>>>>>> In the past, my designs have usually been detailed work with tight
                                >>>>>>>>> registration. I am trying to learn to use more overprinting. I
                                >>>>>>>>> searched the web but didn't see any good sources of info on this. I
                                >>>>>>>>> would be interested in reading about overprinting text or line art
                                >>>>>>>>> on top of solids. For example, the difference in printing line art
                                >>>>>>>>> on top of a printed solid versus printing onto blank paper and the
                                >>>>>>>>> challenges of printing text or line partially on and partially off
                                >>>>>>>>> of a solid shape. I think I will learn a lot as I try to print this
                                >>>>>>>>> project. My initial assumption is to print the solid shapes first
                                >>>>>>>>> with a light impression so that when I print the line art on top of
                                >>>>>>>>> it I have some cushion to press into.
                                >>>>>>>>>
                                >>>>>>>>> Any other advice or links to more info or good examples on
                                >>>>>>>>> overprinting would be very much appreciated.
                                >>>>>>>>>
                                >>>>>>>>> bryan kring
                                >>>>>>>>>
                                >>>>>>>>>
                                >>>>>>>>>
                                >>>>>>>>> --- In PPLetterpress@yahoogroups.com, Peter Fraterdeus<peterf@>
                                >>>>>>>>> wrote:
                                >>>>>>>>>> Hi Bryan
                                >>>>>>>>>>
                                >>>>>>>>>> Are you working on a cylinder press or platen?
                                >>>>>>>>>>
                                >>>>>>>>>> I'm not sure if there's a lot of difference in which surface will
                                >>>>>>>>>> print better.
                                >>>>>>>>>> Certainly it's as much about the press, the ink and the paper as
                                >>>>>>>>>> about the relief material.
                                >>>>>>>>>>
                                >>>>>>>>>>>> a few areas of large simple solid shapes
                                >>>>>>>>>> How large is large?
                                >>>>>>>>>>
                                >>>>>>>>>> If you're doing really substantial areas, dampen the stock. It
                                >>>>>>>>>> makes all the difference!
                                >>>>>>>>>>
                                >>>>>>>>>> P
                                >>>>>>>>>>
                                >>>>>>>>>>
                                >>>>>>>>>> Peter Fraterdeus
                                >>>>>>>>>> Exquisite letterpress takes timeT
                                >>>>>>>>>> http://slowprint.com/
                                >>>>>>>>>> tweet: @slowprint
                                >>>>>>>>>>
                                >>>>>>>>>> IdeasWords : Idea Swords
                                >>>>>>>>>> Communication Strategy
                                >>>>>>>>>> Semiotx.com @ideaswords
                                >>>>>>>>>>
                                >>>>>>>>>> On 19 Sep 2011, at 5:08 PM, bryan kring wrote:
                                >>>>>>>>>>
                                >>>>>>>>>>> Hello,
                                >>>>>>>>>>>
                                >>>>>>>>>>> Does anyone have an opinion on which material would print solids
                                >>>>>>>>>>> better, linoleum block or photopolymer?
                                >>>>>>>>>>>
                                >>>>>>>>>>> I have some artwork that I am preparing to send out for
                                >>>>>>>>>>> processing into photopolymer. The artwork has a few areas of
                                >>>>>>>>>>> large simple solid shapes. If linoleum would get better ink
                                >>>>>>>>>>> transfer then I would try it. If they are the same or if
                                >>>>>>>>>>> photopolymer is better then I would save the carving time and buy
                                >>>>>>>>>>> the plates.
                                >>>>>>>>>>>
                                >>>>>>>>>>> thanks,
                                >>>>>>>>>>> bryan
                                >>
                                >>
                                >>
                                >> ------------------------------------
                                >>
                                >>
                              • Gerald Lange
                                Bryan This makes sense. My experience has been that the amount of time that the paper is out of the box can be treacherous, so my concern was how is this
                                Message 15 of 21 , Sep 20, 2011
                                • 0 Attachment
                                  Bryan

                                  This makes sense.

                                  My experience has been that the amount of time that the paper is out of
                                  the box can be treacherous, so my concern was how is this managed on a
                                  motor driven press. I have a student who wants to learn the process and
                                  she has a C&P. I wasn't sure how this would work.

                                  Thanks.

                                  Gerald


                                  On 9/20/11 8:12 AM, bryan kring wrote:
                                  > I learned to dampen paper from info that I found in this group (which led me to Lewis Allen's book). It has worked great and now I always dampen my paper when printing on unsized paper.
                                  >
                                  > I use "dampening boxes" to hold the paper between print runs. I am able to pull out a stack of about 10-15 sheets at a time to set on the feed board. The press moves fast enough that I can feed and print the stack without any noticeable drying. I usually print on heavy printmaking papers which seem to dry fairly slowly.
                                  >
                                  > Bryan
                                  >
                                  >
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