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RE: [bump] [PCGenListFileHelp] CLASS and SUBCLASS

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  • Paul W. King
    But would making them subclasses work? I just tried taking more than 1 Wiz specialization (the only use of SUBCLASS I m aware of) and couldn t. I think it d
    Message 1 of 23 , Mar 6, 2004
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      But would making them subclasses work? I just tried taking more than 1 Wiz
      specialization (the only use of SUBCLASS I'm aware of) and couldn't.

      I think it'd be a shame to have so much duplication, since the BAB, F/R/W
      saves, Reputation and Defense progression and the levels to choose the bonus
      feats and bonus martial arts styles would be the same for all the subclasses
      of the Contemplative Master and the Martial Arts Master (so we're talking
      over 80 total classes).

      Paul W. King
      OGL SB, PL Chimp, Data Tamarin, TM Lemur, BoD

      -----Original Message-----
      From: Hetter [mailto:hetter71@...]
      Sent: Saturday, March 06, 2004 8:40 AM
      To: PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: Re: [bump] [PCGenListFileHelp] CLASS and SUBCLASS


      Hrmmm....sorry, I focused in on the feat aspect that you mentioned, didn't
      realize you could actually take the class more than once. In that case, the
      only way I know of to do it would be doing the however many (40+?)
      sublcasses.
    • Barak
      Subclasses wouldn t work. Hmmm, how about making a basic class (that wouldn t actually be taken) and then using .COPY and/or .MOD to make each of the variants?
      Message 2 of 23 , Mar 6, 2004
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        Subclasses wouldn't work.

        Hmmm, how about making a basic class (that wouldn't actually be taken) and
        then using .COPY and/or .MOD to make each of the variants? Then you don't
        have the duplication.


        Barak
        ~PCGen BoD
        ~OS Silverback


        > -----Original Message-----
        > From: Paul W. King [mailto:paulking.rhochi@...]
        >
        > But would making them subclasses work? I just tried taking
        > more than 1 Wiz specialization (the only use of SUBCLASS I'm
        > aware of) and couldn't.
        >
        > I think it'd be a shame to have so much duplication, since
        > the BAB, F/R/W saves, Reputation and Defense progression and
        > the levels to choose the bonus feats and bonus martial arts
        > styles would be the same for all the subclasses of the
        > Contemplative Master and the Martial Arts Master (so we're
        > talking over 80 total classes).
        >
        > Paul W. King
        > OGL SB, PL Chimp, Data Tamarin, TM Lemur, BoD
      • Paul W. King
        Here, let me use an actual base class, that isn t used. Martial Arts Master As I said previously, BAB, F/R/W, Rep and Def don t change based on the style
        Message 3 of 23 , Mar 6, 2004
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          Here, let me use an actual base class, that isn't used.

          Martial Arts Master
          As I said previously, BAB, F/R/W, Rep and Def don't change based on the
          style chosen
          Now, at every odd level you get a Mastery and every even a bonus feat.
          These are chosen from the list dependent on the style your mastering.

          So, if you choose Aikido, then you must choose the Aikido Masteries and the
          Aikido bonus feats. There is nothing that forbids you to pick up Karate,
          but then for the Karate Master, you must choose Karate Masteries and Karate
          bonus feats.

          That make a bit more sense? Or was I getting confused on your explanation
          and just muddy the waters some more?

          Paul W. King
          OGL SB, PL Chimp, Data Tamarin, TM Lemur, BoD

          -----Original Message-----
          From: Barak [mailto:barak@...]
          Sent: Saturday, March 06, 2004 9:03 AM
          To: PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: RE: [bump] [PCGenListFileHelp] CLASS and SUBCLASS


          Subclasses wouldn't work.

          Hmmm, how about making a basic class (that wouldn't actually be taken) and
          then using .COPY and/or .MOD to make each of the variants? Then you don't
          have the duplication.
        • Barak
          ... Is this progressive or stacking? If I take 2 levels in Akido Master and then take a level in Karate Master, do I get the bonuses for a 3rd level master,
          Message 4 of 23 , Mar 6, 2004
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            > -----Original Message-----
            > From: Paul W. King [mailto:paulking.rhochi@...]
            >
            > Here, let me use an actual base class, that isn't used.
            >
            > Martial Arts Master
            > As I said previously, BAB, F/R/W, Rep and Def don't change
            > based on the style chosen Now, at every odd level you get a
            > Mastery and every even a bonus feat. These are chosen from
            > the list dependent on the style your mastering.

            Is this progressive or stacking? If I take 2 levels in Akido Master and
            then take a level in Karate Master, do I get the bonuses for a 3rd level
            master, or the bonuses for a 2nd level Akido and a 1st level Karate? If it
            stacks it'll be very problematical. If it doesn't, cool. :p

            > So, if you choose Aikido, then you must choose the Aikido
            > Masteries and the Aikido bonus feats. There is nothing that
            > forbids you to pick up Karate, but then for the Karate
            > Master, you must choose Karate Masteries and Karate bonus feats.

            Ok. Easy enough (I think). Following are what I'd try... classes then
            feats.

            **********************
            Master Class (Do Not Take)
            BAB F/R/W etc.
            1) ADD:FEAT(TYPE=Mastery)
            2) ADD:FEAT(TYPE=Bonus)

            Master Class (Do Not Take).COPY=Akido Master
            1 DEFINE:MasterType|0 BONUS:VAR|MasterType|1

            Master Class (Do Not Take).COPY=Karate Master
            1 DEFINE:MasterType|0 BONUS:VAR|MasterType|2
            ***********************
            Akido Smash
            TYPE:Mastery
            PREVAREQ:MasterType,1
            Stuff

            Akido Dodge
            TYPE:Mastery
            PREVAREQ:MasterType,1
            Stuff

            Karate Kick
            TYPE:Mastery
            PREVAREQ:MasterType,2
            Stuff

            Karate Chop
            TYPE:Mastery
            PREVAREQ:MasterType,2
            Stuff

            > That make a bit more sense? Or was I getting confused on your
            > explanation and just muddy the waters some more?

            I think you were confused (or maybe I was confusing :p). See above.

            Barak

            PS:Let me know if it works... That was all off the top of my head and from
            the docs.
          • taluroniscandar
            ... than 1 Wiz ... Just for future reference Psion uses SUBCLASSes also.
            Message 5 of 23 , Mar 6, 2004
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              > But would making them subclasses work? I just tried taking more
              than 1 Wiz
              > specialization (the only use of SUBCLASS I'm aware of) and couldn't.

              Just for future reference Psion uses SUBCLASSes also.
            • taluroniscandar
              ... and the ... Karate, ... Karate ... explanation ... Could create a basic class (with the BAB, FRW, etc) then put the rest of the stuff into PCGen templates
              Message 6 of 23 , Mar 6, 2004
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                --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com, "Paul W. King"
                <paulking.rhochi@v...> wrote:
                > Here, let me use an actual base class, that isn't used.
                >
                > Martial Arts Master
                > As I said previously, BAB, F/R/W, Rep and Def don't change based on the
                > style chosen
                > Now, at every odd level you get a Mastery and every even a bonus feat.
                > These are chosen from the list dependent on the style your mastering.
                >
                > So, if you choose Aikido, then you must choose the Aikido Masteries
                and the
                > Aikido bonus feats. There is nothing that forbids you to pick up
                Karate,
                > but then for the Karate Master, you must choose Karate Masteries and
                Karate
                > bonus feats.
                >
                > That make a bit more sense? Or was I getting confused on your
                explanation
                > and just muddy the waters some more?
                >

                Could create a basic class (with the BAB, FRW, etc) then put the rest
                of the stuff into PCGen templates (which are not exactly the same as
                DnD templates) Apply the skill, qualify for feats etc, thru the
                template (PRETEMPLATE) or just apply the feats and mastery stuff from
                the template itself. At, what is it, every odd level, give the
                character a TEMPLATE choice and base every else off of that choice.
              • Paul W. King
                ... Its the 2nd one. In your example, you d have an Aikido mastery and Aikido feat as 2nd level Aikido Master and a Karate mastery as a 1st level Karate
                Message 7 of 23 , Mar 6, 2004
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                  > Is this progressive or stacking? If I take 2 levels in Akido
                  > Master and then take a level in Karate Master, do I get the
                  > bonuses for a 3rd level master, or the bonuses for a 2nd level
                  > Akido and a 1st level Karate? If it stacks it'll be very
                  > problematical. If it doesn't, cool. :p

                  Its the 2nd one. In your example, you'd have an Aikido mastery and
                  Aikido feat as 2nd level Aikido Master and a Karate mastery as a 1st
                  level Karate Master.

                  > Ok. Easy enough (I think). Following are what I'd try... classes
                  > then feats.

                  Looking at your example, it would seem that you can't take multiple
                  classes. If you take Aikido Master, MasterType is set to 1. If you
                  then take Karate Master, MasterType goes up to 3 (1+2), and you'd
                  get a different set of Mastery.

                  Paul W. King
                  OGL SB, PL Chimp, Data Tamarin, TM Lemur, BoD
                • Paul W. King
                  ... *smacks head against wall* Boy! Do I now feel stupid. I m going to take some advil now...I have a headache. :P
                  Message 8 of 23 , Mar 6, 2004
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                    > Just for future reference Psion uses SUBCLASSes also.

                    *smacks head against wall*

                    Boy! Do I now feel stupid. I'm going to take some advil now...I
                    have a headache. :P
                  • Paul W. King
                    ... Would that work with being a multiple master? You could, conceivably, be an Aikido Master 1, Karate Master 1 and Jujitsu Master 1. Paul W. King OGL SB, PL
                    Message 9 of 23 , Mar 6, 2004
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                      > Could create a basic class (with the BAB, FRW, etc) then put the
                      > rest of the stuff into PCGen templates (which are not exactly the
                      > same as DnD templates) Apply the skill, qualify for feats etc,
                      > thru the template (PRETEMPLATE) or just apply the feats and
                      > mastery stuff from the template itself. At, what is it, every odd
                      > level, give the character a TEMPLATE choice and base every else
                      > off of that choice.

                      Would that work with being a multiple master? You could,
                      conceivably, be an Aikido Master 1, Karate Master 1 and Jujitsu
                      Master 1.

                      Paul W. King
                      OGL SB, PL Chimp, Data Tamarin, TM Lemur, BoD
                    • Barak
                      ... Doh... You re right. You d have to define and test for a separate variable for each one. Course then if you have two of them, you ll be offered feats
                      Message 10 of 23 , Mar 6, 2004
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                        > -----Original Message-----
                        > From: Paul W. King [mailto:paulking.rhochi@...]

                        > Looking at your example, it would seem that you can't take multiple
                        > classes. If you take Aikido Master, MasterType is set to 1. If you
                        > then take Karate Master, MasterType goes up to 3 (1+2), and you'd
                        > get a different set of Mastery.

                        Doh... You're right. You'd have to define and test for a separate variable
                        for each one. Course then if you have two of them, you'll be offered feats
                        from both of them when the chooser pops. Ugh.

                        Why don't you do something simple for a change???? :p

                        Barak
                      • Paul W. King
                        Because none of the rules are simple? :P ... From: Barak [mailto:barak@voyager.net] Sent: Saturday, March 06, 2004 3:03 PM To:
                        Message 11 of 23 , Mar 6, 2004
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                          Because none of the rules are simple? :P

                          -----Original Message-----
                          From: Barak [mailto:barak@...]
                          Sent: Saturday, March 06, 2004 3:03 PM
                          To: PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com
                          Subject: RE: [bump] [PCGenListFileHelp] CLASS and SUBCLASS


                          Why don't you do something simple for a change???? :p
                        • Paul W. King
                          In Legends of Excalibur, to become a Knight, you need a Nobility (I made it a new stat) of 41 or higher. Now, there are ex-Knights, but that only happens if
                          Message 12 of 23 , Mar 6, 2004
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                            In Legends of Excalibur, to become a Knight, you need a Nobility (I made it
                            a new stat) of 41 or higher. Now, there are ex-Knights, but that only
                            happens if your Nobility drops below 20. Is there a way to code this up? I
                            know Paladins become ex-Paladins if they stop being LG, but this ex class
                            has a bit more leeway.

                            Paul W. King
                            OGL SB, PL Chimp, Data Tamarin, TM Lemur, BoD
                          • Paul W. King
                            Legends of Excalibur has a feat called Innate Spell which reduces the spell point cost of a particular spell its applied to. Now, the Enchantress PrC grants
                            Message 13 of 23 , Mar 6, 2004
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                              Legends of Excalibur has a feat called Innate Spell which reduces the spell
                              point cost of a particular spell its applied to. Now, the Enchantress PrC
                              grants the Innate Spell feat, but it can only be applied to a limited number
                              of spells.

                              From the docs, CHOOSE:SPELLLIST appears to be what I need for the general
                              case. Is there a way to utilize the general feat for the Enchatress'
                              specific application of it, or would it be easier to make a 2nd feat?

                              Paul W. King
                              OGL SB, PL Chimp, Data Tamarin, TM Lemur, BoD
                            • taluroniscandar
                              ... I believe you can place level-based, er, stuff in templates but it likely go off TL or CL rather than level since you got the template. Someone else was
                              Message 14 of 23 , Mar 8, 2004
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                                --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com, "Paul W. King"
                                <paulking.rhochi@v...> wrote:
                                > > Could create a basic class (with the BAB, FRW, etc) then put the
                                > > rest of the stuff into PCGen templates (which are not exactly the
                                > > same as DnD templates) Apply the skill, qualify for feats etc,
                                > > thru the template (PRETEMPLATE) or just apply the feats and
                                > > mastery stuff from the template itself. At, what is it, every odd
                                > > level, give the character a TEMPLATE choice and base every else
                                > > off of that choice.
                                >
                                > Would that work with being a multiple master? You could,
                                > conceivably, be an Aikido Master 1, Karate Master 1 and Jujitsu
                                > Master 1.

                                I believe you can place level-based, er, 'stuff' in templates but it
                                likely go off TL or CL rather than level since you got the template.

                                Someone else was recently asking about 'level-since you got
                                something'. I think it ended up a FReq.
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