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PRESTAT: SPELLSTAT functionality

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  • pshipley@ymail.com
    Hi I think that the following tag used to work (in 5.17.x at some point, in a feat file): PRESTAT:1,SPELLSTAT=17 where SPELLSTAT was the ability score (not
    Message 1 of 20 , Jan 9, 2013
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      Hi

      I think that the following tag used to work (in 5.17.x at some point, in a feat file):

      PRESTAT:1,SPELLSTAT=17

      where SPELLSTAT was the ability score (not modifier) for the casting class in question. This now gives a SEVERE error (first few lines below) which suggests that PRESTAT is now expecting one of the basic stat entries only.

      Two questions:

      1) Is this a) deliberate; b) a use case that was missed in the rebuild; c) a bug; or d) something that never worked & the rebuild makes visible the error??

      2) Depending on 1, how should I achieve this? (I have 3 feats in a source with prerequisites like "Spellcasting attribute 13".)

      Error trace:

      16:48:29.281 SEVERE AWT-EventQueue-1 pcgen.core.prereq.PrereqHandler passes Problem encountered when testing PREREQ

      for Effective Caster. See following trace for details.
      java.lang.NullPointerException
      at pcgen.core.analysis.StatAnalysis.getBaseStatFor(Unknown Source)
      at pcgen.core.analysis.StatAnalysis.getTotalStatFor(Unknown Source)
      at plugin.pretokens.test.PreStatTester.passes(Unknown Source)
    • Maredudd
      Hi Folks! I can t find the SPELLSTAT subtag in the docs as a valid subtag for PRESTAT. Are you certain that it worked previously? Maredudd ... [Non-text
      Message 2 of 20 , Jan 9, 2013
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        Hi Folks!

        I can't find the SPELLSTAT subtag in the docs as a valid subtag for PRESTAT. Are you certain that it worked previously?

        Maredudd


        On Jan 9, 2013, at 2:58 PM, "pshipley@..." <paul_shipley@...> wrote:

        > Hi
        >
        > I think that the following tag used to work (in 5.17.x at some point, in a feat file):
        >
        > PRESTAT:1,SPELLSTAT=17
        >
        > where SPELLSTAT was the ability score (not modifier) for the casting class in question. This now gives a SEVERE error (first few lines below) which suggests that PRESTAT is now expecting one of the basic stat entries only.
        >
        > Two questions:
        >
        > 1) Is this a) deliberate; b) a use case that was missed in the rebuild; c) a bug; or d) something that never worked & the rebuild makes visible the error??
        >
        > 2) Depending on 1, how should I achieve this? (I have 3 feats in a source with prerequisites like "Spellcasting attribute 13".)
        >
        > Error trace:
        >
        > 16:48:29.281 SEVERE AWT-EventQueue-1 pcgen.core.prereq.PrereqHandler passes Problem encountered when testing PREREQ
        >
        > for Effective Caster. See following trace for details.
        > java.lang.NullPointerException
        > at pcgen.core.analysis.StatAnalysis.getBaseStatFor(Unknown Source)
        > at pcgen.core.analysis.StatAnalysis.getTotalStatFor(Unknown Source)
        > at plugin.pretokens.test.PreStatTester.passes(Unknown Source)
        >
        >
        >


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • pshipley@ymail.com
        No, not absolutely. It seems a peculiar syntax to have invented though (it s in a source that only I have worked on, to my knowledge), so I guess I got it from
        Message 3 of 20 , Jan 9, 2013
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          No, not absolutely. It seems a peculiar syntax to have invented though (it's in a source that only I have worked on, to my knowledge), so I guess I got it from somewhere else (?!). It certainly never used to throw an error; though as I noted, I'm prepared to put this down to better error-checking in 6.0.

          On the assumption that it just doesn't work, I guess the question then becomes: how do I implement a feat with a prereq of "Spellcasting attribute 13"?

          Cheers!

          --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com, Maredudd wrote:
          >
          > Hi Folks!
          >
          > I can't find the SPELLSTAT subtag in the docs as a valid subtag for PRESTAT. Are you certain that it worked previously?
          >
          > Maredudd
          >
          >
          > On Jan 9, 2013, at 2:58 PM, "pshipley@..." wrote:
          >
          > > Hi
          > >
          > > I think that the following tag used to work (in 5.17.x at some point, in a feat file):
          > >
          > > PRESTAT:1,SPELLSTAT=17
          > >
          > > where SPELLSTAT was the ability score (not modifier) for the casting class in question. This now gives a SEVERE error (first few lines below) which suggests that PRESTAT is now expecting one of the basic stat entries only.
          > >
          > > Two questions:
          > >
          > > 1) Is this a) deliberate; b) a use case that was missed in the rebuild; c) a bug; or d) something that never worked & the rebuild makes visible the error??
          > >
          > > 2) Depending on 1, how should I achieve this? (I have 3 feats in a source with prerequisites like "Spellcasting attribute 13".)
          > >
          > > Error trace:
          > >
          > > 16:48:29.281 SEVERE AWT-EventQueue-1 pcgen.core.prereq.PrereqHandler passes Problem encountered when testing PREREQ
          > >
          > > for Effective Caster. See following trace for details.
          > > java.lang.NullPointerException
          > > at pcgen.core.analysis.StatAnalysis.getBaseStatFor(Unknown Source)
          > > at pcgen.core.analysis.StatAnalysis.getTotalStatFor(Unknown Source)
          > > at plugin.pretokens.test.PreStatTester.passes(Unknown Source)
          > >
          > >
          > >
          >
          >
          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          >
        • Maredudd
          The only thing I m coming up with is using the following: PREMULT:2,[PREVARGTEQ:INTSCORE,17],[PRECLASS:1,Wizard=1] You could set up a gang of PRExxxs for each
          Message 4 of 20 , Jan 9, 2013
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            The only thing I'm coming up with is using the following:

            PREMULT:2,[PREVARGTEQ:INTSCORE,17],[PRECLASS:1,Wizard=1]

            You could set up a gang of PRExxxs for each spell stat, and it it is used as a prerequisite.

            Kinda chunky, and would be a bear to maintain, but it would work I believe.

            Andrew might have a better solution.

            Maredudd

            On Jan 9, 2013, at 3:59 PM, "pshipley@..." <paul_shipley@...> wrote:

            > No, not absolutely. It seems a peculiar syntax to have invented though (it's in a source that only I have worked on, to my knowledge), so I guess I got it from somewhere else (?!). It certainly never used to throw an error; though as I noted, I'm prepared to put this down to better error-checking in 6.0.
            >
            > On the assumption that it just doesn't work, I guess the question then becomes: how do I implement a feat with a prereq of "Spellcasting attribute 13"?
            >
            > Cheers!
            >
            > --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com, Maredudd wrote:
            > >
            > > Hi Folks!
            > >
            > > I can't find the SPELLSTAT subtag in the docs as a valid subtag for PRESTAT. Are you certain that it worked previously?
            > >
            > > Maredudd
            > >
            > >
            > > On Jan 9, 2013, at 2:58 PM, "pshipley@..." wrote:
            > >
            > > > Hi
            > > >
            > > > I think that the following tag used to work (in 5.17.x at some point, in a feat file):
            > > >
            > > > PRESTAT:1,SPELLSTAT=17
            > > > ]
            > > > where SPELLSTAT was the ability score (not modifier) for the casting class in question. This now gives a SEVERE error (first few lines below) which suggests that PRESTAT is now expecting one of the basic stat entries only.
            > > >
            > > > Two questions:
            > > >
            > > > 1) Is this a) deliberate; b) a use case that was missed in the rebuild; c) a bug; or d) something that never worked & the rebuild makes visible the error??
            > > >
            > > > 2) Depending on 1, how should I achieve this? (I have 3 feats in a source with prerequisites like "Spellcasting attribute 13".)
            > > >
            > > > Error trace:
            > > >
            > > > 16:48:29.281 SEVERE AWT-EventQueue-1 pcgen.core.prereq.PrereqHandler passes Problem encountered when testing PREREQ
            > > >
            > > > for Effective Caster. See following trace for details.
            > > > java.lang.NullPointerException
            > > > at pcgen.core.analysis.StatAnalysis.getBaseStatFor(Unknown Source)
            > > > at pcgen.core.analysis.StatAnalysis.getTotalStatFor(Unknown Source)
            > > > at plugin.pretokens.test.PreStatTester.passes(Unknown Source)
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > >
            > >
            > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            > >
            >
            >


            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • Doug Limmer
            I usually try to work around this with something like PREVARGTEQ:max(INTSCORE,WISSCORE,CHASCORE),17 This assumes that a spellcaster will have their
            Message 5 of 20 , Jan 9, 2013
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              I usually try to work around this with something like
              PREVARGTEQ:max(INTSCORE,WISSCORE,CHASCORE),17 This assumes that a
              spellcaster will have their spellcasting stat as the highest one. This
              isn't perfect, but it should usually work.

              Of course if you're one of those Pathfinder orc sorcerers that cast off
              of CON, it won't work at all...

              [Yes, Pathfinder sorcerers with the right archetype can cast off of CHA,
              INT, WIS, or CON --- and that's Paizo-only sources.]

              DJL

              On 1/9/2013 4:51 PM, Maredudd wrote:
              >
              > The only thing I'm coming up with is using the following:
              >
              > PREMULT:2,[PREVARGTEQ:INTSCORE,17],[PRECLASS:1,Wizard=1]
              >
              > You could set up a gang of PRExxxs for each spell stat, and it it is
              > used as a prerequisite.
              >
              > Kinda chunky, and would be a bear to maintain, but it would work I
              > believe.
              >
              > Andrew might have a better solution.
              >
              > Maredudd
              >
              > On Jan 9, 2013, at 3:59 PM, "pshipley@...
              > <mailto:pshipley%40ymail.com>" paul_shipley@...
              > <mailto:paul_shipley%40tesco.net>> wrote:
              >
              > > No, not absolutely. It seems a peculiar syntax to have invented
              > though (it's in a source that only I have worked on, to my knowledge),
              > so I guess I got it from somewhere else (?!). It certainly never used
              > to throw an error; though as I noted, I'm prepared to put this down to
              > better error-checking in 6.0.
              > >
              > > On the assumption that it just doesn't work, I guess the question
              > then becomes: how do I implement a feat with a prereq of "Spellcasting
              > attribute 13"?
              > >
              > > Cheers!
              > >
              > > --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com
              > <mailto:PCGenListFileHelp%40yahoogroups.com>, Maredudd wrote:
              > > >
              > > > Hi Folks!
              > > >
              > > > I can't find the SPELLSTAT subtag in the docs as a valid subtag
              > for PRESTAT. Are you certain that it worked previously?
              > > >
              > > > Maredudd
              > > >
              > > >
              > > > On Jan 9, 2013, at 2:58 PM, "pshipley@..." wrote:
              > > >
              > > > > Hi
              > > > >
              > > > > I think that the following tag used to work (in 5.17.x at some
              > point, in a feat file):
              > > > >
              > > > > PRESTAT:1,SPELLSTAT=17
              > > > > ]
              > > > > where SPELLSTAT was the ability score (not modifier) for the
              > casting class in question. This now gives a SEVERE error (first few
              > lines below) which suggests that PRESTAT is now expecting one of the
              > basic stat entries only.
              > > > >
              > > > > Two questions:
              > > > >
              > > > > 1) Is this a) deliberate; b) a use case that was missed in the
              > rebuild; c) a bug; or d) something that never worked & the rebuild
              > makes visible the error??
              > > > >
              > > > > 2) Depending on 1, how should I achieve this? (I have 3 feats in
              > a source with prerequisites like "Spellcasting attribute 13".)
              > > > >
              > > > > Error trace:
              > > > >
              > > > > 16:48:29.281 SEVERE AWT-EventQueue-1
              > pcgen.core.prereq.PrereqHandler passes Problem encountered when
              > testing PREREQ
              > > > >
              > > > > for Effective Caster. See following trace for details.
              > > > > java.lang.NullPointerException
              > > > > at pcgen.core.analysis.StatAnalysis.getBaseStatFor(Unknown Source)
              > > > > at pcgen.core.analysis.StatAnalysis.getTotalStatFor(Unknown Source)
              > > > > at plugin.pretokens.test.PreStatTester.passes(Unknown Source)
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > >
              > > >
              > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              > > >
              > >
              > >
              >
              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >
              >



              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • pshipley@ymail.com
              Huh. By chance I ve been working on (someone else s) half-finished set in NFD this evening, and what do you know: I came upon a use of var(SPELLSTAT). So I m
              Message 6 of 20 , Jan 9, 2013
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                Huh.

                By chance I've been working on (someone else's) half-finished set in NFD this evening, and what do you know: I came upon a use of var(SPELLSTAT).

                So I'm going back to thinking that there was something here that used to work, probably undocumented (!).

                I think you've both nailed the problems with your solutions (maintenance & potentially invalid assumptions, respectively). I'm going with a PRETEXT for now & holding out hope for a cunning answer from our Data 2nd :-)

                Cheers!

                --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com, Doug Limmer wrote:
                >
                > I usually try to work around this with something like
                > PREVARGTEQ:max(INTSCORE,WISSCORE,CHASCORE),17 This assumes that a
                > spellcaster will have their spellcasting stat as the highest one. This
                > isn't perfect, but it should usually work.
                >
                > Of course if you're one of those Pathfinder orc sorcerers that cast off
                > of CON, it won't work at all...
                >
                > [Yes, Pathfinder sorcerers with the right archetype can cast off of CHA,
                > INT, WIS, or CON --- and that's Paizo-only sources.]
                >
                > DJL
                >
                > On 1/9/2013 4:51 PM, Maredudd wrote:
                > >
                > > The only thing I'm coming up with is using the following:
                > >
                > > PREMULT:2,[PREVARGTEQ:INTSCORE,17],[PRECLASS:1,Wizard=1]
                > >
                > > You could set up a gang of PRExxxs for each spell stat, and it it is
                > > used as a prerequisite.
                > >
                > > Kinda chunky, and would be a bear to maintain, but it would work I
                > > believe.
                > >
                > > Andrew might have a better solution.
                > >
                > > Maredudd
                > >
                > > On Jan 9, 2013, at 3:59 PM, "pshipley@...
                > > " paul_shipley@...
                > > > wrote:
                > >
                > > > No, not absolutely. It seems a peculiar syntax to have invented
                > > though (it's in a source that only I have worked on, to my knowledge),
                > > so I guess I got it from somewhere else (?!). It certainly never used
                > > to throw an error; though as I noted, I'm prepared to put this down to
                > > better error-checking in 6.0.
                > > >
                > > > On the assumption that it just doesn't work, I guess the question
                > > then becomes: how do I implement a feat with a prereq of "Spellcasting
                > > attribute 13"?
                > > >
                > > > Cheers!
                > > >
                > > > --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com
                > > , Maredudd wrote:
                > > > >
                > > > > Hi Folks!
                > > > >
                > > > > I can't find the SPELLSTAT subtag in the docs as a valid subtag
                > > for PRESTAT. Are you certain that it worked previously?
                > > > >
                > > > > Maredudd
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > > On Jan 9, 2013, at 2:58 PM, "pshipley@" wrote:
                > > > >
                > > > > > Hi
                > > > > >
                > > > > > I think that the following tag used to work (in 5.17.x at some
                > > point, in a feat file):
                > > > > >
                > > > > > PRESTAT:1,SPELLSTAT=17
                > > > > > ]
                > > > > > where SPELLSTAT was the ability score (not modifier) for the
                > > casting class in question. This now gives a SEVERE error (first few
                > > lines below) which suggests that PRESTAT is now expecting one of the
                > > basic stat entries only.
                > > > > >
                > > > > > Two questions:
                > > > > >
                > > > > > 1) Is this a) deliberate; b) a use case that was missed in the
                > > rebuild; c) a bug; or d) something that never worked & the rebuild
                > > makes visible the error??
                > > > > >
                > > > > > 2) Depending on 1, how should I achieve this? (I have 3 feats in
                > > a source with prerequisites like "Spellcasting attribute 13".)
                > > > > >
                > > > > > Error trace:
                > > > > >
                > > > > > 16:48:29.281 SEVERE AWT-EventQueue-1
                > > pcgen.core.prereq.PrereqHandler passes Problem encountered when
                > > testing PREREQ
                > > > > >
                > > > > > for Effective Caster. See following trace for details.
                > > > > > java.lang.NullPointerException
                > > > > > at pcgen.core.analysis.StatAnalysis.getBaseStatFor(Unknown Source)
                > > > > > at pcgen.core.analysis.StatAnalysis.getTotalStatFor(Unknown Source)
                > > > > > at plugin.pretokens.test.PreStatTester.passes(Unknown Source)
                > > > > >
                > > > > >
                > > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                > > > >
                > > >
                > > >
                > >
                > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                > >
                > >
                >
                >
                >
                > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                >
              • thpr
                As best I can tell (d) Looking at the code for the PRESTAT tester, I have every reason to believe 5.16 would throw off the same error, as the PRESTAT test code
                Message 7 of 20 , Jan 10, 2013
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                  As best I can tell (d)

                  Looking at the code for the PRESTAT tester, I have every reason to believe 5.16 would throw off the same error, as the PRESTAT test code has been effectively stable since May 1 2009.

                  A code review of the code we shipped in 5.14 (capturing behavior prior to that change) shows it would have silently consumed the error but the PRE would always "fail" (SPELLSTAT would have returned zero).

                  TP.

                  --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com, "pshipley@..." wrote:
                  >
                  > Hi
                  >
                  > I think that the following tag used to work (in 5.17.x at some point, in a feat file):
                  >
                  > PRESTAT:1,SPELLSTAT=17
                  >
                  > where SPELLSTAT was the ability score (not modifier) for the casting class in question. This now gives a SEVERE error (first few lines below) which suggests that PRESTAT is now expecting one of the basic stat entries only.
                  >
                  > Two questions:
                  >
                  > 1) Is this a) deliberate; b) a use case that was missed in the rebuild; c) a bug; or d) something that never worked & the rebuild makes visible the error??
                  >
                  > 2) Depending on 1, how should I achieve this? (I have 3 feats in a source with prerequisites like "Spellcasting attribute 13".)
                  >
                  > Error trace:
                  >
                  > 16:48:29.281 SEVERE AWT-EventQueue-1 pcgen.core.prereq.PrereqHandler passes Problem encountered when testing PREREQ
                  >
                  > for Effective Caster. See following trace for details.
                  > java.lang.NullPointerException
                  > at pcgen.core.analysis.StatAnalysis.getBaseStatFor(Unknown Source)
                  > at pcgen.core.analysis.StatAnalysis.getTotalStatFor(Unknown Source)
                  > at plugin.pretokens.test.PreStatTester.passes(Unknown Source)
                  >
                • thpr
                  ... Class LST in each spellcasting class: DEFINE:SPECIALBONUSFEATS|0 BONUS:VAR|SPECIALBONUSFEATS|PREVARGTEQ:var(SPELLBASESTAT),13 Feat LST: MyFeat
                  Message 8 of 20 , Jan 10, 2013
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                    --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com, "pshipley@..." wrote:
                    >
                    > On the assumption that it just doesn't work, I guess the question then becomes: how do I implement a feat with a prereq of "Spellcasting attribute 13"?
                    >
                    > Cheers!


                    Class LST in each spellcasting class:
                    DEFINE:SPECIALBONUSFEATS|0
                    BONUS:VAR|SPECIALBONUSFEATS|PREVARGTEQ:var(SPELLBASESTAT),13

                    Feat LST:
                    MyFeat <> PREVARGTEQ:SPECIALBONUSFEATS,1


                    ?

                    Note: The SPELLBASESTAT will only work if it appears in in the Class LST file - it cannot be used in the Feat LST file, hence the use of a "temporary" variable to communicate information over to the Feat LST file.

                    Warning #1: This has a multi-class "hole" in that you can get a sorcerer with a stat of 18 and a Wizard with a stat of 11 and still get through this test when you are selecting a feat when adding a Wizard class level. If this is then a metamagic feat, I'm not sure if it can stop it from being used on Wizard. YMMV on how important that is for your feat.

                    Warning #2: There may be a bug in some of the variable code, and I'm certainly no expert on our variable system, so I can't tell which of these is what you mean and which will actually work (it looks to me like the intent of them in the comments is swapped vs. their actual behavior)

                    PREVARGTEQ:var(SPELLBASESTAT),13
                    PREVARGTEQ:var(SPELLBASESTATSCORE),13

                    I *think* the former should return something like +3 (fail) and the latter something like 16 (pass), but I don't think that's what they do today. This should be tested, and also recognize that it was a very brief look at the code, so I may be making mistakes due to speed of interpretation.

                    TP.
                  • Andrew
                    Hi, I guess as a data monkey I should point out that the syntax is off and we re breaking set standards. a) DEFINE:SpecialBonusFeats|0
                    Message 9 of 20 , Jan 10, 2013
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                      Hi,

                      I guess as a data monkey I should point out that the syntax is "off" and we're breaking set standards.

                      a) DEFINE:SpecialBonusFeats|0 < Only System Vars use all UPPERCASE.
                      b) BONUS:VAR|SpecialBonusFeats|PREVARGTEQ:SPELLBASESTAT,13
                      or
                      PREVARGTEQ:var("SPELLBASESTAT"),13

                      Now, to take this a step further, and I'm about to pass out so forgive any mistake, but if we're
                      doing this for each class, why not define it properly

                      CLASS:Wizard.MOD DEFINE:WizardSpellStat|var("SPELLBASESTAT")
                      or
                      DEFINE to 0 and BONUS:WizardSpellStat|var("SPELLBASESTAT")

                      Cheers and good night.



                      On 1/10/2013 12:39 PM, thpr wrote:
                      >
                      >
                      > --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com, "pshipley@..." wrote:
                      >> On the assumption that it just doesn't work, I guess the question then becomes: how do I implement a feat with a prereq of "Spellcasting attribute 13"?
                      >>
                      >> Cheers!
                      > Class LST in each spellcasting class:
                      > DEFINE:SPECIALBONUSFEATS|0
                      > BONUS:VAR|SPECIALBONUSFEATS|PREVARGTEQ:var(SPELLBASESTAT),13
                      >
                      > Feat LST:
                      > MyFeat <> PREVARGTEQ:SPECIALBONUSFEATS,1
                      >
                      >
                      > ?
                      >
                      > Note: The SPELLBASESTAT will only work if it appears in in the Class LST file - it cannot be used in the Feat LST file, hence the use of a "temporary" variable to communicate information over to the Feat LST file.
                      >
                      > Warning #1: This has a multi-class "hole" in that you can get a sorcerer with a stat of 18 and a Wizard with a stat of 11 and still get through this test when you are selecting a feat when adding a Wizard class level. If this is then a metamagic feat, I'm not sure if it can stop it from being used on Wizard. YMMV on how important that is for your feat.
                      >
                      > Warning #2: There may be a bug in some of the variable code, and I'm certainly no expert on our variable system, so I can't tell which of these is what you mean and which will actually work (it looks to me like the intent of them in the comments is swapped vs. their actual behavior)
                      >
                      > PREVARGTEQ:var(SPELLBASESTAT),13
                      > PREVARGTEQ:var(SPELLBASESTATSCORE),13
                      >
                      > I *think* the former should return something like +3 (fail) and the latter something like 16 (pass), but I don't think that's what they do today. This should be tested, and also recognize that it was a very brief look at the code, so I may be making mistakes due to speed of interpretation.
                      >
                      > TP.
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > ------------------------------------
                      >
                      > Yahoo! Groups Links
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >

                      --
                      Andrew Maitland (LegacyKing)
                      Admin Silverback - PCGen Board of Directors
                      Data 2nd, Docs Tamarin, OS Lemur
                      Unique Title "Quick-Silverback Tracker Monkey"
                      Unique Title "The Torturer of PCGen"


                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    • pshipley@ymail.com
                      Thanks chaps - appreciate your time to take a look at it. Given that it s a 3PP set & I don t recall seeing this requirement on any other feat (& certainly
                      Message 10 of 20 , Jan 11, 2013
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                        Thanks chaps - appreciate your time to take a look at it.

                        Given that it's a 3PP set & I don't recall seeing this requirement on any other feat (& certainly none of Paizo's), I don't think we should modify other sets to implement.

                        .MODs to classes (per Andrew) in the 3PP set is probably the least invasive & somewhat doable - though this would I guess suffer from the irritating problem of how to determine if the user has loaded APG/UC/UM/... to avoid unconstructed ref problems. I *might* do this for the Paizo core classes at least, and let 3PP set users modify if they wish to support others...

                        OTOH, this all sounds like too much work for 3 feats in one 3PP set - if this requirement starts cropping up a lot, I guess a code FREQ or modifications to the core sets might be in order; for now, a simple PRETEXT is probably good enough!

                        Thanks!

                        --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com, Andrew wrote:
                        >
                        > Hi,
                        >
                        > I guess as a data monkey I should point out that the syntax is "off" and we're breaking set standards.
                        >
                        > a) DEFINE:SpecialBonusFeats|0 < Only System Vars use all UPPERCASE.
                        > b) BONUS:VAR|SpecialBonusFeats|PREVARGTEQ:SPELLBASESTAT,13
                        > or
                        > PREVARGTEQ:var("SPELLBASESTAT"),13
                        >
                        > Now, to take this a step further, and I'm about to pass out so forgive any mistake, but if we're
                        > doing this for each class, why not define it properly
                        >
                        > CLASS:Wizard.MOD DEFINE:WizardSpellStat|var("SPELLBASESTAT")
                        > or
                        > DEFINE to 0 and BONUS:WizardSpellStat|var("SPELLBASESTAT")
                        >
                        > Cheers and good night.
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > On 1/10/2013 12:39 PM, thpr wrote:
                        > >
                        > >
                        > > --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com, "pshipley@" wrote:
                        > >> On the assumption that it just doesn't work, I guess the question then becomes: how do I implement a feat with a prereq of "Spellcasting attribute 13"?
                        > >>
                        > >> Cheers!
                        > > Class LST in each spellcasting class:
                        > > DEFINE:SPECIALBONUSFEATS|0
                        > > BONUS:VAR|SPECIALBONUSFEATS|PREVARGTEQ:var(SPELLBASESTAT),13
                        > >
                        > > Feat LST:
                        > > MyFeat <> PREVARGTEQ:SPECIALBONUSFEATS,1
                        > >
                        > >
                        > > ?
                        > >
                        > > Note: The SPELLBASESTAT will only work if it appears in in the Class LST file - it cannot be used in the Feat LST file, hence the use of a "temporary" variable to communicate information over to the Feat LST file.
                        > >
                        > > Warning #1: This has a multi-class "hole" in that you can get a sorcerer with a stat of 18 and a Wizard with a stat of 11 and still get through this test when you are selecting a feat when adding a Wizard class level. If this is then a metamagic feat, I'm not sure if it can stop it from being used on Wizard. YMMV on how important that is for your feat.
                        > >
                        > > Warning #2: There may be a bug in some of the variable code, and I'm certainly no expert on our variable system, so I can't tell which of these is what you mean and which will actually work (it looks to me like the intent of them in the comments is swapped vs. their actual behavior)
                        > >
                        > > PREVARGTEQ:var(SPELLBASESTAT),13
                        > > PREVARGTEQ:var(SPELLBASESTATSCORE),13
                        > >
                        > > I *think* the former should return something like +3 (fail) and the latter something like 16 (pass), but I don't think that's what they do today. This should be tested, and also recognize that it was a very brief look at the code, so I may be making mistakes due to speed of interpretation.
                        > >
                        > > TP.
                        > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        > > ------------------------------------
                        > >
                        > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                        > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        >
                        > --
                        > Andrew Maitland (LegacyKing)
                        > Admin Silverback - PCGen Board of Directors
                        > Data 2nd, Docs Tamarin, OS Lemur
                        > Unique Title "Quick-Silverback Tracker Monkey"
                        > Unique Title "The Torturer of PCGen"
                        >
                        >
                        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        >
                      • Andrew
                        Hi, And I could point out this tag: *Formula:* |charbonusto( x , y )| *Variable Used (x):* Text (Parameter 1 - Optional) *Variable Used (x):* Text (Parameter
                        Message 11 of 20 , Jan 11, 2013
                        • 0 Attachment
                          Hi,

                          And I could point out this tag:

                          *Formula:* |charbonusto("x","y")|

                          *Variable Used (x):* Text (Parameter 1 - Optional)

                          *Variable Used (x):* Text (Parameter 2)

                          *What it Does:*

                          * This function returns the value of a call to PlayerCharacter.getTotalBonusTo(p1, p2).
                          * These values reflect bonuses applied to the parameter not the full value of that parameter.
                          * Other valid parameter pairs (x - y) include:
                          o PCLEVEL - <class name>
                          o STAT - BASESPELLSTAT
                          o STAT - BASESPELLSTAT;CLASS.<class named>
                          o STAT - CAST.<spell type>
                          o FEAT - POOL
                          o VAR - <variable name>
                          o CHECKS - <check type>
                          o TOHIT - TOHIT
                          o DOMAIN - NUMBER
                          o CASTERLEVEL - <class name>
                          o HP - ALTHP
                          o COMBAT - BAB
                          o WEAPONPROF=<weapon name> - PCSIZE
                          o WEAPONPROF=TYPE.<weapon proficency> - PCSIZE
                          * Parameter 1 (x) is optional. If it is not present, it will default to "PCLEVEL".

                          *Examples:*

                          |charbonusto("PCLEVEL", "Cleric")|

                          Returns the number of bonus Spellcaster Levels to the class specified, which usually come from
                          Prestige classes.

                          |charbonusto("CHECKS", "REFLEX")|

                          Will return Reflex bonuses from a high Dexterity and other bonuses but not the full reflex save
                          value.



                          On 1/11/2013 5:58 AM, pshipley@... wrote:
                          > Thanks chaps - appreciate your time to take a look at it.
                          >
                          > Given that it's a 3PP set & I don't recall seeing this requirement on any other feat (& certainly none of Paizo's), I don't think we should modify other sets to implement.
                          >
                          > .MODs to classes (per Andrew) in the 3PP set is probably the least invasive & somewhat doable - though this would I guess suffer from the irritating problem of how to determine if the user has loaded APG/UC/UM/... to avoid unconstructed ref problems. I *might* do this for the Paizo core classes at least, and let 3PP set users modify if they wish to support others...
                          >
                          > OTOH, this all sounds like too much work for 3 feats in one 3PP set - if this requirement starts cropping up a lot, I guess a code FREQ or modifications to the core sets might be in order; for now, a simple PRETEXT is probably good enough!
                          >
                          > Thanks!
                          >
                          > --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com, Andrew wrote:
                          >> Hi,
                          >>
                          >> I guess as a data monkey I should point out that the syntax is "off" and we're breaking set standards.
                          >>
                          >> a) DEFINE:SpecialBonusFeats|0 < Only System Vars use all UPPERCASE.
                          >> b) BONUS:VAR|SpecialBonusFeats|PREVARGTEQ:SPELLBASESTAT,13
                          >> or
                          >> PREVARGTEQ:var("SPELLBASESTAT"),13
                          >>
                          >> Now, to take this a step further, and I'm about to pass out so forgive any mistake, but if we're
                          >> doing this for each class, why not define it properly
                          >>
                          >> CLASS:Wizard.MOD DEFINE:WizardSpellStat|var("SPELLBASESTAT")
                          >> or
                          >> DEFINE to 0 and BONUS:WizardSpellStat|var("SPELLBASESTAT")
                          >>
                          >> Cheers and good night.
                          >>
                          >>
                          >>
                          >> On 1/10/2013 12:39 PM, thpr wrote:
                          >>> --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com, "pshipley@" wrote:
                          >>>> On the assumption that it just doesn't work, I guess the question then becomes: how do I implement a feat with a prereq of "Spellcasting attribute 13"?
                          >>>>
                          >>>> Cheers!
                          >>> Class LST in each spellcasting class:
                          >>> DEFINE:SPECIALBONUSFEATS|0
                          >>> BONUS:VAR|SPECIALBONUSFEATS|PREVARGTEQ:var(SPELLBASESTAT),13
                          >>>
                          >>> Feat LST:
                          >>> MyFeat <> PREVARGTEQ:SPECIALBONUSFEATS,1
                          >>>
                          >>>
                          >>> ?
                          >>>
                          >>> Note: The SPELLBASESTAT will only work if it appears in in the Class LST file - it cannot be used in the Feat LST file, hence the use of a "temporary" variable to communicate information over to the Feat LST file.
                          >>>
                          >>> Warning #1: This has a multi-class "hole" in that you can get a sorcerer with a stat of 18 and a Wizard with a stat of 11 and still get through this test when you are selecting a feat when adding a Wizard class level. If this is then a metamagic feat, I'm not sure if it can stop it from being used on Wizard. YMMV on how important that is for your feat.
                          >>>
                          >>> Warning #2: There may be a bug in some of the variable code, and I'm certainly no expert on our variable system, so I can't tell which of these is what you mean and which will actually work (it looks to me like the intent of them in the comments is swapped vs. their actual behavior)
                          >>>
                          >>> PREVARGTEQ:var(SPELLBASESTAT),13
                          >>> PREVARGTEQ:var(SPELLBASESTATSCORE),13
                          >>>
                          >>> I *think* the former should return something like +3 (fail) and the latter something like 16 (pass), but I don't think that's what they do today. This should be tested, and also recognize that it was a very brief look at the code, so I may be making mistakes due to speed of interpretation.
                          >>>
                          >>> TP.
                          >>>
                          >>>
                          >>>
                          >>>
                          >>> ------------------------------------
                          >>>
                          >>> Yahoo! Groups Links
                          >>>
                          >>>
                          >>>
                          >>>
                          >> --
                          >> Andrew Maitland (LegacyKing)
                          >> Admin Silverback - PCGen Board of Directors
                          >> Data 2nd, Docs Tamarin, OS Lemur
                          >> Unique Title "Quick-Silverback Tracker Monkey"
                          >> Unique Title "The Torturer of PCGen"
                          >>
                          >>
                          >> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          >>
                          >
                          > ------------------------------------
                          >
                          > Yahoo! Groups Links
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >

                          --
                          Andrew Maitland (LegacyKing)
                          Admin Silverback - PCGen Board of Directors
                          Data 2nd, Docs Tamarin, OS Lemur
                          Unique Title "Quick-Silverback Tracker Monkey"
                          Unique Title "The Torturer of PCGen"


                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        • pshipley@ymail.com
                          Thanks, I hadn t found that bit - having played about with this, & a couple of other things, I have still drawn a blank. For the record, not altogether
                          Message 12 of 20 , Jan 11, 2013
                          • 0 Attachment
                            Thanks, I hadn't found that bit - having played about with this, & a couple of other things, I have still drawn a blank.

                            For the record, not altogether unsurprinsgly, with the code below, both abilities on a Wiz1 with 16 Int report 0 in all places.

                            Test Ability 1
                            CATEGORY:Special Ability
                            TYPE:SpecialQuality
                            DESC:What are the values of charbonusto("STAT","BASESPELLSTAT") (%1) and charbonusto("STAT","BASESPELLSTAT;CLASS.Wizard") (%2)?|charbonusto("STAT","BASESPELLSTAT")|charbonusto("STAT","BASESPELLSTAT;CLASS.Wizard")

                            Test Ability 2
                            CATEGORY:Special Ability
                            TYPE:SpecialQuality
                            DESC:What are the values of BASESPELLSTAT (%1), BASESPELLSTATSCORE (%2), SPELLBASESTAT (%3) and SPELLBASESTATSCORE (%4)?|BASESPELLSTAT|BASESPELLSTATSCORE|SPELLBASESTAT|SPELLBASESTATSCORE

                            (Note that according to docs, BASESPELLSTAT is the mod for the class's base spell stat and "can be used in any formula, in any file, in any gamemode.")

                            --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com, Andrew wrote:
                            >
                            > Hi,
                            >
                            > And I could point out this tag:
                            >
                            > *Formula:* |charbonusto("x","y")|
                            >
                            > *Variable Used (x):* Text (Parameter 1 - Optional)
                            >
                            > *Variable Used (x):* Text (Parameter 2)
                            >
                            > *What it Does:*
                            >
                            > * This function returns the value of a call to PlayerCharacter.getTotalBonusTo(p1, p2).
                            > * These values reflect bonuses applied to the parameter not the full value of that parameter.
                            > * Other valid parameter pairs (x - y) include:
                            > o PCLEVEL -
                            > o STAT - BASESPELLSTAT
                            > o STAT - BASESPELLSTAT;CLASS.
                            > o STAT - CAST.
                            > o FEAT - POOL
                            > o VAR -
                            > o CHECKS -
                            > o TOHIT - TOHIT
                            > o DOMAIN - NUMBER
                            > o CASTERLEVEL -
                            > o HP - ALTHP
                            > o COMBAT - BAB
                            > o WEAPONPROF= - PCSIZE
                            > o WEAPONPROF=TYPE. - PCSIZE
                            > * Parameter 1 (x) is optional. If it is not present, it will default to "PCLEVEL".
                            >
                            > *Examples:*
                            >
                            > |charbonusto("PCLEVEL", "Cleric")|
                            >
                            > Returns the number of bonus Spellcaster Levels to the class specified, which usually come from
                            > Prestige classes.
                            >
                            > |charbonusto("CHECKS", "REFLEX")|
                            >
                            > Will return Reflex bonuses from a high Dexterity and other bonuses but not the full reflex save
                            > value.
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            > On 1/11/2013 5:58 AM, pshipley@... wrote:
                            > > Thanks chaps - appreciate your time to take a look at it.
                            > >
                            > > Given that it's a 3PP set & I don't recall seeing this requirement on any other feat (& certainly none of Paizo's), I don't think we should modify other sets to implement.
                            > >
                            > > .MODs to classes (per Andrew) in the 3PP set is probably the least invasive & somewhat doable - though this would I guess suffer from the irritating problem of how to determine if the user has loaded APG/UC/UM/... to avoid unconstructed ref problems. I *might* do this for the Paizo core classes at least, and let 3PP set users modify if they wish to support others...
                            > >
                            > > OTOH, this all sounds like too much work for 3 feats in one 3PP set - if this requirement starts cropping up a lot, I guess a code FREQ or modifications to the core sets might be in order; for now, a simple PRETEXT is probably good enough!
                            > >
                            > > Thanks!
                            > >
                            > > --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com, Andrew wrote:
                            > >> Hi,
                            > >>
                            > >> I guess as a data monkey I should point out that the syntax is "off" and we're breaking set standards.
                            > >>
                            > >> a) DEFINE:SpecialBonusFeats|0 < Only System Vars use all UPPERCASE.
                            > >> b) BONUS:VAR|SpecialBonusFeats|PREVARGTEQ:SPELLBASESTAT,13
                            > >> or
                            > >> PREVARGTEQ:var("SPELLBASESTAT"),13
                            > >>
                            > >> Now, to take this a step further, and I'm about to pass out so forgive any mistake, but if we're
                            > >> doing this for each class, why not define it properly
                            > >>
                            > >> CLASS:Wizard.MOD DEFINE:WizardSpellStat|var("SPELLBASESTAT")
                            > >> or
                            > >> DEFINE to 0 and BONUS:WizardSpellStat|var("SPELLBASESTAT")
                            > >>
                            > >> Cheers and good night.
                            > >>
                            > >>
                            > >>
                            > >> On 1/10/2013 12:39 PM, thpr wrote:
                            > >>> --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com, "pshipley@" wrote:
                            > >>>> On the assumption that it just doesn't work, I guess the question then becomes: how do I implement a feat with a prereq of "Spellcasting attribute 13"?
                            > >>>>
                            > >>>> Cheers!
                            > >>> Class LST in each spellcasting class:
                            > >>> DEFINE:SPECIALBONUSFEATS|0
                            > >>> BONUS:VAR|SPECIALBONUSFEATS|PREVARGTEQ:var(SPELLBASESTAT),13
                            > >>>
                            > >>> Feat LST:
                            > >>> MyFeat <> PREVARGTEQ:SPECIALBONUSFEATS,1
                            > >>>
                            > >>>
                            > >>> ?
                            > >>>
                            > >>> Note: The SPELLBASESTAT will only work if it appears in in the Class LST file - it cannot be used in the Feat LST file, hence the use of a "temporary" variable to communicate information over to the Feat LST file.
                            > >>>
                            > >>> Warning #1: This has a multi-class "hole" in that you can get a sorcerer with a stat of 18 and a Wizard with a stat of 11 and still get through this test when you are selecting a feat when adding a Wizard class level. If this is then a metamagic feat, I'm not sure if it can stop it from being used on Wizard. YMMV on how important that is for your feat.
                            > >>>
                            > >>> Warning #2: There may be a bug in some of the variable code, and I'm certainly no expert on our variable system, so I can't tell which of these is what you mean and which will actually work (it looks to me like the intent of them in the comments is swapped vs. their actual behavior)
                            > >>>
                            > >>> PREVARGTEQ:var(SPELLBASESTAT),13
                            > >>> PREVARGTEQ:var(SPELLBASESTATSCORE),13
                            > >>>
                            > >>> I *think* the former should return something like +3 (fail) and the latter something like 16 (pass), but I don't think that's what they do today. This should be tested, and also recognize that it was a very brief look at the code, so I may be making mistakes due to speed of interpretation.
                            > >>>
                            > >>> TP.
                            > >>>
                            <snip>
                          • thpr
                            It s the MODIFICATION, not the BASE. SPELLSTAT:INT defines the base. BONUS:STAT|BASESPELLSTAT defines the modification. If there is no
                            Message 13 of 20 , Jan 11, 2013
                            • 0 Attachment
                              It's the MODIFICATION, not the BASE.

                              SPELLSTAT:INT defines the base.

                              BONUS:STAT|BASESPELLSTAT defines the modification.

                              If there is no BONUS:STAT|BASESPELLLSTAT on the character this will return 0.

                              Also, removing SPELLSTAT:x from a class will break a ton of stuff, so please don't modify the core datasets to universally put the stats into a bonus rather than the base.

                              TP.

                              --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com, "pshipley@..." wrote:
                              >
                              > Thanks, I hadn't found that bit - having played about with this, & a couple of other things, I have still drawn a blank.
                              >
                              > For the record, not altogether unsurprinsgly, with the code below, both abilities on a Wiz1 with 16 Int report 0 in all places.
                              >
                              > Test Ability 1
                              > CATEGORY:Special Ability
                              > TYPE:SpecialQuality
                              > DESC:What are the values of charbonusto("STAT","BASESPELLSTAT") (%1) and charbonusto("STAT","BASESPELLSTAT;CLASS.Wizard") (%2)?|charbonusto("STAT","BASESPELLSTAT")|charbonusto("STAT","BASESPELLSTAT;CLASS.Wizard")
                              >
                              > Test Ability 2
                              > CATEGORY:Special Ability
                              > TYPE:SpecialQuality
                              > DESC:What are the values of BASESPELLSTAT (%1), BASESPELLSTATSCORE (%2), SPELLBASESTAT (%3) and SPELLBASESTATSCORE (%4)?|BASESPELLSTAT|BASESPELLSTATSCORE|SPELLBASESTAT|SPELLBASESTATSCORE
                              >
                              > (Note that according to docs, BASESPELLSTAT is the mod for the class's base spell stat and "can be used in any formula, in any file, in any gamemode.")
                              >
                              > --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com, Andrew wrote:
                              > >
                              > > Hi,
                              > >
                              > > And I could point out this tag:
                              > >
                              > > *Formula:* |charbonusto("x","y")|
                              > >
                              > > *Variable Used (x):* Text (Parameter 1 - Optional)
                              > >
                              > > *Variable Used (x):* Text (Parameter 2)
                              > >
                              > > *What it Does:*
                              > >
                              > > * This function returns the value of a call to PlayerCharacter.getTotalBonusTo(p1, p2).
                              > > * These values reflect bonuses applied to the parameter not the full value of that parameter.
                              > > * Other valid parameter pairs (x - y) include:
                              > > o PCLEVEL -
                              > > o STAT - BASESPELLSTAT
                              > > o STAT - BASESPELLSTAT;CLASS.
                              > > o STAT - CAST.
                              > > o FEAT - POOL
                              > > o VAR -
                              > > o CHECKS -
                              > > o TOHIT - TOHIT
                              > > o DOMAIN - NUMBER
                              > > o CASTERLEVEL -
                              > > o HP - ALTHP
                              > > o COMBAT - BAB
                              > > o WEAPONPROF= - PCSIZE
                              > > o WEAPONPROF=TYPE. - PCSIZE
                              > > * Parameter 1 (x) is optional. If it is not present, it will default to "PCLEVEL".
                              > >
                              > > *Examples:*
                              > >
                              > > |charbonusto("PCLEVEL", "Cleric")|
                              > >
                              > > Returns the number of bonus Spellcaster Levels to the class specified, which usually come from
                              > > Prestige classes.
                              > >
                              > > |charbonusto("CHECKS", "REFLEX")|
                              > >
                              > > Will return Reflex bonuses from a high Dexterity and other bonuses but not the full reflex save
                              > > value.
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > > On 1/11/2013 5:58 AM, pshipley@ wrote:
                              > > > Thanks chaps - appreciate your time to take a look at it.
                              > > >
                              > > > Given that it's a 3PP set & I don't recall seeing this requirement on any other feat (& certainly none of Paizo's), I don't think we should modify other sets to implement.
                              > > >
                              > > > .MODs to classes (per Andrew) in the 3PP set is probably the least invasive & somewhat doable - though this would I guess suffer from the irritating problem of how to determine if the user has loaded APG/UC/UM/... to avoid unconstructed ref problems. I *might* do this for the Paizo core classes at least, and let 3PP set users modify if they wish to support others...
                              > > >
                              > > > OTOH, this all sounds like too much work for 3 feats in one 3PP set - if this requirement starts cropping up a lot, I guess a code FREQ or modifications to the core sets might be in order; for now, a simple PRETEXT is probably good enough!
                              > > >
                              > > > Thanks!
                              > > >
                              > > > --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com, Andrew wrote:
                              > > >> Hi,
                              > > >>
                              > > >> I guess as a data monkey I should point out that the syntax is "off" and we're breaking set standards.
                              > > >>
                              > > >> a) DEFINE:SpecialBonusFeats|0 < Only System Vars use all UPPERCASE.
                              > > >> b) BONUS:VAR|SpecialBonusFeats|PREVARGTEQ:SPELLBASESTAT,13
                              > > >> or
                              > > >> PREVARGTEQ:var("SPELLBASESTAT"),13
                              > > >>
                              > > >> Now, to take this a step further, and I'm about to pass out so forgive any mistake, but if we're
                              > > >> doing this for each class, why not define it properly
                              > > >>
                              > > >> CLASS:Wizard.MOD DEFINE:WizardSpellStat|var("SPELLBASESTAT")
                              > > >> or
                              > > >> DEFINE to 0 and BONUS:WizardSpellStat|var("SPELLBASESTAT")
                              > > >>
                              > > >> Cheers and good night.
                              > > >>
                              > > >>
                              > > >>
                              > > >> On 1/10/2013 12:39 PM, thpr wrote:
                              > > >>> --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com, "pshipley@" wrote:
                              > > >>>> On the assumption that it just doesn't work, I guess the question then becomes: how do I implement a feat with a prereq of "Spellcasting attribute 13"?
                              > > >>>>
                              > > >>>> Cheers!
                              > > >>> Class LST in each spellcasting class:
                              > > >>> DEFINE:SPECIALBONUSFEATS|0
                              > > >>> BONUS:VAR|SPECIALBONUSFEATS|PREVARGTEQ:var(SPELLBASESTAT),13
                              > > >>>
                              > > >>> Feat LST:
                              > > >>> MyFeat <> PREVARGTEQ:SPECIALBONUSFEATS,1
                              > > >>>
                              > > >>>
                              > > >>> ?
                              > > >>>
                              > > >>> Note: The SPELLBASESTAT will only work if it appears in in the Class LST file - it cannot be used in the Feat LST file, hence the use of a "temporary" variable to communicate information over to the Feat LST file.
                              > > >>>
                              > > >>> Warning #1: This has a multi-class "hole" in that you can get a sorcerer with a stat of 18 and a Wizard with a stat of 11 and still get through this test when you are selecting a feat when adding a Wizard class level. If this is then a metamagic feat, I'm not sure if it can stop it from being used on Wizard. YMMV on how important that is for your feat.
                              > > >>>
                              > > >>> Warning #2: There may be a bug in some of the variable code, and I'm certainly no expert on our variable system, so I can't tell which of these is what you mean and which will actually work (it looks to me like the intent of them in the comments is swapped vs. their actual behavior)
                              > > >>>
                              > > >>> PREVARGTEQ:var(SPELLBASESTAT),13
                              > > >>> PREVARGTEQ:var(SPELLBASESTATSCORE),13
                              > > >>>
                              > > >>> I *think* the former should return something like +3 (fail) and the latter something like 16 (pass), but I don't think that's what they do today. This should be tested, and also recognize that it was a very brief look at the code, so I may be making mistakes due to speed of interpretation.
                              > > >>>
                              > > >>> TP.
                              > > >>>
                              >
                              >
                            • thpr
                              ... That does not accomplish what I was attempting to do since you have localized it to Wizard. The point was to consolidate the spell stats of _any_
                              Message 14 of 20 , Jan 11, 2013
                              • 0 Attachment
                                --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com, Andrew wrote:
                                > Now, to take this a step further, and I'm about to pass out so forgive any mistake, but if we're
                                > doing this for each class, why not define it properly
                                >
                                > CLASS:Wizard.MOD DEFINE:WizardSpellStat|var("SPELLBASESTAT")
                                > or
                                > DEFINE to 0 and BONUS:WizardSpellStat|var("SPELLBASESTAT")

                                That does not accomplish what I was attempting to do since you have localized it to Wizard.

                                The point was to consolidate the spell stats of _any_ spellcaster into _one_ variable, not do that solely for Wizard.

                                TP.
                              • Doug Limmer
                                One problem with that approach is multiclassed characters. A cleric/wizard has two different spell stats. (A 3.0 psion has six all by himself! Sort of!)
                                Message 15 of 20 , Jan 11, 2013
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                                  One problem with that approach is multiclassed characters. A
                                  cleric/wizard has two different spell stats. (A 3.0 psion has six all
                                  by himself! Sort of!)

                                  DS/DL

                                  On 1/11/2013 10:33 AM, thpr wrote:
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com
                                  > <mailto:PCGenListFileHelp%40yahoogroups.com>, Andrew wrote:
                                  > > Now, to take this a step further, and I'm about to pass out so
                                  > forgive any mistake, but if we're
                                  > > doing this for each class, why not define it properly
                                  > >
                                  > > CLASS:Wizard.MOD DEFINE:WizardSpellStat|var("SPELLBASESTAT")
                                  > > or
                                  > > DEFINE to 0 and BONUS:WizardSpellStat|var("SPELLBASESTAT")
                                  >
                                  > That does not accomplish what I was attempting to do since you have
                                  > localized it to Wizard.
                                  >
                                  > The point was to consolidate the spell stats of _any_ spellcaster into
                                  > _one_ variable, not do that solely for Wizard.
                                  >
                                  > TP.
                                  >
                                  >



                                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                • pshipley@ymail.com
                                  ... *if* it were worth doing (which I re-emphasise I don t think it is for three 3PP feats), one could at least then do a
                                  Message 16 of 20 , Jan 11, 2013
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                                    ... *if* it were worth doing (which I re-emphasise I don't think it is for three 3PP feats), one could at least then do a max(Class1SpellStat,Class2SpellStat...) for the specific situation that I'm developing for (that is, the feat is not particular about which class has the spell stat).

                                    Cheers

                                    Paul

                                    --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com, Doug Limmer wrote:
                                    >
                                    > One problem with that approach is multiclassed characters. A
                                    > cleric/wizard has two different spell stats. (A 3.0 psion has six all
                                    > by himself! Sort of!)
                                    >
                                    > DS/DL
                                    >
                                    > On 1/11/2013 10:33 AM, thpr wrote:
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > > --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com
                                    > > , Andrew wrote:
                                    > > > Now, to take this a step further, and I'm about to pass out so
                                    > > forgive any mistake, but if we're
                                    > > > doing this for each class, why not define it properly
                                    > > >
                                    > > > CLASS:Wizard.MOD DEFINE:WizardSpellStat|var("SPELLBASESTAT")
                                    > > > or
                                    > > > DEFINE to 0 and BONUS:WizardSpellStat|var("SPELLBASESTAT")
                                    > >
                                    > > That does not accomplish what I was attempting to do since you have
                                    > > localized it to Wizard.
                                    > >
                                    > > The point was to consolidate the spell stats of _any_ spellcaster into
                                    > > _one_ variable, not do that solely for Wizard.
                                    > >
                                    > > TP.
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                    >
                                  • pshipley@ymail.com
                                    Re your last: gods, no! No such intention! A few posts ago, I in fact said that even *adding* a variable to the core sets (leaving everything else intact) was
                                    Message 17 of 20 , Jan 11, 2013
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                                      Re your last: gods, no! No such intention! A few posts ago, I in fact said that even *adding* a variable to the core sets (leaving everything else intact) was much too invasive for the use-case here.

                                      Sleep easy!

                                      --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com, "thpr" wrote:
                                      >
                                      >
                                      > It's the MODIFICATION, not the BASE.
                                      >
                                      > SPELLSTAT:INT defines the base.
                                      >
                                      > BONUS:STAT|BASESPELLSTAT defines the modification.
                                      >
                                      > If there is no BONUS:STAT|BASESPELLLSTAT on the character this will return 0.
                                      >
                                      > Also, removing SPELLSTAT:x from a class will break a ton of stuff, so please don't modify the core datasets to universally put the stats into a bonus rather than the base.
                                      >
                                      > TP.
                                      >
                                      <snip>
                                    • thpr
                                      My syntax should have been: BONUS:VAR|SPECIALBONUSFEATS|1|PREVARGTEQ... I lost the |1 So I m using the VAR as a Boolean do I meet this limit or not , which is
                                      Message 18 of 20 , Jan 11, 2013
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                                        My syntax should have been:
                                        BONUS:VAR|SPECIALBONUSFEATS|1|PREVARGTEQ...
                                        I lost the |1

                                        So I'm using the VAR as a Boolean "do I meet this limit or not", which is why I am very specifically not attempting to put the spellstat directly into a variable... that ends up having a multi-class weakness in that two stats of 11 adding up to 22. When using my form of Boolean test, The 2 safely add up to 2, and are only tested !=0 in the later test.

                                        Having said that, there are a whole set of issues around implementation where I would get more information and even challenge the base assumptions of the original post if it were really something we were trying to get into our base data.

                                        TP.

                                        --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com, Doug Limmer wrote:
                                        >
                                        > One problem with that approach is multiclassed characters. A
                                        > cleric/wizard has two different spell stats. (A 3.0 psion has six all
                                        > by himself! Sort of!)
                                        >
                                        > DS/DL
                                        >
                                        > On 1/11/2013 10:33 AM, thpr wrote:
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > > --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com
                                        > > , Andrew wrote:
                                        > > > Now, to take this a step further, and I'm about to pass out so
                                        > > forgive any mistake, but if we're
                                        > > > doing this for each class, why not define it properly
                                        > > >
                                        > > > CLASS:Wizard.MOD DEFINE:WizardSpellStat|var("SPELLBASESTAT")
                                        > > > or
                                        > > > DEFINE to 0 and BONUS:WizardSpellStat|var("SPELLBASESTAT")
                                        > >
                                        > > That does not accomplish what I was attempting to do since you have
                                        > > localized it to Wizard.
                                        > >
                                        > > The point was to consolidate the spell stats of _any_ spellcaster into
                                        > > _one_ variable, not do that solely for Wizard.
                                        > >
                                        > > TP.
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >
                                        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                        >
                                      • thpr
                                        I m responding to the fact that a bug has been opened for the STAT BASESPELLSTAT showing zero, when I suspect the character has no BONUS:STAT|BASESPELLSTAT
                                        Message 19 of 20 , Jan 11, 2013
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                                          I'm responding to the fact that a bug has been opened for the STAT BASESPELLSTAT showing zero, when I suspect the character has no BONUS:STAT|BASESPELLSTAT present.

                                          TP.


                                          --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com, "pshipley@..." wrote:
                                          >
                                          > Re your last: gods, no! No such intention! A few posts ago, I in fact said that even *adding* a variable to the core sets (leaving everything else intact) was much too invasive for the use-case here.
                                          >
                                          > Sleep easy!
                                          >
                                          > --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com, "thpr" wrote:
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > > It's the MODIFICATION, not the BASE.
                                          > >
                                          > > SPELLSTAT:INT defines the base.
                                          > >
                                          > > BONUS:STAT|BASESPELLSTAT defines the modification.
                                          > >
                                          > > If there is no BONUS:STAT|BASESPELLLSTAT on the character this will return 0.
                                          > >
                                          > > Also, removing SPELLSTAT:x from a class will break a ton of stuff, so please don't modify the core datasets to universally put the stats into a bonus rather than the base.
                                          > >
                                          > > TP.
                                          > >
                                          >
                                          >
                                        • thpr
                                          Because creating one each and then doing a Max produces variable sprawl, which eventually gets confusing and slows down the system as we constantly have to
                                          Message 20 of 20 , Jan 11, 2013
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                                            Because creating one each and then doing a Max produces variable sprawl, which eventually gets confusing and slows down the system as we constantly have to evaluate and process all of the interim variables.

                                            Less is more.

                                            See my last post on this thread ... by using an overall "Boolean" variable so you don't end up with having to do a MAX at all.

                                            TP.

                                            --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com, "pshipley@..." wrote:
                                            >
                                            > ... *if* it were worth doing (which I re-emphasise I don't think it is for three 3PP feats), one could at least then do a max(Class1SpellStat,Class2SpellStat...) for the specific situation that I'm developing for (that is, the feat is not particular about which class has the spell stat).
                                            >
                                            > Cheers
                                            >
                                            > Paul
                                            >
                                            > --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com, Doug Limmer wrote:
                                            > >
                                            > > One problem with that approach is multiclassed characters. A
                                            > > cleric/wizard has two different spell stats. (A 3.0 psion has six all
                                            > > by himself! Sort of!)
                                            > >
                                            > > DS/DL
                                            > >
                                            > > On 1/11/2013 10:33 AM, thpr wrote:
                                            > > >
                                            > > >
                                            > > > --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com
                                            > > > , Andrew wrote:
                                            > > > > Now, to take this a step further, and I'm about to pass out so
                                            > > > forgive any mistake, but if we're
                                            > > > > doing this for each class, why not define it properly
                                            > > > >
                                            > > > > CLASS:Wizard.MOD DEFINE:WizardSpellStat|var("SPELLBASESTAT")
                                            > > > > or
                                            > > > > DEFINE to 0 and BONUS:WizardSpellStat|var("SPELLBASESTAT")
                                            > > >
                                            > > > That does not accomplish what I was attempting to do since you have
                                            > > > localized it to Wizard.
                                            > > >
                                            > > > The point was to consolidate the spell stats of _any_ spellcaster into
                                            > > > _one_ variable, not do that solely for Wizard.
                                            > > >
                                            > > > TP.
                                            > > >
                                            > > >
                                            > >
                                            > >
                                            > >
                                            > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                            > >
                                            >
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