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Use feat to make a skill usable untrained?

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  • Allen Cohn
    Hi, LSTers, I would like my custom feat to allow the character to use certain skills untrained. Is there a tag to do this? Thanks, Allen
    Message 1 of 7 , Sep 30, 2012
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      Hi, LSTers,

      I would like my custom feat to allow the character to use certain skills untrained. Is there a tag to do this?

      Thanks,
      Allen
    • Andrew
      Hi, Not Currently. You can alter it from Cross-Class to Class, or make it Exclusive. But altering the Untrained to Trained would require a Feature Request -
      Message 2 of 7 , Sep 30, 2012
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        Hi,

        Not Currently. You can alter it from Cross-Class to Class, or make it Exclusive. But altering the
        Untrained to Trained would require a Feature Request - It's actually a good idea. Go ahead and open
        a NEW TAG and give a proposal for it.

        It would be a good addition for 6.2 :)

        Cheers,

        On 9/30/2012 10:22 AM, Allen Cohn wrote:
        > Hi, LSTers,
        >
        > I would like my custom feat to allow the character to use certain skills untrained. Is there a tag to do this?
        >
        > Thanks,
        > Allen
        >
        >
        >
        > ------------------------------------
        >
        > Yahoo! Groups Links
        >
        >
        >
        >

        --
        Andrew Maitland (LegacyKing)
        Admin Silverback - PCGen Board of Directors
        Data 2nd, Docs Tamarin, OS Lemur
        Unique Title "Quick-Silverback Tracker Monkey"
        Unique Title "The Torturer of PCGen"


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • tripleduck
        I wonder if it would be possible to create a new skill within your homebrew that is called something like Skill (Feat) , which isn t directly selectable, but
        Message 3 of 7 , Oct 2, 2012
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          I wonder if it would be possible to create a new skill within your homebrew that is called something like "Skill (Feat)", which isn't directly selectable, but given when the feat is taken. That new skill could be marked as "useable untrained".

          Just a thought. :)
        • FerretDave
          Greetings Do you mean ranks cannot be added, but taking a feat gives you some ranks in it? You d have to have the feat BONUS the skill. You could set the
          Message 4 of 7 , Oct 3, 2012
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            Greetings

            Do you mean ranks cannot be added, but taking a feat gives you some ranks in it? You'd have to have the feat BONUS the skill.

            You could set the VISIBLE tag to .. OS ? or similar. so it only appears on the output sheet, *NOT* in the skills list in pcgen (so ranks cannot be added manually).

            Skill would always appear on OS though, regardless.

            Cheers
            D

            --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com, "tripleduck" <tulsagrown@...> wrote:
            >
            > I wonder if it would be possible to create a new skill within your homebrew that is called something like "Skill (Feat)", which isn't directly selectable, but given when the feat is taken. That new skill could be marked as "useable untrained".
            >
            > Just a thought. :)
            >
          • tripleduck
            ... Well, I was thinking more of creating a duplicate skill to the ones he wants to allow, make them usable untrained, but then give them a PREFEAT so that no
            Message 5 of 7 , Oct 3, 2012
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              --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com, "FerretDave" wrote:
              > Do you mean ranks cannot be added, but taking a feat gives you some
              > ranks in it? You'd have to have the feat BONUS the skill.
              > You could set the VISIBLE tag to .. OS ? or similar. so it only
              > appears on the output sheet, *NOT* in the skills list in pcgen (so
              > ranks cannot be added manually).
              > Skill would always appear on OS though, regardless.

              Well, I was thinking more of creating a duplicate skill to the ones he wants to allow, make them usable untrained, but then give them a PREFEAT so that no ranks can be added unless they have the feat. I can see now my original thought process was flawed and this wouldn't accomplish what the OP wants.

              Though, the PREFEAT thing on a skill is pretty cool. I tested it and it works well. :) It doesn't allow you to add ranks unless you have a specific feat.
            • Andrew
              Hi, It s a bit of a workaround, but it will work. You don t need to give it ranks. Look at the Pathfinder Conditional Skills. Just set it up like one of those.
              Message 6 of 7 , Oct 3, 2012
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                Hi,

                It's a bit of a workaround, but it will work. You don't need to give it ranks. Look at the
                Pathfinder Conditional Skills. Just set it up like one of those.

                Skill Name (Use Untrained)

                You'll need to tweak it to work with the feat, but that method will work.

                OR

                Better yet, just setup the feat to do this:

                CHOOSE:SKILL|NORANKS
                MULT:YES
                STACK:NO

                BONUS:SKILLRANK|%LIST|1|TYPE=NoStack
                BONUS:SKILL|%LIST|-1|TYPE=UseUntrained

                With one Rank it will appear, the negative will cancel out the overall total. It's a hack, but
                should accomplish what you desire.

                Cheers,

                On 10/3/2012 11:47 AM, tripleduck wrote:
                > --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com, "FerretDave" wrote:
                >> Do you mean ranks cannot be added, but taking a feat gives you some
                >> ranks in it? You'd have to have the feat BONUS the skill.
                >> You could set the VISIBLE tag to .. OS ? or similar. so it only
                >> appears on the output sheet, *NOT* in the skills list in pcgen (so
                >> ranks cannot be added manually).
                >> Skill would always appear on OS though, regardless.
                > Well, I was thinking more of creating a duplicate skill to the ones he wants to allow, make them usable untrained, but then give them a PREFEAT so that no ranks can be added unless they have the feat. I can see now my original thought process was flawed and this wouldn't accomplish what the OP wants.
                >
                > Though, the PREFEAT thing on a skill is pretty cool. I tested it and it works well. :) It doesn't allow you to add ranks unless you have a specific feat.
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                > ------------------------------------
                >
                > Yahoo! Groups Links
                >
                >
                >
                >

                --
                Andrew Maitland (LegacyKing)
                Admin Silverback - PCGen Board of Directors
                Data 2nd, Docs Tamarin, OS Lemur
                Unique Title "Quick-Silverback Tracker Monkey"
                Unique Title "The Torturer of PCGen"


                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • Allen Cohn
                Thank you for your thoughts on this, guys. I m not adept with all things LST so I m a bit confused. Am I correct that with Andrew s hack I don t need to create
                Message 7 of 7 , Oct 5, 2012
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                  Thank you for your thoughts on this, guys.

                  I'm not adept with all things LST so I'm a bit confused.

                  Am I correct that with Andrew's hack I don't need to create a new, duplicate
                  skill?

                  Since I know precisely which Skills I want to be useable untrained (Use
                  Magic Device and Spellcraft) with this Feat do I need to use the CHOOSE? Can
                  I instead just have the feat include

                  BONUS:SKILLRANK|Use Magic Device,Spellcraft|1|TYPE=NoStack
                  BONUS:SKILL|Use Magic Device,Spellcraft|-1|TYPE=UseUntrained

                  without the CHOOSE, MULT, and STACK tags?

                  What do the TYPE=NoStack and the TYPE=UseUntrained accomplish?

                  I was also thinking that if the user does actually add a rank to either of
                  these skills then the kluge will no longer be necessary for that particular
                  skill. So, perhaps I would need to have something like this in the Feat:

                  BONUS:SKILLRANK|Use Magic Device|1|TYPE=NoStack|!PRESKILL:1,Use Magic
                  Device=1
                  BONUS:SKILL|Use Magic Device|-1|TYPE=UseUntrained|!PRESKILL:1,Use Magic
                  Device=1
                  BONUS:SKILLRANK|Spellcraft|1|TYPE=NoStack|!PRESKILL:1,Spellcraft=1
                  BONUS:SKILL|Spellcraft|-1|TYPE=UseUntrained|!PRESKILL:1,Spellcraft=1

                  ?

                  Thanks,
                  Allen


                  Re: Use feat to make a skill usable untrained?
                  Wed Oct 3, 2012 12:06 pm (PDT) . Posted by:
                  "Andrew" Drew0500
                  Hi,

                  It's a bit of a workaround, but it will work. You don't need to give it
                  ranks. Look at the
                  Pathfinder Conditional Skills. Just set it up like one of those.

                  Skill Name (Use Untrained)

                  You'll need to tweak it to work with the feat, but that method will work.

                  OR

                  Better yet, just setup the feat to do this:

                  CHOOSE:SKILL|NORANKS
                  MULT:YES
                  STACK:NO

                  BONUS:SKILLRANK|%LIST|1|TYPE=NoStack
                  BONUS:SKILL|%LIST|-1|TYPE=UseUntrained

                  With one Rank it will appear, the negative will cancel out the overall
                  total. It's a hack, but
                  should accomplish what you desire.

                  Cheers,
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