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Trouble with REMOVE:FEAT

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  • Phillip Ryan
    Help, I am receiving the following error as PCGen is loading: SEVERE: Error parsing REMOVE, invalid SubToken: FEAT Jan 12, 2008 3:01:10 PM pcgen.util.Logging
    Message 1 of 22 , Jan 12, 2008
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      Help,

      I am receiving the following error as PCGen is loading:
      SEVERE: Error parsing REMOVE, invalid SubToken: FEAT
      Jan 12, 2008 3:01:10 PM pcgen.util.Logging deprecationPrint

      Here is the offending tag from my classes.lst
      REMOVE:FEAT|Simple Weapon Proficiency(Crossbow Light)|

      Here is what the docs say the REMOVE:FEAT tag syntax should be:
      REMOVE:FEAT|x,x|y
      with this as an example:
      REMOVE:FEAT|Alertness|
      Removes the Alertness feat, no choice is presented, the feat is simply
      removed.

      I am hoping that a fresh set of eyes will be able to spot what I am
      doing wrong.
      I know that there has been discussion about the difficulty of removing
      feats.
      Is that what this is? Are the docs ahead of the code?

      This the only remaining load error I can trace to my *.lst files.
      The myriad CHOOSE warnings from the rsrd files would be the topic of
      another thread.

      PCGen 5.13.7 (2008-01-12 1:20 autobuild)
      Homebrew Campaign
      3.5 RSRD - Campaign Set - Core Books I, II and III

      Thank you,
      Phillip
    • Barak
      ... No idea what the problem is here. ... Bad example, there should not be a trailing pipe. But I don t think that s the problem being reported... Barak
      Message 2 of 22 , Jan 12, 2008
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        > -----Original Message-----
        > I am receiving the following error as PCGen is loading:
        > SEVERE: Error parsing REMOVE, invalid SubToken: FEAT
        > Jan 12, 2008 3:01:10 PM pcgen.util.Logging deprecationPrint

        No idea what the problem is here.

        > with this as an example:
        > REMOVE:FEAT|Alertness|
        > Removes the Alertness feat, no choice is presented, the feat is simply
        > removed.

        Bad example, there should not be a trailing pipe.

        But I don't think that's the problem being reported...

        Barak
      • Phillip Ryan
        ... Thanks for the quick response Barak. I tried it with and without the trailing pipe. It made no difference. The error reported is that FEAT is an invalid
        Message 3 of 22 , Jan 12, 2008
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          --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com, "Barak" <barak@...> wrote:
          >
          > > -----Original Message-----
          > > I am receiving the following error as PCGen is loading:
          > > SEVERE: Error parsing REMOVE, invalid SubToken: FEAT
          > > Jan 12, 2008 3:01:10 PM pcgen.util.Logging deprecationPrint
          >
          > No idea what the problem is here.
          >
          > > with this as an example:
          > > REMOVE:FEAT|Alertness|
          > > Removes the Alertness feat, no choice is presented, the feat is simply
          > > removed.
          >
          > Bad example, there should not be a trailing pipe.
          >
          > But I don't think that's the problem being reported...
          >
          > Barak
          >
          Thanks for the quick response Barak.

          I tried it with and without the trailing pipe. It made no difference.
          The error reported is that FEAT is an invalid SubToken for REMOVE. The
          docs say REMOVE:FEAT can be used in class and template files. I am
          using it on a class level line in a class file. I am stuck when the
          code does not work the way the docs say it should.

          Phil
        • Andrew Maitland
          ... Hm, interesting. Does the feat get removed though? If not, on the class line. use TEMPLATE:RemoveFeatBlah In a template file make: RemoveFeatBlah
          Message 4 of 22 , Jan 12, 2008
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            Phillip Ryan wrote:
            > --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com, "Barak" <barak@...> wrote:
            >
            >>> -----Original Message-----
            >>> I am receiving the following error as PCGen is loading:
            >>> SEVERE: Error parsing REMOVE, invalid SubToken: FEAT
            >>> Jan 12, 2008 3:01:10 PM pcgen.util.Logging deprecationPrint
            >>>
            >> No idea what the problem is here.
            >>
            >>
            >>> with this as an example:
            >>> REMOVE:FEAT|Alertness|
            >>> Removes the Alertness feat, no choice is presented, the feat is simply
            >>> removed.
            >>>
            >> Bad example, there should not be a trailing pipe.
            >>
            >> But I don't think that's the problem being reported...
            >>
            >> Barak
            >>
            >>
            > Thanks for the quick response Barak.
            >
            > I tried it with and without the trailing pipe. It made no difference.
            > The error reported is that FEAT is an invalid SubToken for REMOVE. The
            > docs say REMOVE:FEAT can be used in class and template files. I am
            > using it on a class level line in a class file. I am stuck when the
            > code does not work the way the docs say it should.
            >
            > Phil
            >
            Hm, interesting. Does the feat get removed though?

            If not, on the class line. use TEMPLATE:RemoveFeatBlah

            In a template file make:
            RemoveFeatBlah
            REMOVE:FEAT|Alertness
            VISIBLE:YES
            <<Change to VISIBLE:NO after test confirms it is working>>


            >
            >
            >
            > Yahoo! Groups Links
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >

            --
            ~ Andrew Maitland (LegacyKing)
            ~ Admin Silverback, PCGen Board of Directors
            ~ Data Gibbon, Tracker Gibbon, Docs Lemur
            "Quick-Silverback Tracker Monkey"



            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • Phillip Ryan
            ... simply ... Andrew No, the feat is not removed when called from the Class Level Line. I tried your suppestion of using a template and that did not work
            Message 5 of 22 , Jan 12, 2008
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              --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com, Andrew Maitland
              <drew0500@...> wrote:
              >
              >
              >
              > Phillip Ryan wrote:
              > > --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com, "Barak" <barak@> wrote:
              > >
              > >>> -----Original Message-----
              > >>> I am receiving the following error as PCGen is loading:
              > >>> SEVERE: Error parsing REMOVE, invalid SubToken: FEAT
              > >>> Jan 12, 2008 3:01:10 PM pcgen.util.Logging deprecationPrint
              > >>>
              > >> No idea what the problem is here.
              > >>
              > >>
              > >>> with this as an example:
              > >>> REMOVE:FEAT|Alertness|
              > >>> Removes the Alertness feat, no choice is presented, the feat is
              simply
              > >>> removed.
              > >>>
              > >> Bad example, there should not be a trailing pipe.
              > >>
              > >> But I don't think that's the problem being reported...
              > >>
              > >> Barak
              > >>
              > >>
              > > Thanks for the quick response Barak.
              > >
              > > I tried it with and without the trailing pipe. It made no difference.
              > > The error reported is that FEAT is an invalid SubToken for REMOVE. The
              > > docs say REMOVE:FEAT can be used in class and template files. I am
              > > using it on a class level line in a class file. I am stuck when the
              > > code does not work the way the docs say it should.
              > >
              > > Phil
              > >
              > Hm, interesting. Does the feat get removed though?
              >
              > If not, on the class line. use TEMPLATE:RemoveFeatBlah
              >
              > In a template file make:
              > RemoveFeatBlah
              > REMOVE:FEAT|Alertness
              > VISIBLE:YES
              > <<Change to VISIBLE:NO after test confirms it is working>>
              >
              > --
              > ~ Andrew Maitland (LegacyKing)
              > ~ Admin Silverback, PCGen Board of Directors
              > ~ Data Gibbon, Tracker Gibbon, Docs Lemur
              > "Quick-Silverback Tracker Monkey"
              >
              Andrew

              No, the feat is not removed when called from the Class Level Line. I
              tried your suppestion of using a template and that did not work either.

              Here is the template line I used: (new lines are tabs)
              RemoveFeatCrossbows
              REMOVE:FEAT|Simple Weapon Proficiency(Crossbow Light)
              VISIBLE:YES

              As you can see I am trying to remove a weapon proficiency in Light
              Crossbow. I eventually want to remove proficiency in all crossbows for
              this class if they are followers of a particular deity.
              Maybe REMOVE:FEAT is not the way to remove a weapon proficiency. I am
              open to suggestions.

              Thank you for your help and suggentions. And thanks to Eddy Anthony
              for correcting the example in the docs so quickly.

              Phil
            • Eddy Anthony
              ... The docs say Provides options for removing hidden and standard feats, but not those applied with the VFEAT or MFEAT tags. Perhaps it also has no effect
              Message 6 of 22 , Jan 12, 2008
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                Phillip Ryan scribed:

                > No, the feat is not removed when called from the Class Level Line. I
                > tried your suppestion of using a template and that did not work either.
                >
                > Here is the template line I used: (new lines are tabs)
                > RemoveFeatCrossbows
                > REMOVE:FEAT|Simple Weapon Proficiency(Crossbow Light)
                > VISIBLE:YES
                >
                > As you can see I am trying to remove a weapon proficiency in Light
                > Crossbow. I eventually want to remove proficiency in all crossbows for
                > this class if they are followers of a particular deity.
                > Maybe REMOVE:FEAT is not the way to remove a weapon proficiency. I am
                > open to suggestions.

                The docs say "Provides options for removing hidden and standard feats, but
                not those applied with the VFEAT or MFEAT tags."

                Perhaps it also has no effect on automatic feats granted via the FEAT:AUTO
                tag. Standard and hidden feats imply those chosen in the feat tag or via an
                ADD:FEAT pop up.

                Is the class you are coding a .MOD of an existing class or are you coding
                your own custom class? I'm sure there is a way to do what you need but I'm
                not sure what you are attempting.
                --
                ~ Eddy Anthony (MoSaT)
                ~ Chair Monkey, PCGen Board of Directors
                ~ Data Content Second, Doc Chimp, OS Tamarin
              • Phillip Ryan
                ... either. ... feats, but ... FEAT:AUTO ... via an ... coding ... but I m ... I am trying to .MOD the paladin class. Paladins receive Simple Weapon
                Message 7 of 22 , Jan 12, 2008
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                  --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com, Eddy Anthony <eddyba@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > Phillip Ryan scribed:
                  >
                  > > No, the feat is not removed when called from the Class Level Line. I
                  > > tried your suppestion of using a template and that did not work
                  either.
                  > >
                  > > Here is the template line I used: (new lines are tabs)
                  > > RemoveFeatCrossbows
                  > > REMOVE:FEAT|Simple Weapon Proficiency(Crossbow Light)
                  > > VISIBLE:YES
                  > >
                  > > As you can see I am trying to remove a weapon proficiency in Light
                  > > Crossbow. I eventually want to remove proficiency in all crossbows for
                  > > this class if they are followers of a particular deity.
                  > > Maybe REMOVE:FEAT is not the way to remove a weapon proficiency. I am
                  > > open to suggestions.
                  >
                  > The docs say "Provides options for removing hidden and standard
                  feats, but
                  > not those applied with the VFEAT or MFEAT tags."
                  >
                  > Perhaps it also has no effect on automatic feats granted via the
                  FEAT:AUTO
                  > tag. Standard and hidden feats imply those chosen in the feat tag or
                  via an
                  > ADD:FEAT pop up.
                  >
                  > Is the class you are coding a .MOD of an existing class or are you
                  coding
                  > your own custom class? I'm sure there is a way to do what you need
                  but I'm
                  > not sure what you are attempting.
                  > --
                  > ~ Eddy Anthony (MoSaT)
                  > ~ Chair Monkey, PCGen Board of Directors
                  > ~ Data Content Second, Doc Chimp, OS Tamarin
                  >
                  I am trying to .MOD the paladin class. Paladins receive Simple Weapon
                  proficiency through an AUTO:FEAT. I want to remove the crossbow
                  proficiencies (Light and Heavy.)

                  Since the restriction on crossbows only applies to three or four
                  deities out of about fifteen I thought that REMOVE:FEAT with an
                  appropriate PREDEITY condition would be ideal. Once it is working for
                  paladins I can use the same .MOD on clerics.

                  I hope that helps. I don't know all of the options available to do
                  what I want done.

                  Thanks for your help.

                  Phil
                • Barak
                  I wasn t paying close enough attention the first time around... ... Even if you weren t getting that error message, this wouldn t work. Simple Weapon
                  Message 8 of 22 , Jan 12, 2008
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                    I wasn't paying close enough attention the first time around...

                    > I am trying to .MOD the paladin class. Paladins receive Simple Weapon
                    > proficiency through an AUTO:FEAT. I want to remove the crossbow
                    > proficiencies (Light and Heavy.)

                    Even if you weren't getting that error message, this wouldn't work.

                    Simple Weapon Proficiency does not have a CHOOSE in it, so it doesn't have
                    any targets (the part in parens after the feat name). As far as the program
                    is concerned there is no such thing as Simple Weapon Proficiency(Blah).

                    You could remove the entire SWP feat with "REMOVE:FEAT|Simple Weapon
                    Proficiency" and then grant back the profs you want them to have via an
                    AUTO:WEAPONPROF tag. That's about the only way I can think of to accomplish
                    what you want.

                    Barak
                  • Eddy Anthony
                    ... REMOVE is not for use when you are altering data via .MOD. What you want is to CLEAR the feat Use: AUTO:FEAT|.CLEAR.Simple Weapon Proficiency to set the
                    Message 9 of 22 , Jan 12, 2008
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                      Phillip Ryan scribed:

                      > I am trying to .MOD the paladin class. Paladins receive Simple Weapon
                      > proficiency through an AUTO:FEAT. I want to remove the crossbow
                      > proficiencies (Light and Heavy.)
                      >
                      > Since the restriction on crossbows only applies to three or four
                      > deities out of about fifteen I thought that REMOVE:FEAT with an
                      > appropriate PREDEITY condition would be ideal. Once it is working for
                      > paladins I can use the same .MOD on clerics.

                      REMOVE is not for use when you are altering data via .MOD. What you want is
                      to CLEAR the feat

                      Use: "AUTO:FEAT|.CLEAR.Simple Weapon Proficiency" to set the class not to
                      load this feat. You will then need to add back all the profs you want the
                      class to have that were covered under simple weapons leaving out crossbows.
                      There is no way to remove a specific proficiency that belongs to a type once
                      the whole type has been granted.

                      A simpler method might be to just add a penalty for the crossbow which is
                      the same as the non-prof penalty, the crossbow would still show in black as
                      proficient but the attack numbers would be as if they were not.
                      That would be:

                      BONUS:WEAPONPROF=TYPE.Crossbow|TOHIT|-4
                      --
                      ~ Eddy Anthony (MoSaT)
                      ~ Chair Monkey, PCGen Board of Directors
                      ~ Data Content Second, Doc Chimp, OS Tamarin
                    • Phillip Ryan
                      Thanks Eddy, Barak, I didn t know I couldn t use REMOVE:FEAT in a .MOD. Is that why I am getting the invalid SubToken error? I will use the .CLEAR and create a
                      Message 10 of 22 , Jan 13, 2008
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                        Thanks Eddy, Barak,

                        I didn't know I couldn't use REMOVE:FEAT in a .MOD. Is that why I am
                        getting the invalid SubToken error?

                        I will use the .CLEAR and create a hidden feat similar to the Wizard
                        Weapon Proficiencies feat to put back the weapons I want.

                        Thanks again.

                        Phil

                        --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com, Eddy Anthony <eddyba@...> wrote:
                        >
                        > Phillip Ryan scribed:
                        >
                        > > I am trying to .MOD the paladin class. Paladins receive Simple Weapon
                        > > proficiency through an AUTO:FEAT. I want to remove the crossbow
                        > > proficiencies (Light and Heavy.)
                        > >
                        > > Since the restriction on crossbows only applies to three or four
                        > > deities out of about fifteen I thought that REMOVE:FEAT with an
                        > > appropriate PREDEITY condition would be ideal. Once it is working for
                        > > paladins I can use the same .MOD on clerics.
                        >
                        > REMOVE is not for use when you are altering data via .MOD. What you
                        want is
                        > to CLEAR the feat
                        >
                        > Use: "AUTO:FEAT|.CLEAR.Simple Weapon Proficiency" to set the class
                        not to
                        > load this feat. You will then need to add back all the profs you
                        want the
                        > class to have that were covered under simple weapons leaving out
                        crossbows.
                        > There is no way to remove a specific proficiency that belongs to a
                        type once
                        > the whole type has been granted.
                        >
                        > A simpler method might be to just add a penalty for the crossbow
                        which is
                        > the same as the non-prof penalty, the crossbow would still show in
                        black as
                        > proficient but the attack numbers would be as if they were not.
                        > That would be:
                        >
                        > BONUS:WEAPONPROF=TYPE.Crossbow|TOHIT|-4
                        > --
                        > ~ Eddy Anthony (MoSaT)
                        > ~ Chair Monkey, PCGen Board of Directors
                        > ~ Data Content Second, Doc Chimp, OS Tamarin
                        >
                      • Barak
                        ... Could be. :p Just a general note for future reference: REMOVE if for run-time changes, .MOD is for startup changes. ... That should do the trick nicely,
                        Message 11 of 22 , Jan 13, 2008
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                          > -----Original Message-----
                          > I didn't know I couldn't use REMOVE:FEAT in a .MOD. Is that why I am
                          > getting the invalid SubToken error?

                          Could be. :p

                          Just a general note for future reference: REMOVE if for run-time changes,
                          .MOD is for startup changes.

                          > I will use the .CLEAR and create a hidden feat similar to the Wizard
                          > Weapon Proficiencies feat to put back the weapons I want.

                          That should do the trick nicely, although it means you won't have the
                          original class/abilities available.

                          Barak
                        • Dave_3rd
                          This is a question I ve been sitting on for a while... I have bucketfuls previously rolled NPCs, many downloaded from the WotC website. I d like to organize
                          Message 12 of 22 , Jan 13, 2008
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                            This is a question I've been sitting on for a while... I have bucketfuls
                            previously rolled NPCs, many downloaded from the WotC website. I'd like to
                            organize them in a nice, neat, /consistent/ format, like (say for example
                            oh, I don't know, how about) in PCGen. The thing is, I can't quite figure
                            out how to just simply enter in the data for a character without
                            "generating" it, from scratch, each and every level. For my purposes, this
                            is unnecessary and actually obstructive... Everything's already been done
                            for me, and it's exceptionally unlikely I'll need to "rescind" any levels
                            for 99.64% of anything I'm likely to throw at my players. My immediate
                            concern is in having a database of NPCs, prestige monsters, and other stuff
                            that needs stats.

                            Is there a way to just enter the data without having to calculate it every
                            step/level of the way? Alternatively, is PCGen a good idea for a NPC
                            database?

                            Dave III
                          • Andrew Maitland
                            Hi Dave, PCGen s main purpose is to generate characters. Taking a pre-existing character from another source and storing them sounds like a good thing for
                            Message 13 of 22 , Jan 13, 2008
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                              Hi Dave,

                              PCGen's main purpose is to generate characters. Taking a pre-existing
                              character from another source and storing them sounds like a good thing
                              for euruvian.com - Or so I've heard.

                              If you don't mind the effort, you could enter the characters in to
                              PCGen, you don't have to do each level at a time, but you would need to
                              generate it from the beginning.

                              Dave_3rd wrote:
                              > This is a question I've been sitting on for a while... I have bucketfuls
                              > previously rolled NPCs, many downloaded from the WotC website. I'd like to
                              > organize them in a nice, neat, /consistent/ format, like (say for example
                              > oh, I don't know, how about) in PCGen. The thing is, I can't quite figure
                              > out how to just simply enter in the data for a character without
                              > "generating" it, from scratch, each and every level. For my purposes, this
                              > is unnecessary and actually obstructive... Everything's already been done
                              > for me, and it's exceptionally unlikely I'll need to "rescind" any levels
                              > for 99.64% of anything I'm likely to throw at my players. My immediate
                              > concern is in having a database of NPCs, prestige monsters, and other stuff
                              > that needs stats.
                              >
                              > Is there a way to just enter the data without having to calculate it every
                              > step/level of the way? Alternatively, is PCGen a good idea for a NPC
                              > database?
                              >
                              > Dave III
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              > Yahoo! Groups Links
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >

                              --
                              ~ Andrew Maitland (LegacyKing)
                              ~ Admin Silverback, PCGen Board of Directors
                              ~ Data Gibbon, Tracker Gibbon, Docs Lemur
                              "Quick-Silverback Tracker Monkey"



                              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                            • Dave_3rd
                              Yeah, with a name like PCGen, I knew I was basically asking it to do something it wasn t specifically designed to do... Interestingly, almost every
                              Message 14 of 22 , Jan 13, 2008
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                                Yeah, with a name like PCGen, I knew I was basically asking it to do
                                something it wasn't specifically designed to do... Interestingly, almost
                                every character/NPC related program out there is a generator rather than a
                                database. An online database isn't much use to me either, since I'm planning
                                on being off-line during my games... the computer's just a way to avoid
                                having to juggle papers and notebooks.

                                I suppose the best way to get what I want is to figure out a database maker
                                program like MS Access, but I really haven't put enough ranks into Arcane
                                Knowledge: Programming. I was just hoping PCGen could do the job with a
                                minimum of fuss.

                                Dave III


                                > PCGen's main purpose is to generate characters. Taking a pre-existing
                                > character from another source and storing them sounds like a good thing
                                > for euruvian.com - Or so I've heard.

                                > If you don't mind the effort, you could enter the characters in to
                                > PCGen, you don't have to do each level at a time, but you would need to
                                > generate it from the beginning.
                              • Andrew Maitland
                                Hi Dave, Sorry couldn t really help you out. Not much call for personal character databases... Closest I know of is the online database, though I m sure you
                                Message 15 of 22 , Jan 13, 2008
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                                  Hi Dave,

                                  Sorry couldn't really help you out. Not much call for personal character
                                  databases... Closest I know of is the online database, though I'm sure
                                  you can grab some for off-line use.

                                  All of the characters PCGen makes are stored as pcg files. I think there
                                  are other programs that read the format, but in order to make a database
                                  for other systems would be a rather large undertaking.

                                  If you want to have character ready to be printed at the game table in
                                  pcgen, you'd need to enter them in. If you want to work on such a
                                  project integrating pcgen and various other pc generators, we'd be more
                                  than happy to work with you on it.

                                  Let me know.

                                  Dave_3rd wrote:
                                  > Yeah, with a name like PCGen, I knew I was basically asking it to do
                                  > something it wasn't specifically designed to do... Interestingly, almost
                                  > every character/NPC related program out there is a generator rather than a
                                  > database. An online database isn't much use to me either, since I'm planning
                                  > on being off-line during my games... the computer's just a way to avoid
                                  > having to juggle papers and notebooks.
                                  >
                                  > I suppose the best way to get what I want is to figure out a database maker
                                  > program like MS Access, but I really haven't put enough ranks into Arcane
                                  > Knowledge: Programming. I was just hoping PCGen could do the job with a
                                  > minimum of fuss.
                                  >
                                  > Dave III
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >> PCGen's main purpose is to generate characters. Taking a pre-existing
                                  >> character from another source and storing them sounds like a good thing
                                  >> for euruvian.com - Or so I've heard.
                                  >>
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >> If you don't mind the effort, you could enter the characters in to
                                  >> PCGen, you don't have to do each level at a time, but you would need to
                                  >> generate it from the beginning.
                                  >>
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > Yahoo! Groups Links
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >

                                  --
                                  ~ Andrew Maitland (LegacyKing)
                                  ~ Admin Silverback, PCGen Board of Directors
                                  ~ Data Gibbon, Tracker Gibbon, Docs Lemur
                                  "Quick-Silverback Tracker Monkey"



                                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                • Dave_3rd
                                  Hmm.. Seems odd to think there s not much call for this kind of thing. is this one of those thinking too much beginner s mistakes, like trying to plot out an
                                  Message 16 of 22 , Jan 13, 2008
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                                    Hmm.. Seems odd to think there's not much call for this kind of thing. is
                                    this one of those "thinking too much" beginner's mistakes, like trying to
                                    plot out an entire campaign world before playing the first few dungeon
                                    crawls?



                                    Entering them NPC's info doesn't scare me (ok, that's a lie. let's just say
                                    I'm willing to do it anyway), it's just that PCGen, since it (appears to be)
                                    set up to start at level one, no matter what, is therefore not happy to
                                    handle me saying 'Ok, X is a level 20 something/something, with these skills
                                    and those spells' without demanding things like when, precisely, X started
                                    multi-classing, how many ranks he took along the way, and when such-and-so
                                    qualifiers started kicking in. Fair enough, it's a Character Generator, it's
                                    assumed that things will begin at the beginning. I'm the one making weird
                                    demands, I realize that.



                                    *Grunt* Ah, well. back to the search engines..



                                    Dave III







                                    _____

                                    From: PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com
                                    [mailto:PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Andrew Maitland
                                    Sent: Sunday, January 13, 2008 4:45 PM
                                    To: PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com
                                    Subject: Re: [PCGenListFileHelp] How to do it...?



                                    Hi Dave,

                                    Sorry couldn't really help you out. Not much call for personal character
                                    databases... Closest I know of is the online database, though I'm sure
                                    you can grab some for off-line use.

                                    All of the characters PCGen makes are stored as pcg files. I think there
                                    are other programs that read the format, but in order to make a database
                                    for other systems would be a rather large undertaking.

                                    If you want to have character ready to be printed at the game table in
                                    pcgen, you'd need to enter them in. If you want to work on such a
                                    project integrating pcgen and various other pc generators, we'd be more
                                    than happy to work with you on it.

                                    Let me know.

                                    Dave_3rd wrote:
                                    > Yeah, with a name like PCGen, I knew I was basically asking it to do
                                    > something it wasn't specifically designed to do... Interestingly, almost
                                    > every character/NPC related program out there is a generator rather than a
                                    > database. An online database isn't much use to me either, since I'm
                                    planning
                                    > on being off-line during my games... the computer's just a way to avoid
                                    > having to juggle papers and notebooks.
                                    >
                                    > I suppose the best way to get what I want is to figure out a database
                                    maker
                                    > program like MS Access, but I really haven't put enough ranks into Arcane
                                    > Knowledge: Programming. I was just hoping PCGen could do the job with a
                                    > minimum of fuss.
                                    >
                                    > Dave III
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >> PCGen's main purpose is to generate characters. Taking a pre-existing
                                    >> character from another source and storing them sounds like a good thing
                                    >> for euruvian.com - Or so I've heard.
                                    >>
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >> If you don't mind the effort, you could enter the characters in to
                                    >> PCGen, you don't have to do each level at a time, but you would need to
                                    >> generate it from the beginning.
                                    >>
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > Yahoo! Groups Links
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >

                                    --
                                    ~ Andrew Maitland (LegacyKing)
                                    ~ Admin Silverback, PCGen Board of Directors
                                    ~ Data Gibbon, Tracker Gibbon, Docs Lemur
                                    "Quick-Silverback Tracker Monkey"

                                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





                                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                  • Andrew Maitland
                                    No, you can make a xth level character or NPC. In fact, we have an NPC button. Push it, choose the class(es) and Level(s). I d suggest making the stat changes.
                                    Message 17 of 22 , Jan 13, 2008
                                    • 0 Attachment
                                      No, you can make a xth level character or NPC. In fact, we have an NPC
                                      button. Push it, choose the class(es) and Level(s). I'd suggest making
                                      the stat changes. You have options... I'm just saying importing another
                                      format or using pcgen as a database, isn't in the near future. But
                                      making a NPC based upon an existing paper one isn't hard to do either.

                                      and even creating a regular pc/npc isn't much work, no you aren't forced
                                      to go by each level... I routinely make 10th, 12th or 15th level
                                      characters. I just set the stats, indicate which stat boost happens
                                      every 4th level, (and bonus feats if using 5.12.1).

                                      After that, spells, equipment and such is fairly easy.

                                      Dave_3rd wrote:
                                      > Hmm.. Seems odd to think there's not much call for this kind of thing. is
                                      > this one of those "thinking too much" beginner's mistakes, like trying to
                                      > plot out an entire campaign world before playing the first few dungeon
                                      > crawls?
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      > Entering them NPC's info doesn't scare me (ok, that's a lie. let's just say
                                      > I'm willing to do it anyway), it's just that PCGen, since it (appears to be)
                                      > set up to start at level one, no matter what, is therefore not happy to
                                      > handle me saying 'Ok, X is a level 20 something/something, with these skills
                                      > and those spells' without demanding things like when, precisely, X started
                                      > multi-classing, how many ranks he took along the way, and when such-and-so
                                      > qualifiers started kicking in. Fair enough, it's a Character Generator, it's
                                      > assumed that things will begin at the beginning. I'm the one making weird
                                      > demands, I realize that.
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      > *Grunt* Ah, well. back to the search engines..
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      > Dave III
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      > _____
                                      >
                                      > From: PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com
                                      > [mailto:PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Andrew Maitland
                                      > Sent: Sunday, January 13, 2008 4:45 PM
                                      > To: PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com
                                      > Subject: Re: [PCGenListFileHelp] How to do it...?
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      > Hi Dave,
                                      >
                                      > Sorry couldn't really help you out. Not much call for personal character
                                      > databases... Closest I know of is the online database, though I'm sure
                                      > you can grab some for off-line use.
                                      >
                                      > All of the characters PCGen makes are stored as pcg files. I think there
                                      > are other programs that read the format, but in order to make a database
                                      > for other systems would be a rather large undertaking.
                                      >
                                      > If you want to have character ready to be printed at the game table in
                                      > pcgen, you'd need to enter them in. If you want to work on such a
                                      > project integrating pcgen and various other pc generators, we'd be more
                                      > than happy to work with you on it.
                                      >
                                      > Let me know.
                                      >
                                      > Dave_3rd wrote:
                                      >
                                      >> Yeah, with a name like PCGen, I knew I was basically asking it to do
                                      >> something it wasn't specifically designed to do... Interestingly, almost
                                      >> every character/NPC related program out there is a generator rather than a
                                      >> database. An online database isn't much use to me either, since I'm
                                      >>
                                      > planning
                                      >
                                      >> on being off-line during my games... the computer's just a way to avoid
                                      >> having to juggle papers and notebooks.
                                      >>
                                      >> I suppose the best way to get what I want is to figure out a database
                                      >>
                                      > maker
                                      >
                                      >> program like MS Access, but I really haven't put enough ranks into Arcane
                                      >> Knowledge: Programming. I was just hoping PCGen could do the job with a
                                      >> minimum of fuss.
                                      >>
                                      >> Dave III
                                      >>
                                      >>
                                      >>
                                      >>
                                      >>> PCGen's main purpose is to generate characters. Taking a pre-existing
                                      >>> character from another source and storing them sounds like a good thing
                                      >>> for euruvian.com - Or so I've heard.
                                      >>>
                                      >>>
                                      >>
                                      >>> If you don't mind the effort, you could enter the characters in to
                                      >>> PCGen, you don't have to do each level at a time, but you would need to
                                      >>> generate it from the beginning.
                                      >>>
                                      >>>
                                      >>
                                      >>
                                      >> Yahoo! Groups Links
                                      >>
                                      >>
                                      >>
                                      >>
                                      >>
                                      >>
                                      >
                                      >

                                      --
                                      ~ Andrew Maitland (LegacyKing)
                                      ~ Admin Silverback, PCGen Board of Directors
                                      ~ Data Gibbon, Tracker Gibbon, Docs Lemur
                                      "Quick-Silverback Tracker Monkey"



                                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                    • Tom Parker
                                      ... This is a bug in our pluginbuild.xml file, as the FEAT subtoken of REMOVE is not being packaged into our release. Thanks for reporting this issue. TP.
                                      Message 18 of 22 , Jan 13, 2008
                                      • 0 Attachment
                                        --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com, "Phillip Ryan" <pryan7@...>
                                        wrote:
                                        >
                                        > Help,
                                        >
                                        > I am receiving the following error as PCGen is loading:
                                        > SEVERE: Error parsing REMOVE, invalid SubToken: FEAT
                                        > Jan 12, 2008 3:01:10 PM pcgen.util.Logging deprecationPrint
                                        >
                                        > Here is the offending tag from my classes.lst
                                        > REMOVE:FEAT|Simple Weapon Proficiency(Crossbow Light)|

                                        This is a bug in our pluginbuild.xml file, as the FEAT subtoken of
                                        REMOVE is not being packaged into our release. Thanks for reporting
                                        this issue.

                                        TP.
                                      • Phillip Ryan
                                        ... While I am sorry that there is a bug in the code, I feel better that the problem was not just my lack of coding skills. Phil
                                        Message 19 of 22 , Jan 13, 2008
                                        • 0 Attachment
                                          --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com, "Tom Parker" <thpr@...> wrote:
                                          >
                                          > --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com, "Phillip Ryan" <pryan7@>
                                          > wrote:
                                          > >
                                          > > Help,
                                          > >
                                          > > I am receiving the following error as PCGen is loading:
                                          > > SEVERE: Error parsing REMOVE, invalid SubToken: FEAT
                                          > > Jan 12, 2008 3:01:10 PM pcgen.util.Logging deprecationPrint
                                          > >
                                          > > Here is the offending tag from my classes.lst
                                          > > REMOVE:FEAT|Simple Weapon Proficiency(Crossbow Light)|
                                          >
                                          > This is a bug in our pluginbuild.xml file, as the FEAT subtoken of
                                          > REMOVE is not being packaged into our release. Thanks for reporting
                                          > this issue.
                                          >
                                          > TP.
                                          >
                                          While I am sorry that there is a bug in the code, I feel better that
                                          the problem was not just my lack of coding skills.

                                          Phil
                                        • Andrew Maitland
                                          Tom, I found that the REMOVE feat wasn t applying to AUTO:FEAT, but worked fine with ADD:FEAT. This was brought up when Tim Ragnow was trying to implement the
                                          Message 20 of 22 , Jan 13, 2008
                                          • 0 Attachment
                                            Tom,

                                            I found that the REMOVE feat wasn't applying to AUTO:FEAT, but worked
                                            fine with ADD:FEAT. This was brought up when Tim Ragnow was trying to
                                            implement the variant wizard classes in the Arcana Unearthed Source Book.

                                            If it will remove AUTO granted feats, than great... one less problem to
                                            try and work around.

                                            Phillip Ryan wrote:
                                            > --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com, "Tom Parker" <thpr@...> wrote:
                                            >
                                            >> --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com, "Phillip Ryan" <pryan7@>
                                            >> wrote:
                                            >>
                                            >>> Help,
                                            >>>
                                            >>> I am receiving the following error as PCGen is loading:
                                            >>> SEVERE: Error parsing REMOVE, invalid SubToken: FEAT
                                            >>> Jan 12, 2008 3:01:10 PM pcgen.util.Logging deprecationPrint
                                            >>>
                                            >>> Here is the offending tag from my classes.lst
                                            >>> REMOVE:FEAT|Simple Weapon Proficiency(Crossbow Light)|
                                            >>>
                                            >> This is a bug in our pluginbuild.xml file, as the FEAT subtoken of
                                            >> REMOVE is not being packaged into our release. Thanks for reporting
                                            >> this issue.
                                            >>
                                            >> TP.
                                            >>
                                            >>
                                            > While I am sorry that there is a bug in the code, I feel better that
                                            > the problem was not just my lack of coding skills.
                                            >
                                            > Phil
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            > Yahoo! Groups Links
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >

                                            --
                                            ~ Andrew Maitland (LegacyKing)
                                            ~ Admin Silverback, PCGen Board of Directors
                                            ~ Data Gibbon, Tracker Gibbon, Docs Lemur
                                            "Quick-Silverback Tracker Monkey"



                                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                          • Tom Parker
                                            ... Book. ... REMOVE is designed to take out FEATs with a nature of NORMAL, thus no VFEAT, or AUTO:FEAT. I don t think this behavior should be changed,
                                            Message 21 of 22 , Jan 13, 2008
                                            • 0 Attachment
                                              --- In PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com, Andrew Maitland
                                              <drew0500@...> wrote:
                                              > Tom,
                                              >
                                              > I found that the REMOVE feat wasn't applying to AUTO:FEAT, but worked
                                              > fine with ADD:FEAT. This was brought up when Tim Ragnow was trying to
                                              > implement the variant wizard classes in the Arcana Unearthed Source
                                              Book.
                                              >
                                              > If it will remove AUTO granted feats, than great... one less problem to
                                              > try and work around.

                                              REMOVE is designed to take out FEATs with a nature of NORMAL, thus no
                                              VFEAT, or AUTO:FEAT. I don't think this behavior should be changed,
                                              because it may alter existing data.

                                              I'm happy to have this brought to _experimental and discussed as to
                                              what we can do in the future, but we need the discussion there to
                                              address the transition.

                                              TP.
                                            • Susan Dittmar
                                              ... I think it s not so much no one asking than everyone asking it differently. What I did for my NPC database is save the pcg files (and the generated pdfs)
                                              Message 22 of 22 , Jan 18, 2008
                                              • 0 Attachment
                                                Quoting Dave_3rd (dave_3rd@...):
                                                > Hmm.. Seems odd to think there's not much call for this kind of thing.

                                                I think it's not so much no one asking than everyone asking it differently.

                                                What I did for my NPC database is save the pcg files (and the generated pdfs) in
                                                a hierarchy of directories. I sort them by challenge rating.

                                                Then I started a plain text file with a table detailing challenge rating, name,
                                                race, class levels, and some remarks. I can sort this text file according to
                                                whichever fields interests me most at the moment, and then find the sheet I
                                                need by its challenge rating and name. For someone more used to the office
                                                suite(s) and less used to unix' command line tools, you could use a spreadsheet
                                                instead of the plain text file.

                                                When preparing adventures, I sometimes move or copy the files needed to a
                                                special directory or directory structure, making it easier to find the sheet I
                                                need for this special session.


                                                I thought a lot about how to structure my collection of character sheet, and
                                                did not yet come up with any better way of sorting them :-(

                                                Susan
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