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Re: [PCGenListFileHelp] Re: Changing a skill from use trained to untrained

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  • Craig Bogun
    In what file would I put that? Wouldn t that just MOD the skill at lst load time? ... -- Craig Bogun [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    Message 1 of 15 , Oct 11, 2006
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      In what file would I put that? Wouldn't that just MOD the skill at lst load
      time?

      On 12/10/06, Paul Grosse <paul.grosse@...> wrote:
      >
      > Umm how about this, not totally sure if that will work but it might.?
      >
      > MySkill.MOD<tab>USEUNTRAINED:YES|PREFEAT:1,MyFeat
      >
      > In the feat.lst file
      > MyFeat<tab>TYPE:Special<tab>CSKILL:MySkill
      >
      >
      > > -----Original Message-----
      > > From: PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com<PCGenListFileHelp%40yahoogroups.com>
      > > [mailto:PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com<PCGenListFileHelp%40yahoogroups.com>]
      > On Behalf Of ed ballot
      > > Sent: Wednesday, October 11, 2006 9:20 AM
      > > To: PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com<PCGenListFileHelp%40yahoogroups.com>
      > > Subject: Re: [PCGenListFileHelp] Re: Changing a skill from
      > > use trained to untrained
      > >
      > > It works for me in v5.10.1. Here's an quick example that I
      > > just cooked up that keeps the skill MySkill exclusive until
      > > the feat MyFeat is taken
      > >
      > > In the skill.lst file
      > > MySkill<tab>KEYSTAT:INT<tab>TYPE:Intelligence<tab>EXCLUSIVE:YES
      > >
      > > In the feat.lst file
      > > MyFeat<tab>TYPE:Special<tab>CSKILL:MySkill
      > >
      > > Caveat: no classes can have MySkill in their skill list since
      > > that defeats the purpose of EXCLUSIVE.
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > On 10/11/06, Craig Bogun <craig.bogun@...<craig.bogun%40gmail.com>>
      > wrote:
      > > >
      > > > Oh well thats a shame. Can anyone tell me if they have
      > > had success
      > > > with the EXCLUSIVE tag? I can't seem to get it to work as
      > > advertised.
      > > >
      > > > On 11/10/06, Andrew Maitland <drew0500@...<drew0500%40yahoo.com>
      > > > <drew0500%40yahoo.com>>
      > > > wrote:
      > > > >
      > > > > The only way I can think to do it:
      > > > >
      > > > > Take your skill and copy it using a similar name. Then, use the
      > > > > EXCLUSIVE:YES and then make the USEUNTRAINED what you
      > > want. Then use
      > > > > either a template or feat that makes the Skill either a
      > > cross class
      > > > > or class skill.
      > > > >
      > > > > I can't think of any other way to make what you want to work.
      > > > >
      > > > > Andrew
      > > > >
      > > > > Craig Bogun wrote:
      > > > > >
      > > > > > As far as I can tell EXCLUSIVE doesn't work. I don't
      > > know if this
      > > > > > is a
      > > > > bug
      > > > > > with this version or not as I have only been using PCGen for a
      > > > > > short
      > > > > time,
      > > > > > ie This version.
      > > > > > Setting it up like that still allows the selecting of
      > > the skill as
      > > > cross
      > > > > > class which I don't want. I did put in a PREFEAT on the
      > > skills but
      > > > this
      > > > > > still doesn't get the result I want.
      > > > > > This is a d20 Modern variant by the way if that helps.
      > > It's meant
      > > > > > to work a little like "Jack of all trades" feat for the trained
      > > > > > only to
      > > > untrained
      > > > > > switching, but looking at the code for that feat it
      > > looks like it
      > > > wasn't
      > > > > > implemented.
      > > > > >
      > > > > > Anyother ideas
      > > > > >
      > > > > > On 11/10/06, ed ballot <eballot@... <eballot%40gmail.com>
      > > > > > <eballot%40gmail.com><eballot%40gmail.com>
      > > > > > <mailto:eballot% <eballot%25> <eballot%25> <eballot%25>40gmail.com>>
      > wrote:
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > I think .MOD is a static change which cannot be used to
      > > > > > > dynamically change skills or other objects.
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > One thing you might try is make the skill EXCLUSIVE and only
      > > > > > > become
      > > > a
      > > > > > > class
      > > > > > > skill by selecting the feat (see CSKILL tag). In
      > > theory you can
      > > > > > > only select exclusive skills if they are are class skill for
      > > > > > > you.
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > Ed
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > On 10/10/06, craig_bogun
      > > > > > > <craig.bogun@... <craig.bogun%40gmail.com><craig.bogun%
      > 40gmail.com>
      > > > <craig.bogun%40gmail.com>
      > > > > > <mailto:craig.bogun%40gmail.com> <craig.bogun%40gmail.com>>
      > > > > > > wrote:
      > > > > > > >
      > > > > > > > No ideas? Is it possible to MOD a skill in a
      > > template? What I
      > > > really
      > > > > > > > wish to do is make the skill univalable untill the FEAT is
      > > > > > > > taken,
      > > > is
      > > > > > > > that possible?
      > > > > > > > This is all for a home grown Psionic system that
      > > uses skills
      > > > > > > > and
      > > > > feats
      > > > > > > > to run the powers.
      > > > > > > >
      > > > > > > > Anyone?
      > > > > > > >
      > > > > > > > --- In
      > > > > > > >
      > > PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com <PCGenListFileHelp%40yahoogroups.com>
      > <PCGenListFileHelp%40yahoogro
      > > > > > > > ups.com>
      > > > <PCGenListFileHelp%40yahoogroups.com>
      > > > > > <mailto:PCGenListFileHelp%40yahoogroups.com
      > > > > ><PCGenListFileHelp%40yahoogroups.com>
      > > > > > > <PCGenListFileHelp%40yahoogroups.com>,
      > > > > > > > "craig_bogun"
      > > > > > > > <craig.bogun@...> wrote:
      > > > > > > > >
      > > > > > > > > I wish to code a feat that adds a skill as a
      > > class skill and
      > > > > changes
      > > > > > > > > it from only used trained to use untrained?
      > > > > > > > >
      > > > > > > > > Any help would be much appreciated.
      > > > > > > > >
      > > > > > > > > Craig
      > > > > > > > >
      > > > > > > >
      > > > > > > >
      > > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > > --
      > > > > > Craig Bogun
      > > > > >
      > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > >
      > > > --
      > > > Craig Bogun
      > > >
      > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > >
      > >
      > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > Yahoo! Groups Links
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      >
      >
      >



      --
      Craig Bogun


      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • ed ballot
      Curious that it worked as desired for me (before taking MyFeat, trying to add points to Myskill causes pcgen to display a not allowed dialog). What version of
      Message 2 of 15 , Oct 11, 2006
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        Curious that it worked as desired for me (before taking MyFeat, trying to
        add points to Myskill causes pcgen to display a not allowed dialog). What
        version of PCGen are you using?

        Some random suggestions:
        Make sure you unload all sources, refresh, and load them. Then test with a
        newly created character.

        Make sure you haven't added MySkill anywhere else, such as the class.lstfile.



        On 10/11/06, Craig Bogun <craig.bogun@...> wrote:
        >
        > Tried that exact code (with tabs in place of <tab> of course) and it
        > still
        > lets me add it as a cross class skill if I don't have the feat.
        >
        > On 12/10/06, ed ballot <eballot@... <eballot%40gmail.com>> wrote:
        > >
        > > It works for me in v5.10.1. Here's an quick example that I just cooked
        > > up
        > > that keeps the skill MySkill exclusive until the feat MyFeat is taken
        > >
        > > In the skill.lst file
        > > MySkill<tab>KEYSTAT:INT<tab>TYPE:Intelligence<tab>EXCLUSIVE:YES
        > >
        > > In the feat.lst file
        > > MyFeat<tab>TYPE:Special<tab>CSKILL:MySkill
        > >
        > > Caveat: no classes can have MySkill in their skill list since that
        > defeats
        > > the purpose of EXCLUSIVE.
        > >
        >


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Craig Bogun
        I am using version 5.10.1 and doing everything you suggest still doesn t work, interesting though it does work in 3.5e game mode, I think we have a bit of a
        Message 3 of 15 , Oct 11, 2006
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          I am using version 5.10.1 and doing everything you suggest still doesn't
          work, interesting though it does work in 3.5e game mode, I think we have a
          bit of a bug that doesn't parse EXCLUSIVE tag for the modern game mode
          skills. I am assume that it is meant to work in all the modes of use, is
          this true?

          On 12/10/06, ed ballot <eballot@...> wrote:
          >
          > Curious that it worked as desired for me (before taking MyFeat, trying
          > to
          > add points to Myskill causes pcgen to display a not allowed dialog). What
          > version of PCGen are you using?
          >
          > Some random suggestions:
          > Make sure you unload all sources, refresh, and load them. Then test with a
          > newly created character.
          >
          > Make sure you haven't added MySkill anywhere else, such as the
          > class.lstfile.
          >
          > On 10/11/06, Craig Bogun <craig.bogun@... <craig.bogun%40gmail.com>>
          > wrote:
          > >
          > > Tried that exact code (with tabs in place of <tab> of course) and it
          > > still
          > > lets me add it as a cross class skill if I don't have the feat.
          > >
          > > On 12/10/06, ed ballot <eballot@... <eballot%40gmail.com><eballot%40gmail.com>> wrote:
          > > >
          > > > It works for me in v5.10.1. Here's an quick example that I just cooked
          > > > up
          > > > that keeps the skill MySkill exclusive until the feat MyFeat is taken
          > > >
          > > > In the skill.lst file
          > > > MySkill<tab>KEYSTAT:INT<tab>TYPE:Intelligence<tab>EXCLUSIVE:YES
          > > >
          > > > In the feat.lst file
          > > > MyFeat<tab>TYPE:Special<tab>CSKILL:MySkill
          > > >
          > > > Caveat: no classes can have MySkill in their skill list since that
          > > defeats
          > > > the purpose of EXCLUSIVE.
          > > >
          > >
          >
          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          >
          >
          >



          --
          Craig Bogun


          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • ed ballot
          Ahh. Sorry for being dense. There are some game mode files in pcgen system gameModes that might be overriding the Exclude setting for modern. I didn t see
          Message 4 of 15 , Oct 11, 2006
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            Ahh. Sorry for being dense. There are some game mode files in
            pcgen\system\gameModes that might be overriding the Exclude setting for
            modern. I didn't see anything obvious, though, so I'd also guess bug.

            Ed


            On 10/11/06, Craig Bogun <craig.bogun@...> wrote:
            >
            > I am using version 5.10.1 and doing everything you suggest still doesn't
            > work, interesting though it does work in 3.5e game mode, I think we have a
            > bit of a bug that doesn't parse EXCLUSIVE tag for the modern game mode
            > skills. I am assume that it is meant to work in all the modes of use, is
            > this true?
            >
            > On 12/10/06, ed ballot <eballot@... <eballot%40gmail.com>> wrote:
            > >
            > > Curious that it worked as desired for me (before taking MyFeat, trying
            > > to
            > > add points to Myskill causes pcgen to display a not allowed dialog).
            > What
            > > version of PCGen are you using?
            > >
            > > Some random suggestions:
            > > Make sure you unload all sources, refresh, and load them. Then test with
            > a
            > > newly created character.
            > >
            > > Make sure you haven't added MySkill anywhere else, such as the
            > > class.lstfile.
            > >
            > > On 10/11/06, Craig Bogun <craig.bogun@...<craig.bogun%40gmail.com><
            > craig.bogun%40gmail.com>>
            > > wrote:
            > > >
            > > > Tried that exact code (with tabs in place of <tab> of course) and it
            > > > still
            > > > lets me add it as a cross class skill if I don't have the feat.
            > > >
            > > > On 12/10/06, ed ballot <eballot@... <eballot%40gmail.com><eballot%40gmail.com><eballot%
            > 40gmail.com>> wrote:
            > > > >
            > > > > It works for me in v5.10.1. Here's an quick example that I just
            > cooked
            > > > > up
            > > > > that keeps the skill MySkill exclusive until the feat MyFeat is
            > taken
            > > > >
            > > > > In the skill.lst file
            > > > > MySkill<tab>KEYSTAT:INT<tab>TYPE:Intelligence<tab>EXCLUSIVE:YES
            > > > >
            > > > > In the feat.lst file
            > > > > MyFeat<tab>TYPE:Special<tab>CSKILL:MySkill
            > > > >
            > > > > Caveat: no classes can have MySkill in their skill list since that
            > > > defeats
            > > > > the purpose of EXCLUSIVE.
            > > > >
            > > >
            > >
            > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            > >
            > >
            > >
            >
            > --
            > Craig Bogun
            >
            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            >
            >
            >


            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • Craig Bogun
            Not dense at all, if it works in one mode you would expect it to work in all. Thanks for you help, the EXCLUSIVE tag is exactly what I want and I had tried it
            Message 5 of 15 , Oct 11, 2006
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              Not dense at all, if it works in one mode you would expect it to work in
              all. Thanks for you help, the EXCLUSIVE tag is exactly what I want and I
              had tried it but when it didn't work I came looking for assistance, I should
              have said what I had tried at the start.

              Got us both there the little blighter.

              Craig

              On 12/10/06, ed ballot <eballot@...> wrote:
              >
              > Ahh. Sorry for being dense. There are some game mode files in
              > pcgen\system\gameModes that might be overriding the Exclude setting for
              > modern. I didn't see anything obvious, though, so I'd also guess bug.
              >
              > Ed
              >
              > On 10/11/06, Craig Bogun <craig.bogun@... <craig.bogun%40gmail.com>>
              > wrote:
              > >
              > > I am using version 5.10.1 and doing everything you suggest still doesn't
              > > work, interesting though it does work in 3.5e game mode, I think we have
              > a
              > > bit of a bug that doesn't parse EXCLUSIVE tag for the modern game mode
              > > skills. I am assume that it is meant to work in all the modes of use, is
              > > this true?
              > >
              > > On 12/10/06, ed ballot <eballot@... <eballot%40gmail.com><eballot%40gmail.com>> wrote:
              > > >
              > > > Curious that it worked as desired for me (before taking MyFeat, trying
              > > > to
              > > > add points to Myskill causes pcgen to display a not allowed dialog).
              > > What
              > > > version of PCGen are you using?
              > > >
              > > > Some random suggestions:
              > > > Make sure you unload all sources, refresh, and load them. Then test
              > with
              > > a
              > > > newly created character.
              > > >
              > > > Make sure you haven't added MySkill anywhere else, such as the
              > > > class.lstfile.
              > > >
              > > > On 10/11/06, Craig Bogun <craig.bogun@...<craig.bogun%40gmail.com>
              > <craig.bogun%40gmail.com><
              > > craig.bogun%40gmail.com>>
              > > > wrote:
              > > > >
              > > > > Tried that exact code (with tabs in place of <tab> of course) and it
              > > > > still
              > > > > lets me add it as a cross class skill if I don't have the feat.
              > > > >
              > > > > On 12/10/06, ed ballot <eballot@... <eballot%40gmail.com><eballot%40gmail.com><eballot%
              > 40gmail.com><eballot%
              > > 40gmail.com>> wrote:
              > > > > >
              > > > > > It works for me in v5.10.1. Here's an quick example that I just
              > > cooked
              > > > > > up
              > > > > > that keeps the skill MySkill exclusive until the feat MyFeat is
              > > taken
              > > > > >
              > > > > > In the skill.lst file
              > > > > > MySkill<tab>KEYSTAT:INT<tab>TYPE:Intelligence<tab>EXCLUSIVE:YES
              > > > > >
              > > > > > In the feat.lst file
              > > > > > MyFeat<tab>TYPE:Special<tab>CSKILL:MySkill
              > > > > >
              > > > > > Caveat: no classes can have MySkill in their skill list since that
              > > > > defeats
              > > > > > the purpose of EXCLUSIVE.
              > > > > >
              > > > >
              > > >
              > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              > > >
              > > >
              > > >
              > >
              > > --
              > > Craig Bogun
              > >
              > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              > >
              > >
              > >
              >
              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >
              >
              >



              --
              Craig Bogun


              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • Paul Grosse
              Yes it will modify the previously existing skill to be Usableuntrained:No by any character that doesn t have MyFeat, once a character takes MyFeat the skill
              Message 6 of 15 , Oct 12, 2006
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                Yes it will modify the previously existing skill to be
                Usableuntrained:No by any character that doesn't have MyFeat, once a
                character takes MyFeat the skill will be marked as untrained and make it
                a class skill so that you can at ranks at 1:1.

                You would create a custom mod set for your campaign read the docs in the
                doc folder and use the sample set included in the data folder as a base
                for your set (if using 5.11).

                >
                > In what file would I put that? Wouldn't that just MOD the
                > skill at lst load time?
                >
                > On 12/10/06, Paul Grosse <paul.grosse@...> wrote:
                > >
                > > Umm how about this, not totally sure if that will work
                > but it might.?
                > >
                > > MySkill.MOD<tab>USEUNTRAINED:YES|PREFEAT:1,MyFeat
                > >
                > > In the feat.lst file
                > > MyFeat<tab>TYPE:Special<tab>CSKILL:MySkill
                > >
                > >
                > > > -----Original Message-----
                > > > From:
                > > >
                > PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com<PCGenListFileHelp%40yahoogroups.co
                > > > m>
                > > >
                > [mailto:PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com<PCGenListFileHelp%40yahoog
                > > > roups.com>]
                > > On Behalf Of ed ballot
                > > > Sent: Wednesday, October 11, 2006 9:20 AM
                > > > To:
                > > >
                > PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com<PCGenListFileHelp%40yahoogroups.co
                > > > m>
                > > > Subject: Re: [PCGenListFileHelp] Re: Changing a skill from use
                > > > trained to untrained
                > > >
                > > > It works for me in v5.10.1. Here's an quick example that I just
                > > > cooked up that keeps the skill MySkill exclusive until the feat
                > > > MyFeat is taken
                > > >
                > > > In the skill.lst file
                > > > MySkill<tab>KEYSTAT:INT<tab>TYPE:Intelligence<tab>EXCLUSIVE:YES
                > > >
                > > > In the feat.lst file
                > > > MyFeat<tab>TYPE:Special<tab>CSKILL:MySkill
                > > >
                > > > Caveat: no classes can have MySkill in their skill list
                > since that
                > > > defeats the purpose of EXCLUSIVE.
                > > >
                > > >
                > > >
                > > > On 10/11/06, Craig Bogun
                > > > <craig.bogun@...<craig.bogun%40gmail.com>>
                > > wrote:
                > > > >
                > > > > Oh well thats a shame. Can anyone tell me if they have
                > > > had success
                > > > > with the EXCLUSIVE tag? I can't seem to get it to work as
                > > > advertised.
                > > > >
                > > > > On 11/10/06, Andrew Maitland
                > > > > <drew0500@...<drew0500%40yahoo.com>
                > > > > <drew0500%40yahoo.com>>
                > > > > wrote:
                > > > > >
                > > > > > The only way I can think to do it:
                > > > > >
                > > > > > Take your skill and copy it using a similar name.
                > Then, use the
                > > > > > EXCLUSIVE:YES and then make the USEUNTRAINED what you
                > > > want. Then use
                > > > > > either a template or feat that makes the Skill either a
                > > > cross class
                > > > > > or class skill.
                > > > > >
                > > > > > I can't think of any other way to make what you want to work.
                > > > > >
                > > > > > Andrew
                > > > > >
                > > > > > Craig Bogun wrote:
                > > > > > >
                > > > > > > As far as I can tell EXCLUSIVE doesn't work. I don't
                > > > know if this
                > > > > > > is a
                > > > > > bug
                > > > > > > with this version or not as I have only been using
                > PCGen for a
                > > > > > > short
                > > > > > time,
                > > > > > > ie This version.
                > > > > > > Setting it up like that still allows the selecting of
                > > > the skill as
                > > > > cross
                > > > > > > class which I don't want. I did put in a PREFEAT on the
                > > > skills but
                > > > > this
                > > > > > > still doesn't get the result I want.
                > > > > > > This is a d20 Modern variant by the way if that helps.
                > > > It's meant
                > > > > > > to work a little like "Jack of all trades" feat for the
                > > > > > > trained only to
                > > > > untrained
                > > > > > > switching, but looking at the code for that feat it
                > > > looks like it
                > > > > wasn't
                > > > > > > implemented.
                > > > > > >
                > > > > > > Anyother ideas
                > > > > > >
                > > > > > > On 11/10/06, ed ballot <eballot@...
                > > > > > > <eballot%40gmail.com>
                > > > > > > <eballot%40gmail.com><eballot%40gmail.com>
                > > > > > > <mailto:eballot% <eballot%25> <eballot%25>
                > > > > > > <eballot%25>40gmail.com>>
                > > wrote:
                > > > > > > >
                > > > > > > > I think .MOD is a static change which cannot be used to
                > > > > > > > dynamically change skills or other objects.
                > > > > > > >
                > > > > > > > One thing you might try is make the skill
                > EXCLUSIVE and only
                > > > > > > > become
                > > > > a
                > > > > > > > class
                > > > > > > > skill by selecting the feat (see CSKILL tag). In
                > > > theory you can
                > > > > > > > only select exclusive skills if they are are
                > class skill for
                > > > > > > > you.
                > > > > > > >
                > > > > > > > Ed
                > > > > > > >
                > > > > > > > On 10/10/06, craig_bogun
                > > > > > > > <craig.bogun@...
                > > > > > > > <craig.bogun%40gmail.com><craig.bogun%
                > > 40gmail.com>
                > > > > <craig.bogun%40gmail.com>
                > > > > > > <mailto:craig.bogun%40gmail.com> <craig.bogun%40gmail.com>>
                > > > > > > > wrote:
                > > > > > > > >
                > > > > > > > > No ideas? Is it possible to MOD a skill in a
                > > > template? What I
                > > > > really
                > > > > > > > > wish to do is make the skill univalable untill
                > the FEAT is
                > > > > > > > > taken,
                > > > > is
                > > > > > > > > that possible?
                > > > > > > > > This is all for a home grown Psionic system that
                > > > uses skills
                > > > > > > > > and
                > > > > > feats
                > > > > > > > > to run the powers.
                > > > > > > > >
                > > > > > > > > Anyone?
                > > > > > > > >
                > > > > > > > > --- In
                > > > > > > > >
                > > > PCGenListFileHelp@yahoogroups.com
                > > > <PCGenListFileHelp%40yahoogroups.com>
                > > <PCGenListFileHelp%40yahoogro
                > > > > > > > > ups.com>
                > > > > <PCGenListFileHelp%40yahoogroups.com>
                > > > > > > <mailto:PCGenListFileHelp%40yahoogroups.com
                > > > > > ><PCGenListFileHelp%40yahoogroups.com>
                > > > > > > > <PCGenListFileHelp%40yahoogroups.com>,
                > > > > > > > > "craig_bogun"
                > > > > > > > > <craig.bogun@...> wrote:
                > > > > > > > > >
                > > > > > > > > > I wish to code a feat that adds a skill as a
                > > > class skill and
                > > > > > changes
                > > > > > > > > > it from only used trained to use untrained?
                > > > > > > > > >
                > > > > > > > > > Any help would be much appreciated.
                > > > > > > > > >
                > > > > > > > > > Craig
                > > > > > > > > >
                > > > > > > > >
                > > > > > > > >
                > > > > > > > >
                > > > > > > >
                > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                > > > > > > >
                > > > > > > >
                > > > > > > >
                > > > > > >
                > > > > > > --
                > > > > > > Craig Bogun
                > > > > > >
                > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                > > > > > >
                > > > > > >
                > > > > >
                > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                > > > > >
                > > > > >
                > > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > > --
                > > > > Craig Bogun
                > > > >
                > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > >
                > > >
                > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                > > >
                > > >
                > > >
                > > >
                > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                > > >
                > > >
                > > >
                > > >
                > > >
                > > >
                > > >
                > > >
                > > >
                > > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                >
                >
                >
                > --
                > Craig Bogun
                >
                >
                > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                >
                >
                >
                >
                > Yahoo! Groups Links
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
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