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YEC nonsense on the Carbon-14 "dating" of diamonds!

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  • Todd S. Greene
    Young earth creationists have produced a new pseudoscience argument in geology, where they claim that using C14 dating of diamonds (since there is a detectable
    Message 1 of 3 , Oct 17, 2007
      Young earth creationists have produced a new pseudoscience argument
      in geology, where they claim that using C14 dating of diamonds (since
      there is a detectable measurement of C14) proves that the earth isn't
      millions and billions of years old. (Note that this discussion also
      applies to the claims of creationists in regard to C14 in coal and
      oil.)

      In typical young earth creationist form, they OMIT relevant
      information (plus, they never bother to even try to publish
      their "research" in any professional science journal of geology or
      geoscience - when young earth creationist pretend they're legitimate
      scientists, they're just lying).

      Here's the part that's (relatively) common knowledge: Carbon-14 (the
      radioactive carbon isotope) is produced by radiation (cosmic rays)
      against Nitrogen-14. A very small fraction of N14 atoms are
      transformed into C14.

      Here's the part that's not so well known, but that scientists
      (geophysicists and physicists) working in this particular area of
      study are well aware of, that the creationists are NOT telling you
      (and that would cause creationists trying to submit articles to
      professional journals of geology or geophysics to be shot on sight
      for being such ignorant numbskulls about the very area of study that
      they're dicussing): C14 is ALSO produced in the ground by the
      radioactive decay of uranium and thorium.

      See:
      Excess carbon-14 abundances in uranium ores: Possible evidence for
      emission from uranium-series isotopes
      by D. Barker, A. J. T. Jull, and D. J. Donahue
      (Geophysical Research Letters, Volume 12, Issue 10, p. 737-740 [1985])
      http://adsabs.harvard.edu/abs/1985GeoRL..12..737B

      Carbon-14 Abundances in Uranium Ores and Possible Spontaneous Exotic
      Emission from U-Series Nuclides
      by A. J. T. Jull, D. Barker, and D. J. Donahue
      (Meteoritics, Vol. 20, p.676 [Dec. 1985])
      http://adsabs.harvard.edu/abs/1985Metic..20..676J

      14C in uranium and thorium minerals: a signature of cluster
      radioactivity?
      by R. Bonetti, et al
      (European Physical Journal A, Vol. 5, No. 2, 235-238 [Jun. 1999])

      Carbon-14 in Coal Deposits
      by Kathleen Hunt
      http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/c14.html

      Also:
      Creationist Claim CD011.6: C14 date of old oil
      http://www.talkorigins.org/indexcc/CD/CD011_6.html

      So notice the typical young earth creationist pattern. Because of
      their ignorance of the relevant science, they develop a new young
      earth creationist argument that's ALREADY EXPLAINED AND KNOWN TO BE
      WRONG BEFORE THEY EVEN MADE IT UP.

      - Todd Greene

      (P.S.: My digging up this information was prompted by a young earth
      creationist presenting this argument to me on the YouTube site a few
      hours ago. Note that this proves how anyone with half a brain and
      using the information resource access provided by the wonderful
      invention called the "internet," a person can find out very quickly
      how silly a lot of these creationist arguments are.)
    • Leasia Korbel
      A scientist who is also labeled a creationist usually isn t allowed to publish anything in a *science journal* that goes against general accepted theory...
      Message 2 of 3 , Oct 17, 2007
        A scientist who is also labeled a "creationist" usually isn't allowed to
        publish anything in a *science journal* that goes against general
        accepted theory...

        Maybe you can help clear up a mystery for me...I was watching a KIDS
        program, where one of the characters made a comment about how this is
        the THIRD set of Rocky Mountains because they've been leveled and raised
        THREE TIMES... It seems to be right up your alley... Thanks!


        --- In OriginsTalk@yahoogroups.com, "Todd S. Greene" <greeneto@...>
        wrote:
        >
        > Young earth creationists have produced a new pseudoscience argument
        > in geology, where they claim that using C14 dating of diamonds (since
        > there is a detectable measurement of C14) proves that the earth isn't
        > millions and billions of years old. (Note that this discussion also
        > applies to the claims of creationists in regard to C14 in coal and
        > oil.)
        >
        > In typical young earth creationist form, they OMIT relevant
        > information (plus, they never bother to even try to publish
        > their "research" in any professional science journal of geology or
        > geoscience - when young earth creationist pretend they're legitimate
        > scientists, they're just lying).
        >
        > Here's the part that's (relatively) common knowledge: Carbon-14 (the
        > radioactive carbon isotope) is produced by radiation (cosmic rays)
        > against Nitrogen-14. A very small fraction of N14 atoms are
        > transformed into C14.
        >
        > Here's the part that's not so well known, but that scientists
        > (geophysicists and physicists) working in this particular area of
        > study are well aware of, that the creationists are NOT telling you
        > (and that would cause creationists trying to submit articles to
        > professional journals of geology or geophysics to be shot on sight
        > for being such ignorant numbskulls about the very area of study that
        > they're dicussing): C14 is ALSO produced in the ground by the
        > radioactive decay of uranium and thorium.
        >
        > See:
        > Excess carbon-14 abundances in uranium ores: Possible evidence for
        > emission from uranium-series isotopes
        > by D. Barker, A. J. T. Jull, and D. J. Donahue
        > (Geophysical Research Letters, Volume 12, Issue 10, p. 737-740 [1985])
        > http://adsabs.harvard.edu/abs/1985GeoRL..12..737B
        >
        > Carbon-14 Abundances in Uranium Ores and Possible Spontaneous Exotic
        > Emission from U-Series Nuclides
        > by A. J. T. Jull, D. Barker, and D. J. Donahue
        > (Meteoritics, Vol. 20, p.676 [Dec. 1985])
        > http://adsabs.harvard.edu/abs/1985Metic..20..676J
        >
        > 14C in uranium and thorium minerals: a signature of cluster
        > radioactivity?
        > by R. Bonetti, et al
        > (European Physical Journal A, Vol. 5, No. 2, 235-238 [Jun. 1999])
        >
        > Carbon-14 in Coal Deposits
        > by Kathleen Hunt
        > http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/c14.html
        >
        > Also:
        > Creationist Claim CD011.6: C14 date of old oil
        > http://www.talkorigins.org/indexcc/CD/CD011_6.html
        >
        > So notice the typical young earth creationist pattern. Because of
        > their ignorance of the relevant science, they develop a new young
        > earth creationist argument that's ALREADY EXPLAINED AND KNOWN TO BE
        > WRONG BEFORE THEY EVEN MADE IT UP.
        >
        > - Todd Greene
        >
        > (P.S.: My digging up this information was prompted by a young earth
        > creationist presenting this argument to me on the YouTube site a few
        > hours ago. Note that this proves how anyone with half a brain and
        > using the information resource access provided by the wonderful
        > invention called the "internet," a person can find out very quickly
        > how silly a lot of these creationist arguments are.)
        >
      • Alan-
        ... Now where did you get that lie, Todd? ... Ahaha. The plot thickens. Of course you ve got to assume the Creationists didn t know this or hid it?!With more
        Message 3 of 3 , Oct 18, 2007
          > when young earth creationist pretend they're legitimate scientists,
          > they're just lying).
          Now where did you get that lie, Todd?

          But here's the good part:
          > Here's the part that's (relatively) common knowledge: Carbon-14 (the
          > radioactive carbon isotope) is produced by radiation (cosmic rays)
          > against Nitrogen-14
          Ahaha. The plot thickens. Of course you've got to assume the
          Creationists didn't know this or hid it?!With more degrees than you!

          > Here's the part that's not so well known, but that scientists
          > (geophysicists and physicists) working in this particular area of
          > study are well aware of, that the creationists are NOT telling you
          > (and that would cause creationists trying to submit articles to
          > professional journals of geology or geophysics to be shot on sight for
          > being such ignorant numbskulls about the very area of study that
          > they're dicussing): C14 is ALSO produced in the ground by the
          > radioactive decay of uranium and thorium.
          So what else are the "geophysicists and physicists" hiding, according to
          you?

          So since we have Carbon-14 in diamonds, here they come. No problem. Now
          they take the covers up. It's cosmic rays that make it, it's ALSO
          produced by decay of uranium and thorium, excess carbon-14 in uranium
          ores, coal deposits. NOW they tell us, and pretend they've been telling
          it all along!

          Not so smooth anymore. Hey there was one evolutionist who took the
          covers off a few more stories about carbon-14. The director of one of
          the three labs that announced the "results" about the Shroud who
          measured his aunt's scarf to be from the future!

          Those labs shared a conference call before announcing anything, in
          violation of contract and in violation of every decent science methodology.

          --Alan
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