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"Many planners also don't support BRT because they fear that HOVs, hybrids, and everything else . . ."

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  • Eric Britton
    Eric Bruun reminds us: Many planners also don t support BRT because they fear that HOVs, hybrids, and everything else will be allowed in.. . . Well yes, And
    Message 1 of 4 , Aug 1, 2006

      Eric Bruun reminds us: "Many planners also don't support BRT because they fear that HOVs, hybrids, and everything else will be allowed in.. . ."

       

      Well yes, And once again they are right and wrong (what is it about our planner friends?):

       

      1. The important thing in these set-aside lanes is that they are adequately and visibly used. Critical or otherwise the screamers and howlers will get a public consensus on closing them down because they are better used by SO cars.

      2. The BRT lanes in Paris are congenially and visibly used by buses, taxis, cyclists and emergency vehicles. They are most notably not used by cars or tourist coaches (brrrh!).  Now you may want to argue about the taxis but the fact is that things move smoothly and the lanes are nicely used without crating congestion problems of their own.  (It is so agreeable to be in a bus or on a bike and sail past all those stalled farting (sorry!) cars.) Also, BTW, as a helmeted city cyclist  I (and most others) feel a lot safer working in an environment where the lanes are larger and we are sharing the space with trained professional drivers. (Most motorists do now know how to handle bike traffic. They simply are not trained to look for us and when they see us behave appropriately).

      3. Whether or not you let in hybrids, that is your choice, but I for one do not see any overwhelming logic to it, especially since those of us who are following it are rapidly getting the message on the real impact of this yuppie form of think-good transport.

      4. HOVs. You bet! But this is my view and it requires real thought and strategic implementation (and enforcement).

       

      It would be a shame to let this thread go, since it is in my view critical to the transportation rehab that is now so very badly needed in our cities. And indeed, we have been getting so many communications and questions on this, that we are now considering moving up our Vol. 1, No. 2 item on the New Mobility Advisory/Briefs (project opens today by the way, you will be hearing about it later) –and switching from the planned Brief on Congestion Charging (et al) and getting right into the guts of the more universal and timely issues of BRT and reserved lanes. Your thoughts on this?

       

      ericbritton

    • Lee Schipper
      Eric put it right about rail to the Dulles airport. AS to the rail vs bus comparison, its sad how image means spending 5-10 times more money. Typical good bus
      Message 2 of 4 , Aug 1, 2006
        Eric put it right about rail to the Dulles airport.
        AS to the rail vs bus comparison, its sad how image means spending 5-10
        times more money. Typical good bus lanes in Latin America carry 10-15
        THOUSANd people per hour -- by contranst
        the "Circulator", a new roughly east-west bus in Washington, seems to
        carry a few hundred people per hour and is stuck in traffic all the way.
        No wonder people don't believe in buses.

        Do they believe in their wallets?

        Note that in QUito Ecuador authorities have now permitted ordinary
        traffic to use the previously bus-only late in an apparent attempt to
        undermine the functionality of the bus corridor.

        It's too bad there is a battle between rail and buses. WE need both,
        distributed in a way that is cost effective. Buses stuck in traffic are
        not cost effective, nor is very expensive metro that flies
        along--empty.


        >>> ericbruun@... 07/31/06 4:46 PM >>>
        Lee

        Have they succeed in getting money yet for rail for DC proper? If so, I
        think it is an
        easier sell to take lanes for LRT in the middle of the road than for
        BRT. People
        can't imagine that the bus service would be really good and don't
        imagine using it themselves. Many planners also
        don't support BRT because they fear that HOVs, hybrids, and everything
        else
        will be allowed in.

        I certainly agree that a rail line to Dulles Airport is ridiculously
        low priority given
        how long the line would have to be and the almost total gridlock of
        much of the region. But don't forget it is in the powerful Frank Wolf's
        district, it would serve a lot of powerful corporate interests, Congress
        members, and so on.

        Eric


        -----Original Message-----
        >From: Lee Schipper <SCHIPPER@...>
        >Sent: Jul 31, 2006 2:14 PM
        >To: 'Richard Bradley' <delores@...>, 'Ellen Jones'
        <ellen@...>, eric.britton@...
        >Cc: NewMobilityCafe@yahoogroups.com
        >Subject: [NewMobilityCafe] Washington DC "Mass" Transit?
        >
        >The really said thing about the DC idea is that the city seems to be
        >able to spend many many times more for trams than it need spend
        >but can't spent for real busways. And today it was noted in the press
        >that the Region is about to spend 2-3 billion dollars to get our
        Metro
        >to the Distant Dulles airport..from Tyson's corner, as well as from
        >where the metro is today (in the middle of the I-66 motorway) to
        >Tyson's.
        >
        >If I recall its about 3km from the nearest station westward to
        tyson's
        >corne, and another 20km approx from Tyson's corner to the Airport. At
        >issue is whether the metro should go under
        >or over Tyson's, the huge shopping area made famous in Joel Garreau's
        >"Edge Cities". Heaven forbid the metro should actually go surface
        >through Tyson's and take
        >space from cars! Even more heaven forbid that the connection to the
        >airport be a BRT using the existing empty center of the motorway to
        the
        >airport, as well as some
        >of that great shock-and-awe engineering we're so good at to connect
        the
        >nearest metro to Tyson's and then the motorway. Why spend a few
        hundred
        >millions of OPM (other people's money) when you can spend thousands
        of
        >millions!
        >
        >I'm not trying to be anti mass transit, only wondering why again we
        >continually push aside cost effective approaches in favor of very
        >expensive ones?
        >
        >>>> eric.britton@... 7/31/2006 1:36:49 PM >>>
        >Rich Bradley and Ellen Jones of the Downtown Business Improvement
        >District of
        >Washington DC have asked about the "center lane busways that had the
        >waiting
        >area in the middle, with bus traffic going along each side" that are
        >being
        >crated and extended here in Paris. Here are a couple of references
        that
        >may
        >interest other of you as well. (In the language we speak over here,
        but
        >there
        >are plenty of images for those who don't but are still curious:
        >
        >
        >
        >1. The name in French is Mobilien (an invented word). The home
        >page is at
        >http://www.v2asp.paris.fr/v2/Deplacements/mobilien/default.asp
        >
        >
        >
        >2. You can see a map identifying all 17 existing lines at
        >http://www.v2asp.paris.fr/v2/Deplacements/mobilien/carte.asp
        >
        >
        >
        >3. For a selection of photos:
        >http://www.v2asp.paris.fr/v2/Deplacements/mobilien/Galerie_photos.asp#

        >
        >
        >
        >
        >4. Some user interviews:
        >http://www.v2asp.paris.fr/v2/Deplacements/mobilien/default.asp
        >
        >
        >
        >5. Some pictures showing Line 91 which more or less runs right
        >around the
        >corner here connecting three major rail stations, etc.. Portions of
        it
        >are run
        >in the middle two lanes with rather nice treatments of the boarding,
        >access
        >arrangements. The others more conventionally in the side lanes.
        Suffice
        >it to
        >say that the central lanes are where in our view the action is, both
        >for Paris
        >and other cities.
        >
        >
        >
        >o
        >http://www.v2asp.paris.fr/v2/Deplacements/mobilien/Ligne_91/ligne91_amenagements

        >
        >.asp
        >
        >
        >
        >One day I will have to get out there and shoot some of the key points
        >so that
        >you will have a batter idea.
        >
        >
        >
        >Unless someone can point us to something already available on this.
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >Check in here via the homepage at http://www.newmobility.org
        >To post message to group: NewMobilityCafe@yahoogroups.com
        >Please think twice before posting to the group as a whole
        >(It might be that your note is best sent to one person?)
        >
        >
        >
        >
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        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >






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