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green transport hierarchy

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  • Simon Norton
    Moved over from World Transport Forum: From: Simon Norton Date: Tue May 30, 2006 6:44pm Subject: green transport hierarchy I
    Message 1 of 7 , May 31, 2006
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      Moved over from World Transport Forum:

       

      From: Simon Norton <S.Norton@...>
      Date: Tue May 30, 2006 6:44pm
      Subject: green transport hierarchy

       

       

      I generally agree with Dave's comments, so let me clarify by saying that "small
      vehicles can only be assumed to be an advantage over large ones if the number
      of passengers [per vehicle] is kept constant".
       
      The advantage of higher frequency may not always be applicable. For example,
      consider coaches which take passengers from a rail station to a popular event
      starting at a specific time; it's clearly best to use fewer, larger buses.

       

    • Simon Norton
      Michael Yeates refers to people who argue that more passengers means more subsidies. Where do they get their brains from ? The main reason why subsidies came
      Message 2 of 7 , May 31, 2006
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        Michael Yeates refers to people who argue that more passengers means more
        subsidies. Where do they get their brains from ? The main reason why subsidies
        came to be needed in the first place is that (especially off peak) passengers
        were abstracted away by cars. Conversely, I would imagine that the greatest
        potential to capture new passengers was off peak where the existing modal share
        of the car is greatest.

        Another factor is that in times of congestion the transfer of passengers from
        cars to buses can create new capacity on the latter because if vehicles are
        going faster they can do more round trips in the same time and for the same
        cost.

        Michael also says that people can cycle 4-5 times faster than walking for the
        same effort. As a one time cyclist I never managed more than a factor of 2. I
        dare say a top quality bike might have made a difference, but many people
        wouldn't want to use them for everyday cycling because of the danger of theft.

        Simon Norton
      • Rory McMullan
        http://www.taipeitimes.com/News/front/archives/2006/06/01/2003311083 By Jimmy Chuang STAFF REPORTER Thursday, Jun 01, 2006 Taiwan is planning to construct
        Message 3 of 7 , Jun 2, 2006
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          By Jimmy Chuang
          STAFF REPORTER
          Thursday, Jun 01, 2006
           
          Taiwan is planning to construct 2,600km of bicycle lanes by 2011 to help promote the use of bicycles rather than motor vehicles.
           
          "The idea is to help save energy, protect the environment and promote the idea of riding bicycles. However, we want to avoid potential waste at the same time as well," Premier Su Tseng-chang (Ĭ­s©÷) said.
           
          Su said that the Cabinet's plan was to build bicycle-only lanes nationwide, and also to amend related traffic rules so that bicyclists' legal rights can be protected. While constructing the bike lanes, the premier asked officials to avoid wasting money by considering the practicality of the lanes in terms of location and material used for construction.
           
          "You do not want to build a bike lane in a mountain area where bicyclists would not even visit. You do not want to cut down a lot of trees or pave over those spaces that used to be grass just to build a fancy bike track," Su said.
           
          In the meantime, Su said that he was also concerned about the fact that, although the sale of sport utility vehicles (SUV) was decreasing worldwide, the sale of SUVs in Taiwan was growing steadily. He said that since SUVs guzzle more gas, they were anathema to energy conservation efforts.
           
          "We will ask the Ministry of Transportation and Communications to do something about it. Maybe we should control the number of SUVs by raising applicable taxes. Anyway, we will do whatever it takes to protect Taiwan's natural environment," Su said.
           
          In the 1990s, the Taipei City Government built the city's first bicycle lane on Dunhua N Road. The lane began in front of Songshan Domestic Airport, and ended at Dunhua N Road and Renai Road.

          Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

        • Anzir Boodoo
          Simon, ... Total agreement, supported (in the UK) by: Stagecoach Buses, who have proposed to government a Kickstart funding mechanism whereby government
          Message 4 of 7 , Jun 4, 2006
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            Simon,
            On 31 May 2006, at 21:23, Simon Norton wrote:

            > Michael Yeates refers to people who argue that more passengers
            > means more
            > subsidies. Where do they get their brains from ? The main reason
            > why subsidies
            > came to be needed in the first place is that (especially off peak)
            > passengers
            > were abstracted away by cars. Conversely, I would imagine that the
            > greatest
            > potential to capture new passengers was off peak where the existing
            > modal share
            > of the car is greatest.

            Total agreement, supported (in the UK) by:

            Stagecoach Buses, who have proposed to government a "Kickstart"
            funding mechanism whereby government funds a major service
            improvement on a lossmaking (but potentially profitable) bus route
            instead of subsidising it. The operator improves the route and
            frequency, or pays for priority measures or park & ride, and after 3
            years the route has to stand on its own two feet financially. How?
            Because more passengers means less subsidy per passenger, and
            eventually you get into profit. Kickstarts would be of the order of
            GBP 200,000 to GBP 1,000,000 (a typical bus costs GBP 100,000)

            the rail industry. Some commuter lines in South East England (serving
            London) have gone from being lossmaking to profitmaking in the last
            few years as London's growth has fuelled commuting. In major cities
            outside London, there is a perception that rail is heavily lossmaking
            and there are high subsidies per passenger. While these are in the
            order of GBP 0.20 - 0.30 per passenger, in the West Midlands they are
            around GBP 0.05 per passenger. Why? Because the trains are more full.
            They also run longer trains at a higher frequency than many other
            urban areas.

            Harrogate & District buses (north of Leeds) concluded that, as they
            served a wealthy area with high car ownership, they had to provide a
            competitive product. So they invested in the most expensive double
            deck buses in the UK, with reclining leather seats, and do not charge
            a premium fare. They aimed to attract the "BMW drivers" who preferred
            to queue on the roads into Leeds. The service is profitable and the
            frequency has had to be increased twice. They also plan later
            journeys to abstract passengers from taxis. The service launch cost
            around GBP 3,000,000 to put together. The bus company is happy, it
            was within their power to deliver in the short term, and car volumes
            in the corridor are down more than 10%

            RULE: More services mean more subsidies, more passengers mean more
            revenue. You try and run more services to get more passengers until
            your subsidies reduce or you go into profit.

            > Another factor is that in times of congestion the transfer of
            > passengers from
            > cars to buses can create new capacity on the latter because if
            > vehicles are
            > going faster they can do more round trips in the same time and for
            > the same
            > cost.

            A lot of this benefit can be got from good bus priority measures.
            More passengers (in the UK, not in some Continental countries like
            Italy) mean more waiting time at stops, which slows the bus down again.

            > Michael also says that people can cycle 4-5 times faster than
            > walking for the
            > same effort. As a one time cyclist I never managed more than a
            > factor of 2. I
            > dare say a top quality bike might have made a difference, but many
            > people
            > wouldn't want to use them for everyday cycling because of the
            > danger of theft.

            That's certainly put me off cycling before. As a traveller, you want
            some security of your ride home. If I plan a journey by bike that has
            no public transport backup (such as riding to a nearby village that
            has no bus service, or staying until after the last bus when it's too
            far to walk), I need to know I can get back...

            --
            Anzir Boodoo MRes MILT Aff. IRO
            transcience, 72 Staplehurst, BRACKNELL RG12 8DD
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