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Re: Pro Patria Mill ?

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  • sanjuangeol1947
    Tere is an unofficial competition between gold refineries. Whe I was living in Perth, Western Australia the Perth Mint was awarded the title for being the only
    Message 1 of 14 , Jan 1, 2008
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      Tere is an unofficial competition between gold refineries. Whe I was
      living in Perth, Western Australia the Perth Mint was awarded the
      title for being the only refinery in the world to consistantly
      achieving .9999 purity.

      In the days of the Pro Patria mill it would have been very difficult
      for refineries to achieve 4 nines (.9999 purity).

      By the way, the Pro Patria, and other mills were only concentrators,
      with an amalgamation circuit for recovering gold, and not refineries.
      They would have produced dore that would have contained small amounts
      of silver and copper (which often gives the dore the "golden" color
      that we often think is "pure" gold). Some of the "purest" gold
      produced in the US (at the Jerritt Canyon mine in Nevada) is often an
      uninspiring light gold color.

      Ted
      sanjuangeol1947
    • Dale Buxton
      In it’s final configuration, the Pro Patria would have to have been well past it’s stamp mill processing days. Stamping and vibrating tables just
      Message 2 of 14 , Jan 1, 2008
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        In it’s final configuration, the Pro Patria would have
        to have been well past it’s stamp mill processing
        days. Stamping and vibrating tables just couldn’t keep
        up with the demand and operating expenses of the
        twenties and thirties.

        I think it should be said here that main reduction
        aims of mills in the San Juan Mining Region, was the
        reduction and concentration of silver/lead and zinc
        ores with minors on gold and other trace elements. At
        the time of the San Juan mining boom, the US Gov. was
        purchasing both gold and silver and in the San Juan’s,
        silver was emanately more exploitable than gold. Now
        while gold is a trace mineral in the San Juan’s, it
        almost never the main ore body exploited. It is almost
        always locked in mineral matrixes called telluride’s
        and to the naked eye, even the largest flecks of gold
        in this stuff, never look even remotely like yellow
        gold.

        Some of the mines in the Rico area were rich in
        another ore called pyrites and while these
        concentrates sometimes look a little more yellow in
        color than silver/lead concentrates, they are more
        easily exploited in the manufacture of sulfuric acid
        than in gold extraction. And for a time these pyrites
        were indeed used to make sulfuric acid at Rico.

        I have vials of concentrated silver ore, raw molly and
        galena lead in front of me at the moment and to the
        naked eye, the materials look virtually
        undifferentiated. They have a color that is very much
        like a pale graphite with a metallic tinge to it.
        With the older stamp milling process, the end
        concentrates always looked like a fine corn-meal
        grained lead powder. As floatation separation became
        the preferred concentration method, the consistency of
        the end product became and even finer grained powder.
        Now, with centrifugal separation the concentrates come
        out like chips with almost no moisture content in them
        at all.

        If there are any questions on these points I can refer
        them to my uncle who has over thirty years of ore
        milling experience with Climax, AMAX and Phelps/Dodge
        and is somewhat of a walking history book on Colorado
        mining.

        Dale Buxton

        --- sanjuangeol1947 <dwilton@...> wrote:

        > Tere is an unofficial competition between gold
        > refineries. Whe I was
        > living in Perth, Western Australia the Perth Mint
        > was awarded the
        > title for being the only refinery in the world to
        > consistantly
        > achieving .9999 purity.
        >
        > In the days of the Pro Patria mill it would have
        > been very difficult
        > for refineries to achieve 4 nines (.9999 purity).
        >
        > By the way, the Pro Patria, and other mills were
        > only concentrators,
        > with an amalgamation circuit for recovering gold,
        > and not refineries.
        > They would have produced dore that would have
        > contained small amounts
        > of silver and copper (which often gives the dore the
        > "golden" color
        > that we often think is "pure" gold). Some of the
        > "purest" gold
        > produced in the US (at the Jerritt Canyon mine in
        > Nevada) is often an
        > uninspiring light gold color.
        >
        > Ted
        > sanjuangeol1947
        >
        >



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      • rlmossholder
        Happy New Year to All, I received my Banta HO Pro Patria mill about a week before Christmas and have been working on it diligently through the holiday season.
        Message 3 of 14 , Jan 2, 2008
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          Happy New Year to All,

          I received my Banta HO Pro Patria mill about a week before Christmas
          and have been working on it diligently through the holiday season. I'm
          just about finished with the main building. I need to install the
          windows, a little siding, and the roof. Then it's on to the truck
          dump, where I am adding a bucket tram house and a 30" gage mine track.
          I will be adding lights and sound to the mill, and animation to the
          bucket tram. I have a good recording for a stamp mill, but the era I
          am modeling post dates stamp mills. Does anyone know of a source for
          good audio recordings of a ball mill?

          I really appreciate all the info that has been given here. I have
          tried to find historical info about the Pro Patria mill but am coming
          up short. I know there was an article in the NG&SLG some years ago and
          there was a book about the RGS which mentions the mill briefly but
          that's about all.

          I am not modeling the RGS or Colorado, rather, Northern California in
          the late 1920's. My railroad is freelanced and this mill will be one
          of the major generators of revenue for my 3' gage railroad "The
          Trinity & Pacific". This follows the Trinity River in N. California
          along what is now Hwy 299. There was never a railroad, but it had a
          brief gold rush in the mid 1800's along the Trinity River and New
          River. There were a lot of timber operations as well. My railroad is
          focused around these two industries. The mining is based on a
          fictional second gold rush along the Trinity River with the discovery
          of the Holy Trinity Strike in 1908. I have determined the output of
          the Holy Trinity Mill will be about 3-5 boxcars per week and shipped
          to a refinery for further processing. The mill will be fed from a 30"
          gage mining railroad and a bucket tram. The power for the mill will be
          supplied from a Pelton-wheel-type hydro-electric power station. All
          supplies for the mine and mill will be brought in by rail to the mill
          and transferred accordingly.

          When I finish the mill I will post some photos of it if anyone is
          interested.

          I hope you all have a happy and prosperous New Year.
          Rich M.
        • Rick Neet
          Hi Rich, That s an interesting concept you re working on. I ve traveled the 299 Hwy numerous times in the last 25 years on business and have always enjoyed it.
          Message 4 of 14 , Jan 2, 2008
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            Hi Rich,

            That's an interesting concept you're working on. I've traveled the 299 Hwy numerous
            times in the last 25 years on business and have always enjoyed it. Quite scenic,
            just don't be in a hurry.

            From my personal experience in visiting modern ball mills they basically emit
            just a continuous "machinery roar". Any low toned "growling" machinery recording
            could suffice for a ball mill although that might be rather boring to any guests. The
            stamp mill recording might lend more interest to the conversation with a visitor.
            As for authenticity, 1) the Bully Choop Mine had 30 stamps and was about 15 miles
            southeast of Weaverville, and 2) it's your railroad and freelance at that so you can do
            whatever you please. {;^)

            The best books I've seen with information on the Pro Patria mill are Sundance
            Publishing's series on the Rio Grande Southern. Volume V and VI have numerous
            references to the mill with a number of different photos.

            Good luck with your project.

            Rick Neet


            ----- Original Message -----
            From: rlmossholder
            To: NGMMG@yahoogroups.com
            Sent: Wednesday, January 02, 2008 9:18 AM
            Subject: [NGMMG] Re: Pro Patria Mill ?


            Happy New Year to All,

            I received my Banta HO Pro Patria mill about a week before Christmas
            and have been working on it diligently through the holiday season. I'm
            just about finished with the main building. I need to install the
            windows, a little siding, and the roof. Then it's on to the truck
            dump, where I am adding a bucket tram house and a 30" gage mine track.
            I will be adding lights and sound to the mill, and animation to the
            bucket tram. I have a good recording for a stamp mill, but the era I
            am modeling post dates stamp mills. Does anyone know of a source for
            good audio recordings of a ball mill?

            I really appreciate all the info that has been given here. I have
            tried to find historical info about the Pro Patria mill but am coming
            up short. I know there was an article in the NG&SLG some years ago and
            there was a book about the RGS which mentions the mill briefly but
            that's about all.

            I am not modeling the RGS or Colorado, rather, Northern California in
            the late 1920's. My railroad is freelanced and this mill will be one
            of the major generators of revenue for my 3' gage railroad "The
            Trinity & Pacific". This follows the Trinity River in N. California
            along what is now Hwy 299. There was never a railroad, but it had a
            brief gold rush in the mid 1800's along the Trinity River and New
            River. There were a lot of timber operations as well. My railroad is
            focused around these two industries. The mining is based on a
            fictional second gold rush along the Trinity River with the discovery
            of the Holy Trinity Strike in 1908. I have determined the output of
            the Holy Trinity Mill will be about 3-5 boxcars per week and shipped
            to a refinery for further processing. The mill will be fed from a 30"
            gage mining railroad and a bucket tram. The power for the mill will be
            supplied from a Pelton-wheel-type hydro-electric power station. All
            supplies for the mine and mill will be brought in by rail to the mill
            and transferred accordingly.

            When I finish the mill I will post some photos of it if anyone is
            interested.

            I hope you all have a happy and prosperous New Year.
            Rich M.








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          • Ken Clark
            Rich Looking forward to some photos of the Pro Patria Mill. Generally speaking from visit s to a couple of operating mills, you can not hear much noise outside
            Message 5 of 14 , Jan 3, 2008
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              Rich

              Looking forward to some photos of the Pro Patria Mill.
              Generally speaking from visit's to a couple of operating
              mills, you can not hear much noise outside the mill building.
              A Rod or Ball mill has a low rumble, noisy it is running
              empty, quiet too full.
              Photo section "Ore Processing" & "Sandon BC" have ore
              circuits for various time periods & size's of mills. The
              Sandon ones are for Silver/Lead/Zinc recovery.

              As a side note, I have accumlated a fair bit of info/photos
              & plans for the Hydro system which was built by the
              Silversmith Mining Group in Sandon for their mill- some photos
              in Sandon Photos.

              Ken
              GWN


              --- In NGMMG@yahoogroups.com, "rlmossholder" <rlmossholder@...> wrote:
              >
              > Happy New Year to All,
              >
              > I received my Banta HO Pro Patria mill about a week before
              Christmas
              > and have been working on it diligently through the holiday season.
              I'm
              > just about finished with the main building. I need to install the
              > windows, a little siding, and the roof. Then it's on to the truck
              > dump, where I am adding a bucket tram house and a 30" gage mine
              track.
              > I will be adding lights and sound to the mill, and animation to the
              > bucket tram. I have a good recording for a stamp mill, but the era I
              > am modeling post dates stamp mills. Does anyone know of a source for
              > good audio recordings of a ball mill?
              >

              The power for the mill will be supplied from a Pelton-wheel
              -type hydro-electric power station. All supplies for the
              mine and mill will be brought in by rail to the mill and
              transferred accordingly.
              >
              > When I finish the mill I will post some photos of it if anyone is
              > interested.
              >
              > I hope you all have a happy and prosperous New Year.
              > Rich M.
              >
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