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01/21/02 Monday

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  • Gloria Lee
    ******************** attachment is email of Jan s poem with picture ******************** GENE POOLE Ed: Re: Parsing (some questions) NDS Hi Ed, ... In short,
    Message 1 of 1 , Jan 22, 2002
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      attachment is email of Jan's poem with picture
       
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      GENE POOLE
      Ed: Re: Parsing (some questions)

      NDS

      Hi Ed,

      You asked:
      >
      >Hi
      Gene,
      >
      >Some questions have come up pertaining to your
      recent
      >posts.
      >
      >Are peers, as you deÞne them, equivalent to
      particles with
      >regard to the issue of separateness?

      In short, no. More on this at the end of this posting.

      >If peers are not equivalent
      to particles what do you think
      >would activate their communication with
      each other?

      Basically, willingness to come out and say something.

      >If peers are equivalent to particles, is not the fact
      of
      >perceived separation an underlying motivation for
      their
      >communication?

      Well, if you are implying that people communicate only
      because of perceived separateness, I would disagree.

      >The admission by peers that separateness was
      sensed
      >between them would support the idea that
      their
      >communication would beneÞt by more forthright discussion
      >of
      actual everyday experience.

      Yes, this seems to be a true statement, and is close to
      what I was saying, and how I actually feel.

      >Wondering
      if this and/or something else is what you are
      >suggesting?
      >
      >Ed

      Ed, thanks for asking.

      What is 'really going on' may be more pleasing to know,
      and more fantastic, than can easily be imagined.

      Consider that 'all of us' are vital factors of a very
      important, and evolving, conversation.

      This conversation is taking place not between
      particles, but between factors of what is essentially
      'one thing'. It is the nature of the conversation, to
      reflect the growing and evolving nature of this 'one
      thing'. Strange as it may seem, it is alive, living
      conversation between alive and living Beings, which
      allows refinement of this 'one thing'.

      'One thing' holding many conversations within itself;
      how many 'languages' are there, expressing right now?
      Are we to treat only words as language, or does language
      also encompass DNA, species mutation, and even the
      weather?

      Make no mistake; I am proposing, or stating, that our
      conversation is a process of refinement, deliberately
      conducted by 'one thing' for the expression and even
      exaltation of the nature of the 'one thing'.

      Whether we feel that there really are particles or not,
      is not really an issue. The issue is for us humans, to
      continue the game.

      Know it or not, those who seek finality, those who seek
      or think they have found final conclusions, have concluded
      wrongly. The point is to continue, not to stop.

      So those who advocate cessation as 'answer', show that
      they do not comprehend that the 'question' actually mutates
      continually, and that continuing conversation tracks and follows
      these mutations.

      This continuing expression is contributing to our evolution,
      for better or worse. Remember Jerry's advocacy of
      conversing for the sheer joy of expounding?

      Our conversation is considered by some to be an important
      exercise in 'problem solving'; some of these, consider that
      the answers are already known, and need merely to be
      assimilated, understood, and applied, to solve certain problems.

      While it may seem that refinement is indeed problem
      solving, we have seen and know, that the processes of
      thinking and expressing are considered to be 'problems'
      in and of themselves, and that some people are of the
      opinion that such processes should be quenched, avoided,
      or stifled, for a 'higher purpose'.

      I am proposing, or stating, that our conversation is
      an expression of the 'one thing'. Any individual is free
      to attune, by using the compass of pleasure; trial and
      error are allowed, in the process of refinement. The
      'one thing' apparently wants or needs our refinement,
      and our attunement, for itself. Our birth, and our giving birth,
      may represent the importance which is given to our
      expression, and to the continuation of our ability to express.

      One who tries this, one who allows an inner sense of
      what is harmony, to guide to greater harmony, may
      be contributing more, than is apparent to that one. It
      is not to be found in conformance, adherence, or
      obedience, but in simple freedom, and everyone has
      inherent sense of what is beautiful and pleasant.

      It has taken (it seems) millions of years for us to reach
      this point of possibility; we have mass instant communication;
      we can quickly surpass any known level of group or collective
      intention, organization, and harmony as individuals. It may
      be time to break away from group-think and the assumptions
      that specific beliefs must be shared, for there to be harmony
      among individuals. It may be enough, at last, for individuals
      to have peace within themselves, without the assumption
      that there has to be an overt outer movement.

      In the evolvement that is occurring, it must be allowed for
      individuals to express and to communicate outside of the
      traditional formal ways and means which we usually
      identify with. It may be not only adequate, but preferred,
      to be individuals, 'indivisible one', as is the 'one thing'
      which we all really are, anyway.

      So the issue of particles is a very important one, for
      we are more than a collection of particles conversing;
      we are instead, one thing conversing within itself.

      Somewhere, there is a suggestion about 'making a
      joyful noise'...


      ==Gene Poole==

      CHRISTIANA
      a particle parses a living moment
       
      Words, those familiar parsing tools of 'reality', seem of late to have surrendered their meaning. The comforting ledges of beliefs, ideas and ideals, as well as absence of same, have been leveled. Immersion into This, nudged by grace and duplicity of life. A dimly echoed question remained. How does one, who has danced in words, commune with others without them? Resting for months in this question, what has emerged are the words: pattern, rhythm, texture. Awareness has shifted to a different matrix of information.
       
      I read and have pondered this guidance about listening to Bach: the patterns in this music are more 'horizontal' than 'vertical' and one must listen 'horizontally' to get it.
       
      Tonight three hours of patterns-rhythms-textures danced through me as hundreds of thousands of musical notes. The offering from Garrick Ohlsson's piano genius. A heart-body's memory of one living as the essence of Chopin. Played seamlessly, with the mastery of complexity only a human-in-love can offer. I can not discern if listening was 'horizontal' or 'vertical' or a-directional. What seems so is that communion happened.
       
      The final piece included these terms Andante spianato
       
      Andante: moderately slow --- A movement or passage in a moderate tempo.
      [From Italian andare, to walk.]

      Spianato: smooth, leveled, planed, even, tranquil

      And I am left with a heart smile awareness that it is This, a moderate, slow walk wrought by what has been planed smooth, which offers abiding communion with others.. with or without words, in all directions.

      By the way.. Chopin is often referred to as a "salon composer". Tonight, this is my parsed particle of living heart composition to this salon.

      Christiana, who is grateful to be here amongst you


      ERIC BLACKSTEAD


      Harshaji & Friends,

      Harshaji. Nice to have you back. I hope yours time with your family
      was relaxing and enjoyable. I've been holding off bringing up some
      subjects until you were back with us again.

      The first is a suggestion about HS Magazine. As there are quite a few
      nondualism/spirituality/kundalini magazines presented by various
      related forums, and because all of them seem to have to stretch to
      come up with enough original material every 3 or 4 months, it's
      occured to me that if you (Harsha) got together with Jerry, Gene and
      other interested nondual etc. list owners and editors, you could
      probably put together a dynamic, enjoyable and ORIGINAL magazine as
      often as every 1 or 2 months.

      Wouldn't everybody benefit from this? All the readers would benefit
      from access to much more high quality material in one place, and they
      would get to do it more frequently. Important subjects would inspire
      conversation on a group of related sites relative to one subject at a
      time, thus providing us a broader base and deeper interest from more
      concerned readers. A Common magazine would be an obvious improvement
      on quality from each of the individual mags, and would undoubtedly
      begin to develope a larger audience as word of such a quality
      offering would spread across the web to other forumites with a less
      intense but still evident interest...and of course, quality tends to
      call to and reach towards MORE quality, suggesting we consider the
      logical anomaly...can Nonduality be synergistic?

      Let me add, that with regards to material that might not make the
      cut, but holding genuine relevance for any particular list, it can
      always be included in that list's posting of the Common Big (or
      bigger)Magazine.

      What do you think, Harsha?  What do the rest of you think? I'll post
      this same idea on the rest of the sites that I'm familiar with
      tomorrow or the next day, providing that one or some of you don't
      come up with "a discouraging word" to suggest that nondual subjects
      continue to "range" a little closer to "home".

      yours in the bonds,
      eric


      JOHN METZGER
      We are the clumsy passersby, we push past each other with elbows,
      with feet, with trousers, with suitcases,
      we get off the train, the jet plane, the ship, we step down
      in our wrinkled suits and sinister hats.
      We are all guilty, we are all sinners,
      we come from dead-end hotels or industrial peace,
      this might be our last clean shirt,
      we have misplaced our tie,
      yet even so, on the edge of panic, pompous,
      sons of bitches who move in the highest circles
      or quiet types who don't owe anything to anybody,
      we are one and the same, the same in time's eyes,
      or in solitude's: we are the poor devils
      who earn a living and a death working
      bureautragically or in the usual ways,
      sitting down or packed together in subway stations,
      boats, mines, research centers, jails,
      universities, breweries,
      (under our clothes the same thirsty skin),
      (the hair, the same hair, only in different colors).
             Pablo Neruda
       

       
      Deep stuff lately on the living conversation of 'the one thing'. Offlist in my workaday world with the developmentally disabled, the sophistication of our conversation here is extrapolated 'to include them'. Jerry has been interested in buying me a house daily for the last 8 years, another wants only to converse about my gaining for him a shirt, hat, and gloves with his name, Eddie, on them. Sharon laughs seldom but enjoys the accusation of having 6 fingers on one hand. Jonathon wants only to talk about who let the dogs out. Karl asks if I want to see his penis. Philip can't speak or hear and I can't sign but we have a sign of holding an open hand, thumb against nose, to denote any confusion or craziness that comes up. Etc. They wanted as a group for me to tell you/us that they are definitely interested in the course of what is being said about 'the one thing'. As we are saying to each other, I will say to them, in a manner tailored to each, that the conversation is richer than can be imagined.  Thanks, John  
       

      MARTHA RAMSEY
       
      greetings.

      i am imagining that as awareness and presence grow, gradually words
      become more and more simply embodiments of that silence.  silence (as
      quality not quantity) would enter more and more, both in between and
      during the articulation of each word.  one's speech/writing would appear
      to be becoming more clear and simple, in the words, while what the words
      describe and point to and invite and evoke would be manifested through
      them in greater depth, largeness, and precision.

      daring to speak to this group, into this storm of words for which i am
      very grateful

      love
      martha,
      holding on as tight as i can.



      JERRY KATZ
       
      i like seeing your post next to john metzgers. more activities of the
      street. heard from jody today, saying he'll join us in la jolla.

      anyone else in southern California like to join us for the evening feb.
      16, in la jolla? it'll be casual, perhaps at someone's comfortable
      cottage. christiana, cee, chuck hillig, rudy, jody, myself, ron
      perrymore, thomas murphy, and others will show up as people bring their
      friends. metta zetty might stop in. she's a featured speaker this year.
      write me or christiana if you're interested. you don't have to be
      signed-up for the inner directions gathering to join us.

      jerry
       
      ~~~
      Hi Robert,

      Thank you for your letter. It's really too bad you won't be around when
      we're there feb. 15-17. I'm sure we'll meet another time.

      There will be a retreat in Nova Scotia, October 11-13, 2002. The web
      page telling about it is at <http://nonduality.com/retreat.htm>, in case
      you find yourself in that part of the world.

      I remind readers that you're 21 years old, in the U.S. Navy, and a
      spiritual prodigy who can handle anything thrown at you. We keep trying
      to scare the Landmark graduates, but no luck so far.

      Love,
      Jerry


      DAN BERKOW
      nonduality
       
      Well-said, and well-observed, Jerry.

      The need to maintain the "tour guide" as
        "tour guide" is avoidance of what you
        are terming "void" ...

      Any need to "get rid of tour guides" also
        is a form of avoidance and self-distraction ...

      The "tourguide" is a signpost, and the destination
        is not even the Twilight Zone --
        it's only who you already are, but have confused yourself
        about being.

      The signpost might be read, not only as "nonduality"
        but "the end of your reality."

      So, yes, there is fear, and guides, and
        the end of fear and guides.

      In/as love, and what is beyond love and any
        quality.

      Peace,
      Dan

       

      JERRY
       
      Paul,

      I've already offended all my own gurus and guides, visionary angel men,
      mantras and knowings, religious upbringing, mother and father. When you stand
      alone, that happens. It's their problem, not mine.

      I never meant for you to leave the list. This will sound further offensive,
      and I apologize in advance, but I was referring to leaving your relationship
      with Krishna.

      I don't claim to have advanced knowledge, just to be speaking from where I
      am. I don't know what's right or wrong, what's true and what's not, and don't
      claim to. But I do speak from where I'm at. Forgive me and stay on the list
      if you would like. I'll try to stay out of your way.


      ED AARONS
      parsing/Gene
       
      Gene wrote:
      "One of my disciplines is to dare to say or write what is
      considered impossible to state. I find little use for constant
      reiteration, in conventional language, of the same old
      formulae for 'attainment' or 'transcendance', especially as
      prattled in 'newbie-101', condescension-styled, error-ridden,
      yet oh-so-socially-approved, do-gooder-idealistic style.
       
      I find that there is an unfortunate tradition which dogs
      us all, which is embedded in our culture, and which
      exerts a tragically retarding effect. This is, to never dare
      to speak from the point of view of actual experience, but
      to instead to duck the possibility of uncomfortable accusations,
      by always repeating 'beginners lessons' in lieu of honest
      and straightforward conversation among peers. I am sure
      that there can be other interpretations of what evidences this
      sodden trend, but from my own POV, the lack of straight
      peer-to-peer conversation turns the whole scene into
      an unfortunate charade. "
      ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
       
      As I reflect on the above statements, I sense the difficulty in speaking from the point of view of actual experience on a list that supposedly views such experience as false,  illusory or even non-existent. 
       
      Ed


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