- Jan Barendrecht http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NondualitySalon/message/55565 _________________________________________________________________________Message 1 of 1 , May 29, 2001View SourceJan Barendrecht
That is where I differ with tradition. I deconstruct mAya, avidya and
ajnAna. When I deconstruct these items all that remains is jnana.
People see Maya, when they can't see the whole, just exclusively IMO.
Oops I forgot, even jnana should go away at the end. Anything left at
the end is still a non-duality's burden. :-)
What is knowledge afterall? It depends on how you define the container
(brain) that holds the knowledge. Learning and forgetting are two sides
of the same coin.
But as long as there is a coin there will be two sides. When is it
going to become a point which has no sides or infinite sides?
We're using the term differently then. Jnana yoga is the practice
detailed by Shankara for arriving at the experiential awareness of
nonduality. Jnana (the word used without the term "yoga" attached) *is*
the state of experiential awareness of nonduality.
Therefore, when one has arrived at jnana, one is a jnani. He/she lives
in the full realization of nonduality as an ongoing and direct
revelation. There is nothing to "drop" from here, although the mind of
the jnani will continue to develop in the context of the ongoing
Your approach appears to be an attempt to create a psychological
equivalent of the nondual experience by "dropping" the contents of
thought. The goal would be an empty mind. The assumption is that an
empty mind reflects nothing, therefore the nondual experience will be
The problem with this approach is twofold. First, a completely empty
mind is a very difficult achievement. Very few individuals ever develop
this ability. Secondly, once an empty mind is attained, the recognition
of pure awareness must occur. Just because a mind is empty doesn't mean
that it has the ability to recognize pure awareness. This is the point
where the guru is very helpful, although not necessary in every case.
Perhaps I've made an assumption here. Please advise if this is so.
Many minds (on this list and off) have been blessed to recognize pure
awareness without having to jump through the hoop of a completely empty
mind. However, it wasn't by a psychological regime as much as being in
the right place at the right time with the right attitude of surrender
and openness to grace.
As a misleading fiction concocted by thought, I suppose it is.
Perhaps the difficulty is in the thinking that it is "my own mind."
No, "the difficulty" stems from the notion that "mind" is some sort of
persistent, ongoing entity rather than the transient, sporadic neural
activity it really is.
Maybe it is both. How do you know?
It IS both. oh my... yum. Hey, if you shut down the identification with
the notion that mind is some sort of persistent, ongoing entity, it
won't be. It'll turn into an amazing network of interconnected thoughts
that just arise and fall. You can paint it if you like. You can sing
it, you can talk about it, you can drum it, you can hear about it, you
can... but even better, you can be it... in fact there isn't anything
else you really want to do... I'm listening to Jai Uttal, so what did
What keeps me tied to the corner of the room, what keeps me tied?
some sort of snake...
Love, Mark neither rope nor snake, it just is.
During a conversation with my fourteen year old daughter last night,
she mentioned that one of her school friends had told her that other
than when she is talking to somebody, doing her schoolwork, or is
engaged in some other activity, "I am not thinking of anything, there
is nothing in my mind. Nothing at all. In fact, my mind is totally
Wow! My daughter laughed and told her "my mum works all the time to get
to be that way."
Submit this to Readers Digest. I'm pretty sure they have a section
called 'Advaita Humour'.
I submitted a story to readers digest once; don't think they printed it
though! It is absolutely true. I was walking down to the beach in
Anglesey, behind two little boys. aged about eight and ten. One said
"the tide is in". The other answered "how do you know?" The first one
replied "well, the water is up to the sand".
Subject: Re: Was Bob Dobbs Real?
"You may ask me any question you like, Dean" said Ivan Stang, pacing
floor of the cell in the Ministry of Slack..
"Does "Bob" Dobbs exist?" asked Bob Dean, strapped to the torture
"Of course he does. The Church of the SubGenius exists. "Bob" Dobbs is
High Epopt of the Church of the SubGenius. Therefore, "Bob" Dobbs
"Does he exist in the same way I exist?"
"You do not exist".
- from _1998_, George Orwell's suppressed last novel.
It is tough to stay current on top of non-duality food chain! :-)
It seems to me that the brain is responsible for thoughts and that it
can indeed become very quiet when identities or conditionings have been
processed out. Brain functions are enhanced by this processing. In
satori, no more thought and what is called the mind, does not exist at
all... we are immersed in those moments of clarity..only perception and
perceiver melted into that moment.