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Tuesday, February 6

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  • umbada@ns.sympatico.ca
    There have been a few additions to the Nonduality Salon website. The quick links are at This is part of what you ll find:
    Message 1 of 1 , Feb 7, 2001
      There have been a few additions to the Nonduality Salon website.
      The quick links are at <http://www.nonduality.com/new.htm>

      This is part of what you'll find:

      In the Nondual Perspectives section added Nonduality and Yoga,
      and the following entries:

      James Traverse, Eric Baret, Richard Miller

      Added the following extraordinary people to the list of Living
      Teachers of Nonduality:

      Antoine Carré. "I guess Vertigo comes when one comes to realize
      that each little action or movement carries all of life with
      it... And Vertigo comes to vanish when there is no one left to
      realize that each little action or movement carries all of life
      with it..." Antoine had been on this list but was somehow
      deleted and due to an oversight was not re-installed. Thanks to
      the person who reminded me.

      Susan Dane. "Spirituality is about one central thing--not self
      promotion or self-improvement, but rather becoming the space
      where Spirit lives its life as us. Dedication to this 'striving'
      is the wisest investment of our time and energy and the only
      true promise of a genuine 'better.'" ... "...through radical and
      absolute surrender to the one Spirit, God--upon the moment--the
      supposed momentum of the human ego and its many belief-systems
      comes to a screeching halt."

      Kenneth G. Mills. "My life has been one, hopefully, that could
      lead you to find the Key that would erase your robotization and
      would allow you to perceive your True Identity. This is not easy
      to do. The reason it isn't easy to do is because you have such a
      love affair with your everyday experience without realizing it
      is built on supposition." ... "'Kenneth Mills' evening gowns are
      clearly the work of a Renaissance man. There is poetry in every
      pleat, art in every sweep of silk. His creative talent is so
      prolific that his designs will remain light years ahead of his

      James Traverse. "The key to Natural Yoga is to emphasize
      Stillness which manifests as emphasizing perceiving (not the
      object of perception). In Natural Yoga perceiving, silent
      non-localized awareness, is the instrument of transformation.
      Space-Silence is the environment of natural yoga." ... "Natural
      Yoga is the living union of Movement within Stillness where you
      live completely in the perception (Stillness) and the sensations
      of stretching (movements) appear in Stillness."



      I will be introducing the contributors to the HarshaSatsangh Magazine on
      regular basis, many of whom are well known to us already and part of the
      internet spiritual community. I have written before about Frankji, a
      devotee of Ramana Maharshi. Sri Frankji has a rich background in the
      spiritual literature and a comprehensive understanding of the unity
      permeates all things. His life experiences and long periods of solitude
      meditation have given him the rare flexibility and universal vision to
      everyone on their own ground and at the same time transmit the highest
      of the Self. To convey through spiritual insight and power "That" which
      words cannot convey is the mark of an accomplished Yogi. This describes

      In Frankji's own words from the HS webiste,

      Frank writes, "Plainview, NY, 1968: Zen unlocks the mystery that in
      Reality is Itself an Unfathomable Mystery that defies unlocking! I then
      found this Mystery at the base of the teachings of Krishna, Jesus, Lao
      Chuang Tzu, Rumi, Osho, Tokusan, Milarepa, Padmasambava... the list goes
      and on. Its clarity, however, reached its pinnacle for me in the mouna
      diksha (silence initiation) of my guru Ramana, who opened the way to the
      mounam of Dakshinamurthi to brahman Itself. I stand now naked in the
      wilderness, proclaiming loud and clear as the Big Bang Bell of Creation
      Itself that Self-realization is already utterly everyone's experience
      and now*! That it is the common and most paradoxic of all delusions in
      we've consistently managed *to go out of our way* to construct the
      belief in
      our being otherwise!"
      (Frank has a website called Pathways to Metaphysics on the secret
      of the Ancients. --(The Editors).

      To discover the variety of riches in understanding that Frankji offers,
      please go to the website and read his article and you will also find the
      link to Frankji' website there as well.

      Love to all

      For those of you who are new here to the NDS, I invite you to
      join HarshaSatsangha. Jerry and I go way back and realize the
      value to be offered by different lists. HS has a slightly
      different flavor but a complementary orientation to the NDS. HS
      is not right for everyone but it may be right for you. We are
      looking for a few good men and women. Join the marines of
      nonduality. Meet the over 300 teachers and students of yoga and
      meditation in a variety of nondual and dual religious and
      mystical traditions. Some one mentioned to me that we are the
      largest Sri Ramana group on Yahoo. I don't know if that is true
      but you are invited to find out by clicking below.


      I also invite you to visit the official HS website at
      www.harshasatsangh.com and look at our internet magazine. Please
      look at the credits section and you will recognize
      internationally renowned people as both editors and
      contributors. Our Chief Technology Officer (CTO) is David
      Hodges. Gloria Lee is the Editor - In - Chief, and Greg Goode is
      the Executive Editor and the Philosophy and Religion Editor. We
      have a number of excellent editors dealing in Astrology, Yoga,
      Tantra, Kundalini, Raw Foods, Vegetarianism and other topics. We
      are always on the lookout for talented sages, yogis, meditators,
      writers, in case you wish to contribute for future issues.

      Here is the list description.

      This spiritual discussion group is an open Satsang and is
      blessed by Sri Ramana Maharshi, the great Jnani Sage of
      Arunachala. HarshaSatsangha is in the best tradition of a joyous
      spiritual fellowship for facilitating the Recognition of the
      Eternal Reality that is One's Own Self. "I Am That!" This is the
      uncompromising, simple, and yet Radical Truth proclaimed in a
      variety of ways by the ancient and modern Sages of Hinduism,
      Jainism, Buddhism, and Taoism. In Advaita Vedanta, the highest
      teaching emphasizes the complete identity of the Individual Soul
      with the Supreme Soul. In Tibetan Buddhism, Dzogchen is
      considered the supreme teaching and represents the nondual focus
      on one's innate wakefulness. How beautiful the variety of
      expressions in so many different traditions! We embrace this
      variety with great joy and in fellowship in HarshaSatsangha.

      No religion or teacher or tradition has a monopoly on the
      Essential Truth of Reality which is Our Own Nature. In this
      context, HarshaSatsangha focuses on the aspirations and
      experiences of individuals on the spiritual path. Everyone
      interested in any of the Shiva and Shakti traditions, and the
      related yogic and tantric paths as well as those practicing
      primarily the cognitive methods of the pure nondual teachings of
      great Jnanis such as Ramana Maharshi are welcome to join. The
      discussions are typically expected to focus on Self-Realization,
      Kundalini Shakti and Its Manifestations, God-Realization, the
      Goddess, Enlightenment, and various types of Samadhis (Savikalpa
      and Nirvikalpa). Discussion of various teachers and teachings
      can also be enriching as long as there is mutual respect and a
      feeling of amity in the conversation. Humor and poetry and other
      artistic expressions of the spiritual life are encouraged and
      supported. May God Bless everyone with Peace, Joy, and
      Understanding. May we all nourish and heal each other in the
      spirit of Compassion, Wisdom and Love. OM Shanti, Shanti,
      Shanti. Peace to all living beings




      Great stuff, Dan. I'm sorry to put you on the spot or in the
      spotlight, or whatever, and ask questions that beg for answers,
      but perhaps more spontaneous eruptions will occur....I have read
      that awareness has the twin qualities of cognition and clarity:
      I have some vague notion of what clarity might be, but for the
      life of me, I can't see how the quality of cognition arises in
      that "knowingness" must have a knower and a known (while clarity
      suggests just a quality of beingness or non-duality)--is there
      some aspect of cognition, or a kind of non-dual cognition...?
      Love from a figment of your...Terry.

      Hey, Terry!
      Great talking to you -
      not feeling put on the spot.

      Enjoying spontaneous eruptions ;-)

      You're right on-target as seen here.
      Cognition involves subject and object,
      or knower and known, hence "nondual
      awareness" (put in quotes because
      it doesn't exist ;-) can't be the product
      or outcome of cognition.

      So, how can cognition, involving the
      implied subject for any object, and
      vice vers, arise
      at all where there is "awareness"?
      A related question: how can anything
      appear to happen when there is
      nothing happening? (It can't be
      assumed that cognition refers to
      something outside of cognition,
      because that assumption *is*

      The "real" answer to this is:
      be here -- be where cognition
      arises. This instant in which
      cognition simultaneously
      is and is not, and neither is
      nor is not. That is the only
      "real" clarity on the matter.

      Having said that, metaphorically
      one could say that cognition
      appears (an event appears to happen)
      even though nothing "really" happens.
      That appearance is possible because
      a subject can be implied by an object
      simultaneously with an object being
      implied by a subject. A present
      experience can be implied by a
      past experience, just as a past
      experience is implied by the
      present (the relationship of
      present thought and memory,
      experience-near cognition and
      experience-distant cognition).

      You can say that if A is because B is,
      and B is because A is, then neither
      A nor B can "really" exist. But, there
      is nothing in reality (i.e., awareness,
      infinity, no-thingness) to prevent such
      paradoxical appearance, either. Because
      nothing prevents it, it appears to appear.

      It appears to itself to have a self
      to appear to, but that
      appearance of itself to itself always
      depends on something appearing
      to have appeared. Said simply,
      nothing really happens, but
      everything appears to happen.
      Said even more simply: Nothing!
      Everything! Really!

      Some have called this the creativity of
      the infinite, others have called it maya.
      It might be called "infinite inevitability".

      When you are right here, where this is
      "happening", it's not happening.
      Thus, the question is "absorbed" by
      the infinite itself -- the question has
      no place to arise. That itself is
      the "answer".



      “The beginning of wisdom is silence. The second stage is

      A Hebrew Sage

      “Listening is a primitive act of love in which a person gives
      himself to another’s word, making himself accessible and
      vulnerable to that word.”



      From an interview in "The Sun" magazine with Bo Lozoff, founder
      of The Prison Ashram Project.

      Bo: In 1990 I gave a worksop at a prison in Loisiana.(at that
      point he had been doing prison work for over 15 years). The
      place was like a modern day slave plantation; all the prisoners
      were black. This was in the heat of the summer and there were
      about 60 men in the workshop. One man stood up and said in a
      quaivering voice, "I just can't believe that i'm getting to see
      Bo Lozoff in my prison. You wrote me personally one time". He
      held up a little scrap of paper as if it were a religious relic.
      I did what I'd done many times before, something i was very
      proud of; I said to him " You and I are just the same. We're
      both seekers. What you're feeling, you feel not toward me but
      toward God". In other words I cut his experience to shreds. I'd
      been doing that for years, because I rationally believed that I
      couldn't let people mistake the messesnger for the message. I
      was very proud of my humility. Through my meditation practice I
      soon came to realize that my professional modesty was a
      completely self- centered reaction. I should have made *him* the
      center of the experience. There is nothing wrong with devotion,
      whether it is to a human being, a deity, a tree, or a stone.
      It's a wonderful a beautiful experience. It was important for
      this man in that Loisiana prison to express his admiration for
      someone who had helped him turn his life around, and I should
      have let him have that experience. I didn't have to let it swell
      my head, but I had to let him have it. Instead I cut him down.
      Because of that, I vowed not to go into a prison again until I
      was mature enough to allow people to express their gratitude,
      appreciation, admiration, and affection without worrying about
      what it meant for me. So I spent three years in retreat because
      of that one isntance. My point is that when we deceive
      ourselves, even in a way that's popularly considered ok, our
      practice will point it out. If we have a fairly quiet mind and
      something inside of us seems to say over and over "you did
      something wrong, you did something wrong." We ask "What?" And
      that something says "Keep looking, you'll see". And then if
      you're willing to act on what you've done you may gain some
      understanding about yourself and about the world.

      --contributed by Matthew Files



      Thank you Matthew. There is an arrogance behind needing to
      correct others, even when disguised as wanting to help. And it
      is especially evident when it isn't asked for. What is said here
      about devotion applies to many more examples of letting people
      have their experience, their insight, their way of expressing



      I have often thought that the finger pointing at the moon was
      the masters way of saying "There... it is behind there".



      A visitor asking Nisargadatta about paths, practices and

      Maharaj: For meditation you should sit with identification with
      the knowledge "I am" only and have confirmed to yourself that
      you are not the body. You must dwell only in that knowledge "I
      am"--not merely the words "I am." The design of your body does
      not signify your identification. And also, the name which is
      given to you or to the body is not your correct identity. The
      name which is imposed on you, or the name which you have heard
      about you--you have accepted that name as yourself. Similarly,
      since you have seen your body, you think you are the body. So
      you have to give up both these identities. And the indwelling
      knowledge that you are, without words, that itself you are. In
      that identity, you must stabilize yourself. And then, whatever
      doubts you have, will be cleared by that very knowledge, and
      everything will be opened up in you...

      Visitor: My question is, is there a useful way for arriving at
      moksha and are there particular signs for distinguishing which
      paths are the best for us?

      M: You just listen to all this, whatever is being said here;
      follow that, abide in that and be that. Don't ask me about other
      paths. The path I am expounding, you listen to that, and abide
      in it...

      V: I am interested especially in practice, how to start it.

      M: Forget all about physical disciplines in this connection. I
      am telling you that the indwelling principle. "I am," the
      knowledge that you are, you have to *be* that. Just be that.
      With that knowledge "I am," hold on to the knowledge "I am."

      V: It is difficult to abandon attachment to action; even in this
      way it is not easy always to remember "I am," the truth of the

      M: You know that you are sitting here; you know you are, do you
      require any special effort to hold on to that "you are"? You
      know you are; abide in that. The "I am" principle without words,
      that itself is the God of all Ishwaras.

      V: Is devotion not useful as an initial step?

      M: First step or second step, I have the first and final step at
      the same time! The knowledge "I am," without words, itself is
      the Ishwara. He, Ishwara, does not want another (Maya) agent or
      intermediary. Direct.

      Nisargadatta Maharaj
      "The Ultimate Medicine"
      Edited by Robert Powell
      Blue Dove Press



      Life is a meaning-free zone.... illusion is otherwise.



      Hi Everyone,

      I just posted some snow pictures of the aftereffects from New
      England's big snow storm of last night. This morning I walked to
      work and took some pictures along my route. I put three of the
      pictures on my web site and my online journal:

      http://www.outermost.com or


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