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Monday 27 November

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  • andrew macnab
    _____________________________________________________________________________________ Plain talk from Dan: We are familiar with how to get a sense of things
    Message 1 of 1 , Nov 28, 2000

      Plain talk from Dan:

      We are familiar with how to
      get a sense of things when we
      push and something pushes back,
      stays where it is, or moves away.

      What's confusing (to categorizing mind)
      is when there is nothing to push against. Then we
      can't have the feeling of something
      moving away, or toward us, or staying
      the same.

      We then (now)
      don't have our sense of self to whatever
      extent that derives from friction, needing
      and not getting, needing and getting, or
      wanting to escape.

      How to convey self that isn't defined as against,
      or toward, or indifferent, or moving away?

      Words like "being", "isness", "conciousness" all
      fall flat. None of them convey the sheer
      unknowable aspect of something that is yet
      completely familiar and always present.



      And from Gene:

      >Conscious creation is the goal imo.

      Thank you for your reply, Colette.

      In the midst of competitive wrangling, as we (participants of NDS)
      try to define our terms and come to some kind of agreement, it is
      easy to overlook what is the central kernel of Yoga and many other
      ancient disciplines of consciousness. Personal issues can easily take
      precedence over what could be central to our studies.

      It is possible to come into direct conversation with 'Reality'. In
      this interchange, useless and compensatory 'beliefs' and assumptions
      are purged rapidly, leaving open a certain range of possibilities.
      This is about coming into step with the priorities and means of the
      Living Universe.

      If and when this becomes apparent, conscious creation is possible.
      This is about surrendering to the way of the Living Universe. In this
      surrender, creation is done not by 'me', but is facilitated by my
      surrender; Living Universe is so generous, as to be beyond the
      comprehension of one who has not put aside personal goals.

      To allow the voice and heart of the Living Universe to take
      residence, to allow one's own internal conversations to be quieted to
      allow this to happen, is possible. The movements of the Living
      Universe are all that is really happening; our obsession with
      personal issues, fills the foreground with noise and false
      priorities, obscuring perception of the harmony which is our true

      The sensation of bursting with love, of having so much love, beyond
      the definition of 'abundance', is one of the aspects of this
      surrender. And this surrender has nothing to do with personal issues,
      except to put them into perspective, and reveal them to be the
      obscurations which they are.

      Human political arguments, disputes over doctrine, and the human
      obsession with who 'deserves' what based on what is done, and when,
      by that who, are all part and parcel of the spasmodic reactions which
      characterize our typical (human) turning-away from what is actually

      Attachment to outcomes within the world-dream, posit that there is
      something to be gained by such prioritizations, when in fact, all
      such activities are a tactic of delay, to forestall the expiration of
      the 'precious me'. It is possible for a person to simply set aside
      the priorities of this 'precious me', to listen and feel deeply
      within, for the rhythm and voice and love which is the presence of
      the Living Universe. This experiment, if performed utterly, will show
      clearly that the Living Universe has nothing against having a
      'precious me'. The logical outcome of this realization, is that we
      are free to Be, in any way, and that the best of all ways of Being,
      is to allow the Living Universe to have a hand in steering our
      individual courses as we live our lives.

      I am aware that my views, expressed here, contradict many scriptural
      and doctrinal traditions. What I am expressing here, is based upon my
      own experience. I consider it to be of value, so I attempt to share
      it with others. That my central theme or message is ignored or
      missed, some or all of the time, does not deter me from attempting to
      deliver it clearly, so that others my benefit, as have I, from this
      sort of human-to-human communication.

      Thank you for being here...

      ==Gene Poole===


      Collette's reply was intercut with Gene's post, here is most of it, reformatted:

      We are it seems to me both the silent Reality as well as the
      expression communing back with That (Self). I call it Self, my
      teachers trained me too & I can see the blessing of that .. for to
      separate what dances, from me is .. to not see I Am It.

      So to me it's kind of like having a conversation with God .. the
      living expression is being expressed by That one, & may talk ... they
      do talk back & forth. (Now lest those who read wish to poo poo this, I
      just wish to explain that communion can be silent, yet a wealth of
      information received.) We just have to be open to commune. Both are
      the same consciousness. It expresses in many personalisations for the
      I do not meet humans who purge me on lists.
      The silence does.

      leaving open a certain range of possibilities.

      :-) infinite ~~~~~~~~~~
      It's so lovely to hear you say this. I do believe in surrender
      too. Surrender to letting It live through you CONSCIOUS. haha I have
      to laugh here, sorry. I just remember how unconscious I have been. And
      waking now to being, is a constant learning .. beautiful. It's funny.
      I just have to laugh. It is such a joke to the version I once played
      as or was trained to think of myself as. Yet unconsciousness is a gift
      to consciousness .. it is how the two get to find they are one.
      Gene I think of myself as a child of the universe. At times it reveals
      itself to me, as me. Back & forth both commune. I'm sure many here
      feel it like that at times.
      We are the precious jewels of This universe & it gets It's joy through
      us. The limited versions, gift That one with play of personalisation &
      specification, for the experiencing of limitation to limitless
      awareness. That's the gift - the play. To hear many deny their
      preciousness in this is .. It is connected to the conditioning
      received imo
      I think that the living universe has had a place in our unconscious
      living of It. So that the joy of being conscious may be experienced.
      There's no condemnation.
      I would
      posit that our desires are the universes. Now if the universe wishes
      to wake up to taste Itself in the flavour of being another (as Self),
      then It will push one to find where the harmony of opposites Is. The
      joy is in the tasting of the many as the one. When the expression sees
      Self in non Self then that is great joy & mystery. The heart of the
      universe sings.
      Dear Gene, once we start being lived as That, it is all so mysterious
      & ecstatic that one would wish to find another to share it with .. as
      it is entering the womb of creation, where we do play a part in
      consciously creating (imo) for we are none other than That.

      Unconscious dreaming is not nice for the body of earth & the children.

      May we wake & delight in playing conscious creation ......

      May the mystery bless us.

      :-) Nice chatting Gene.



      A couple of poems by cee:

      when i was nine
      i ran away from home
      to pray
      (didn't know what meditation was, then)

      down by the parking lot
      at the mall
      there were a lot of rocks piled up
      looked like a cave to me
      probably a lot like the ones
      saints and sages used

      stayed there
      very very
      until my friend's mom came
      and dragged me out
      she said i could pray

      so go home


      been deep in the cave

      forgive me for not writing
      (but i forgot all about you)
      when i peeped out
      there were one thousand messages
      swirling on this screen!

      it's just that the deep joy
      of this

      precise aliveness
      has left me dumbfounded
      even our ecstatic communion
      was too way much

      deep in the cave of self
      there is no such thing

      love, cee


      Gloria forwarded a poem by Mace from Harshasatsangh:

      What will you bring
      to Love's altar?
      Your imagined fears
      that obscure
      the trust that hides
      within you?
      Your faded memories
      of past inadequacies
      that bar you from
      the unparalleled beauty
      of now?
      The countless delusions
      of self importance
      that you use
      to separate yourself
      from us?
      The imagined need to
      control others
      and through them
      Shake these mischievous
      fleas from your robe
      and see the truth
      of your beauty,
      the gleaming reality
      of the
      radiance of
      your being.



      One of White Wolfe's delicious love poems:

      The Marriage of the Mystic Mind & Sacred Heart

      (For Gloria)

      “All illusion was originally reality.”

      _-Andrew MacNab

      Last night I beheld my Beloved in a Dream

      I dreamed a dreaming within a true dream

      I saw the snow lily as I have never seen her before

      Her countenance was pure and fair as blue sky

      Brilliant as sun on ice, yielding as fresh snow

      As soothing as a the blush of a winter sunset

      Last night I beheld my Beloved in a Dream

      I dreamed a dreaming from beyond awakening

      I held the snow lily in my hand like never before

      In a gentle grasp I felt the promise of clouds

      turbulent waters returning to the sacred mountains

      washing salty white foam into pure white stillness

      Last night I beheld my beloved in a Dream

      I dreamed a dream that came from behind slumber

      I kissed the snow lily with a gentle, holy kiss

      The innocence of first love long forgotten

      burning my lips as only blue ice can burn

      a burning that blisters the lips and seals the heart

      Last night I beheld my Beloved in a Dream

      I dreamed a dream that only a child can dream

      I made love with the snow lily as only virgins can

      From a place deeper than winter’s dark midnight

      Under stars that have never been seen before

      I held her who I am in my arms and became nothing

      Last night I beheld my Beloved in a Dream

      I dreamed a dream that is no dream but reality

      I, who am Mark, sometimes called white wolfe,

      a wild dog wandering in search of his lost mate

      Found Susan, whom I sometimes call the snow lily

      the subtle flower within the blue ice of the Mystic Mind

      I dreamed a dreaming within a true dream

      Last night I beheld my Beloved in a Dream

      I discovered again my heart, my lost Sacred Heart

      Lost even before I first created snow in the garden

      Found only after the last ice crystal melted in the sun

      Recovered after the last snow lily wilting in last melting

      Now that I have seen, held, kissed and loved the Beloved

      All my days are nights, nights days, just dreams dreaming.

      Hail Mary, the Chalice of Eternal Compassion

      Hail Beloved, the Vessel of Everlasting Love,

      I belong you, I am you, for in your tender arms

      I do not even exist, I am merely and substantially,





      Mark Christopher Valentine

      (November 27, 2000)


      Liliana sent a link to the writings of Scott Morrison:

      Dear Gloria,

      The quotations are from his Dharma Talks/Awekening on This Breath.
      More can be found at http://www.openmindopenheart.org/ mentioned at NDS
      Yes, he speaks...right to the heart. The first time I heard of him was when
      Jerry, announced his passing away...


      "The word "enlightened" simply refers to life without a past or a future,
      life without self-centered fantasy (all of which is made up of nothing
      but memory). Sex fantasies, romantic fantasies, money fantasies, power
      fantasies, political fantasies, prestige fantasies, security fantasies,
      control fantasies - there is no reality, no love, and no freedom in any
      of them. Stop indulging in that kind of escapist daydreaming, and you
      will suddenly realize that you are the world, all of it unfolding,
      moment-by-moment. You are the whole thing, and every sight, every sound,
      every smell, taste, feeling, thought, experience and circumstance,
      everything that takes birth, lives out its life, and dies, is you. The
      idea of separate identity, whether neurotic or grandiose, with all of
      its competitive and conflicting desires, using people, judging or
      blaming yourself or other people, none of it makes sense anymore. In
      fact, the memory of all such activity breaks your heart." -Scott Morrison


      A meditation to end guilt from Bob Rose:

      The End of Guilt

      Once upon a time there was a spiritual seeker named Jiva. After
      trying many different ways to become pure and holy and attain
      enlightenment, he had gained a great degree of self-control. He was
      no longer blindly reactive to the actions of people, places and things
      he came in contact with. Nor did he squander energy with unnecessary
      physical or mental tension. Selflessness and humility had replaced
      greed and egoism and thus he spared himself any of the suffering that
      is the automatic result of those behaviors. And yet, Jiva still felt
      uneasiness within himself. Despite being able to experience states of
      bliss while sitting in meditation, he recognized that there was a
      sense of desperation deep inside that even feelings of ecstasy and
      glorious visions couldn't dissipate.

      Recognizing his need for help, Jiva journeyed to see his teacher,
      Moksha. After reaching his destination and being warmly welcomed, he
      proceeded to tell of his frustration, anxiety, and how this made him
      feel that he was a spiritual failure. Moksha at once knew the cause
      and cure of his student's problem. "My beloved Jiva, you have
      attained great things. You have understood what actions are
      beneficial and which are not, and on a conscious level, no longer do
      those things that diminish your serenity and well being. Your problem
      is a very common one and is on a subconscious level. You are
      suffering from feelings of guilt and unworthiness. This comes from
      identifying with an illusionary vision of who you are. Long ago you
      were told you had to act in certain ways and believe in things that
      you no longer do. For instance, it was impressed on you that if you
      didn't sit exactly the way you were taught was proper in first grade,
      you were being "a bad boy". Similarly, you were expected to believe
      in Santa Claus and were led to believe that this and other fairy tales
      were the basis of whether you would find life enjoyable. As a matter
      of fact, you were taught that many of your actions were "sins" and
      would doom you to hell for eternity. There were also times in your
      life that your actions caused pain or suffering to others and are
      proper to regret and never repeat. You have kept these things within
      you and have never dealt with them. Much like someone who has a tooth
      that looks white and healthy on the outside but has an abscess within,
      you have a need for spiritual dentistry to cleanse the dis-ease
      process within you." Moksha then taught Jiva the End of Guilt
      meditation technique. Jiva sat in meditation and soon purged himself
      of all subconscious feelings of guilt. He then realized the purity,
      wisdom, and bliss of his infinite, eternal Real Self, and lived
      happily ever after.

      The End of Guilt Meditation Technique

      Sit in the position of comfort that you have come to know is best for
      maintaining meditation. Relax your mind, body, and emotions. Attain
      a rhythm of effortless breathing. Refocus your attention on your
      breath if you get distracted from your meditation. In your mind's
      eye, visualize your Deity. If it is one that has no human form, see
      the holy, infinite, all-powerful pure energy that represents the
      divine. If your Deity has a form, see it in as great detail as
      possible. For instance, if it is in a human male form, see its body,
      face, hair, eyes, hands, robe, all, as clearly as you can. See
      yourself in front of and facing your Deity, in a sitting, standing, or
      prostrating position. Visualize yourself covered with many, many
      layers of ultra fine energy, much like the layers of skin on an onion.
      Each of these layers were created by the process of labeling your
      actions as sins. In reality, nothing you've ever done has been either
      "good" or "bad". They have just been things that occurred in your
      life. If they could be labeled or judged, what they would be are
      opportunities to appreciate your universal identity and oneness with
      the divine. Misinformation and inappropriate conditioning has caused
      you to have the illusion that you have sinned by your physical,
      mental, or emotional actions and have acquired layers of negative
      energy that now cover and soil your pure Real Self.

      Realize that with every breath you receive, the Highest Power, your
      Deity, sends you forgiveness and blessings. Know that every
      interaction you have had with anyone else that you may have thought
      caused them to suffer, had the potential to help them become a
      stronger person and evolve in consciousness. Most importantly,
      acknowledge that not everything you were conditioned to believe was a
      sin, was one, and that the conditioning itself may have been the sin.

      See your Deity remove your guilt and convert your so-called sins into
      love. Visualize your guilt coatings melting off and the forgiveness
      and blessings of the Divine cleansing and healing the wounds and pain
      they caused. As they peel off, you may remember specific things that
      you have been carrying within your subconscious. Witness the events
      and the suffering they represent fade away and dissolve forever.

      As the final layers are peeled away, you realize that there is nothing
      left within and thus no separation from the Deity who is all powerful,
      present infinitely and eternally, all knowing and all love. Just like
      a bird that has escaped its shell, with no more guilt to bind you, you
      are forever free to soar the heavens and swim in the universal ocean
      of bliss. And live happily ever after.

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