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[NDS] Thursday November 23rd

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  • andrew macnab
    ______________________________________________________________________________________ Dear friends.. old and new.. As some of you know, I sense and dance the
    Message 1 of 1 , Nov 24, 2000

      Dear friends.. old and new..

      As some of you know, I sense and dance the rhythm of this time of year
      as it washes over me. The banquet of grace spread out before, within,
      and beyond me this year, has *everything* to do with the gifts which
      you, (met here in this sacred place, and in person) have presented.

      This year, from this list, I have met Judi, Gene, Jerry, Matthew, Steve,
      Dan, Greg, Andrew, Harsha, Gloria, Mark, Mary, David, Jody, Victor,
      Michael, Biff, Petros, Amrita (Old Hag), Nora, Marcia, Rob Rabbin,
      Thomas Murphy, Chuck Hillig, Melody (via phone) and Mark Christopher
      (White Wolfe). A year of blessings in rarified company.

      This year, through this list, I have been turned inside out;
      disappeared, reappeared; been gently and roughly guided to see through
      the dross; and again and again entrained upon That which resides in the
      interval of abiding. I live ever more clearly in the Stream, and the
      flotsam has lost much of it's stickum.

      As I harvest this abundance, I light a tall Golden candle on this table
      of Thanks Giving; and offer a Living Heartful of deep gratitude, as I
      prepare to again empty out through the fallow Advent season in
      preparation for new birth arising.

      I pause to reflect upon relationship.. right relationship. These
      thoughts, culled from yesterday and today, speak to the essence of the
      gracefulness of this community. The words.. "there is only Love" and
      "there is no where to go" are now ablaze as living pulsations. I am now,
      all of you... may my life honor your gifts.

      I love you,



      Hello friend Jerry...

      >From: umbada@...
      >Subject: Re: Gene Re: Michael- Read comments
      >In oldtime newsreels of men and women in black coats being driven
      >from their homeland, I've always thought I'd like to see one of them
      >walk up to the camera and say something self-aware such as the
      >cartoon character says.

      That could have been done, but for the palpable curtain erected by
      the aggressors. The aggressor commands the context, denying the
      wholeness of the aggressed. The technique of commanding context has
      yet to be understood, but yelling and interrupting is one
      manifestation of that technique.

      Forcing people to live under a threat, is also commanding context.
      The implication of threat, if it stimulates reaction in that context,
      leads to the materialization of the consequence promised by the
      threat; thus, those (threatened) who act as though they want to argue
      with the threat, are punished for revealing the context of force.
      Killing those who have the courage to point out this game, is the
      main tactic of the evil commandants of the world-dream; lacking the
      ones who have this courage, the context of threat is enough to keep
      vast populations in check.

      >However, I don't think self-awareness sells. People want an
      >invisible curtain between them and the players, which is fine and
      >essential when being entertained. However it gets carried into
      >families, between parents and kids, and within the individual there
      >are many invisible curtains.

      As long as the curtain is employed in various 'harmless' ways, the
      context of curtain and denial will be a form of tacit communication,
      thus making it available to tyrants.

      >Nonduality might be called the doing away of all invisible curtains,
      >which is when every atom is self-aware, and tiny pebbles become best

      This is why it is vital for each individual to drop the internal
      curtains; nonduality is that abolishment of internal curtains.
      Self-honesty must precede any platitudinous outpourings which point
      to 'other'. Gut-honesty must be established, before any scriptural
      'truths' can be understood.

      >There is no history, no bodies in black coats in old newsreels, and
      >nothing is more important than a pebble in the gutter in a bad part
      >of town, nothing screams in your ear as loudly, nothing sits tall
      >and magnificent in the world as much as that pebble when the
      >invisible curtain is parted.

      Jerry, thanks for showing just how our acceptance of the most humble
      and denied aspects of ourselves, is the compassion which is the key
      to nondual understanding. That tiny pebble, the least of all, is the
      denied and devalued aspect of myself, which as long as that internal
      curtain is installed, will remain disenfranchised. I cannot be whole,
      when in denial of any aspect of myself.

      Merely assigning a label of 'undesirable'. 'illusory', 'seen this way
      only by sleepers', 'product of ignorance', will not abolish the
      aspect in question. Compassionate acceptance of oneself is what is
      needed. This reunion is the establishment of honesty.

      And that will help a tiny pebble become a little boulder.

      Rock on,

      ==Gene Poole==


      Dear Gene,

      Tyrants control only that which lies within their own "realm." Thus,
      they are harmless to "those" who lie outside the sphere of their

      * Tyrants can control the physical body, ordering it here and there,
      torturing it, locking it in a prison cell. Those who identify with
      the physical body will feel tyrannized, and will suffer.

      * Tyrants can control the mind (to an extent, anyway). Those who
      identify with thought and with the mind will feel tyrannized, and
      will suffer.

      * Tyrants may rape and abuse nature as well. But nature herself is
      more violent to her inhabitants than any tyrant, and far wiser to her
      own condition. In the end, nature kills the tyrant long before the
      tyrant can harm her... and she heals faster than most suspect.

      The solution is not the elimination of the tyrant (patently
      impossible, another will simply spring up to take the place of the
      last), but the elimination of that which can be tyrannized and
      controlled by "others," that which can suffer.

      The existence of "The Tyrant" implies the existence of those who
      need, want, choose or are willing to be tyrannized.

      How to eliminate those people? <grin>...




      Tim and Gene:


      Om, you wrote:

      >From: "Omkara Datta" <core@...>
      >Subject: Gene/Re: (no subject, no object)
      >Dear Gene,
      >Tyrants control only that which lies within their own "realm." Thus,
      >they are harmless to "those" who lie outside the sphere of their

      Indeed. Tyrants depend upon the complicity of their victims. This
      complicity is formed during phases of learning to use symbols, during
      early childhood. The attachment of values to symbols, specifically,
      is what makes the tyrant-victim polarity possible.

      Nondual studies may lead to the stripping of values from symbols,
      leaving only value-neutral pointers. Without the values arising
      simultaneously with the perception of the symbols, choice enters as a

      Tyrants modus is to leave no choice; thus, any system which leads to
      the stripping of values from symbols, is essentially anti-tyrannical.
      Such reformative systems include Zen, and Landmark Education, among

      >* Tyrants can control the physical body, ordering it here and there,
      >torturing it, locking it in a prison cell. Those who identify with
      >the physical body will feel tyrannized, and will suffer.

      Perhaps this is so. One may remind oneself of the 'realm of
      possibility'. Awareness can change anything.

      >* Tyrants can control the mind (to an extent, anyway). Those who
      >identify with thought and with the mind will feel tyrannized, and
      >will suffer.

      The real 'tyrant' we all must face, is the compound known as the
      'world-dream'. It is from this collective realm of artifacts
      (intangible as they may be), that we draw the components of identity.
      As long as a person depends upon the world-dream as a source of
      identity, tyranny is possible.

      >* Tyrants may rape and abuse nature as well. But nature herself is
      >more violent to her inhabitants than any tyrant, and far wiser to
      >her own condition. In the end, nature kills the tyrant long before
      >the tyrant can harm her... and she heals faster than most suspect.

      Interesting speculation.

      >The solution is not the elimination of the tyrant (patently
      >impossible, another will simply spring up to take the place of the
      >last), but the elimination of that which can be tyrannized and
      >controlled by "others," that which can suffer.

      This view you offer, is why I am careful to state certain things with
      great care. Nothing need be eliminated; indeed, elimination is the
      way of the tyrant.

      I advocate to awaken _TO_ the dream, rather than _from_ the dream.
      Awakening to the dream, may halt automatic identification of subject
      with object, eg, the automatic equation of value with symbol.

      If this step is taken, if one awakens to (or within) the dream, the
      tools at our disposal may be used to dramatically reform the contents
      of the dream in which we find ourselves. These tools are the
      'controls' to which awareness has access, but which controls are
      hidden behind a foreground of value-laden symbols, the reality of one
      who does not know the nature of the dream (maya).

      Finding one's controls, gives one certain powers (siddhes) which have
      direct application in shaping what I call 'DISPLAY' (ala Vajrayana).
      Display is what is apparent reality. It is possible to directly shape
      'Display', thus to change what is apparently 'happening'.

      'Most people' however, have no interest or awareness of the nature of
      'Display', other than to go through formulaic rituals (such as
      'workiing for money' and 'eating to live') to accomplish the
      repetitious recreation of yesterday. Some of us are gifted by Grace,
      with direct perception of this conundrum, and choose to take control,
      to the extent that compassion allows. Tools/controls are loaded when
      needed, not when chosen.

      >The existence of "The Tyrant" implies the existence of those who
      >need, want, choose or are willing to be tyrannized.
      >How to eliminate those people? <grin>...

      (I have always said, that good 'elimination' will greatly aid clear
      vision. Beware the syndrome of 'Ocular Rectumulosis'. )

      You might try:

      For an interesting interpretation of what I have said above.

      Another approach is here:

      It is difficult to describe reality, in terms allowed by the tyrants
      of the world-dream. Our resorting to esoteric language, is the
      attempt to do so. But still, every metaphor has serious shortcomings.
      If it were not so, it would be possible to communicate _directly_ by
      using mere words. As it is, direct communication (communionication)
      is always happening, but for most, it is obscured behind the chaotic
      foreground of the battlegrounds of the world-dream.

      ==Gene Poole==


      David Hodges:

      Tim -
      Thanks for posting these. It was interesting to see something that I
      posted in there, from a year and a half ago....it is interesting to see how
      a voice or a quote speaks to one at a particular crossroads, which may not
      even be recognized as a crossroads at the time.
      So, it was only 11 days after posting that Sri Nisargadatta quote about
      "going beyond" that I was driving down the highway and, in an instant, my
      small self dropped away like a balloon whose skin is pricked with a pin,
      and there was nothing but Presence, Self, "That".
      That was on Palm Sunday, 1999, so I refer to it as the Palm Sunday
      Breakthrough. As an experience it faded as all experiences do, but as a
      life step, it continues to ramify and extend and I am still discovering how
      this wave continues to wash away the remnants of who I used to be.

      At 04:03 PM 11/22/2000 -0800, you wrote:

      >-----Original Message-----
      >From: David Hodges
      >Sent: Thursday, March 11, 1999 9:08 PM
      >To: NondualitySalon@onelist.com
      >Subject: [NondualitySalon] Go Beyond
      >From: David Hodges <>
      >Here's a quote from Sri Nisargadatta that I encountered in my reading and
      >which I read as if he were speaking directly to me:
      >"For some time longer you will remain sleep-walking, as you do now, bereft
      >of meaning and assurance; but this period will end and you will find your
      >work both fruitful and easy. There are always moments when one feels empty
      >and estranged. Such moments are most desirable for it means the soul has
      >cast its moorings and is sailing for distant places. This is detachment -
      >when the old is over and the new has not yet come. If you are afraid, the
      >state may be distressing; but there is really nothing to be afraid of.
      >Remember the instruction: whatever you come across - go beyond."
      >I really like the phrase, "the soul has cast its moorings and is sailing
      >for distant places."
      >I think I am in one of those moments now.


      Dear Tim,

      As you wish others holy days, and we are recalling great posts, here is one of
      yours which I greatly treasure and thus have saved. I have witnessed some
      remarkable transformations here. Yours is one of them. I am most thankful today
      myself for all those who have been a catalyst for the inner alchemy. It happens
      here, over and over.

      Much love to you,

      ----- Original Message -----
      From: Tim Gerchmez <fewtch@...>
      To: <NondualitySalon@onelist.com>
      Sent: Thursday, July 01, 1999 5:46 PM
      Subject: [NondualitySalon] Holy Ground

      From: Tim Gerchmez <fewtch@...>

      Dear List,

      I find myself walking on Holy Ground today. For years I have covered up
      myself against the abuse of my father in childhood, hidden in rage and
      bitterness and sadness. Today I see for the first time (deeply, not
      mentally) who my father really is, and I realized that I love him deeply.
      He has changed greatly since those earlier years, and so have I. I realize
      that underneath the sometimes egotistical, harsh and judgmental personality
      lies an innocent person, a child, who delights in nature and in animals,
      and who writes poetry (which I hear is pretty darned good). I didn't even
      know my father wrote poetry until recently. Imagine that... living 35
      years and not knowing your own father was a poet...

      Holding this love for my father, I find that the Shiva/Shakti within me is
      at last united. I see now that underneath EVERYONE, from the saint to the
      mass murderer, lies a tender, innocent and vulnerable soul, which has only
      defended itself against the circumstances it found itself in as best it
      could. I can see the Divinity in everyone, and in EVERYTHING. It is so
      childlike and vulnerable... innocent, delighting in everything It sees,
      loving everyone so deeply... and the friction of this world has covered
      this vulnerable self in almost everyone with layers of defenses.

      That's why I say I walk on Holy Ground today. Shiva and Shakti can unite
      within me at last. I hated the Shiva within me for a long time. Now I
      love Him unconditionally.

      OM Shanti OM Shanti Shanti,


      Wanted to repost this one too, in which Gene made a rare appearance as
      *Arcturian Flame-Being*. The flame passed to me by Gene continues to light the
      Love, Gloria

      Message: 9
      Date: Mon, 30 Aug 1999 21:51:35 -0700
      From: magus@... (==Gene Poole==)
      Subject: Re: Kaffea/a crumb for you


      Re: Kaffea/a crumb for you

      Portrait of the artist as a young girl:

      Are you aware that in reading

      That the voice you hear as you read these words

      Is none other than your own voice?

      It is the same voice that confers

      Bitter worthlessness

      Upon the hearer

      There are so many voices

      Which ones to trust?

      Trust the ones that love you

      How is one to know love

      In the bitter recession

      Of all that is good?

      Love does not ever speak

      Ill of the one who is loved

      No bitter remonstration

      The one who is loved

      Is the one who may love

      If you have been loved, love

      Silent retreat

      Rest to the soul

      Letting go of protection

      It is seriously known

      It is known to be serious

      It is serious to be known

      Allowing bitterness to pass

      Fading with each day

      Abiding reconfiguration

      Vital circulation


      A river flows

      No idealism left

      Cupboards bare

      Yet breath continues

      Blank walls

      Do no harm

      Quiet is peace

      Chrysalis fragile

      Move and it is powder

      Do not move and you are dead

      Fondest memories

      Essence will remain

      You may sleep

      Repair by angels

      No worry needed

      It is grace

      Wiping away dusty webs

      Opening the verdant window

      Tiny one asks for entry

      The man

      Who paints the pictures

      Will catch you if you fall


      *Arcturian Flame-Being*


      Dear Andrew,

      This entire apparent world
      is the "human mind in action".
      The idea of being human is
      "mind in action".

      When "mind" resolves
      the conundrums that
      result in all these fires,
      there is nothing left to
      do but put out the fires.

      You have seen the sky on fire.
      What will put that one out?




      For the sake of simplicity, mind could be seen as a potential to
      perceive and respond but when overloaded (overstimulated), it is
      auto-generating "garbage" (mind-chatter), likely to interfere with "normal"
      functioning, which is perceiving and responding ONLY WHEN REQUIRED
      (stimulated). When not required (stimulated), it is silent (no
      mind-chatter), and that is the empty mind - inactive, just a potential.


      Dan and Jody:

      >> Dear Jody,
      >> Anytime there is a being who carries
      >> reactions from what other beings
      >> did to that being or did not
      >> do for that being, there is "contradiction
      >> of being".
      >> When a being carries nothing with that
      >> being regarding what other beings
      >> did or didn't do relative to that being,
      >> that being is not "in relationship",
      >> hence not in contradiction.
      >> That being is "not a body, not a mind"
      >> to what ever extent a body is in relation
      >> to other bodies, or a mind is in relation
      >> to other minds.
      >> This "being not in relationship" is
      >> not a being that is outside of
      >> relationship, yet to say that it
      >> is "relationship itself" is not
      >> enough. It is more than relationship
      >> itself, and that is where words fail.
      >> Words imply entities in relationship,
      >> as each word has "meaning" only
      >> in the context provided by other
      >> words with meaning.
      >> Words that appear on this screen do not
      >> necessarily imply that one being is
      >> telling something to another being.
      >> Love,
      >> Dan
      >Then you're nobody talking to no one?
      >Come on Dan. It's a conceit. In the context
      >of this discussion, you are Dan Berkow, even if you
      >have ceased to know yourself that way. Whenever something
      >shows up from Dan Berkow, it is regarded as having come
      >from the computer that belongs to the entity that pays
      >taxes known as Dan Berkow.
      >As such, there is a being known as Dan Berkow who
      >is telling something to a being known as Jody.
      >You can dance around that all night and the next day,
      >but from the regard of this discussion, it is certainly
      >more true than not.

      Dear Jody,

      No, the fact that there is a name has
      no association with the implication
      that there must be a real and separable
      entity who bears the name.

      Because there is a conceptual world which
      involves money and named entities paying
      taxes does not require that there be
      a really existing entity involved.

      This is not dancing around.

      It is a deep look at "the human mind"
      and the depth possible is not
      actualized if remaining stuck
      with seeing this entity vs. that
      entity, this entity having its
      reality by what it thinks of that entity.

      The dance, as I see it, is avoidance of
      the "deep issue" as to who it is that
      is talking here. And to take it
      as one entity giving information to
      another entity limits the depth of the

      I post this only for the sake of love,
      for the sake of "looking deeply".
      If it works, great. If not, throw it out.

      It's not a debate of a Dan-entity with a Jody-entity.

      If looking deeply is, what will be seen is this:
      The deep-seated assumption that a named
      entity infers a really existing entity
      is groundless.

      To call looking at that
      "dancing around" preserves an assumption
      "continuing itself as valid".

      To call a disagreeing point of view
      a "conceit" merely continues
      the inference that an entity
      must be doing something
      for a motivation of its own.

      Beware of assumptions about what is
      real - they may hide reality from view.



      Melody and Jan:

      ºHi Jan,
      ºlistening deeper here.....
      ººIf so, then does one *really* have a duty
      ººto WAKE UP?
      ºYes - because every man wants him/herself and fellow-beings to be
      ºhappy and "waking up" does just that.
      ºHow does one go about waking hirself up?

      j: One doesn't - in a "civilized" society, Self-awareness wouldn't get "drowned" in
      the first
      place and it would mean effortless dissolution of the sense of "I" without the hassle
      dazzle of "enlightenment".
      In the present society, Self-awareness is "drowned" and that has to be corrected
      first, it is
      called "waking up" or "enlightenment".
      M:ºBy 'waking up', do you mean: dropping the sense of 'me'?

      j: No, by "waking up" is meant what I described as:
      "to wake up from.... yes, from what? It cannot be remembered anymore, yet something
      nice did happen one cannot convey in words as it appears nothing did happen after all,
      but a
      sweetheart would see it immediately".

      M:ºIf so, how does a 'me' drop 'me'?

      j: No dropping whatsoever - the sense of "I" is burnt out, in an almost literal sense
      as feelings
      of burning will abound. That is why I maintain the issue of "hard wiring of the sense
      of 'I'"; the
      mind-body is noticeably changed and at times it can be quite painful.




      white wolfe has been so busy suffering the pangs of love rejected and scorned, he is
      amused to
      find anyone would bother to deny something so obvious as the First Noble

      did this long string start with the simple koan i wrote between the master and the

      here are some more reflections on the meaning of suffering as experienced by this wild

      further up and further in,

      white wolfe

      Meditations on Pentecost in the Age of Misery<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns =
      "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" />

      I sit and await stillness and silence

      in the false darkness of the clouded sky at twilight.

      Slowly the blue and white canvas melts, fades

      into emptiness.

      The symphonic chorus of the universe resolves itself

      into tranquility.

      I sit in the infinity of limitless space,

      the eternity after one breath ends and before another begins.

      Suddenly, as the last darkness that will ultimately envelope the first light,

      He who is the Sacred Heart,

      as if suspended on a Crucifix of teeming blue light,

      She who is Avalokiteshvara,

      sitting as if upon the moon floating in the empty firmament,

      are before me.

      I ask him,

      Why must I suffer

      He says to me,

      So you will understand Love.

      I do not reply.

      He says,

      You must love all my Creatures as you love true Self.

      I say, I do not understand

      He says,

      You must die to self.

      You must take up your cross and follow me.

      You must live in the world but not on the world.

      You are not the Lord of Creation but its Steward.

      I am the Son of the Father who is the Light of the Universe. You must become as I am.

      Then and only then will you have Peace.

      I am the Way of Love.

      I say to her,

      What must I do to stop suffering

      She says to me,

      You must cleave to the light but hold to the dark.

      You must become an empty vessel.

      You must allow the suffering I send you to carve you into a vessel of Love

      Then and only then will you be able have compassion on all Creatures.

      I am the Daughter of the Mother who is the Darkness of Creation. You must become as I

      Then and only then will you have Joy.

      I am the Womb of Compassion.

      I say to them,

      I am weak.

      As One they speak to me,

      We are strong enough to suffer for you so that you may join us in Love.

      We are here to Love you until you join us in Compassion for all Creatures.

      Touch our Sacred Heart and you will become Love.

      Call our Secret Name and you will become Compassion.

      As One they speak to me.

      You are not yet one of the gods.

      You are something more than just a creature, but you are still a Creature.

      You are one among the many, but the many are the one.

      Just as We are not one, but two, not two, but One.

      Until the one is ready to surrender to the many this remains the Age of Misery.

      Humility is the beginning of the endless journey from Suffering into Joy.

      Let go of self interest. Awake! There is no self. Take up your Cross and follow me.

      The fields are ripe to harvest. There is much work to be done before the end of time.

      They are gone.

      I remain pierced, wounded by light.

      I am still, enveloped by darkness.

      She who is the Bodhisattva.

      He who is the Christ.

      Their names and faces are many through the ages.

      In stillness and silence I remain,

      remain dark and empty.

      The emptiness of the false dawn washes into the fullness of endless days.

      The symphonic chorus of the universe lifts its voice in jubilation of a new beginning.

      I am in the in between time of eternity.

      The time after one breath ends and before another begins.

      And now I am not the same as I was.

      I have been called to a new life and given a new name.

      I have been called on a journey and there is no going back.

      Lamb of God have Mercy upon us.

      Kwannon Bosatu show us the way of Compassion.

      Most Sacred Heart of Jesus grant us Peace.

      Make us worthy of fulfilling the Promise of Creation.

      My name and the name of the journey are the same.

      And that name is Love. I fall into your arms my Immortal Beloved.

      As it was, is now, and ever will be world without end.

      Mark Christopher Valentine


      Forwarded from a friend:



      I was having an out-of-body experience one day so I grounded myself and got
      centered with the help of my spirit guides and almost astral traveled
      anyway, but the phone rang. I sensed the negative vibrations so I threw
      the I-Ching and checked my numerology chart and nearly had a primal, but my
      energy was too blocked, so I did some bioenergetics and self-parenting,
      took some flower essence and ate an organic oat bran ginseng muffin, but my
      inner child wasn't feeling nurtured yet so I had a Rice Dream Frozen Pie
      too, but that made me hyper so I did the relaxation response while
      listening to my subliminal tapes, but I was feeling depersonalized so I did
      some polarity work, foot reflexology and past life regression, then
      rebirthed myself and called Moon Beam, the bodyworker, to make an
      appointment for a Shiatsu, Reike, Rolfing, Feldenkreis, Swedish, Japanese
      deep tissue massage, but she flaked out and never returned my call, so I
      decided to energize my crystals and do some positive imagery because all
      my visualization techniques and affirmations made my space feel invaded, so
      to get empowered, I got a psychic reading from Mother HeartLove around the
      issue of my assertiveness so I could feel my radiance and have some energy
      for my psychocalisthenics and inversion swing before my harmonic brain-wave
      synergy session, which made me more focused for my actualization seminar,
      holistic healing class and dream workshop, so I'd be more clear for my
      Gestalt behavioral cognitive transpersonal Rechian Jungian Freudian
      Ericksonian session at the hot springs but my aura was weak for my
      trance-channeling group so I fasted until noon to recharge my chakras and I
      sensed my intuition was high and my cycle was focused, so I turned on my
      ion generator to open up for my neural-linguistic programming session, but
      I needed to have my pyramid recharged before my guided synchronicity
      meditation, so I got some craniosacral therapy, which aligned me for the
      fire walk, which was between my tarot card reading and my sensory
      deprivation tank appointment, but after all that I felt what I truly needed
      was a meaningful relationship to mirror myself so I went to my personal
      shaman, and then to my guru, but they were no help, so instead I went to
      the Intensive Whole Life Earth Rebirth Cosmic Expo Symposium Workshop to
      find someone who really knew what was going on, but that didn't work
      either, so I locked myself in a calcium coated Orgone Box and went to sleep
      so I could "get it" in the dream state.

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