#5013 - Sat/Sun Aug 31/Sep 1, 2013 - Editor: Dustin LindenSmith
- #5013 - Sat/Sun Aug 31/Sep 1, 2013 - Editor: Dustin LindenSmith
The Nonduality Highlights • http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NDhighlights/This issue of the "H of the HL" comes from a 2010 issue edited by Jerry which features a dialogue with the contemporary nondual heavyweight Charlie Hayes, whom I believe to be connected directly to Sailor Bob Adamson, if memory serves.The dialogue focuses on that funny mind quirk some of us can develop early in our introduction to pure nonduality, when we feel like we understand all this stuff intellectually but still aren't able somehow to apply it successfully to our lives. Charlie has a pretty effective way of drilling down to the most important question of all in this person's quest. He also helps to organize some of this questioner's confused concepts about where "they" sit in the context of awareness itself.I enjoy these kinds of dialogues quite a bit. They often involve people who consider themselves to be serious seekers and who have a genuine drive to "get it," and if they can successfully disentangle themselves from their own personal story at that stage, then they might just surprise themselves by fully awakening not long afterwards.Dustin---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Jerry Katz <umbada@...>
Date: Wed, May 26, 2010 at 10:15 PM
Subject: [NDhighlights] #3905 - Wednesday, May 26, 2010 - Editor: Jerry Katz
To: NDH <firstname.lastname@example.org>, NDS <email@example.com>, iam <firstname.lastname@example.org>, NDSN <email@example.com>, AdvaitaToZen@yahoogroups.com#3905 - Wednesday, May 26, 2010 - Editor: Jerry KatzThe Nonduality Highlights - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NDhighlightsCharlie Hayes responds to questions:"Tan1772" writes: I totally "buy" that I exist and I have awareness.
C: Please DON’T! There is absolutely NO way to say a truth that can be bought or believed; “The truth that can be said is NOT the Real Truth”. Do not believe, accept or “buy into” ANY concept! As must be repeated over and over until it really sinks in: These are conceptual POINTERS ONLY. Look where the pointers POINT rather than taking them on board as some “truth!” And have a look: WHO is it that “buys” this anyway?
Q: But that's exactly where I am stuck:
C: WHO is this “I” that “is stuck?” That is a concept, nothing more and nothing actually real. That “I” seeming to be stuck on itself; and the stuckness (glue) itself, is just a habitual firm yet false belief that what you are IS that “I” thought. You assume you ARE that sense of being a separate “me”. No matter how much you try to get “unstuck” you stay stick until and unless you root under that “I:” sense to find out if it is actually real! The glue is your belief in that person, your mask that you wear to prop up a sense of insecurity that “you” have been fighting since about age three.
Q: I feel that my awareness is a function of this body. When my body is gone, my awareness will also be gone.
C: This is a confused view: You do not "own" awareness; you ARE awareness. And yes, the body is required for consciousness, for sure. The Awareness, the Timeless Being, is That which ALLOWS consciousness, body, world etc to appear yet That is absolutely independent of all that, including the consciousness of being-awakeness. That body and its consciousness disappear in deep sleep every night while Awareness remains ever present giving life to a sleeping body, breathing it, living it, growing its hair, fingernails, being its heart etc., all with NO consciousness whatsoever. So let the seeing be clear that awareness IS PRIOR and Eternal while consciousness comes and goes.
Awareness IS, eternally free, nondual and empty, clear and full in Itself; duality-consciousness is the first appearance IN Awareness. Awareness is Eternal, while consciousness comes and goes. Don’t confuse or collapse these. Awareness ALWAYS IS regardless of the happening of consciousness OR unconsciousness.
Q: Of course I can't say that with experiential certainty…
C: Right. So that cannot be a timeless actual truth, can it!?
Q: but it seems to be true by observing people who died. They are no long aware of what happens. While I can't locate my awareness (I can't because it's a function of the body rather than something solid), my awareness is nonetheless dependent on the body. The best analogy I can think of is actually the one often used in non-dual teaching: the body is the light bulb that shines the light of awareness. The light is not specific anywhere, but if you take away the bulb, the light also disappears.
Q: Can you 'enlighten' me on this, literally?
C: No. But YOU can, the Real You, which is that unperceivable self shining Light-Of-Knowing that exists forever, prior to, during, and after any and all concepts, experiences and all the manifest passing phenomena. That (Noumenon) is what IS; all else is what APPEARS. AND, these are NOT TWO. Ungraspable for the mind, which can only understand opposites. Stop trying to figure this out There is NO joy in the mind, the field of opposites, positions and concepts and points of view are all useless for this. Stop. Now. YOU ARE. That simple Isness-Awareness which registers consciousness and unconsciousness is what You are. BE That and nothing else. Full Stop Period. And the bottom line is, these are Not Two. You need NO "enlightenment". You already ARE the Light of Being, Awareness arising as Consciousness. It is that simple!
Thanks for writing; feel free to stay in touch until any and all confusion is dissolved.