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Tuesday, August 8

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  • umbada@ns.sympatico.ca
    If you think that everything is under control, you re not driving fast enough. ~ Mario Andretti --Andrew Macnab Or you haven t crashed yet! --Manchine
    Message 1 of 1 , Aug 9 4:14 AM
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      "If you think that everything is under control, you're not
      driving fast enough." ~ Mario Andretti --Andrew Macnab

      Or you haven't crashed yet! --Manchine

      Jerry, you wrote/asked:

      Has anyone ever practiced meditation while lucid dreaming?
      The great thing about it is that you don't have to relax
      your body. Your body's already quite relaxed. In fact, it's

      I've done lucid dreaming meditation a few times. The first
      thing you notice is what I just mentioned: there's no
      bodily relaxation to practice. How about the easing or
      releasing of thoughts? There's none of that either. In fact
      the only thought would be, 'I am dreaming'. There's none of
      the other junk pressing on the mind. Then arises the
      thought, 'I'm going to meditate'.

      The meditation begins immediately. For me, there is direct
      contact with the third eye. Whatever chakra you focus on
      will immediately absorb your attention, I would think. I
      don't know, though, because I've never talked to anyone
      about it, nor have I ever read anything about this

      What happens to me is that the third eye opens viciously,
      it swirls and reveals all kinds of symbolic secrets and
      offers to suck me in. It's very powerful.

      I have also inquired 'Who am I?' in a lucid dream. It
      throws me to my body, or it finds me looking into a mirror.
      It shows me my real self, I think. I say, 'I think',
      because the whole darn thing is a dream! It has the veil of
      dreaminess about it no matter how lucid it is.

      I don't know whether lucid dreaming meditation or inquiry
      has value other than recreationally. It's possible that
      inquiry would be more clearly understood when waking
      inquiry is compared to lucid dreaming inquiry. Waking
      inquiry is much more effective, I find. Lucid dreaming
      meditation is recreational and very interesting. I wonder
      if others sensitive to third eye activity would try it.
      Maybe others could try inquiry during lucid dreaming and
      report what happens. It's recreational inquiry, my latest

      Hi Jerry,

      I am familiar with what you say here.

      In my own such dreams, I have the experience of leaping
      vastly ahead, and of preparing the future for myself. This
      includes pruning or parsing my identity, to the point that
      I am undistinguishable from the future.

      Jerry: Hi Gene, isn't the leap 'vastly ahead' the same as
      leap into the deep present? I'm not sure why the 'future'
      is used, unless the feel of the process of the pruning and
      parsing dissolves the future and in that dissolving the
      future opens as a vast and evident emptiness.

      Gene replies: This is my tricky way of pointing out that
      the future is unknown, and that like the future, I am
      unknown. The future is The Unknown; we live here at the end
      of time, the future is the spigot of Grace, can we take it
      as it is? Can we take the flood of raw, and can we resist
      projecting yesterdays colors and patterns upon it? Is it
      true that we can 'know' only by comparison, and by
      comparison to what 'was'? In sum, can we allow the unknown
      to be just what it is, whatever it is?

      If we can see that we now live in a 'reality' which is
      perceived through formal protocols, If we can see that we
      interpret rather than perceive, if we can see our own
      folly, we can then see. Knowing our own folly, we can relax
      about the need for stringency; we can see that our
      stringent insistence upon accuracy is driven by criteria,
      and that criteria are implanted, not essential. Still, I
      feel it is good to be able to differentiate between our
      folly and what is; in fact, our folly is just another
      species of what is, and because it is so, it is possible
      for us to see our folly. Our folly is in the face of what
      is, pancake makeup and lipstick and eye-shadow, making us
      the unknown in drag.

      Gene had written: This is no different in 'waking' or
      'dreaming'. I admit that I have lost the distinction
      between the two.

      Jerry responded: Whether one is dreaming or waking, there
      could be the clarity that 'this is it' and so there would
      be no distinction there between waking and sleeping. While
      I can't say I have that clarity with every dream, or hardly
      any dream, and while there is unconscious deep sleep, there
      remains a continuity.

      Gene responds: Yes. Is the continuity one of identity
      (folly) or is it the continuity of the impersonal

      Perhaps this is the actual question, answered by the
      eternal "First there is a mountain (identity), then there
      is no mountain (identity lost, background now foreground),
      then there is (foreground now mountain, identity is

      Jerry said: I don't feel that I awake to a new day each
      day. Nor do I feel that going to sleep marks the end of the
      day. Sleeping and waking happen, and so do dreams, but
      there is a continuity of empty being that knows no break,
      no discontinuity. However my body certainly knows waves of
      emotion, thought, feeling, and all that, including
      sleepiness and alertness! These waves always settle,
      eventually, into the continuity of empty being. So there is
      no distinction between waking and sleeping.

      Gene responds: Understood. Perhaps at a certain point, each
      person begins to experience a backflow of time, a sort of
      doubling of presence, like how when one stands in the surf,
      the water coming in, flows over the water going out,
      producing what is called 'undertow'. This bi-layered
      experience gives the option of experiencing both, or one or
      the other. Or if one simply relaxes, one is rolled out to

      Gene had said: If I don't like the future, I don't like
      myself. If I like myself, I like the future.

      I am like the future; when I get there, I will be only what
      I am.

      Jerry responded: In a sense, then, there is really no
      getting there. If anything, I feel the future comes; it's
      like an ever-welling of an ocean wave on the horizon.

      Gene responds: Agreed. Have you seen the Australian movie
      'The Last Wave'?

      Gene had said: Face it, the future haunts like a ghost,
      making identity squirm. Whose footfalls are those, heard
      upstairs at midnight?

      Jerry responded: The footfalls are vibrations sent to break
      down the wall obstructing the view of the horizon. Until
      one can see the horizon, the future can haunt.

      Gene responds: Thanks, Jerry.

      The future haunts in the same way as do the 'ghosts of
      vanished vitamins' in the Uncle Ben's Rice commercials; and
      our follies are the ghosts which must be made visible.
      Eating our folly-vitamins makes us strong enough to surf
      the unknown.

      Hanging Ten,

      ==Gene Poole


      J: In a sense, then, there is really no getting there. If
      anything, I feel the future comes; it's like an
      ever-welling of an ocean wave on the horizon.

      G: Agreed. Have you seen the Australian movie 'The Last

      Greg Goode: I love it, I've seen it about 6 times, starting
      when it first came out in the U.S.


      Gene: Is the continuity one of identity (folly) or is it
      the continuity of the impersonal background?

      Ed Arrons: Identity/story/personality is some kind of
      object that appears to the impersonal background. No object
      that appears in consciousness can be continuous. Even
      continuity is an object and is not continuous! The
      impersonal background, which is what the object appears to,
      is what is continuous.


      Any Byron Katie fans out there?

      I just picked up a spicy little book:
      _Losing the Moon_

      This from Byron Katie:

      God is good, God is everything - the end.
      You go on with your illusion that something
      is not okay
      and you lose
      and you lose
      and you lose.

      It's all been a misunderstanding:
      The ego to me is a beautiful thing.


      From Mu

      My Lover

      My lover has diamond lazer eyes
      They pierce anything!
      My lover has a furnace in her mouth
      Her tounge burns anything!
      My lover has arms like swords
      They cut anything!

      My lover wants you.
      Why do you tremble?
      Her eyes see only love.
      Her kisses are wine.
      Her embrace brings comfort.

      Come, be destroyed by my lover.
      Come, be alive!



      Peace - Michael


      A selection from A Long Day's Journey into Night was sent
      to the list by Skye a few months ago. I've included it in
      today's Nondual Daily Nugget:




      The snapshots I scanned came out using a lot of KB, so they
      take a while to load onto your screen. They are too much
      for the limited memory left on NDS, but I think you all can
      get into the HS files to see them. These are some rare
      occurences caught on film here. OH came out of a 20 year
      retirement from dancing to appear, and a photo that caught
      Harsha actually levitating may be seen. (If anyone knows
      how to reduce the KB, without sacrificing too much detail
      quality, please assist.)



      Bruce rode to the rescue!! he reduced the Kb and put them
      up into NDS. Thanks Bruce, you are a sweetheart too! ~Glo




      Gloria, nice job! The pictures are great. My heart warms
      when I muse over that heavenly retreat and all you
      magnificent souls that graced it. It really is a re-treat.
      With fond memories and appreciation for your energetic and
      caring involvement.

      In this empty space,
      the abyss of light comforts
      like mother's warm arms.

      Gloria, you are the light and the warm arms.
      Love, Mary


      I have been in a 'timeless' state of being
      since coming back from the NDS/HS retreat.


      Peace - I lost my watch! - Michael


      It seems that the understanding of enlightenment,
      nonduality, and duality etc., throughout the ages, boils
      down to a process of focusing and defocusing attention, and
      how that process conditions and remedies the perception of

      One may notice, with sufficient experience, that breathing
      and focusing work together in this conditioning (and
      reconditioning) process.

      This process typically operates randomly (or by grace),
      agitating and pacifying the self. Upon experiencing
      sufficient agitation (suffering) breathing becomes
      arrhythmic followed by a gasping for breath. In that moment
      of deep inbreath, a defocusing from agitated perception to
      Awareness occurs. Apparently, this is how healing begins.
      At some point this noticing remedies one's everyday
      perceptions of separateness.


      A NET of JEWELS daily meditations for seekers of Truth
      RAMESH S. BALSEKAR http://www.advaita.org

      August 9

      Anyone who has truly apprehended that it is impossible for
      him to live independently according to his own "will power"
      would naturally cease having any intentions. When he is
      convinced that living is a sort of dreaming in which he has
      no control over his actions, all tension ceases and a sense
      of total freedom takes over.

      ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~

      Whatever is perceivable is perishable, but your true nature
      is that which is neither perceivable nor perishable.

      We are the Nonduality Generation.
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