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NDhighlights for Saturday, August 6, 2000

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  • Melody
    ANDREW offered: The individual self can exist only as a process of becoming, whereas THAT WHICH IS is the perennial state of BEING. Therefore, its realization
    Message 1 of 1 , Aug 6 8:21 AM
      ANDREW offered:

      The individual self can exist only as a process of becoming, whereas THAT
      WHICH IS is the perennial state of BEING. Therefore, its realization is
      the annihilation of the individual.- Ramesh Balsekar

      Between the idea
      And the reality
      Between the motion
      And the act
      Falls the shadow

      Between the conception
      And the creation
      Between the emotion
      And the response
      Falls the Shadow

      Between the desire
      And the spasm
      Between the potency
      and the existence
      Between the essence
      And the descent
      Falls the Shadow
      T.S. Elliot
      From: THe Hollow Men


      also from ANDREW:

      Finding this silence is the whole point and essence of meditation. Then you can be aware of it always throughout your life. It is
      Reality. It's not about going somewhere, or running after something.



      During process of morning waking, one takes only a few slim volumes
      from what is an infinite library, and this is the initialization of
      identity. Being the essence of those few slim volumes, disqualifies
      and thus makes invisible the 'rest' of the library; in this way, is
      an individual made.

      If during process of morning waking, one refuses to select, and thus
      refuses to initialize identity, what one is, is 'just consciousness',
      unformed. In this case, the entire library is available; no
      qualifiying or disqualifying criteria (the structure of identity) is
      in place, to act as filter.

      In this version, awareness is infinite space, and this space is
      populated by information. In this version, all information is in
      awareness, not limited by identity, but instead freely and
      immediately available. Identity is a nexus around which information
      clusters, as determined in the moments of initialization of identity.
      Identity limits what is 'known', only to what is familiar to that

      The journey of identity is characterized by a very slow gaining of
      additional perspectives, because it literally does not know, what it
      does not know; it can relate only to what is included in the process
      of initialization during waking. Expansion of identity is the usual
      goal; yet, we can see that identity is essentially doomed. Refusal to
      initialize identity upon waking, gives access to what a slow-growing
      and yet doomed identity would eventually have, eg, 'everything'.

      During deep dreamless sleep, there is no identity, yet life
      continues. In waking hours, social needs demand identity; waking
      initialization of identity occurs because of social demands. Waking
      practice of minimal identity disqualifies the need for extensive
      waking initialization of identity; eventually, identity is reduced to
      'name, rank, and serial number'. No social interaction can actually
      demand more than that; carrying more than that, is what disqualifies
      the rest of the infinite library of information.

      The entire infinite library fits easily into the space which is
      awareness; if consciousness is unhampered by limiting identity,
      awareness is primarily of awareness 'itself', which is 'me' or Self.
      It is the 'me' which refuses limitation, which is aware of awareness
      as the primary, having free access to space (emptiness) and all that
      it contains. Identity must travel on fixed tracks, but conscious of
      awareness as Self, is the 'off-road vehicle'. Social needs entrain

      Memory is a string of pearls, identity is the thread which binds them
      in a certain order. If the thread is pulled out, memory reforms as a
      constellation of relationship of awareness to awareness;
      consciousness is able to appreciate itself as a movement in
      awareness. It is this movement of consciousness which is the ability
      to choose of what, identity is initialized of; it is the deliberate
      suspension of movement of consciousness, which eventually allows
      'choosing' less identity upon waking. This is a practice.

      Identity is optional. Awareness is the emptiness of space, in which
      everything 'is'. What is in awareness in optional, or 'of choice'.
      Consciousness is movement in space.

      Consciousness is the child of space; consciousness moves from object
      to object, but all objects are in awareness-space already. When
      consciousness sees this, its movements are stilled to a great degree,
      stilled, for the ready availability of everything makes searching
      unnecessary. Consciousness which is aware of its parent-emptiness,
      finds itself in a comfortable womb.

      If during waking processes, one turns away from the shelves of the
      volumes of memory, one faces empty space. Through practice, one can
      eliminate the bulk of identity. Waking practice of minimal identity
      allows access to unrelated and related information, even that which
      'identity' has never learned. Impersonal memory can be accessed.

      If we see that the usual process is the growth of identity, and that
      identity is what qualifies (limits) knowledge, we can see that the
      less of identity there is, the more of knowledge is available. In
      this way, what is 'unknown' (to identity) is available to
      consciousness. Consciousness is what chooses, and moves in the
      process. Needing less and less, movement is lessened, and the
      emptiness of awareness is suddenly full; this is the dimension of

      ANDREW responds:

      What occurred to me reading this post is that identity and personality are not the same thing. Nor is personality dependent on
      identity, though identity might be dependent on personality. In fact it seems that the less identity the more intense powerful and
      free personality becomes. It occurs to me that perhaps personality carries identity as a burden. With a lighter load of identity,
      personality remains. We remain diverse.

      GLORIA forwards some RAMESH S. BALSEKAR
      quotes, and asks:

      What do you guys think of this idea of Being/becoming.

      "The guru makes no distinction between the great and small when offering the golden gift of salvation. He is always there as guide
      to all, pointing to THAT which is the real nature of all seekers."
      "The individual self can exist only as a process of becoming, whereas THAT WHICH IS is the perennial state of BEING. Therefore,
      its realization is the annihilation of the individual"

      JAN responds:

      This could open the doors to debates whether or not the individuality can be annihilated or not... The dictionary gives for


      1. a. The aggregate of qualities and characteristics that distinguish one person or thing from others. b. An individual or
      distinguishing feature.
      2. The quality or state of being individual; singularity: She was so absorbed by the movement that she lost all sense of
      3. A single, distinct entity.


      Regarding 1, many specific properties and characteristics remain, are not affected in essence. Regarding 2, the sense of
      individuality can be lost without losing the potential to respond so that 3 won't apply; the real nature is undifferentiated which
      leaves no room for whatever sense of "I", whether "small" or "cosmic".

      Regarding "becoming", one could argue that as long the potential to differentiate remains, "becoming" would indicate a process of
      decline for this potential. One might argue just as well that when knowing "who one is", irrespective the state of the mind, the
      issue of "becoming" is moot.

      Being is in becoming but different (a buddhist would say being becomes).
      There is no becoming without being (vis a vis experience) and there is
      no being without becoming because being has identity only in relation to

      Creativity is the process of becoming, the individual a creation, a creature. In the perennial state of being there is no creation
      or destruction, it is a steady state. Annihilation of the individual in what sense, Ramesh is a unique individual with unique
      traits, as was Nisargadatta before him. So annihilation from his own point of view? Meaning looking out at someone else one sees an
      individual, looking in at oneself one does not. But then comes the understanding that there is no split between observer and
      observed, so there goes individuality out the window, or does it? Alternatively the understanding can be that I am all individuals.
      That the individual is fluid, constantly changing. So, on one hand, that which is is the perennial state of being, on the other
      hand, change happens. Both incontrovertable. The becoming individual rises out of and falls back into constant being. Movement and
      stillness. The process of becoming is movement, the individual is movement. Being is stillness. I'm not sure if what I've written
      here makes sense. It's late here.



      Until you really know what active K. is, there's no way to
      understand silence.

      Consciously recognising this is recognizing the silence, they coexist
      in THIS.


      MELODY and GENE:

      M: It's such a marvelous experience to allow both
      opposing forces at the same time, Gene. When I do
      so I am immediately shifted to 'witness' position....
      witnessing and allowing both the body 'refusal',
      along with the conscious 'allowing' of thought
      and experience.....that they seem to neutralize
      that 'pulling' - of moving towards/moving away...

      they become simply 2 ingredients of 1 experience.

      Yes. The one thing is the conversation we (each of us) are; the two
      ingredients are the 'interloculotors' which carry on this

      It is good to experience oneself as this conversation (one thing); in
      this way, all conversation is eventually understood to be between
      self and self. This realization is the release of social obligation,
      and eventually, world-dream identity.

      People are designed to be free, and less than free, they suffer.
      Suffering has stimulated the myriad approaches to relief, and has
      intensified and deepened conversation. This is all internal, but is
      projected as the world-dream. Our social obligations force us to play
      the roles we suppose we are trapped in.

      Eventually we will all see that each of us is a chatting
      conversation; each of us is a 'virtual neuron' in a Vast, Aware
      Living Infinite System. In this awareness, our projected
      transactional conversations will suddenly become on-topic; in this
      moment, a state of 'unity' (the reference here is to nuclear physics)
      will occur. In this moment, do many become one.

      By being 'on topic' right now, we welcome unity, or 'Big Bang II'.


      JERRY and GENE:

      I have also inquired 'Who am I?' in a lucid dream. It throws
      me to my body, or it finds me looking into a mirror. It
      shows me my real self, I think. I say, 'I think', because
      the whole darn thing is a dream! It has the veil of
      dreaminess about it no matter how lucid it is.

      I don't know whether lucid dreaming meditation or inquiry
      has value other than recreationally. It's possible that
      inquiry would be more clearly understood when waking inquiry
      is compared to lucid dreaming inquiry. Waking inquiry is
      much more effective, I find. Lucid dreaming meditation is
      recreational and very interesting. I wonder if others
      sensitive to third eye activity would try it. Maybe others
      could try inquiry during lucid dreaming and report what
      happens. It's recreational inquiry, my latest invention.

      I am familiar with what you say here.

      In my own such dreams, I have the experience of leaping vastly ahead,
      and of preparing the future for myself. This includes pruning or
      parsing my identity, to the point that I am undistinguishable from
      the future.

      This is no different in 'waking' or 'dreaming'. I admit that I have
      lost the distinction between the two.

      If I don't like the future, I don't like myself. If I like myself, I
      like the future.

      I am like the future; when I get there, I will be only what I am.

      Face it, the future haunts like a ghost, making identity squirm.
      Whose footfalls are those, heard upstairs at midnight?


      BERTRAM introduces himself:

      May I first say that I feel honored by your groups acceptance of me
      a new member. Namaste! I am 68 and a retired film and tv writer
      director...I also have been following a path of spirituality for more
      than 40 years...mostly in the form of Advaita and also the teachings
      J. Krishnamurti. I must also include a period of Zen study...Between
      films I would move "inwards" to That which is the only Reality.

      I retired to a small village in France in 1982 where I spent most of
      time painting and studying (and some teaching) of Advaita and related
      forms of One Pointed Meditation that Ramana Maharshi considers
      prior to Self inquiry ( AtmaVichara.)

      Since returning to the States (California) in 1991 I have taught
      Advaita related meditation and have directed and edited three one
      documentaries on Eastern spirituality : "Abide As the Self": The Life
      And Teachings of Ramana Maharsi..."Awaken To The Eternal" The Life
      Teachings of Nisargadatta Maharaj...and "Open To The Infinite" a live
      event with Ram Dass and Krishna Das.

      Recently I've created a meditation website(streaming audio)
      where visitors are guided through a ten minute mindcalming
      session whose purpose is to relieve stress and also help meditators
      slowly ease into a silent mind and a deep meditation (one might say
      acts as a pre-meditation warm up.) These mini-meditations are ancient
      and were meant to quickly "annihalate" the personality (ego) prior to
      long meditation sessions. The sessions are also efficient in helping
      people to sleep better. The site was sponsored by friends and
      and so there is no charge for Mindcalming sessions. Should you be
      interested in doing a Mindcalming session,visit: www.mindcalming.com

      Thank you again for allowing me the honor of being a member of your


      I very much enjoyed your guided
      meditation and found it very effective
      in 'slowing the mind down'. After
      hearing only the first 6 words, and
      recognizing the hypnotic 'cadence',
      I happily recalled many of my first
      moments of 'stillness' that often
      came in my practice of hypnotherapy
      ....simply by hearing that slow 'cadence'
      of my own voice. I had forgotten how
      naturally I began 'shifting'...getting
      more and more still....as I invited
      others to do the same.

      I particularly appreciated the
      invitation to listen to the 'spaces'
      (which you provided beautifully),
      and the invitation to look at
      2 feet away from you, and
      notice 'you' are one of the objects
      in the room. Very nice.



      The Beloved is a Hidden Treasure
      (For the Mirror)

      "I was a hidden treasure, and I desired to be known; therefore I created the creation in order that I might be known." -Sufi Wisdom

      The Beloved is like the fragrant kiss of the Rose. A hidden treasure to be appreciated, courted, Ungraspable, not to be possessed,
      merely enjoyed. Ephemeral and illusive as the time during which her delicate petals gently unfold and then wither, falling one by
      one back to the dark, fecund earth. Her form and essence, briefly one, falling in two, her ravishing beauty withering, as you watch,
      into dust. Her essence, her sweet perfume, drifting, arising, Heavenward, floating endlessly upward on the wind. Ironically, both
      returning, having again become two, both to the Root, one by falling, the other arising, Returning to the Source, the original
      dark Nothingness, the Father and the Mother of the revealed and the hidden, of all that flourishes in the laugher of sunlight and
      wind. The body to the gentle Mother, the soul to the loving Father.

      The Beloved is like the lingering of ruby red wine, a kiss of flavor stolen from a sacramental chalice. Something forbidden
      trickling hotly into the blood, igniting the soul with a holy fire that won't burn out. Whispering of an ecstasy that can only be
      expressed as a burning, burning, burning, longing, longing, longing, a thirst that cannot be quenched, a fire that cannot be
      smothered. The Beloved's chalice is one that is never full, never empty. No matter how many times the Lover returns to steal a kiss,
      lift the Beloved by her silver waist, gaze into her golden eyes and lift her holy nectar to his parched and burning mouth, The
      Lover is never satisfied for more than a fugitive moment. His burning, burning, burning, longing, longing, longing is to become one
      with the Beloved. To become the wine, the holy vessel, and by drinking, drinking, drinking, drinking, become one and of the same
      essence that is the Beloved.

      There is little the Lover can do but futilely attempt to stand in the stillness and be present to the Rose. And so, for a moment, at
      least, halt the relentless procession of all Creation through devouring time, its remorseless expansion into ever retreating space.
      And patiently await, calmly stand, tranquilly sit, until, His form begins falling and his essence wafting, until, his burning fires
      his body to ashes and his soul to smoke.

      Then like his Rose, he who is one will become two again, Then and only then, for, perhaps, the first time, in life and in death,
      They will be two souls of One Spirit dancing upon the Cosmic Wind.


      There is a Rose of such virtue
      She is the Rose that bear Jesu. Hail, Mary, Mother of Bliss and Love.



      An agitated state is an ideal time to ask "who am I". The I of the storm
      is a dead calm, simply there.

      I was in the library today when a mirror image of my various qualities
      arose in the worst imaginable light. That is a very good time to
      remember Self :))

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