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  • Liliana Pechal
    JERRY KATZ: Tasting I AM All I know is that I ve sat in my room and been face to face with nothing but myself and it has seemed like the only real thing there
    Message 1 of 1 , Jul 9, 2000
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      Tasting I AM

      All I know is that I've sat in my room and been face to face
      with nothing but myself and it has seemed like the only real
      thing there is. I have valued and trusted it beyond
      anything. Though there are endless attempts to describe that
      communion with self, they all fail. At best they are
      scriptural. But they all fail. One fails, stumbles and falls
      to the ground. Whoever looks most graceful falling down,
      looks most graceful getting back up, but it's still
      beautiful failure. Even scripture is beautiful failure. The
      only success happens when one is alone, tasting I AM.



      JERRY KATZ concluded:

      "Men are from earth. Women are from earth. Deal with it."

      Thanks to M on the Bhairava list.


      ANDREW MACNAB wrote:

      The question "Who am I" is the ultimate question. "What am I doing?
      Where am I?" like
      all other questions break down into it if followed to their end. It
      is the self
      referential existential question for the doer, the ego. When its
      unanswer is seen and
      it is thereby undermined, there is silence.
      Silence is at the core of all the teachings. Ramana emphasized
      silence more even
      than self enquiry. Self enquiry is doing. It is a way of exhausting
      doing. Silence is
      non-doing. The true guru, the universal inner guru, is the silent

      "Silence is like the even flow of electrical current.
      Speech is like obstructing the current for lighting
      and other purposes. However much a jnani might talk,
      he is still the Silent One. However much he might work,
      he is still the Quiet One." R. M.

      Another point emphasised by Ramana is that the jnani sees everyone as
      a jnani. Here
      again, silence, silent satsangh is the only true community of jnanis,
      and the question
      "Who am I" leads to the doers end.
      Advocating the asking of a question is the illusion of the guru's
      words, it takes an
      illusion to satisfy an illusion. The illusion of the doer is like a
      hunger which is
      satisfied by the illusion of the words.
      Ramana does not advocate asking the question over and over so that
      it becomes like
      a mantra or a prayer. The question is only asked once, and it
      continues under its own
      power. So really as soon as the question is truly asked, the words
      are eaten, that is
      the end of the doer. The asking of the question is the doer's final


      - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
      And JUDI RHODES commented:

      ****** No. "Who am I" is really the answer to tbe question "What am I
      "Doing" is the "I" itself. The "doing" and the "I" are one and the
      is just the activity of seeking, a notion of an "entity" that thinks
      gonna get something or go somewhere. No, there is no one that is
      enlightened. Sounds like a darn good idea though doesn't it? :-)




      --- In NondualitySalon@egroups.com, LBIDD@w... wrote:
      > Here's a snippet from Sobottkaji:
      > If I am not anything,then what am I? The answer is simple:
      > I am the pure Awareness that is aware of all things, and
      > the pure Presence that is the Presence in all things. I am
      > the Awareness of Presence, and the Presence of Awareness.
      > What could be more simple, and yet so profound and so
      > liberating
      > ------------------------------
      > What does "the pure Presence that is the Presence in all
      > things" mean, and how can it be "not anything"?
      > Larry
      'Presence' is usually understood as the essence of something
      which is being sensed. Thus, "the pure Presence that is the
      Presence in all things" might be the ultimate Essence, refering
      back to Pure Awareness. A case of uncertainty covering all the
      bases with a touch of doubletalk. :) Ed




      All is Self
      That is All!

      Supreme Essence
      Is the Presence
      Looking out of eyes
      Hearing into ears

      So simple
      So difficult
      Self playing
      With Self

      Hey, Self!
      Get hand out of pants!

      I LOVE YOU

      I Love You
      Warts and wrinkles and all
      In drama and despair
      In laughter and love
      In the good
      In the evil
      In the dance eternal
      I Love You
      One and All
      In your greatest works
      In your glorious failures
      Your Presence is undying
      Your Love has no qualities
      I Love You
      I love your searching and seeking
      I love your finding and being
      Your beauty is terrifying
      Your terror is beauty
      You lift me up
      You dash me down
      You create me
      You destroy me
      You keep me in darkness
      You keep me in light
      Your Presence is undying
      Your Love has no qualities
      I Love You.


      Peace - Michael


      Some excerpts from the thread on Papaji and Bhagavan Ramana:

      MARK OTTER and JUDI with BOB ROSE commented on the following statement:

      Self Inquiry wrote:

      > Yet another difference between
      > Ramana Maharshi and Papaji:
      > Papaji recommended no effort.
      > Bhagavan Ramana recommended intense effort.
      > --uarelove

      So do you mean that this is an either or situation? I understand
      virtuosos (for example musicians) need to practice and practice and
      until they get to a point where the playing itself takes over and
      getting out of the way is the way to a virtuosic performance. Could
      resolve the apparent paradox? Ramana gave great advice to everyone.
      the practice becomes no longer necessary, the surrender to natural
      happens anyway.) Perhaps Papaji was so enthused about this that he
      the direct teaching. This may well have been fine for those who had
      practicing long enough anyway, and it may well be that the advice
      others needed was not offered. (can a being for whom love comes
      make mistakes?)

      someone who hasn't even started practicing yet, for whom love is an
      thought rarely even entertained,

      - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
      BOB ROSE with JUDI:

      Homer Simpson summed it up nicely:

      "Trying is the first step towards failure."


      > ******** LOL! Homer said that?? If anyone would know, he would! :-)
      The question I think should be, is not "who am I", but "what am I

      I think it is a betterquestion though. A person can sink their teeth
      into that, insteadof flying off into never never land with all their
      speculations of how wonderfully wonderful they are and how everything is
      so wonderfully wonderful. :-)

      Ain't it rich?
      Love much,

      - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

      mathew files wrote:
      > --- In NondualitySalon@egroups.com, Self Inquiry
      > <uarelove@y...>
      > wrote:
      > >
      > >
      > > Bhagavan Ramana gave a method that has suceeded
      > >
      > > on many occaisions, one of those being Papaji.
      > >
      > > --uarelove
      > >
      > >
      > ---------------------------------------------
      > Is there objective proof of success?

      No nothing has ever been prooven objectively, if by
      proof ones means verification of Truth. Not only in
      spiritual subjects, this also applies to all subjects.
      Proof is when thought is satisfied with a conclusion,
      a belief. That proof is not Truth, it is an opinion.
      Only one in whom the ego notion has ended can
      recognize one in whom the ego notion has ended.


      - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
      And MARK OTTER commented here:

      Dear matthew,

      Do you flinch? Does the whisper of ege ever cause you to pull back?
      Does fear ever affect your equanimity? Telling stories about others
      a distraction unless it directly affects this process of responding
      fear. Is disagreeing with a story the act of love or the act of
      fear? I
      don't know the answers to these questions. I sense often when I make
      response, such as this one I am typing now, that there is some fear
      there, pushing the keys.

      trying not to flinch, and reaching out to touch others with the

      - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
      More from MARK:

      They stand so close together there is no room to flinch. We have all
      in non-flinching mode, so it is not so hard to practice. Do whatever
      you stand there with the flinch unneeded. (not firmly held against
      flinch - that's the wrong way, but with the flinch so exposed, so raw
      vulnerable, that the warmth of God rushes in and makes it silent and
      full.) you know. do this yourself and let others find it too. don't
      question their findings if questioning their findings will make them
      back and flinch again. that's the objection to this talk. it does
      this to
      me. no wait, that didn't feel right... okay, I will acknowledge that
      I once
      talked about relaxation and how difficult it is to relax further when
      seems relaxed and how it often is not complete, and tensing up can
      the direction again, allowing further relaxation. perhaps that is
      what is
      being pointed to here. perhaps tales of failure are meant to
      failure. it doesn't matter what folks are pointing towards. What
      matter is how i hear them and what happens next... so point in any
      you want, and I will feel my way forward trusting in my Self.

      Love, Mark

      Self Inquiry wrote:

      > Only one in whom the ego notion has ended can
      > recognize one in whom the ego notion has ended.

      - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

      M: And.....if the guru did refute someones
      > claims (as papaji
      > did) that might not mean that the person isn't
      > realized. (Then again
      > it might). Who's to say? You? Me? (hoo haa).

      Here we get to the crux of making simple things very
      complicated unnecessarily. The Sages have chosen to
      use words. Consider the example of Nisargadatta as to
      just taking a Sage words literally and simply. (...)

      Nisargadatta said:

      I obeyed him because I trusted him.


      I trusted my guru.

      What he told me to do, I did.

      Whatever happened, I would turn away

      my attention from it and remain with the

      sense I am,

      it may look too simple,

      even crude.

      Read part two at:


      and see the example of Nisargadatta just taking

      his Guru's words literally, and simply without

      interpreting them.

      If one interprets them or makes it complicated

      that opens the door for the ego notion to change and

      distort everything.



      - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
      And YOUARELOVE continued:

      Although doubting can be a great aid in the beginning

      and it may be wise to doubt all spiritual Teachers

      and supposed Sages and to check out many options

      etc. That same doubt can be an ego notion preservation

      strategy if it continues forever.

      After one has done the above described due

      dilligence, and found a Sage that one

      has the most confidence in,

      including confidence that the ego notion

      has ended in them, then it is time to stop doubting.

      And it is time to stop the spiritual mixture,

      the spiritual soup of many paths.

      Then the Trust that Nisargadatta mentions,

      and his taking his Guru's words quite literally

      and simply become the valuable aids,

      even more valuable than the doubt was.


      - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
      JERRY KATZ commented:

      Wiser than the sages.

      Self Inquiry wrote:
      > The ego notion has a tendency in most humans to think
      > it is wiser than the Sages.
      > --uarelove

      It has a tendency to think all kinds of things. The ego
      imagines a competition and imagines outcomes of that

      Has any Sage ever claimed wisdom? Seeing that no Sage has
      ever claimed wisdom, there's really no competition. Joshua
      Pritikin has clearly pointed that out in his work on
      competition and nonduality. I always knew to trust my own
      direction. No wisdom by any Sage is superior to that. No
      scripture is superior to that. If anything, Wisdom and
      Scriptures are inferior to that, but since they are not
      competing with me, nor I with them, there is neither
      inferiority nor superiority.


      The Mechanism of Competition



      Old friend Alan Kuntz submitted this link to KundaliniHeat


      A National Public Radio interview with William Segal, a man
      in his 90's who has studied Zen and Gurdjieff.

      Thanks, Alan.




      15 new links have been added to the

      Spiritual Net Directory in the last few days.

      There are now 27

      links to where on the web you can read

      the Teachings of:

      Ramana Maharshi

      Adi Sankara

      Yoga Vasistha

      Nisargadatta Maharaj

      The Ashtavkra Gita

      The Ribhu Gita

      The Avadhuta Gita

      other ancient texts of Advaita Vedanta

      the living Enlightened Sages Russ and Nome


      Hui Neng


      and Vimalkirti Nirdesa Sutra: click:


      with love,



      The day before there was also a very merry unbirthday of BRUCE!:

      (...) Please do notice that every day
      is a new birth -- so much better
      than a mere sun-cycle count (...)
      So then, as per Sri
      Madhatterji Maharaj:

      "A very merry unbirthday
      To me
      To who?
      To me
      Oh, you

      A very merry unbirthday
      To you
      Who, me?
      To you
      Oh, me

      Let's all congratulate us with another cup of tea
      A very merry unbirthday to you

      Now statistics prove
      Prove that you've one birthday
      Imagine just one birthday every year
      Ah, but there are 364 unbirthdays
      Precisely why we're gathered here to cheer

      A very merry unbirthday
      To me?
      To you
      A very merry unbirthday
      For me?
      For you
      Now blow the candle out, my dear
      And make your wish come true
      A very merry unbirthday to you"

      BRUCE also recommended:

      I highly recommend the free
      funds transfer service
      available at www.paypal.com



      To see god is to be God.
      There is no all apart from God
      for him to pervade.
      He alone is.

      - Sri Ramana Maharshi
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