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Wed./May 17

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  • umbada@ns.sympatico.ca
    TIM S CONFESSION JERRY: Thank you for your breath-taking nonduality. TIM: I ll pass the credit along to Grace, and to my Guru, Dan Berkow. His words are not
    Message 1 of 1 , May 19, 2000

      JERRY: Thank you for your breath-taking nonduality.

      TIM: I'll pass the "credit" along to Grace, and to my Guru,
      Dan Berkow. His words are not "common" words at all, but
      act on me as a hand tuning a radio receiver. They set up a
      resonant frequency, and I am instantly and effortlessly
      drawn to and locked onto that frequency. Call it "The
      nondual frequency" if you will, or just "This." Suddenly
      there is bliss and wonderment, and a permanent end to all
      ideas and concepts. Words go no further in explaining this,
      except to indicate that what some call a "direct
      transmission" does not at all depend on being in the
      physical presence of a body. Whatever Dan- Ji is, he is not
      something located in time or space. He is the end of all
      dreamlike appearance, the end of all self-inquiry and "I
      AM" focus, and the beginning of utter wonderment.

      Despite myself, I have been initiated. I have taken



      There are two kinds of teachers, those who like their
      disciples' dependence on them and tend to prolong it, as it
      maintains their status as "gurus" ; and those who treat
      their disciples as equals and try to make them independent,
      self-sufficient, free. Nisargadatta clearly belongs to the
      latter :

      "In reality, the disciple is not different from the guru.
      He is the same dimensionless centre of perception and love
      in action." (343)

      "The guru is there for giving you courage because of his
      experience and success. But only what you discover through
      your own awareness, your own effort, will be of permanent
      use to you." (510)

      "He wants you to see yourself as he sees you. Then you will
      not need a Guru to obey and follow, for you will obey and
      follow your own reality." (215)

      His was a message of self-help, of self-discovery.
      Sometimes he was surprised to see the same visitor coming
      day after day and asked him why he kept on coming, had he
      not heard everything he needed?, now he only had to go and
      investigate for himself.

      For him this investigation consisted not in finding a truth
      that could be learnt from others, but in removing one's
      untrue beliefs, in discarding one's false ideas. That alone
      would make the real and true shine by itself. Because it is
      never absent, it is always here, now, only veiled by our
      wrong thoughts and beliefs.

      Not that one should do anything, either. Or could. Only the
      changeful can ge changed, but not made changeless, so why
      bother at all with it? There's no need of change to reach
      the one Reality, which is unchanging (solid like a rock).



      Lately i do not seem to be able to grasp anything at all,
      especially in this field. Whatever pops up, it's all
      nonsense. The moment it pops up, it's gone. Whatever was
      taken for granted, is put to question. No answers needed
      though. Life is easy that way. Life is very Light and full
      of funny contradictions. Enjoy ! :)))))))



      Oral nondualism seems to be "talking the talk", an easy
      thing for most and a sneaky little trap when we can do it
      eloquently. Then there is the matter of "walking the walk".
      However i dont think nondualism is something that we do or
      not do. It isnt something that we can practice. There is no
      such thing as nondualistic activities as opposed to
      dualistic activities. Nonduality is simply the context of
      all manifestation. There is however enlightened duality.



      The greatest myth perpetuated by religions of all stripes
      is that we are somehow separate from God. In truth, we are

      The myth on this list is that we are dual and must discover
      the truth about non-duality. Therefore we keep telling each
      other how to do it and what we must do or not do to realize


      Peace - just preaching to the choir! - Michael


      Funny indeed - especially when finding out that the absence
      of separation isn't necessarily the same as unconditional
      happiness. Nonduality is easy - understanding that there is
      no separation. The joke is that unconditional happiness
      cannot be understood - not even experienced.

      Not preaching but laughing,



      In the news, they were interviewing a Catholic Cardinal and
      among his comments was that he really didn't have a clear
      idea of the holy trinity. Made me think. :-o

      Well, we know it's complicated and all... among us, it has
      been seen, but it is more difficult to conceptionalize
      mentally and practically impossible to explain. Perhaps
      this was the Cardinal's problem, what's he going to say in
      a 5 minute interview on TV?

      It's a thing that some here say can't be communicated by
      anybody. It's a matter of Grace (the Holy Spirit). Only
      Grace can lead one to this knowledge. It comes to you
      because X said the key words... Was it X that gave it to
      you? No, of course not.

      Even so, it seems that Grace doesn't tell all her secrets
      at once. And the combinations and permutations are endless.
      She gives you a peek at the Father perhaps, or insites into
      what one of the walking sons has said, but without the
      rest, you're worse off.

      Lots of words, explanations, things that make you feel
      better. The mental picture of what the holy trinity (or
      nonduality if you will :-) is becomes a caliapy, that you
      can talk about, and with which you can make other people
      feel good. And that can lead you astray.

      It would be unfortunate if the Cardinal "really" did not
      have an "idea" of what nonduality was, but too, it is said,
      it IS, and there's nothing more to do. It's probably for
      that reason that the "church" says "trust me", it's easier,
      and maybe for the reduction in complication it will "save
      more people"!

      But still, part of the "mystery" that we are to trust, the
      miracle; is that we are not separate, yet here "we are"
      individually, working on understanding "the father, the son
      and the holy spirit". In the name of that singularity,
      coming back to it so that it doesn't exist apart.

      Some cross themselves when they pass a church, some when
      they want something, some when they finish a prayer.

      How many cross themselves for no reason at all? In the name
      of nonduality.



      Zero is too large a number to indicate nonduality, because
      the existence of "zero" implies the existence of
      "non-zero." Numbers are in the mind as concepts and do not
      reflect the nondual.

      Petros (some here probably remember him) once gave a
      mathematical formula he claimed represented nonduality:

      1 - 1 = 0 (or alternately, -1 + 1 0).

      However, he ignored this:

      (1 - 1 0) = 1

      (-1 + 1 0) = 1

      In other words, his supposed "nondual math" is in fact
      purely dual, because "1-1=0" is a set. He paid attention to
      the supposed meaning behind the numbers, forgetting that in
      order for there to be numbers, there must be someone
      present to count, or someone not present to not count.
      Nonduality is beyond both. Neither words nor numbers can
      communicate its essence.




      No nonsense, just me and you. Two worlds completely apart
      trying to understand.

      I'm sorry if I seemed rude we don't know each other.

      Maybe we have to start there first. We can't be wrong,
      we're both excellent people :-) We know that.

      OK, with our little problems, we know that too right?

      Anyways, I don't care about the problems.

      Mine or yours.

      I'd just like to know you. OK?

      Imagine where we could go!




      Hi Dave,

      I finally got a chance to watch the first part of the
      'Jesus' mini-series that I had taped Sunday.

      I love this portrayal of Jesus very much. Very much indeed.

      Not only do I love his joy, and his dancing, and his

      I loved one scene in particular:

      An adulteress had just been brought before Jesus for his
      judgment. When he looked at her, he did not look at her
      appearance, he looked deeply into her eyes without even the
      slightest indication of disapproval or judgment......as if
      he were looking forever. Somehow, I know that the
      adulteress, upon feeling that gaze, began experiencing
      shock waves move thru her body.....not simply waves of love
      or acceptance, no. But the shock that his gaze said: there
      was so much more to the 'adulteress' than what she looks
      like, what she does, or what others 'know' about her.

      That look was enough to change the adulteress' life. (The
      movie didn't say so.....I just know this.)

      After that gaze he then invited "he who is without sin" to
      cast the first stone. And of course, no one could.

      Mary Magdalene was observing this all very closely you

      and as Jesus was leaving the courtyard, he looked her way
      and said, "Do you want to come with us?"

      "Where?" she asked.

      Jesus: "Does it matter?"

      Mary: "Yes. I go where I want. I'm free."

      Jesus: "You're not free. But you could be. Why don't you
      come with us?"

      Mary: "You treated her like......like she was worth

      Jesus: "She is. So are you."

      And with that, Jesus walked away....leaving Mary free to
      choose her course.

      [We know that Mary became a disciple of Jesus....and if the
      written accounts are reasonably accurate, we know that she
      was never really accepted by the other disciples

      ......many of whom were very critical of her.]

      Dave, you say you want to get to know me....

      well... I have just told you the essence of my life's
      'story' in the story I told above.

      You asked me before if I'm hyper sensitive. The answer is
      'yes'.....hyper sensitive to judgment and criticism, to
      stone throwing, and being treated as something 'worthless'.

      Only a 'Jesus' who can look deep into my eyes and 'save' me

      .....and by that I mean: can help me shift my attention
      from the world of the superficial and the personal to that
      which is transcendent.

      I know Mary M. so well, that I can tell you: had some
      preacher or master approached her and began telling her
      what she *should* be doing... and what's wrong with
      her....if he began telling Mary she was deluding
      herself.....or if he told her she needed to 'shut up and
      listen!' (LOL!),

      I can guarantee you what Mary M would have said! It's very
      much akin to what you have heard me say. :-)

      My name is Melody, Dave, And it's nice to meet you.

      signed, a friend


      Samraj (excerpt from Drifted in the Deeper Land)

      You don't want to cling to the body, to the mind, or ask
      any more questions, or engage in any transactions with the
      body-mind. You are looking forward to the peacefulness, the
      contentedness, the happiness, of objectless sleep. You are
      looking forward to it. You would like to do it right now.
      Well, make this not merely a natural impulse of each
      day-cycle, make it your heart-impulse, and you transcend
      death and all suffering.


      Be willed to this, then, in every moment, and relinquish
      the anxiety of attachment to the body-mind.


      So much for death, then. So much for the daily news. So
      much for the clinging activities of an uninspected life.


      This appearance of life will end like any dream ends. But
      you always Stand in the Superior Position, having Communed
      with (Self) and even having slept. You need not take these
      objects seriously then. You are superior to the fault and
      the adventure and the horrible epoch or epochs of mere
      appearances. ...

      Go to sleep in peace. Meditate in peace. Live in peace.
      Live in Depth. Be in Depth. Go to this Depth. Be in this
      Depth. And be Free and Happy

      We are the Nonduality Generation.
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