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#3377 - Wednesday, December 10, 2008 - Editor: Gloria Lee

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  • Gloria Lee
    #3377 - Wednesday, December 10, 2008 - Editor: Gloria Lee Nonduality Highlights - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NDhighlights Thanks to all who wrote, here are
    Message 1 of 1 , Dec 10, 2008
      #3377 - Wednesday, December 10, 2008 - Editor: Gloria Lee
      Nonduality Highlights
      - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NDhighlights 


      Thanks to all who wrote, here are some reader responses to:

      "...this isn't about not duality, it's about nonduality."
      "not duality" is a concept. a negative one, to be sure, but definitely a concept among the "pairs of opposites."
      "nonduality" is before [beyond?] any such conceptualizing; including my conceptualizing here.
      - orva schrock
      Perhaps it means that 'not duality' (two, the division of two words) implies that we are striving to not be dualistic - which is itself a form of dualism, as we segregate what we believe 'dualistic' is against what 'not dualistic' means. Perhaps this striving is yet another 'problem' we create to get over - yet another barrier we need to climb over to get back to what We Are. And 'nonduality' might be a means of expressing the concept in one word, as opposed to two, thus demonstrating to the audience that what we are looking for is not broken into parts, but One, deep inside us?

      - Jasper Self
      Though not really schooled in this teaching of those who appear here, but rather from the dzogchen point of view, a form of nonduality,  this would be my venture:
              Not duality could mean anything, from a denial of duality to a trinitarian stance or simply a materialistic point of view or many other things. But the important thing is this term implies a contrast. That is you are saying something is not dualistic but you could be saying it is something other than nondualistic or something specific. As soon as you set up the contrast, of course, you are being dualistic.
              Nonduality to me means that things just are. It implies simply what is, without any statement of what it is or any evaluation as to content, meaning or attractiveness or non- attractiveness. No evaluation at all. Just clear being. Things just so. No judgement as to qualities or stances or anything else. And, of course, no one to make a judgement.
              I think it is what Heidigger meant in his characterization of dasein, or Plotinus and other mystics meant and what Garab Dorje was trying to tell us. It is far beyond my abilities but takes a real poet to tell us. Longchenpa did a most interesting job of it in his thousands and thousands of pages ( and all in Tibetan, too ) but it is something that has to be experienced.
              To my way of thinking people like Adyashanti, who has more appeal than many other modern teachers, are prating on and rattling on in a very, very boring way about something that is beyond their descriptive capacities. But it is beyond mine too, so I won't go on.
      - Earl
      I get this thus:
      We ponder self and no-self, ego and no-ego, awakened and not-awakened, duality and not-duality. This keeps us busy for decades, deliberating the play of opposites. The nondual, however, is just that - nondual. Neither dual nor not dual. One. No number two or also-rans. Yet without it the game of opposites cannot come into being.
      Crazy stuff to try to speak of, this, and as Adya points out it makes no sense. It can't be realized logically, it's tumbled into when the brain lets go because it finally senses it can't solve the problem. And the tumble is a one-way ride to non-sense land. That's the beauty of it: no self and no no-self and no good sense. Just the shuddering gasp, the speechlessness of a stalled brain ...
      And water to carry and wood to chop!
      :-) Louisa

      Rock Medicine

      This Rock Medicine is not a cure for
      the imaginary ailment that keeps
      the preachers in business.

      It's neither reason for hope nor
      cause for despair, encourages no
      improvement, cancels no debt,
      nor adds any new one.

      It's Rock Medicine, with
      absolutely nothing to
      recommend it.

      It may be the remedy
      for remedies -

      discard as directed.
      Do it now.

      Because it is freely available
      to all, it is most common.

      Since its value is unknown,
      it is priceless.

      A treatment of Rock Medicine
      accomplishes nothing, incites
      no transformation, stirs no
      secret power, confers no

      Truly, the ultimate
      medicine of last resort.

      It has no initiated practitioners,
      nor evangelizing enthusiasts,
      nor protocol of application.

      It will never be passed on
      from one to another -
      there is no other
      like it.

      Confounding and obscure
      to the meaning-making mind,
      it's the means by which
      mind makes mind.

      All are welcomed to it.
      There's no charge.

      It belongs to nobody, nor
      can any ingredient be added
      to it or subtracted from it -

      it works alone.

      It neither improves nor degrades
      with time, temperament,
      or experience.

      It's always forgotten, though
      it can neither be learned
      nor forgotten, and so -
      a lesson in itself!

      Don't forget it.

      If there were a word for it, it
      wouldn't be the genuine
      Rock Medicine.

      What praise or complaint could do justice
      to that darkness from which the stars
      themselves emerge at night?

      Unnoticed in the spiraling commotion
      of the grand galactic interweave, it will
      humbly thread about its business,
      leaving no trace behind.

      The secrets contained within it
      are amazing and profound.
      Thus, it has no secrets.

      It's Rock Medicine.
      Nothing goes down easier.

      The compassionate choice,
      it's avoided till the end.



      posted by Bob O'Hearn

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