Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Sun./April 16

Expand Messages
  • umbada@ns.sympatico.ca
    Better late than never, here are the Sunday Highlights! I hope everyone is healthy and happy. Jerry JAN BARENDRECHT Doesn t it take two to tango? When hurting
    Message 1 of 1 , Apr 18 11:17 AM
    • 0 Attachment
      Better late than never, here are the Sunday Highlights!
      I hope everyone is healthy and happy.

      Jerry

      JAN BARENDRECHT

      Doesn't it take two to tango? When hurting oneself badly by
      stumbling over a stone, no one will curse the stone but when
      the same hurt is thought to be caused by another human, is
      that a reason to get angry with him/her? The default setting
      of the mind is "ignore" because without its (semi-automatic)
      filtering one would get insane - how unpleasant the "extra"
      perception can be is witnessed by empaths who can't turn it
      off.. In order to see abuse, one has to make the assumption
      that someone is an abuser first.

      The continent where most abuse is taking place is Africa as it
      can be called the victim of slavery and colonialism - the
      continent never recovered from it. Thousands are dying from
      hunger, malaria, TB and aids whereas on this list you are
      seriously discussing hidden forms of verbal abuse? Wouldn't it
      be time to readjust the filters of the mind?

      ***

      What could possibly be the advantage of understanding, which
      is a mental function after all? Would a biochemical knowledge
      of the tongue, nerves and the brain "produce" the
      understanding that sugar will taste sweet? Of course not. Only
      tasting sugar will produce the sensation of the sweet taste.
      That the taste can be worthwhile, can only be recognized by
      observing someone fully enjoying it. Likewise, that
      Self-realization is worthwhile, can only be recognized by
      observing one, fully enjoying "lasting joy" - a matter of
      recognizing "inner silence" which was never absent but always
      overlooked as "the obvious".

      Politely refusing the "gift" of understanding ;)

      __________________________________________________________________

      ANDREW MACNAB

      Model citizen huh? Well that's one label I never had to wear.
      Whew! just lucky I guess.
      I get the point though, it doesn't matter what the label is, it's
      not me/you. Any identity is based in comparing, evaluating
      yourself against others, against society. It's not what is.
      And it does take some concentrated inquiry to really see through
      the whole identity business, often brought on by a life crisis.
      Because then one is confronted with the fact that one's identity
      isn't true, and with a functional identity like 'model citizen'
      it takes a lot to see that the identity isn't true. On the other hand,
      if your identity is 'goofy fuckup' perhaps it's easier to come to a
      point of nonfunctionality where its untruth is seen!

      __________________________________________________________________

      GENE POOLE AND ANDREW MACNAB


      Gene Poole wrote (in part):

      > ...I would point out that while we can say that what is 'mistaken
      > impression' (or even delusion) is 'not what is', that we also have a
      > basis in recognition of what is and what is not... and that in this
      > basis which we carry, the 'what is not' is accorded at least as much
      > weight as 'what is'.

      andrew: Good point, even in its falsehood, it still IS. It is what is not.
      A false concept exists as a false concept.

      > These 'poles' of reality (what is VS what is not) exist as the
      > templates for 'positive' and 'negative' evaluations, and thus act as
      > guides for us in our navigation 'toward what is (or seems to be)
      > 'true and real'.

      a: Where are we headed? Here and now.

      > Being in touch with our own indwelling criteria, that criteria by
      > which we decide, feel, or know what is real or true, may be even more
      > useful than 'knowing' what is real or true. I am saying that if we
      > are aware of what determines our decisions, we are better off than we
      > are, even after having decided 'correctly'.

      a: Yes, I get it, that makes sense, that takes some digging.
      The criteria are the machine tools in the identity factory.
      Rather than trying to discover and discharge all our identities,
      our personal truths, which are legion and we make new ones
      all the time, we can become aware of the manufacturing process,
      and realise that we are not the product that's rolling off
      the assembly line.

      > Powerful contrast equals great resolution. Both poles
      > cohabit our criteria-basin; great contrast is also great tension.
      > Great tension can lead to great discharge; great discharge can be
      > 'either' great anger, or great bliss. Trying to dispose of one pole
      > (the 'negative') is thought to eliminate anger, but if that could be
      > done (which it cannot), also gone would be bliss.
      >
      > If, on the other hand, each pole collides with the other... neither
      > anger nor bliss: = Nirvana.
      >
      a: Really it's simple, being open to anger, bliss or whatever shows up
      and not getting attached to anything. (Simple to say it at least)
      And awareness of the context; anger, even great anger, is a puny
      thing when set against infinity. Bliss though seems quite large. Ample.

      Gene, it's a great pleasure corresponding with you.

      andrew
      _________________________________________________________________

      NEO

      This is one of the most common questions of spiritual self inquiry.
      There seems to be two options.

      If one takes the scientific view we are a body which is not as it
      appears but a constantly fluctuating area of energy and perhaps tiny
      small bits of mass. When we are awake or dreaming the brain generates
      consciousness. When the brain dies then consciousness ends as do we.
      If someone is observing the body while in deep sleep it is still
      there. It does not blink out of existence.

      If one takes the consciousness view we are consciousness and all that
      is, is generated from this consciousness much like a dream. A problem
      I have here is deep sleep. Consciousness appears to disappear from
      existence. If consciousness is who we really are this does not appear
      to make sense.

      Perhaps I have entered a period of self doubt. Any intelligent, non
      abusive replies would be appreciated.

      ______________________________________________________________________

      HARSHA

      The experiencer never was and the Experiencer Is the Inexhaustible. When the
      Seer and the Seen Merge, Unity or Wholeness Recognizes Itself. It Recognizes
      ItSelf as the Eternal and Complete Principle which the ancients called One
      without a second. That which Stands Alone and Free without any support what
      so ever is truly the Self. It is never absent. It Is.

      Once some time back, I asked Sandeep, What is it that you imagine is absent
      after "enlightenment" that is present now. The "disconnect" between our
      state now and the state of "Realization" exists in imagination only. That is
      the strength of imagination. That is called Maya. No one denies the
      limitations of words. Still words are used to indicate Reality.

      It is God pointing to It Self.

      Where else to point?

      Love to all
      Harsha
      __________________________________________________________________

      HARSHA

      Anyone who has been in the spiritual/religious field for any length of time
      will notice that it is no different than any other field. There is politics,
      intrigue, competition for attention among teachers, gurus, etc. Everyone
      claims to have the superior way. Even in the area of exploring the nature of
      the Kundalini Shakti (call it the Holy Ghost or Divine Spirit), the
      competition is heated and intense.

      Over the last 25 years, I have seen many teachers and gurus ridicule each other
      and different paths, and their
      disciples of course take their cue from their gurus. Sometimes the criticism
      might even be justified from some point of view. But this is how spiritual
      business is done. This is how spiritual business always has been done.
      El Collie on the K-List, mentioned examples of healers who could not heal
      themselves. This is not uncommon. That is just life.

      There is a long history of teachers and gurus hiding their own shortcomings
      and problems, sometimes serious, and acting as guides. Certainly, people can still benefit from
      their teaching although some may be misled and harmed as well. This is why it is
      important for spiritual aspirants to take some responsibility and
      familiarize themselves with at least the basic religious and Shakti
      literature which comes from the genuine spiritual traditions.

      Hinduism, Jainism, Buddhism and Taoism and to some extent the
      Judeo-Christian traditions have been the main sources for me. But there are many other veins
      of knowledge as well. These are there for all and can be studied and
      reflected on.

      The genuine aspirant cannot remain satisfied with endless
      intellectual questions and answers or endless psychic experiences through
      kundalini manifestations. But there are subtle questions arising from the
      longing of the Soul, such as (What does it all mean? Where is True Rest?
      What is the foundation of experience, any experience? Who seeks answers? Why
      are answers sought? Who asks questions?). If such questions do not trap one
      in the jungle of intellectual mumbo jumbo but are followed to the source,
      they can hint at the Pull of the Heart.
      __________________________________________________________________

      JUDI RHODES

      The idea that someone has something that you do not. Absurd.
      Well I'm here to tell that I have something alright, nothing! That's
      what I have. You want something to 'get', that's what there is to 'get'!
      I gave my whole life for nothing! Isn't that a hoot!

      ***

      Sometimes I have heard that people just retire to a cave, which I can perfectly
      understand. I went thru a very apathetic period myself with the whole business of
      it, and Gene and I talked abuot it and bumped it entirely out of the plane
      of human enlgihtenemnt and on to the next which is not human at all.
      Lies in space itself. Another 'realm' and 'form' entirely.
      If there is something more, I have yet to see it.

      ***

      A relationship failed for me. Not just any old
      relationship, but a relationship that I bank-rolled the whole shooting
      match on, everything. There was nowhere and no one and no place left
      for me to turn, I saw that I just would have been repeating the same
      old thing over and over again. So there was no way out. I saw that
      I was hurting and had to fix it. I had to get a life of my own outside
      of relationship and experience.

      ________________________________________________________________________________

      DAN

      Between heaven and hell is an instant of no-time.
      To live there, before heaven or hell exist.
      Then, compassion flows naturally, which is "heaven".

      __________________________________________________________________________

      XAN

      Congratulations! You have just received an electronic greeting.

      To view your greeting, simply click on this link:
      http://www.aol.americangreetings.com/pickup.pd?i=44637357&m=4202&rr=y&source=aol109

      ***

      What is so great about human voices?
      It's a cacophany in this world.
      Sound and fury, signifying nothing.

      ***

      "Others" is just appearance.
      And yet, having participated in the saving of
      some lives from utter despair leaves me in
      awe of the roles Grace sometimes has us
      play with each other.

      ***

      My definition of Awake is
      knowing silent source/lovebeing as yourSelf
      ego or no ego.
      My definition of Self-Realized is
      perfect surrender of all ego stuff to Self.
      Until there is Self Realization I am Awakening.
      ____________________________________________________________________

      HARSHA

      Perhaps because we experience our existence as individual entities, the
      possibility that Existence is only experiencing itself in a particular manner is
      worth reflecting on. Existence might be called the Great Mother or the Great
      Emptiness from which all things are born. From the perspective of the mind, the
      experience of Self is often described as Sat-Chit-Ananda (Existence,
      Consciousness, Bliss) in the Advaita Vedanta philosophy. A spiritual path might
      be defined in terms of which attribute most appeals to the mind. Once a student
      asked a teacher, "How can I really know whether I
      exist or not after death?" The teacher said, "You Are Existence." The jump was
      too big. The student became silent. One day, after many years, the student
      Realized. The Self Is Existence. Pure Perception is the Same as the Pure
      Perceiver. It is not nothingness. It is devoid of things. It is No-Thingness.
      This perception is devoid of all thoughts and concepts and imagination of this
      and that and therefore is free from interpretation. To say It is beyond this and
      beyond that is to make a mystery of it. No need to complicate the simple beauty
      of who we are.

      _________________________________________________________________________________

      MARY SALEGUI

      This is the crux of the matter...this attachment to the belief. I,
      myself, am attached to so many because in my mind people and things
      should be a certain way and I suffer when they are not. I'm slowly
      undoing this bondage of mine through Byron and ACIM. Anyway, here it
      goes..

      How attached are you to your belief that people should be kind? How
      do you think and behave around people when they are not kind and you
      believe that they should be kind? Are you judging them, trying to
      change them, feeling sorry for them, feeling superior to them because
      you practice kindness? Are you frustrated when your efforts to
      change their behavior meet resistance? (The Course, by the way, says
      that there is nothing you can do to change the world; the script has
      already been written.) Are you not being unkind in your mind when
      you judge people as unkind? (rhetorical questions, just for your
      consideration)

      And who would you be if you did not hold that belief that
      people should be kind when they are not? What would you be like?
      More peaceful, less frustrated, less disappointed, more accepting and
      loving, more kind perhaps? I think that that is how I would be if I
      drop my belief that people should be kind and I clearly see that is
      not the case in this world .



      __________________________________________________________________



      We are the Nonduality Generation.
      http://www.nonduality.com
    Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.