- Hi. Andrew is having computer problems, otherwise he'd be
doing the highlights of Thursday's postings. We're still
looking for one or more editors one day a week. Have a nice
where to jump in to this conversation?
to even have a conversation in the non-duality salon
is the great cosmic joke!
isn't it a blast that there is only one of us!
it's the infinite orgasm.
who do we think we are talking to?
can it really be true that there is no other?
what kind of beauty is that?
how could we ever express to each other
of own true being?
meet me at the silent place
where bliss flows through us
like we're not even there.
SHANKAR (from I AM list)
In (my) saying, 'again and again approach',
why (I) picked up (this matter), and stated,
as to who this 'Chit' was,
until the impression,
('rising' by) 'leaving' this (Chit), (and)
'removing' (us from our abidance in this Chit),
(it) appears (to be) like 'coming' (and) 'going',
only (to) love (and) attempt (to approach this Chit),
is the 'appropriate' pursuit.
Translation of verse 230 in 'Essence of Sadhana' by Sri
Sadhu Om Swamigal.
Form is emptiness,
Emptiness is form.
I am emptiness,
Emptiness is me.
Because I am a mere configuration, there is freedom to form
innumerable ways. All the world is a stage, and each one of
us an email
eNjOyInG tHe nOpAtH
Paying attention wears me out. And then there was this
recognition that i *wanted* to pay attention because i
thought it was a *must* on the way to the big goal :) So I
just dropped it and it feels great. Several times a day
attention is there all by itself . That feels great too. I
suspect that attention is there always but we do not
recognize it. Somehow we decided that this is attention and
that is not, which of course is an invention of the mind.
So the thing is, and it has been said over and over again,
just let it be. I honestly do not know anymore what's good
for me or what's bad so i am not trying to be either one.
So there's no interference and even if there is something
that feels like interference (its not inference really, it
just thinking) i dont bother about it. (it will disappear
like everything else). I have been fighting and discussing
with imaginary things of which 5 minutes later i could not
even remember what is was about ! There's nothing to figure
out, we only think there is. Concepts, thoughts and
whatever else floating through your mind, do not attach to
it and it will be gone just like that. We just have to
deeply understand that there's no need to interfere and if
you do there's nothing you can do about it. Just watch (but
dont make this a technique, the watching should be casual)
and before you know it it's gone. It's all natural. Or
dont watch at all, that seems to be okay too. Knowing we
dont have to do anything is a big big relief in itself ! We
only need explanations sothat we come to know that we don't
need any :)
marcia wrote--we all sing our songs again &again with the
same notes-- ain't it the truth!! at least here on the list
there's enough variety so it almost never gets boring, but
in my quaker meeting discussion groups i basically know what
every one is going to say before they open their mouths!!
how nice it would be if no one was home... is it possible to
drop one's "usual" personality if one is empty??just
It is certainly possible to less and less identify with
one's identity. The question is what moves into this empty
space? When the personality is taking a backseat or is in
service, more concern for others than self allows one to
truly listen and drop any personal agenda. Almost anyone
can at least temporarily forget self. The person who seems
to me to exemplify this most consistently is Thich Naht
Hanh. He speaks from such a deep place of simply being love
and peace that he is more of a "universality" than a
personality. At the same time he has this gentle humor and
is so fully human..he's not "out there"...or "up
there"..just here and very present to here. I once watched
one of his videos over and over so much that now I can hear
his voice when I read his books. What he communicates non
verbally, his presence, is far more than the content of his
words, tho the meaning all by itself is worthwhile. I
remember very little of what was said at the week's retreat
I attended, but I can still see him walking and holding
hands with the children, the way he smiled at them. What it
is, is that in his presence you too forget your "usual
personality" and become empty.
Expansion & contraction are the play of one process. Some
people are more tuned to contraction (not this - not this)
where as others are more tuned to expansion (love).
I have never considered it in those terms, Roger, but yes.
The image I got when I read that ....(see? there goes that
imag-in ation I was talking about!) was of a balloon.
Let's say that if air is consciousness, and the balloon is
the 'sheath' of body, or personality that separates the
'inner air' (air of the individual) from the rest of the air
(All That Is), then it can be said individual consciousness
can once again be blended with All That Is by either
contracting air - forcing air out of it (neti, neti)
or by expanding the 'inner air' to such an extend that the
veil of separation bursts.
As one who works a lot with balloons, I'll add that by
'working the balloon'....letting air in, and then letting it
out....over and over....the balloon gets very soft and
pliable....and can grow to a much greater expanse than one
imagined....until ultimately the skin is so thin, it easily
Type study can be pretty useful for seeing one's own
As well, for building bridges of communication.
And it can be pretty entertaining.
Someone I knew talked about types as energy rays.
I liked that.
And this struggle to awaken is the "problem" itself. The
more we struggle to awaken the harder it becomes to actually
awaken. Awakening never happens by willful effort.
All the effort and struggle and making it hard is great
Because eventually you realize you can't do it at all And
Then a beginning ..........
Most people block out the pain or feel sorry for the
"other". Try uniting with the "other's" pain. It can turn
the situation from an energy drain to an energy surge as you
become one with them.
re: relationship between sex and meditation I've found
Mantak Chia and Barry (Long is it?) useful resources in
exploring the intercourse (I mean interplay) between these
two. And most of all my own explorations.I've certainly
found, as a male, that lengthly periods between ejaculations
are helpful in making "higher" energies available. My cycle,
and I suspect others' goes like this: first there's the
normal build up of desire, then an emotional reactivity that
wants release and feels grumpy or deprived if not indulged.
IF I work through these emotional hurdles by staying with
them, I find that a kind of "turned-on" sense begins to
colour my days. I become more open sexually to the world.
As this intensifies over days, the carnal pattern of desire
- lusting - decreases and disappears. I'm no longer into
body parts, or that's latently there but in abeyance. My
sexuality starts to juice up my spritual sensibilities, so
that surrender in meditation takes on a sexual analog
(again, and now distinctly, without "pornographic"
imaging).Then I'm much less prone to the emotional
ups-and-downs of relationship and desire, a knowing that my
sex-partner is not the source of my joy - there's a distinct
lessening of possessiveness and attachment. We make love
without my ejaculating and (most of the time) it's wonderful
and enough. The shifting border of orgasm catches me
sometimes when I fancy I didn't mean to go there, but I've
mostly learned to laugh and appreciate that. At other
times, when borders-I-didn't-know have dissolved, and
there's a deep onetaste intimacy, I let go with intension.
All this to say, it's worth a try. The key for me is
working the feelings so I'm not secretly feeling deprived.
If you're getting stuck in those (normal and ordinary)
deprived feelings, this wouldn't be a useful practice.
(Chia includes some cautionary statements about his version
of this practice.
He uses quite a different languaging that I am.) I don't
know if the sex/spirit connection increases for women, by
staying this side of orgasm. According to Chia, women don't
"lose energy" (not his phrase exactly) as men do in the act
(childbearing plays a similar role for women, he sez). As
Judi says, Happy Days, or is that Happy Nights!
I appreciated your post very much.
I have questions and observations but not many answers.
I too have found that if the time lengthens between orgasms
the energy seems to rise and change into feelings and
compassion. That is if I am not indulging in the fantasies
or feeling deprived. I feel more alive and responsive. It
is almost as if I am making love with all of life.
And, like you, sometimes it does creep up on me and just
explode when I am not even aware it is there.
I too wonder about the female version. A woman is very
aware of being around a man who is containing his sexual
energy and not frittering it away in masturbation. The
power of the male positive sexual energy focused on a woman
evokes a total response from her whether she wants to give
it or not. I think there is a real difference here between
men and women.
Well just as our soul is not just inside ourselves but
corresponds and is one with the divine out there. So our
sexual energy, our lower chakras of earth and water
correspond to the elemental forces out there. Now all we
have to do at the time of ejaculation is to exchange this
energy with the elemental forces of earth and water . These
forces will then fill us with mental energy that corresponds
to our sexual energy. It might not be everyones cup of tea
but if you can sense the diversity of energies that comes
from the universal mind,its easy. I havent transcended my
sex-drive yet and dont belief in forcing it. It seems the
more I welcome and embrace sex the less it is there and an
issue. Lets go with the flow, everything has its place.
The lowest level (of orgasm) is just physical release, which
can be for men or women but tends to more frequency on the
male side. At this level energy is lost. Not to mention
the whole ejaculation thing which throws the body into
Women are more likely to have a whole-body rather than
genitally centered experience and in that gain rather than
There is also the phenomenon of 'inner orgasm' which is an
energy thing and may or may not be related to
physical/muscular orgasm. As I understand it this is quite
common for women and can be learned by men through
withholding ejaculation and letting their sexual attention
become more subtle.