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Highlights, Thursda, Dec. 2

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  • umbada@xx.xxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx)
    GEN hi it is raining i am sending the lyrics a song that came to me as a gift. as all of you are a gift in each instant. i love you... Live Like Horses Music
    Message 1 of 1 , Dec 4, 1999

      it is raining
      i am
      sending the lyrics a song that came to me as a gift.
      as all of you are a gift in each instant.
      i love you...

      Live Like Horses
      Music by Elton John
      Lyrics by Bernie Taupin
      I can't control this flesh and blood
      That's wrapped around my bones
      It moves beneath me like a river
      Into the great unknown
      I stepped onto the moving stairs
      Before I could tie my shoes
      Pried a harp out the fingers of a renegade
      Who lived and died the blues
      And his promise made was never clear
      It just carved itself in me
      All I saw was frost inside my head
      On the night he said to me
      Someday we'll live like horses
      Free rein from your old iron fences
      There's more ways than one to regain your senses
      Break out the stalls and we'll live like horses
      We're the victims of the heartbreak
      That kept us short of breath
      Trapped above these bloodless streets
      Without a safety net
      I stood in line to join the trial
      One more customer of fate
      Claimed a spoke in the wheel of the wagon train
      On the road to the golden gate
      On the flat cracked desert I jumped ship
      It just made sense to me
      I've spent too long in the belly of the beast
      And now I shall be free



      My name is Jairo, i am brazilian, 43, married, three
      children, i work on the software industry, i have a long way
      searching and seeking the truth, i have read everything that
      could explain my being, why everything exists, death and so
      on, always the same unanswered questions.

      To make a long journey short, about 2 years ago, i had the
      experience to access a web page about UG Khrisnamurti, after
      a tremendous shock for some days, my face had a smile,
      afterwards, i realised that if there is a truth, its
      perception is subjective, and if we look for the subject
      there is no one.

      With this perception my understanding went easily to
      Advaita, a Non Dual Perception of Existence, and everything
      that helps or enrich this kind of teaching should be

      Thank You Again,


      JAN K.

      From Jan K from Alkmaar, The Netherlands, also known as
      'dutch' on the chat...

      Hey everyone! This is my first post to the list, was havin'
      trouble subscribing, but that has been taken care of. Very
      glad to be here. Check out my new homepage version
      especially for Netscape-users. I have been getting some
      complaints about it being unreadable, the way it looked,
      that is :-)

      Here is the address

      Just click the advaita link down below, and than the
      'english version' in the upper right. If you see strange
      things, like your hard drive formatting suddenly, please
      contact me!

      Love to all of you!
      greetings Jan K

      The ones that never sanctioned a formal community probably
      remained the freshest the longest, and will probably remain
      fresher forever.


      I wonder if even an 'informal community' such as
      NondualitySalon and the website, might not also have
      something of a binding effect, although less than that of
      the formal. It seems that to remain *totally*
      independent of all organization is the only way to guarantee
      that the 'freshness' you describe never goes away at all.
      J. Krishnamurti is a prime example. He realized how his
      own institution was about to trap him even before it got off
      the ground! And his writings retained their freshness until
      the day his body died. There was never an ounce of 'gloss'
      to a single word uttered by J. Krishnamurti.


      J. Krishnamurti also founded and endowed no less than three
      foundations -- one each in the U.S., the U.K., and India --
      with associated, duly accredited schools for children.
      While ostensibly dedicated to the accurate preservation of
      K's words, my experience of these institutions is that they
      together comprise what amounts to a posthumous sat guru
      bhakti sect dedicated to the memory of the non-guru who was
      famous for declaring that "the truth is a pathless land."

      It is also quite well known that K considered himself a
      failure, and in his last years often complained that nobody
      really understood what he was getting at. I have this as
      hearsay, but K is supposed to have declared that if only ten
      out of the thousands who had heard and read his words had
      really been reached, the entire world would have been
      utterly transformed in rather short order.

      I have only the greatest respect for Krishnamurti -- as you
      know, Tim, I acknowledge him as a pivotal communicative
      influence. What I'm pointing to is that the impetus of love
      is perfect, but the service of thought is flawed by nature,
      and that there really is no alternative to a certain degree
      of organization or institutionalization. That said, it is
      certainly true that any degree of formalization is replete
      with pitfalls, as the rather obvious excesses of Adi Da,
      Sathya Sai Baba, and your example of Swami Sivananda

      OLD HAG

      To Bruce and Tim:

      Remember the old story about God and the Devil walking along
      and God sees Truth in front of them? God says, "Oh, look
      there's Truth!" The Devil says, "Quick, give it to me! I'll
      organize it."



      Dear List,

      The Core has been updated with new music for December,
      1999. This month, for the first time, Realplayer G2 is
      required to listen. I made this decision because higher
      quality is available using less bandwidth with this version
      than with earlier versions. Contrary to the view of some,
      Realplayer G2 will run on a 486 or better PC without any

      If interested, please go to the following site:


      Click on the "Monthly Musical Selection" link on the
      left-hand menu.




      elaine wrote: [snip] .....Get past the illusory guilt that
      is holding the entire scam together and we see that there is
      no birth or death but only Life.

      SKYE: I was so enjoying your posts elaine, they have
      inspired me to ponder what my understanding of guilt is, but
      alas, jerry says you have already unsubbed, but here's my 2
      cents anyway.

      I understood The Course in Miracles to be a treatise along
      the lines of the original sin of the 'I' choosing to remain
      separate from all that is. But i sense that we are an
      important experiment for all that is, that it was natural
      for our consciousness to spring forth from and that we are
      not in reality severed from it, so there seems no cause for
      guilt about such.

      I sense there is a wise ancient wisdom of natural guilt and
      then there is an artificial guilt born of our distorted
      limiting beliefs. Both are highly creative energies. If we
      could shed our artificial guilt for natural guilt there
      would be no wars. We would not have chronic illness and the
      body would show far greater endurance than it does now. We
      would manifest our unconscious corporeal sense of justice as
      all animals do, such as thou shalt not kill more than is
      needed for physical sustenance, understand the living
      integrity of all things and have no need to attack any of
      them. Creaturehood is not inherently gluttonous, it follows
      an unconscious order, just as there is a definite order,
      relationship and limit to the number of chromosomes.

      Animals do not have our flexible consciousness, which gives
      us leeway to make our own interpretations, some of which
      have created tremendous difficulties and much artificial

      Its begun to dawn on us that certain violent situations do
      not eventuate unless our own violent thoughts (faced or
      unfaced) have attracted them. And we misunderstood the
      value of creative aggression. We consider aggression
      synonymous with violence and have not understood that
      forceful, active, mental or spoken commands for peace can
      save our life.

      Many natural animal instincts no longer applied when our
      conscious options enlarged and consciousness was projected
      into past present and future. A balance had to be
      maintained, because the animals' innate taboos within us,
      could now be interfered with. So controls were needed. Now
      artificial and natural guilt have become entangled.

      Our species has ignored its natural guilt. :-( eg. Thou
      shalt not violate, over population being a violation etc...
      Hence we are in danger of extinction by destroying the very
      environment that sustains our life. Krishnamurti says we
      are insane, but i think that all that is, freely chose to
      take this creative risk, for it is a confident chess player
      and always supplies (inherent within each risk) an equal
      opportunity to survive all adversities.



      It is this theatre we call 'other' that allows you
      awareness. If there was nothing to contrast there would be
      no existence. The source is the center that you are in the
      sea of consciousness. Where you find your 'self' away from
      that center is where you 'are' but still revolving around
      that center.

      To move the 'self' back into the center only means the
      realization that in fact a center exists. However, without
      the 'other', you would not and could not know this even if
      you realize this 'other' is a mirror.


      I have enjoyed reading the posts on guilt and judgement.
      What are these things? And yet, it is something that we
      must face. A hurdle indeed. Perhaps the greatest hurdle
      that is clearly a programmed and conditioned response.

      The intensity of the feeling must be overcome by facing it
      head on. If not, they will remain as a weight that you
      carry that whispers in your ear and veils you from the true

      thank you for providing a wonderful place where we may
      'artificially' face these issues to improve our outlook both
      inward and outward. For truely, there is no greater secret
      then the one that we keep from our 'self'. The true essence
      of who we are.

      If you saw the device coming or you were told the utility of
      the excercise, would you react and identify the same? Would
      you claim it as your own? Or would the defences come up
      that have fooled you all along into thinking that this
      world, this existence, this consciousness is separate from

      The chaft (the 'other' that surrounds you) is neither
      positive nor negative. Although we cut it away and push it
      back under ground it is still necessary to our growth as
      golden wheat kernals of pure potentiality.
      And each moment that is 'beyond' your 'self' still has a
      positive element if it can be found 'in' your 'self' where
      it has always been, like a friend, waiting in the darkness.


      Osho Zen Tarot Today's complete right-on card for me

      Listen to your heart, move according to your heart,
      whatsoever the stake: A condition of complete simplicity
      costing not less than everything.... To be simple is
      arduous, because to be simple costs everything that you
      have. You have to lose all to be simple.
      That's why people have chosen to be complex and they have
      forgotten how to be simple. But only a simple heart throbs
      with God, hand in hand. Only a simple heart sings with God
      in deep harmony. To reach to that point you will have to
      find your heart, your own throb, your own beat.

      The experience of resting in the heart is not something that
      can be grasped or forced. It comes naturally, as we grow
      more and more in tune with the rhythms of our own inner


      Personally, I believe ACIM is a wonderful very powerful
      discussion of all the things we discuss here... Scripture
      should never be confused with Truth as it can only suggest
      the way.....any time a teaching becomes a substitute for the
      experience which it suggests, a person gets bogged down and
      it simply becomes another element of the dream......where
      the "ego" co-opts the teaching to simply reinforce the
      beliefs that the "ego" already has. I have done this with
      ACIM....and watched myself doing it and my unwillingness to
      put it aside......it became like a crutch to hold my
      enormous fears at bay.........If I hadn't appointed ACIM
      this task I would have "found" something else to use as a
      crutch....Letting go of ACIM has been a lesson in
      itself.........I think I have discovered that I have been
      trying to learn lessons I already learned and thereby
      avoided lessons I have not yet learned. Fear is a powerful
      teacher and as I thought about fear and guilt and sin more
      and more I DID begin to experience them more and more and
      more, whereas I never had before.



      This brings some clarity to a very interesting truism: You
      are what you think. Or expressed in different terms,
      whatever you think about most (and also whatever you invest
      emotional energy in) you tend to attract. Certain new-age
      teachers like Shakti Gawain have 'abused' this notion (have
      you ever read "Creative Visualization?") to teach how to
      attract money, fame and power.

      Invest enough thought-energy in anything, and it will
      manifest. That's why "The poor get poorer, and the rich get
      richer." The poor (in monetary terms) think about nothing
      but being poor. They may think about money, but it's always
      in terms of not having enough. A poor person may get rich
      by simply acting as if they were rich, by associating with
      rich people, beginning to invest instead of impulse-buy,
      dropping the notion that they're poor, the fear of
      insecurity, etc. The rich think about money too, but they
      think about ways to make more of it, not the lack of it.

      This precise truism produced the Bill Gates empire. Gates
      invests all his mental, emotional and physical energy in his
      company, in getting the business and making money (earlier
      on he would work for months or even years at a time, 7 days
      a week, 24 hours/day, catching brief naps in a corner of his
      office). Is it any surprise he's now the richest man in the
      world? All his mental energy, perhaps even while asleep and
      dreaming, was focused on building an empire, getting the
      business. Big thinkers produce big results.

      Life is very much like a lucid dream. We are alive, and
      know that we are alive. We see the world around us and take
      it to be real. To a great extent, we can alter the dream,
      although to get out of it altogether requires going beyond
      it (more about this in a moment). Life is infinitely
      mouldable, since everything is really a projection of our
      thoughts and we are prior to the world. We have far more
      power than we give ourselves credit (in fact, our power to
      manifest what we want is literally infinite), but most don't
      know how to use it, or aren't willing to invest the
      requisite energy.

      Spiritual sadhana runs along similar lines. The thought and
      emotional energy put into getting free from the world-dream
      will take us right to the border of it (Nisargatta
      repeatedly emphasizes that 'earnestness is the most
      important element'). The actual crossing destroys all
      ideas, and thus here "you manifest what you think about
      most" no longer applies, since all thought and ideas cease
      at this boundary. That's why realization can't be produced
      at will. We can take ourselves right to the border of it
      through intense focus, dedication to the ideal, regular
      sadhana... the actual crossing is a mystery, and cannot be
      willed or generated. Once at the border, though, there's
      always an overwhelming tendency for the "event" to occur. I
      like the tree/fruit idea. We can speed up the 'ripening' of
      the fruit immensely. But the fruit cannot make itself fall
      from the tree.
      When the ripeness is there, it will fall -- Some may say by
      Grace. Or perhaps it's just by sheer gravity.

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