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RE: [N1MM] Networking at Field Day

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  • N4DW - Dave
    Terry, W4UD used a Linksys E1200 Wireless to two PC s/stations - both laptops Wired to one PC/station The three stations were in the same shelter, basically
    Message 1 of 23 , Jun 26, 2013
      Terry,



      W4UD used a Linksys E1200



      Wireless to two PC's/stations - both laptops

      Wired to one PC/station



      The three stations were in the same shelter, basically back to back with the
      wired station in the middle and the Linksys on that table.



      A third laptop was also set up basically as a monitor, but was not on for
      the contest, only to sync around 10am Sunday. The sync went perfectly for
      over 1600 QSO's.



      There was no major intermod between stations and I only saw one hiccup on
      the station I was on in 9 hours. That was as if the WinKeyer buffer was
      filled with dits or dah's and it took a while to clear.



      73,

      Dave

      N4DW

      80 CW op at W4UD





      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Jim Brown
      K6MI used wired Ethernet to connect two QRP stations that were about 200 ft apart. We used an ASUS router, but only the Ethernet Switch function. In the past,
      Message 2 of 23 , Jun 27, 2013
        K6MI used wired Ethernet to connect two QRP stations that were about 200 ft apart. We used an ASUS router, but only the Ethernet Switch function. In the past, we've had issues with failures by the wireless router and an ad hoc collection of laptops to dance together. The last time we encountered this, for a multi-op in my shack at home, N6NUL, a computer and software programmer found multiple issues in the setup of one of the computers.

        In a test before we left home, our two wired laptops worked fine with N1MM with the router doing DHCP, but when we set them up at the FD site, they did not.  We found two problems.  One was a defective Ethernet cable. The other was that another member of the FD team had set up an internet downlink from a mountain 30-40 miles away and distributed that connection with another wireless router. That router was also doing DHCP, and in the same address space as our wired DHCP server.  TILT -- you can have only one DHCP server on a system, so things blew up.

        We did two things. First, we went to static IP addresses for the wired Ethernet. Second, just as a precaution, we disabled wireless in both laptops.  It might have worked to use that wireless connection, but we felt that the limited benefit of having the internet was outweighed by the potential for problems that could cost us QSOs. Except for the flaky Ethernet cable, we had no failures. 

        As to RFI -- I've NEVER seen an instance of RFI from my 1.5kW rigs to wired or wireless Ethernet, but it is VERY common to have the wiring of both wired and wireless routers radiate RF trash that is picked up by our antennas. Trash is generated both in the switching power supplies that run the routers/switches, and by the Ethernet cables both on the LAN side and on the WAN side. We ALWAYS apply multi-turn ferrite chokes to both ends of Ethernet cables, and to both the AC and DC side of all switching power supplies.

        One thing we've been doing to reduce this trash is to replace switching power supplies with either linear supplies or batteries of the right voltage. One technique that facilitates this is to break all of the DC lines from the wall warts that come with equipment and install Power Pole connectors. We've managed to locate a nice collection of Ethernet switches and computer monitors that run on 12VDC, so it's easy to run them, and well as our rigs, from a 12V car battery that is charged either by a suitable linear power supply, or by solar cells as we did on FD. We use computer monitors in our FD tents because they are easier to see in bright sunlight.

        There is extensive and detailed advice on RFI suppression in http://k9yc.com/RFI-Ham.pdf

        Hope this helps.

        73, Jim K9YC




        ________________________________
        From: Terry G. Glagowski / W1TR <w1tr@...>
        To: N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com
        Sent: Wednesday, June 26, 2013 9:58 AM
        Subject: [N1MM] Networking at Field Day


        For larger Field Day Groups.

        What kind of networking did you use?

        Did you use Wired Ethernet between distant points (i.e. several hundred
        feet)?

        Did you use Wireless?

        Did you use Optical Fiber?

        What were the considerations?

        Did RF get into your networking equipment, or vice versa?



        73, Terry : )



        Terry G. Glagowski / W1TR

        CMARA Office of the Secretary (Field Day) W1BIM
        HAM: W1TR / USAF MARS: AFA1DI
        25 Hnath Road, Ashford, CT 06278
        (860) 429-9444 (Home Landline)

        (781) 225-5458 (Work Office Landline)
        (508) 864-0041 (Terry's cell)
        (EMail) W1TR@... or W1TR@...
        (Web)  http://www.Glagowski.org/Radio





        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



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      • David Titelbaum
        Terry, As to N1MM networking at FD, I maintain a stable of Dell Latitude D610/D620 laptops, all running WinXP SP3 with (currently) N1MM Ver. 13.5.02,
        Message 3 of 23 , Jun 27, 2013
          Terry,



          As to N1MM networking at FD, I maintain a stable of Dell Latitude D610/D620 laptops, all running WinXP SP3 with (currently) N1MM Ver. 13.5.02, statically addressed in the range of 192.168.1.100 - 1.180, with individual BlueTooth wireless mice and external keyboards. All have internal WiFi that is configured for 802.3g to connect to a Linksys WRT-54GS router running DD-WRT code. The router, with 5.x dB gain antennas, is running at higher-than-consumer output (.225 watt) on US Channel 1.



          This year's configuration consisted of the following:



          (3) Networked Dell Latitude D6xx-series laptops, connected via 802.3g to our centrallized wireless router (noted above). These club-maintained laptops interfaced with various operator-provided radios and keyers (FT-1000, K3, etc., WinKeyer, etc.)

          (1) Standalone Dell Latitude D620-series laptop for our GOTA station, connected to a Yaesu FT-857

          (1) Networked Dell Latitude D620-series laptop, connected via CAT5 to the centralized wireless router as NSRA-MASTER100. This laptop runs as IP 192.168.1.100, the Master N1MM workstation; it does not provide any external Internet access or cluster information.



          As John previously noted, we operate over an open field in a public park with up to 50-60 ft gap between the NSRA-MASTER100 Laptop/Linksys Router combo and the various operator's laptops in individual tents without any interference from the HF radios. We have also introduced Satellite Ops, QRP Ops and general observer laptops from the spares pool in my N1MM Networked IP List (STN:0 - STN:7) during the activity in previous years, all with no degradation to the overall network. At the end of FD2013, all active laptops had their individual FD2013.mdb database backed up to an external thumbdrive. I have additional Linksys WRT-54-series routers that I might consider introducing in a MESH configuration at a later date.



          Possible improvements to my IT configuration:



          1) Configure the NSRA-MASTER100 Laptop/Linksys Router to run from a localized 12VDC source which is back-fed by commercial power. We had a glitch this year during FD where our generator shut down due to an operational issue, yielding a short (5-10 minutes) break in our operation. While this wouldn't cover the operating stations, it would ensure network uptime.

          2) Possibly replace the NSRA-MASTER100 laptop with a standalone headless low power PC that can then be boxed up with the router and dropped in a central location away from any operational tents. I've tried this in the past with a phone pole-mounted case but that was too unwieldy.





          David/KB1MSR

          Club Field Day IT Wrangler



          <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
          David I. Titelbaum
          Home: 978/538-5335
          Cell: 617/823-3381
          Home EMail: kb1msr@...
          Mobile EMail: 6178233381@...
          SMS: dit@...









          To: N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com
          From: w1tr@...
          Date: Wed, 26 Jun 2013 18:49:25 -0400
          Subject: RE: [N1MM] Networking at Field Day





          John,

          Great. if you could find out the models, I would appreciate it.

          I know the NetGear ones have a pretty good range.

          73, Terry / W1TR : )

          From: N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com [mailto:N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com] On
          Behalf Of John
          Sent: Wednesday, June 26, 2013 04:18 PM
          To: N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: Re: [N1MM] Networking at Field Day

          Terry,

          No problem. We used off the shelf wireless routers. I will have to
          check whether there were 2 or 3 routers and get back to you if you want
          the models. I don't know if they ran a cable between the two tents
          operating voice or they had separate connections to the central site .
          The CW tent was the central point for the wireless network. In any case
          the two voice tents were about 20 ft apart and both were about 40-50 ft
          from the CW tent where the central computer was. We ran individual
          computers in each of the 4 stations and collected the information at
          another system in the CW tent. That gave us some redundancy in the case
          of computer or power failure, which has been an issue in the past.

          John

          On 6/26/2013 3:57 PM, Terry G. Glagowski / W1TR wrote:
          >
          > John.
          >
          > I was more interested in the N1MM Networking Setup than the FD
          > Antennas and
          > Equipment.
          >
          > What kind of router did you use?
          >
          > Was it WiFi or hard wired Ethernet, or even optical fiber hardline.
          >
          > How far apart were the Ethernet or WiFi end points?
          >
          > Did the RF from the HF/VHF get into the WiFi or Ethernet? Or vice versa.
          >
          > ETC.
          >
          > 73, Terry / W1TR : )
          >
          > From: N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com <mailto:N1MMLogger%40yahoogroups.com>
          <mailto:N1MMLogger%40yahoogroups.com>
          > [mailto:N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com <mailto:N1MMLogger%40yahoogroups.com>
          > <mailto:N1MMLogger%40yahoogroups.com>] On
          > Behalf Of John
          > Sent: Wednesday, June 26, 2013 01:32 PM
          > To: N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com <mailto:N1MMLogger%40yahoogroups.com>
          <mailto:N1MMLogger%40yahoogroups.com>
          > Subject: Re: [N1MM] Networking at Field Day
          >
          > On 6/26/2013 12:58 PM, Terry G. Glagowski / W1TR wrote:
          > >
          > > For larger Field Day Groups.
          > >
          > > What kind of networking did you use? WIRELESS
          > >
          > > Did you use Wired Ethernet between distant points (i.e. several hundred
          > > feet)?
          > >
          > > Did you use Wireless? YES
          > >
          > > Did you use Optical Fiber? N0
          > >
          > > What were the considerations? SETUP WAS AS FOLLOWS:
          > >
          > 2 40 ft guyed
          > TOWERS ( located in marked areas - per WRTC requirements)
          > 1 with A4S
          > tribander (fixed to west),
          > 1 with Cycle 24
          > Tribander fixed to west)
          > 40 M dipole & 80 M
          > Dipole on each tower using mounted cross bars
          > connected to
          > stations through triplexers connected to each antenna system
          >
          > 3 tents- 2 with
          > one SSB (100) station, one with 2 CW (100W) stations
          >
          > Worked amazingly well. One triplexer had an older filter set on it and
          > there was some rf issues between 40 and 20 (I think) but with some
          > discipline that was mostly avoided.
          >
          > John / WA1JG
          > >
          > >
          > > Did RF get into your networking equipment, or vice versa?
          > >
          > > 73, Terry : )
          > >
          > > Terry G. Glagowski / W1TR
          > >
          > > CMARA Office of the Secretary (Field Day) W1BIM
          > > HAM: W1TR / USAF MARS: AFA1DI
          > > 25 Hnath Road, Ashford, CT 06278
          > > (860) 429-9444 (Home Landline)
          > >
          > > (781) 225-5458 (Work Office Landline)
          > > (508) 864-0041 (Terry's cell)
          > > (EMail) W1TR@... <mailto:W1TR%40ARRL.net> <mailto:W1TR%40ARRL.net>

          > <mailto:W1TR%40ARRL.net> <mailto:W1TR%40ARRL.net>
          > or W1TR@... <mailto:W1TR%40YCCC.org> <mailto:W1TR%40YCCC.org>
          <mailto:W1TR%40YCCC.org>
          > > <mailto:W1TR%40YCCC.org>
          > > (Web) http://www.Glagowski.org/Radio
          > >
          > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          > >
          > >
          >
          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          >
          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          >
          >

          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]







          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Doug Smith
          We didn t do any networking this year, but we have in the past. Wireless has worked quite well and without any interference in either direction to the radio
          Message 4 of 23 , Jun 27, 2013
            We didn't do any networking this year, but we have in the past. Wireless has worked quite well and without any interference in either direction to
            the radio gear.

            One thing I've regretted not doing.. is getting this kind of thing set up & tested well in advance of Field Day. There is an (understandable!)
            tendency to set up the antennas/generators/tents first but that tends to leave computer & software setup for an hour or two before 1800z. If anything
            goes wrong (and it will, it is Field Day after all) then you're faced with deciding whether to fix the network or make QSOs. Apparently one FD group
            around here ended up giving up on computer logging after they were unable to get things configured in time.

            The FD period is also not exactly the right time to be teaching your operators how to use N1MM. There should probably be a dry run at the last club
            meeting before FD (maybe use FT-897s or similar rigs to make a few "contest" QSOs on 432MHz?) so everyone is at least familiar with the software.

            --

            Doug Smith W9WI
            Pleasant View, TN EM66
          • ve3dvy
            we used a wired network with a switch rather than a router since everything was static IP on the lan. It worked and was reliable but not all was good. We had a
            Message 5 of 23 , Jun 27, 2013
              we used a wired network with a switch rather than a router since everything was static IP on the lan. It worked and was reliable but not all was good.

              We had a lot of birdies from the lan wiring I verified this during pre contest testing by first unplugging power from the switch then the Ethernet cables from the computers. the birdies for the most part disappeared as I pulled the cables. so I will be testing either switching the UTP cables with shielded Ethernet cables or even using good old 10baseT and eliminate the switch and run all coax if I have enough PCI cards with the 10baseT connections still hanging around. alternatively I may test things using WiFi instead.

              I too would like to hear the thoughts on using STP vs utp or wifi to reduce the birdies I think 10baseT is a long shot.






              --- In N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com, "Terry G. Glagowski / W1TR" <w1tr@...> wrote:
              >
              > For larger Field Day Groups.
              >
              > What kind of networking did you use?
              >
              > Did you use Wired Ethernet between distant points (i.e. several hundred
              > feet)?
              >
              > Did you use Wireless?
              >
              > Did you use Optical Fiber?
              >
              > What were the considerations?
              >
              > Did RF get into your networking equipment, or vice versa?
              >
              >
              >
              > 73, Terry : )
              >
              >
              >
              > Terry G. Glagowski / W1TR
              >
              > CMARA Office of the Secretary (Field Day) W1BIM
              > HAM: W1TR / USAF MARS: AFA1DI
              > 25 Hnath Road, Ashford, CT 06278
              > (860) 429-9444 (Home Landline)
              >
              > (781) 225-5458 (Work Office Landline)
              > (508) 864-0041 (Terry's cell)
              > (EMail) W1TR@... or W1TR@...
              > (Web) http://www.Glagowski.org/Radio
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >
            • David Titelbaum
              Something to consider when using either Wired or Wireless networks is to go into the NIC Adapter Settings and DISABLING all Power Saver modes. The last thing
              Message 6 of 23 , Jun 27, 2013
                Something to consider when using either Wired or Wireless networks is to go into the NIC Adapter Settings and DISABLING all Power Saver modes. The last thing you want is for the PC to decide to power down the NIC during a contest and drop you off the network, whether it be Wired or Wireless.



                As to the birdies, you might want to force your Wired network, thru your PC NIC settings, to 10 MBit rather than have it default to the highest speed possible. Additionally, preperly made UTP cabling (not the hack jobs some folks use with 22 guage wire hanging out of the RJ45 plug) should be adequate to minimize the interference of external electronic noise, assuming you have a tight system.



                David/KB1MSR






                To: N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com
                From: ve3dvy@...
                Date: Thu, 27 Jun 2013 20:07:17 +0000
                Subject: [N1MM] Re: Networking at Field Day






                we used a wired network with a switch rather than a router since everything was static IP on the lan. It worked and was reliable but not all was good.

                We had a lot of birdies from the lan wiring I verified this during pre contest testing by first unplugging power from the switch then the Ethernet cables from the computers. the birdies for the most part disappeared as I pulled the cables. so I will be testing either switching the UTP cables with shielded Ethernet cables or even using good old 10baseT and eliminate the switch and run all coax if I have enough PCI cards with the 10baseT connections still hanging around. alternatively I may test things using WiFi instead.

                I too would like to hear the thoughts on using STP vs utp or wifi to reduce the birdies I think 10baseT is a long shot.

                --- In N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com, "Terry G. Glagowski / W1TR" <w1tr@...> wrote:
                >
                > For larger Field Day Groups.
                >
                > What kind of networking did you use?
                >
                > Did you use Wired Ethernet between distant points (i.e. several hundred
                > feet)?
                >
                > Did you use Wireless?
                >
                > Did you use Optical Fiber?
                >
                > What were the considerations?
                >
                > Did RF get into your networking equipment, or vice versa?
                >
                >
                >
                > 73, Terry : )
                >
                >
                >
                > Terry G. Glagowski / W1TR
                >
                > CMARA Office of the Secretary (Field Day) W1BIM
                > HAM: W1TR / USAF MARS: AFA1DI
                > 25 Hnath Road, Ashford, CT 06278
                > (860) 429-9444 (Home Landline)
                >
                > (781) 225-5458 (Work Office Landline)
                > (508) 864-0041 (Terry's cell)
                > (EMail) W1TR@... or W1TR@...
                > (Web) http://www.Glagowski.org/Radio
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                >







                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • Jim Brown
                Yes, cables MUST be properly made, but multi-turn ferrite chokes at both ends of the cable are also quite important. Study http://k9yc.com/RFI-ham.pdf  I
                Message 7 of 23 , Jun 27, 2013
                  Yes, cables MUST be properly made, but multi-turn ferrite chokes at both ends of the cable are also quite important.


                  Study http://k9yc.com/RFI-ham.pdf%c2%a0


                  I posted on this only a few hours ago.

                  73, Jim K9YC



                  ________________________________

                  We had a lot of birdies from the lan wiring 


                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • John Bednar
                  I have used 100Mb Ethernet with quality cables rated for 1Gb many times and have never heard any birdies. For FD we had three radios, router, and Ethernet
                  Message 8 of 23 , Jun 27, 2013
                    I have used 100Mb Ethernet with quality cables rated for 1Gb many times and
                    have never heard any birdies. For FD we had three radios, router, and
                    Ethernet cables in one area and didn't any noise.

                    John, K3CT


                    -----Original Message-----
                    From: N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com [mailto:N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com] On
                    Behalf Of ve3dvy
                    Sent: Thursday, June 27, 2013 4:07 PM
                    To: N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com
                    Subject: [N1MM] Re: Networking at Field Day


                    we used a wired network with a switch rather than a router since everything
                    was static IP on the lan. It worked and was reliable but not all was good.

                    We had a lot of birdies from the lan wiring I verified this during pre
                    contest testing by first unplugging power from the switch then the Ethernet
                    cables from the computers. the birdies for the most part disappeared as I
                    pulled the cables. so I will be testing either switching the UTP cables
                    with shielded Ethernet cables or even using good old 10baseT and eliminate
                    the switch and run all coax if I have enough PCI cards with the 10baseT
                    connections still hanging around. alternatively I may test things
                    using WiFi instead.

                    I too would like to hear the thoughts on using STP vs utp or wifi to reduce
                    the birdies I think 10baseT is a long shot.






                    --- In N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com, "Terry G. Glagowski / W1TR" <w1tr@...>
                    wrote:
                    >
                    > For larger Field Day Groups.
                    >
                    > What kind of networking did you use?
                    >
                    > Did you use Wired Ethernet between distant points (i.e. several
                    > hundred feet)?
                    >
                    > Did you use Wireless?
                    >
                    > Did you use Optical Fiber?
                    >
                    > What were the considerations?
                    >
                    > Did RF get into your networking equipment, or vice versa?
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > 73, Terry : )
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > Terry G. Glagowski / W1TR
                    >
                    > CMARA Office of the Secretary (Field Day) W1BIM
                    > HAM: W1TR / USAF MARS: AFA1DI
                    > 25 Hnath Road, Ashford, CT 06278
                    > (860) 429-9444 (Home Landline)
                    >
                    > (781) 225-5458 (Work Office Landline)
                    > (508) 864-0041 (Terry's cell)
                    > (EMail) W1TR@... or W1TR@...
                    > (Web) http://www.Glagowski.org/Radio
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    >




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                  • Terry G. Glagowski / W1TR
                    Has anyone used OPTICAL FIBER? About a decade ago, I installed 1.5 KM optical fiber cable to equipment on the airport floor at St Louis Lambert field for some
                    Message 9 of 23 , Jun 27, 2013
                      Has anyone used OPTICAL FIBER?

                      About a decade ago, I installed 1.5 KM optical fiber cable to equipment on
                      the airport floor at St Louis Lambert field for some FAA experiments.

                      This is when GHz Ethernet was NEW NEW NEW.

                      We used Symmetricom GPS receivers for accurate time base reference.

                      Fiber was expensive and hard to work with but would go LONG DISTANCES.

                      I'm also guessing that it might get rid of birdies since fiber is at a MUCH
                      HIGHER FREQUENCY than VHF !



                      Has anyone seen readily available fiber to replace CAT5 in a house instead
                      of WiFi?



                      73, Terry / W1TR : )



                      From: N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com [mailto:N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com] On
                      Behalf Of ve3dvy
                      Sent: Thursday, June 27, 2013 04:07 PM
                      To: N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com
                      Subject: [N1MM] Re: Networking at Field Day






                      we used a wired network with a switch rather than a router since everything
                      was static IP on the lan. It worked and was reliable but not all was good.

                      We had a lot of birdies from the lan wiring I verified this during pre
                      contest testing by first unplugging power from the switch then the Ethernet
                      cables from the computers. the birdies for the most part disappeared as I
                      pulled the cables. so I will be testing either switching the UTP cables with
                      shielded Ethernet cables or even using good old 10baseT and eliminate the
                      switch and run all coax if I have enough PCI cards with the 10baseT
                      connections still hanging around. alternatively I may test things using WiFi
                      instead.

                      I too would like to hear the thoughts on using STP vs utp or wifi to reduce
                      the birdies I think 10baseT is a long shot.

                      --- In N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com <mailto:N1MMLogger%40yahoogroups.com> ,
                      "Terry G. Glagowski / W1TR" <w1tr@...> wrote:
                      >
                      > For larger Field Day Groups.
                      >
                      > What kind of networking did you use?
                      >
                      > Did you use Wired Ethernet between distant points (i.e. several hundred
                      > feet)?
                      >
                      > Did you use Wireless?
                      >
                      > Did you use Optical Fiber?
                      >
                      > What were the considerations?
                      >
                      > Did RF get into your networking equipment, or vice versa?
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > 73, Terry : )
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > Terry G. Glagowski / W1TR
                      >
                      > CMARA Office of the Secretary (Field Day) W1BIM
                      > HAM: W1TR / USAF MARS: AFA1DI
                      > 25 Hnath Road, Ashford, CT 06278
                      > (860) 429-9444 (Home Landline)
                      >
                      > (781) 225-5458 (Work Office Landline)
                      > (508) 864-0041 (Terry's cell)
                      > (EMail) W1TR@... or W1TR@...
                      > (Web) http://www.Glagowski.org/Radio
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      >





                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    • John Huggins
                      ... Wireless. ... No. ... Yes. ... No, but that idea has merit. ... http://www.hamradio.me/activities/field-day-80211-wireless-network.html ... None noted.
                      Message 10 of 23 , Jun 29, 2013
                        On 6/26/13 12:58 PM, Terry G. Glagowski / W1TR wrote:
                        >
                        > For larger Field Day Groups.
                        >
                        > What kind of networking did you use?
                        >
                        Wireless.
                        >
                        >
                        > Did you use Wired Ethernet between distant points (i.e. several hundred
                        > feet)?
                        >
                        No.
                        >
                        >
                        > Did you use Wireless?
                        >
                        Yes.
                        >
                        >
                        > Did you use Optical Fiber?
                        >
                        No, but that idea has merit.
                        >
                        >
                        > What were the considerations?
                        >
                        http://www.hamradio.me/activities/field-day-80211-wireless-network.html
                        >
                        >
                        > Did RF get into your networking equipment, or vice versa?
                        >
                        None noted.

                        John, kx4o


                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      • Buck Calabro
                        ... Yes. Not for field day, but for the ARRL June and September VHF+ contests. We operate from 3 trucks. One truck has 6M/2M, one has 222/432 and the 3rd has
                        Message 11 of 23 , Jun 29, 2013
                          On 27 June 2013 23:50, Terry G. Glagowski / W1TR <w1tr@...> wrote:

                          > **
                          >
                          > Has anyone used OPTICAL FIBER?
                          >
                          Yes.

                          Not for field day, but for the ARRL June and September VHF+ contests. We
                          operate from 3 trucks. One truck has 6M/2M, one has 222/432 and the 3rd
                          has 902 MHz -47 GHz.(4 operators). We run ST-ST multimode fiber between
                          the trucks. Inside each truck is a media converter to go from fiber to Cat
                          5. That goes to a switch. Inside the truck, all the operating stations
                          use regular Cat 5 from the PC to the switch. No RF problems on the
                          computer network.

                          I found 100M of ST-ST outdoor fiber for a ridiculously low price on Ebay
                          which has been very reliable. I loosely string it through the trees to
                          keep it off the ground.

                          Some advice:
                          Keep the protective caps on the fiber while you run it.
                          Keep a small plastic container with you so you have a clean place to put
                          the protective caps; don't get the polished ends of the fiber get dirty and
                          don't let the protective caps get dirty.
                          Bulkhead connectors are cheap and it beats fishing cable through holes in
                          trucks.
                          When the contest is done, carry your container with you and as you
                          disconnect the fiber from the bulkheads/media converters, put the caps back
                          on.
                          Cap the bulkheads too.
                          I use one of those reels for electrical extension cords to wind the fiber
                          up. No issues after 4 years.
                          Electrical tape will leave a sticky mess. I'm switching to velcro cable
                          ties.

                          Hope that helps.
                          73 de Buck KC2HIZ


                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        • Dale Putnam
                          I ve some fiber equipment for sale, if someone is interested? Have a great day, Dale - WC7S ... From: Buck Calabro Date: Sat, 29 Jun 2013
                          Message 12 of 23 , Jun 29, 2013
                            I've some fiber equipment for sale, if someone is interested?
                            Have a great day,
                            Dale - WC7S

                            -----Original Message-----
                            From: Buck Calabro <kc2hiz@...>
                            Date: Sat, 29 Jun 2013 20:52:10
                            To: <N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com>
                            Subject: Re: [N1MM] Re: Networking at Field Day

                             



                            On 27 June 2013 23:50, Terry G. Glagowski / W1TR <w1tr@... <mailto:w1tr%40yccc.org> > wrote:

                            > **
                            >
                            > Has anyone used OPTICAL FIBER?
                            >
                            Yes.

                            Not for field day, but for the ARRL June and September VHF+ contests. We
                            operate from 3 trucks. One truck has 6M/2M, one has 222/432 and the 3rd
                            has 902 MHz -47 GHz.(4 operators). We run ST-ST multimode fiber between
                            the trucks. Inside each truck is a media converter to go from fiber to Cat
                            5. That goes to a switch. Inside the truck, all the operating stations
                            use regular Cat 5 from the PC to the switch. No RF problems on the
                            computer network.

                            I found 100M of ST-ST outdoor fiber for a ridiculously low price on Ebay
                            which has been very reliable. I loosely string it through the trees to
                            keep it off the ground.

                            Some advice:
                            Keep the protective caps on the fiber while you run it.
                            Keep a small plastic container with you so you have a clean place to put
                            the protective caps; don't get the polished ends of the fiber get dirty and
                            don't let the protective caps get dirty.
                            Bulkhead connectors are cheap and it beats fishing cable through holes in
                            trucks.
                            When the contest is done, carry your container with you and as you
                            disconnect the fiber from the bulkheads/media converters, put the caps back
                            on.
                            Cap the bulkheads too.
                            I use one of those reels for electrical extension cords to wind the fiber
                            up. No issues after 4 years.
                            Electrical tape will leave a sticky mess. I'm switching to velcro cable
                            ties.

                            Hope that helps.
                            73 de Buck KC2HIZ

                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          • Terry G. Glagowski / W1TR
                            Buck, If you have some suggestions for equipment (nomenclature or model numbers) to use at the fiber ends, sources of that, and sources of fiber and what type
                            Message 13 of 23 , Jun 29, 2013
                              Buck,

                              If you have some suggestions for equipment (nomenclature or model numbers)
                              to use at the fiber ends, sources of that, and sources of fiber and what
                              type (nomenclature). I'd appreciate it.



                              I used to work for Bell Labs and GTE Labs ages ago, but I was a software
                              guy, even a VLSI guy, but have NO experience with fiber.

                              About a decade ago, I did work on a project for FAA/DOT to install computer
                              equipment at St. Louis Lambert (STL) airport to collect wing tip wake
                              turbulence data and we used fiber to go 1.5 km gigabit speed to various
                              sensors. A co-worker, Leo, did all the installation and I know he had some
                              special tools (to cut the fiber and prepare it for interface to connectors),
                              and I think at least one of the routers had special ports for fiber.
                              Elsewhere he had to use fiber to CAT5 converters of some kind.



                              73, Terry / W1TR : )



                              From: N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com [mailto:N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com] On
                              Behalf Of Buck Calabro
                              Sent: Saturday, June 29, 2013 04:52 PM
                              To: N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com
                              Subject: Re: [N1MM] Re: Networking at Field Day





                              On 27 June 2013 23:50, Terry G. Glagowski / W1TR <w1tr@...
                              <mailto:w1tr%40yccc.org> > wrote:

                              > **
                              >
                              > Has anyone used OPTICAL FIBER?
                              >
                              Yes.

                              Not for field day, but for the ARRL June and September VHF+ contests. We
                              operate from 3 trucks. One truck has 6M/2M, one has 222/432 and the 3rd
                              has 902 MHz -47 GHz.(4 operators). We run ST-ST multimode fiber between
                              the trucks. Inside each truck is a media converter to go from fiber to Cat
                              5. That goes to a switch. Inside the truck, all the operating stations
                              use regular Cat 5 from the PC to the switch. No RF problems on the
                              computer network.

                              I found 100M of ST-ST outdoor fiber for a ridiculously low price on Ebay
                              which has been very reliable. I loosely string it through the trees to
                              keep it off the ground.

                              Some advice:
                              Keep the protective caps on the fiber while you run it.
                              Keep a small plastic container with you so you have a clean place to put
                              the protective caps; don't get the polished ends of the fiber get dirty and
                              don't let the protective caps get dirty.
                              Bulkhead connectors are cheap and it beats fishing cable through holes in
                              trucks.
                              When the contest is done, carry your container with you and as you
                              disconnect the fiber from the bulkheads/media converters, put the caps back
                              on.
                              Cap the bulkheads too.
                              I use one of those reels for electrical extension cords to wind the fiber
                              up. No issues after 4 years.
                              Electrical tape will leave a sticky mess. I'm switching to velcro cable
                              ties.

                              Hope that helps.
                              73 de Buck KC2HIZ

                              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





                              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                            • Terry G. Glagowski / W1TR
                              I would like to hear about what you have... I have 2 purposes for this... 1) FD... I need to make maybe as much as a 500 foot run (maybe even 1000 in future
                              Message 14 of 23 , Jun 29, 2013
                                I would like to hear about what you have...
                                I have 2 purposes for this...
                                1) FD... I need to make maybe as much as a 500 foot run (maybe even 1000 in
                                future years depending on the site)...
                                2) Home, to get rid of CAT5 between the DSL modem and the Router, and
                                between the router and a couple of computers that I don't want on WiFi to
                                make sure I can get to the router as a SysAdmin. Probably 50 feet max for
                                those runs. Elsewhere in the house, WiFi is OK.

                                73, Terry / W1TR : )


                                -----Original Message-----
                                From: N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com [mailto:N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com] On
                                Behalf Of Dale Putnam
                                Sent: Saturday, June 29, 2013 05:13 PM
                                To: Buck Calabro ; N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com
                                Subject: Re: [N1MM] Re: Networking at Field Day

                                I've some fiber equipment for sale, if someone is interested?
                                Have a great day,
                                Dale - WC7S

                                -----Original Message-----
                                From: Buck Calabro <kc2hiz@...>
                                Date: Sat, 29 Jun 2013 20:52:10
                                To: <N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com>
                                Subject: Re: [N1MM] Re: Networking at Field Day

                                 



                                On 27 June 2013 23:50, Terry G. Glagowski / W1TR <w1tr@...
                                <mailto:w1tr%40yccc.org> > wrote:

                                > **
                                >
                                > Has anyone used OPTICAL FIBER?
                                >
                                Yes.

                                Not for field day, but for the ARRL June and September VHF+ contests. We
                                operate from 3 trucks. One truck has 6M/2M, one has 222/432 and the 3rd has
                                902 MHz -47 GHz.(4 operators). We run ST-ST multimode fiber between the
                                trucks. Inside each truck is a media converter to go from fiber to Cat 5.
                                That goes to a switch. Inside the truck, all the operating stations use
                                regular Cat 5 from the PC to the switch. No RF problems on the computer
                                network.

                                I found 100M of ST-ST outdoor fiber for a ridiculously low price on Ebay
                                which has been very reliable. I loosely string it through the trees to keep
                                it off the ground.

                                Some advice:
                                Keep the protective caps on the fiber while you run it.
                                Keep a small plastic container with you so you have a clean place to put the
                                protective caps; don't get the polished ends of the fiber get dirty and
                                don't let the protective caps get dirty.
                                Bulkhead connectors are cheap and it beats fishing cable through holes in
                                trucks.
                                When the contest is done, carry your container with you and as you
                                disconnect the fiber from the bulkheads/media converters, put the caps back
                                on.
                                Cap the bulkheads too.
                                I use one of those reels for electrical extension cords to wind the fiber
                                up. No issues after 4 years.
                                Electrical tape will leave a sticky mess. I'm switching to velcro cable
                                ties.

                                Hope that helps.
                                73 de Buck KC2HIZ

                                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





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                              • pmackanos
                                W2RDX Rochester DX Association finally got into the 21st century at Field Day this year, we got our network working for the first time for the station
                                Message 15 of 23 , Jun 30, 2013
                                  W2RDX Rochester DX Association finally got into the 21st century at Field Day this year, we got our network working for the first time for the station computers and had internet access, so all stations had packet spots on their station monitors, it was a PIA, but with the help of AE2T, K2DB, K2RNY, W2LB, K2MTH, W3OAB, and K8FC, we finally got it all up and running in a networked environment. I have asked all of the above to send me a synopsis on what we did, so we can document it.
                                  Now all we have to do is get the "casual" SSB operators to learn how to work and chase spots !! The CW ops already knew what control up & down meant hi hi.
                                  We used a linksys wireless router and connected all the station computers to it.
                                  We made the MASTER computer a router, so we could get internet access (thru my cell phone as a wireless hotspot) and then linked the internet to the router computer, and the router computer to he linksys router. I am confused already, thanks to the above guru's, it finally worked, and performed flawlessly all weekend.

                                  Our only problem was the generator went down and took out one of the old dell desktops. (Before the event began.) Luckily I had a spare laptop in my van.

                                  73 Paul K2DB

                                  What kind of networking did you use?

                                  Wireless

                                  Did you use Wired Ethernet between distant points (i.e. several hundred
                                  feet)?

                                  No

                                  Did you use Wireless?

                                  Yes

                                  Did you use Optical Fiber?

                                  NO

                                  What were the considerations?

                                  Getting all stations networked on N1MM ( the easy part )Getting internet access and getting N1MM to get the spots from VE7CC cluster ( this took all the time.) Joe, K8FC finally came in and set us straight.


                                  Did RF get into your networking equipment, or vice versa?

                                  NO

                                  We ran 3A, had 1 SSB and 2 CW stations connected, along with 2 VHF station computers and a MASTER monitor computer.


                                  Paul K2DB



                                  73, Terry : )

                                  --- In N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com, "Terry G. Glagowski / W1TR" <w1tr@...> wrote:
                                  >
                                  > For larger Field Day Groups.
                                  >
                                  > What kind of networking did you use?
                                  >
                                  > Did you use Wired Ethernet between distant points (i.e. several hundred
                                  > feet)?
                                  >
                                  > Did you use Wireless?
                                  >
                                  > Did you use Optical Fiber?
                                  >
                                  > What were the considerations?
                                  >
                                  > Did RF get into your networking equipment, or vice versa?
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > 73, Terry : )
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > Terry G. Glagowski / W1TR
                                  >
                                  > CMARA Office of the Secretary (Field Day) W1BIM
                                  > HAM: W1TR / USAF MARS: AFA1DI
                                  > 25 Hnath Road, Ashford, CT 06278
                                  > (860) 429-9444 (Home Landline)
                                  >
                                  > (781) 225-5458 (Work Office Landline)
                                  > (508) 864-0041 (Terry's cell)
                                  > (EMail) W1TR@... or W1TR@...
                                  > (Web) http://www.Glagowski.org/Radio
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                  >
                                • Buck Calabro
                                  ... The fiber went in service in 2006. The exact gear you d use depends entirely on the kind of fiber you use. We re using OM1, ST-ST 62.5/125 duplex
                                  Message 16 of 23 , Jun 30, 2013
                                    On 29 June 2013 18:39, Terry G. Glagowski / W1TR <w1tr@...> wrote:

                                    > **
                                    >
                                    > If you have some suggestions for equipment (nomenclature or model numbers)
                                    > to use at the fiber ends, sources of that, and sources of fiber and what
                                    > type (nomenclature). I'd appreciate it.
                                    >
                                    The fiber went in service in 2006. The exact gear you'd use depends
                                    entirely on the kind of fiber you use. We're using OM1, ST-ST 62.5/125
                                    duplex multimode fiber. It has a bayonet style mount. We have a TRENDnet
                                    TFC-110MST Fiber Media Converter to connect the fiber to the switches. The
                                    switches are whatever 100M switches we had donated - they're different in
                                    each truck.

                                    As for the fiber itself, we're using only premade fiber. I didn't make up
                                    any ends; that looks too finicky to me. I kept looking on Ebay for ST-ST
                                    fiber. 1 and 3 meter long patch cables are always available, and even now
                                    I see a 60 meter cable and a 78 meter one. The key to remember is
                                    'multimode' - single mode fiber won't plug into a multi-mode jack :-)

                                    Fiber has a bunch of different end connectors. We didn't choose ST because
                                    it was 'the best' - we chose it because that's what someone donated to the
                                    club! It seems that we'd be just as happy with SC, LC or MT-RJ ends (to
                                    name a few). I'm not a fiber guy - I'm a mainframe programmer. so this
                                    stuff seemed like voodoo until I saw that it's pretty much plug and play.

                                    --buck KC2HIZ


                                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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