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Re: [N1MM] Contest Recording (was Enhancement Request)

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  • VR2BrettGraham
    ... If CE 96 has the same functionality, it still can be found easily. 73, VR2BrettGraham
    Message 1 of 27 , Nov 1, 2005
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      KE3D mentioned:

      >The idea is that you preprocess the wav files to equalize the volume
      >between files. It takes a bit of work to get each file such that it
      >does not clip at full scale and matches the other files. Cool Edit
      >(which is not really available) had a widget that you ran on each
      >file (to get the average level and peak) and then you could find a
      >setting to make the others match it.

      If CE '96 has the same functionality, it still can be found easily.

      73, VR2BrettGraham
    • VR2BrettGraham
      ... Although it isn t free, RecAll does pretty good with about 300 MB for a weekend of SO2R recording. Seems everybody does proprietary time code in .wav
      Message 2 of 27 , Nov 1, 2005
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        N1EU mentioned:

        >I abandoned Logger's QSO recording for this contest and used
        >HarddiskOgg (freeware at http://www.fridgesoft.de/harddiskogg.php).
        >It has a command line capability of breaking the recording up every XX
        >seconds - I used 3600 to create one hour long files. It isn't
        >timestamped per se, but it is easy for me to open any of the hour-long
        >files in CoolEdit and listen to specific times. I recorded in mp3
        >(using Lame's dll) at 11khz 16bit stereo, 96kbps stream and believe
        >the hour-long files were about 40MB. The quality was overkill and
        >could have been reduced easily by a factor of 4.

        Although it isn't free, RecAll does pretty good with about 300 MB
        for a weekend of SO2R recording. Seems everybody does
        proprietary time code in .wav files, but it's easy to use it to find
        bits when it comes time to learn from UBNs or to extract
        snippets for massaging with something like CE as invariably it's
        the really weak ones that turn out to be -Bs!

        If you don't want to record your sidetone/monitor, it has VOX
        function. I have yet to find anything missed when it starts
        new record file - I've forgotten how many hours the 25 MB
        limit I have it set to ends up being but it's several & a half.

        And during recent CQ WW RTTY, found it & two instances of
        standalone MMTTY got along quite well.

        73, VR2BrettGraham
      • N1EU
        ... Not sure about CE, but CE Pro has Effects-Amplitude-Normalize and can be applied to a single file or group of files simultaneously. I tried Audacity but
        Message 3 of 27 , Nov 1, 2005
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          --- In N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com, VR2BrettGraham <vr2bg@h...> wrote:
          >
          > KE3D mentioned:
          >
          > >The idea is that you preprocess the wav files to equalize the volume
          > >between files. It takes a bit of work to get each file such that it
          > >does not clip at full scale and matches the other files. Cool Edit
          > >(which is not really available) had a widget that you ran on each
          > >file (to get the average level and peak) and then you could find a
          > >setting to make the others match it.
          >
          > If CE '96 has the same functionality, it still can be found easily.


          Not sure about CE, but CE Pro has Effects-Amplitude-Normalize and can
          be applied to a single file or group of files simultaneously.

          I tried Audacity but noticed audio artifacts after processing my wav
          files. I'm no expert, but I find the results from CoolEdit's audio
          processing noticeably "cleaner" sounding than Audacity.

          Cool Edit Pro is readily available on eBay.

          Cheers,
          Barry
        • Pete Smith
          It is called Amplify, on the Effects menu. 73, Pete
          Message 4 of 27 , Nov 1, 2005
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            It is called Amplify, on the Effects menu.

            73, Pete

            At 11:59 PM 10/31/2005, N5IET Bob wrote:
            >I have that software I will have to look in the help file
            >and find the normalize setting and see how it works.
            >
            >Really wears you out adjusting the volume all the time Hi
            >Hi
            >
            > 73 fer nw,
            >Bob N5IET
            >
            >10X# 37210, FP#-1141, SMIRK#-5177
            >http://www.n5iet.com/
            >Code may be taking a back seat for now,
            >but the pioneering spirit that put the code
            >there in the first place is out front of it all.
            >
            >
            >> -----Original Message-----
            >> From: N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com
            >> [mailto:N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Pete
            >Smith
            >> Sent: Monday, October 31, 2005 8:22 PM
            >> To: N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com;
            >N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com
            >> Subject: RE: [N1MM] Contest Recording (was Enhancement
            >Request)
            >>
            >>
            >> The better method is to use Audacity, freeware that has
            >a
            >> function to normalize a set of recordings to exactly the
            >same
            >> peak level without clipping.
            >>
            >> 73, Pete N4ZR
            >> At 06:06 PM 10/31/2005, N5IET Bob wrote:
            >> >I recorded my call a cq and some other wave files for
            >the first time
            >> >according to the instructions in the manual and they
            >all
            >> worked great
            >> >except for one thing.
            >> >
            >> >I was not able to get any consistency in the level of
            >> >recorded message and had to change the settings on my
            >> >sound card so it would not over drive the output of the
            >transmitter.
            >> >
            >> >Is there a better method?
            >> >
            >> > 73 fer nw,
            >> >Bob N5IET
          • David Robbins K1TTT
            The best method is to record directly with the logger and always have your audio go through the computer. That way the audio path is always the same and
            Message 5 of 27 , Nov 1, 2005
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              The 'best' method is to record directly with the logger and always have your
              audio go through the computer. That way the audio path is always the same
              and your live voice should sound exactly like your recorded voice. So once
              the levels are set they never need to be touched. If you use another
              program you can not count on the level or sound of re-recordings that must
              be done during the contest for splits on 80/40 to sound anything like the
              other recordings, this causes confusion on the other end and can slow you
              down.


              David Robbins K1TTT
              e-mail: mailto:k1ttt@...
              web: http://www.k1ttt.net
              AR-Cluster node: 145.69MHz or telnet://dxc.k1ttt.net


              > -----Original Message-----
              > From: N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com [mailto:N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com] On
              > Behalf Of N5IET Bob
              > Sent: Tuesday, November 01, 2005 04:59
              > To: N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com
              > Subject: RE: [N1MM] Contest Recording (was Enhancement Request)
              >
              > I have that software I will have to look in the help file
              > and find the normalize setting and see how it works.
              >
              > Really wears you out adjusting the volume all the time Hi
              > Hi
              >
              > 73 fer nw,
              > Bob N5IET
              >
              > 10X# 37210, FP#-1141, SMIRK#-5177
              > http://www.n5iet.com/
              > Code may be taking a back seat for now,
              > but the pioneering spirit that put the code
              > there in the first place is out front of it all.
              >
              >
              > > -----Original Message-----
              > > From: N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com
              > > [mailto:N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Pete
              > Smith
              > > Sent: Monday, October 31, 2005 8:22 PM
              > > To: N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com;
              > N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com
              > > Subject: RE: [N1MM] Contest Recording (was Enhancement
              > Request)
              > >
              > >
              > > The better method is to use Audacity, freeware that has
              > a
              > > function to normalize a set of recordings to exactly the
              > same
              > > peak level without clipping.
              > >
              > > 73, Pete N4ZR
              > > At 06:06 PM 10/31/2005, N5IET Bob wrote:
              > > >I recorded my call a cq and some other wave files for
              > the first time
              > > >according to the instructions in the manual and they
              > all
              > > worked great
              > > >except for one thing.
              > > >
              > > >I was not able to get any consistency in the level of
              > > >recorded message and had to change the settings on my
              > > >sound card so it would not over drive the output of the
              > transmitter.
              > > >
              > > >Is there a better method?
              > > >
              > > > 73 fer nw,
              > > >Bob N5IET
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
              > > --------------------~-->
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              > > your home page
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            • W0MU
              I heard one Carib station who s DVK audio was much much louder than his mic audio. I would suggest you have someone listen to your dvk messages and your live
              Message 6 of 27 , Nov 1, 2005
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                I heard one Carib station who's DVK audio was much much louder than his mic
                audio.

                I would suggest you have someone listen to your dvk messages and your live
                mic lines to make sure they are close.



                -----Original Message-----
                From: N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com [mailto:N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com] On
                Behalf Of David Robbins K1TTT
                Sent: Tuesday, November 01, 2005 7:04 AM
                To: N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com
                Subject: RE: [N1MM] Contest Recording (was Enhancement Request)

                The 'best' method is to record directly with the logger and always have your
                audio go through the computer. That way the audio path is always the same
                and your live voice should sound exactly like your recorded voice. So once
                the levels are set they never need to be touched. If you use another
                program you can not count on the level or sound of re-recordings that must
                be done during the contest for splits on 80/40 to sound anything like the
                other recordings, this causes confusion on the other end and can slow you
                down.


                David Robbins K1TTT
                e-mail: mailto:k1ttt@...
                web: http://www.k1ttt.net
                AR-Cluster node: 145.69MHz or telnet://dxc.k1ttt.net


                > -----Original Message-----
                > From: N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com [mailto:N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com]
                > On Behalf Of N5IET Bob
                > Sent: Tuesday, November 01, 2005 04:59
                > To: N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com
                > Subject: RE: [N1MM] Contest Recording (was Enhancement Request)
                >
                > I have that software I will have to look in the help file and find the
                > normalize setting and see how it works.
                >
                > Really wears you out adjusting the volume all the time Hi Hi
                >
                > 73 fer nw,
                > Bob N5IET
                >
                > 10X# 37210, FP#-1141, SMIRK#-5177
                > http://www.n5iet.com/
                > Code may be taking a back seat for now, but the pioneering spirit that
                > put the code there in the first place is out front of it all.
                >
                >
                > > -----Original Message-----
                > > From: N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com
                > > [mailto:N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Pete
                > Smith
                > > Sent: Monday, October 31, 2005 8:22 PM
                > > To: N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com;
                > N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com
                > > Subject: RE: [N1MM] Contest Recording (was Enhancement
                > Request)
                > >
                > >
                > > The better method is to use Audacity, freeware that has
                > a
                > > function to normalize a set of recordings to exactly the
                > same
                > > peak level without clipping.
                > >
                > > 73, Pete N4ZR
                > > At 06:06 PM 10/31/2005, N5IET Bob wrote:
                > > >I recorded my call a cq and some other wave files for
                > the first time
                > > >according to the instructions in the manual and they
                > all
                > > worked great
                > > >except for one thing.
                > > >
                > > >I was not able to get any consistency in the level of recorded
                > > >message and had to change the settings on my sound card so it would
                > > >not over drive the output of the
                > transmitter.
                > > >
                > > >Is there a better method?
                > > >
                > > > 73 fer nw,
                > > >Bob N5IET
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
                > > --------------------~--> Get fast access to your favorite Yahoo!
                > > Groups. Make
                > Yahoo!
                > > your home page
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                > >
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                > >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
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                >




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              • Clive Whelan
                Pete, do you mean, apply an effect to a group of files, if so please tell how? I recently did this to 26 letters and 10 numbers and it took aaaaages! 73 Clive
                Message 7 of 27 , Nov 1, 2005
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                  Pete, do you mean, apply an effect to a group of files, if so please tell
                  how? I recently did this to 26 letters and 10 numbers and it took aaaaages!


                  73


                  Clive
                  GW3NJW

                  The better method is to use Audacity, freeware that has a function to
                  normalize a set of recordings to exactly the same peak level without
                  clipping.

                  73, Pete N4ZR
                  At 06:06 PM 10/31/2005, N5IET Bob wrote:
                  >I recorded my call a cq and some other wave files for the
                  >first time according to the instructions in the manual and
                  >they all worked great except for one thing.
                  >
                  >I was not able to get any consistency in the level of
                  >recorded message and had to change the settings on my
                  >sound card so it would not over drive the output of the
                  >transmitter.
                  >
                  >Is there a better method?
                  >
                  > 73 fer nw,
                  >Bob N5IET



                  To unsubscribe, send an email to:
                  N1MMLogger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com





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                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • Clive Whelan
                  Pete, do you mean, apply an effect to a group of files, if so please tell how? I recently did this to 26 letters and 10 numbers and it took aaaaages! 73 Clive
                  Message 8 of 27 , Nov 1, 2005
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                    Pete, do you mean, apply an effect to a group of files, if so please tell
                    how? I recently did this to 26 letters and 10 numbers and it took aaaaages!


                    73


                    Clive
                    GW3NJW

                    The better method is to use Audacity, freeware that has a function to
                    normalize a set of recordings to exactly the same peak level without
                    clipping.

                    73, Pete N4ZR
                    At 06:06 PM 10/31/2005, N5IET Bob wrote:
                    >I recorded my call a cq and some other wave files for the
                    >first time according to the instructions in the manual and
                    >they all worked great except for one thing.
                    >
                    >I was not able to get any consistency in the level of
                    >recorded message and had to change the settings on my
                    >sound card so it would not over drive the output of the
                    >transmitter.
                    >
                    >Is there a better method?
                    >
                    > 73 fer nw,
                    >Bob N5IET



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                    N1MMLogger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com





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                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • Pete Smith
                    No, I m not aware of any batch adjustment capability - I was referring to all the files used by MM as a set , thinking of the more usual 8-10 files in those
                    Message 9 of 27 , Nov 1, 2005
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                      No, I'm not aware of any "batch" adjustment capability - I was referring to all the files used by MM as a "set", thinking of the more usual 8-10 files in those terms.

                      73, Pete N4ZR

                      At 01:03 PM 11/1/2005, Clive Whelan wrote:

                      > Pete, do you mean, apply an effect to a group of files, if so please tell
                      >how? I recently did this to 26 letters and 10 numbers and it took aaaaages!
                      >
                      >
                      > 73
                      >
                      >
                      > Clive
                      > GW3NJW
                      >
                      > The better method is to use Audacity, freeware that has a function to
                      >normalize a set of recordings to exactly the same peak level without
                      >clipping.
                      >
                      > 73, Pete N4ZR
                      > At 06:06 PM 10/31/2005, N5IET Bob wrote:
                      > >I recorded my call a cq and some other wave files for the
                      > >first time according to the instructions in the manual and
                      > >they all worked great except for one thing.
                      > >
                      > >I was not able to get any consistency in the level of
                      > >recorded message and had to change the settings on my
                      > >sound card so it would not over drive the output of the
                      > >transmitter.
                      > >
                      > >Is there a better method?
                      > >
                      > > 73 fer nw,
                      > >Bob N5IET
                    • David Robbins K1TTT
                      If you change from the default device on the so2r/v tab you should be able to select which input line you want to record from. Using the default device you
                      Message 10 of 27 , Nov 1, 2005
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                        If you change from the default device on the so2r/v tab you should be able
                        to select which input line you want to record from. Using the 'default'
                        device you don't have that kind of control from the program, you have to
                        manually change recording devices from the windows control panel.


                        David Robbins K1TTT
                        e-mail: mailto:k1ttt@...
                        web: http://www.k1ttt.net
                        AR-Cluster node: 145.69MHz or telnet://dxc.k1ttt.net


                        > -----Original Message-----
                        > From: N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com [mailto:N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com] On
                        > Behalf Of Joe Subich, W4TV
                        > Sent: Monday, October 31, 2005 14:35
                        > To: N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com
                        > Subject: RE: [N1MM] Enhancement Request ...
                        >
                        >
                        > Pete,
                        >
                        > Yes, if one were using the $5 SO2R it would probably be necessary
                        > to use a third sound card but I do not see that as a problem.
                        >
                        > At present Dave appears to force the recording to "what you hear"
                        > on the Rx sound card in the "soundcard SO2R" modes. I think that
                        > is a mistake.
                        >
                        > It would be much more flexible if the user should be allowed to
                        > specify the recording inputs independent of transmit or receive
                        > sources. Some users may want to record "what you hear" ...
                        > others might prefer to record both radios continuously, etc.
                        > With some of the inexpensive USB based "sound cards" floating
                        > around, I can see using one of the $25 USB devices that does
                        > not support both mic and line inputs or duplex operation as
                        > a dedicated recording/logging input.
                        >
                        > I also agree with a continuous, time stamped recording (perhaps
                        > with files based on hourly segments).
                        >
                        > 73,
                        >
                        > ... Joe, W4TV
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > > -----Original Message-----
                        > > From: N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com
                        > > [mailto:N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Pete Smith
                        > > Sent: Monday, October 31, 2005 7:10 AM
                        > > To: N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com
                        > > Subject: Re: [N1MM] Enhancement Request ...
                        > >
                        > >
                        > > Sure, Joe - I'm not sure how that would interact with the $5
                        > > SO2R feature that K1TTT invented, but maybe he can comment.
                        > > Time for 3 sound cards?
                        > >
                        > > Personally I would love to have an entirely different QSO
                        > > recording routine. - Ideally, I think it would use a
                        > > continuous recording and industry-standard timestamping in
                        > > the resulting file. The problem with the current scheme is
                        > > that it stops each recording when a QSO is logged, which
                        > > means that during S&P anything that happens immediately after
                        > > the QSO - fills, etc. - gets lost.
                        > >
                        > > 73, Pete N4ZR
                        > >
                        > > At 01:21 AM 10/31/2005, W4TV wrote:
                        > >
                        > > >Pete,
                        > > >
                        > > >If it's not already hidden on the list, can you log a
                        > > >request to separate the some of the audio functions -
                        > > >allow them to be performed on different sound cards for
                        > > >those with multiple sound devices?
                        > > >
                        > > >For example, it would be very nice to have the QSO record
                        > > >function (and review) on the Windows Default sound card
                        > > >(index 0) while the TX Sound Card (DVK) is the second
                        > > >sound card. Among other benefits, A QSO can be reviewed
                        > > >"on the fly" without the possibility of accidentally
                        > > >putting it on the air. In addition, by keeping the TX
                        > > >function off the Windows Default card, the chance of
                        > > >Windows' sound effects making it on the air is greatly
                        > > >reduced.
                        > > >
                        > > >73,
                        > > >
                        > > > ... Joe, W4TV
                        > >
                        > >
                        > >
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                        >
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                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                      • N1EU
                        ... referring to all the files used by MM as a set , thinking of the more usual 8-10 files in those terms. ... FWIW, CoolEdit Pro has a full featured Batch
                        Message 11 of 27 , Nov 1, 2005
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                          --- In N1MMLogger@yahoogroups.com, Pete Smith <n4zr@c...> wrote:
                          >
                          > No, I'm not aware of any "batch" adjustment capability - I was
                          referring to all the files used by MM as a "set", thinking of the more
                          usual 8-10 files in those terms.
                          >

                          FWIW, CoolEdit Pro has a full featured Batch Process mode. You turn
                          on the script recorder and perform the operation on one file
                          (normalize to 0dB, add a little EQ/compression, etc) and then save the
                          script. You then select Batch Process, and add all the files you want
                          processed the same way and tell CE Pro to run the batch. Probably
                          would have saved Clive a little work.

                          73,
                          Barry N1EU
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