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Re: [MT] New Blood 3

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  • Sam Schaperow
    Some people do cultivate them (such as Daniel Wheeler, the expert of MushroomHorticulture, who did it as an outdoor cultivation), & yes that s pretty cool. As
    Message 1 of 24 , Mar 19 12:09 PM
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      Some people do cultivate them (such as Daniel Wheeler, the expert of MushroomHorticulture, who did it as an outdoor cultivation), & yes that's pretty cool.  As to flavor, I have eaten delicious morels from WF.  Can't be sure if cultivated, though. 
      I have cultivated other mushrooms that were delicious. 
      I think what result we get in flavor is a combination of:
      • Freshness
      • maturity level
      • species
      • cooking method
      • growing conditions (probably sometimes, but not others)

      One of the mot flavorful mushrooms I've had was Agaricus bisporus from a growing kit, w/a sweet stipe and excellent texture.  


      Sam

    • vincekirchner
      Okay, ignorance speaking here. What is a burn morel? I read through the messages stating that the cultivated morels are tasteless, but is that because they
      Message 2 of 24 , Mar 19 12:31 PM
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        Okay, ignorance speaking here. What is a burn morel?

        I read through the messages stating that the cultivated morels are tasteless, but is that because they are grown in a sawdust bed under specific light/moisture conditions, would they taste the same if I/we can produce a suitable wild condition in a forest garden structure?

        Vince

        PS. I also think it is cool to say you grew them.



        --- In MushroomTalk@yahoogroups.com, Sam Schaperow <sam.schaperow@...> wrote:
        >
        > Some people do cultivate them (such as Daniel Wheeler, the expert of
        > MushroomHorticulture, who did it as an outdoor cultivation), & yes that's
        > pretty cool. As to flavor, I have eaten delicious morels from WF. Can't
        > be sure if cultivated, though.
        > I have cultivated other mushrooms that were delicious.
        > I think what result we get in flavor is a combination of:
        >
        > - *Freshness*
        > - *maturity level
        > *
        > - *species*
        > - *cooking method*
        > - *growing conditions (probably sometimes, but not others)
        > *
        >
        > One of the mot flavorful mushrooms I've had was Agaricus bisporus from a
        > growing kit, w/a sweet stipe and excellent texture.
        >
        >
        > Sam
        >
      • George P. Macklin
        Hey Vince, A burn morel is a morel that grows in an area that has been through the distress caused by a fire. You can research previous burn sites using the US
        Message 3 of 24 , Mar 19 12:40 PM
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          Hey Vince,

          A burn morel is a morel that grows in an area that has been through the distress caused by a fire. You can research previous burn sites using the US Forest Service to find possible locations.

          Cheers,
          George P. Macklin

          www.granularmatter.com | Eurorack Modules | www.toppobrillo.com


          On Tue, Mar 19, 2013 at 12:31 PM, vincekirchner <vince@...> wrote:
           

          Okay, ignorance speaking here. What is a burn morel?

          I read through the messages stating that the cultivated morels are tasteless, but is that because they are grown in a sawdust bed under specific light/moisture conditions, would they taste the same if I/we can produce a suitable wild condition in a forest garden structure?

          Vince

          PS. I also think it is cool to say you grew them.


        • Sam Schaperow
          Vince, The burn morels appear to not be much of an Eastern USA phenomenon, but west of the East they can ammount to huge #s of morels, as well as very large
          Message 4 of 24 , Mar 19 1:16 PM
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            Vince, The burn morels appear to not be much of an Eastern USA phenomenon, but west of the East they can ammount to huge #s of morels, as well as very large ones (not positive on the latter). 

            Mike, I've not only known Daniel W. to grow them outside through many steps, but also someone (in CT??) to grow them in his basement (or so I've heard).  I think Daniel's were of excellent flavor, but I don't know about he basement ones. 

            Sam
            On Tue, Mar 19, 2013 at 3:40 PM, George P. Macklin <junkrhythm@...> wrote:
             

            Hey Vince,

            A burn morel is a morel that grows in an area that has been through the distress caused by a fire. You can research previous burn sites using the US Forest Service to find possible locations.

            Cheers,
            George P. Macklin

            www.granularmatter.com | Eurorack Modules | www.toppobrillo.com


            On Tue, Mar 19, 2013 at 12:31 PM, vincekirchner <vince@...> wrote:
             

            Okay, ignorance speaking here. What is a burn morel?

            I read through the messages stating that the cultivated morels are tasteless, but is that because they are grown in a sawdust bed under specific light/moisture conditions, would they taste the same if I/we can produce a suitable wild condition in a forest garden structure?

            Vince

            PS. I also think it is cool to say you grew them.





            --
            Sam Schaperow, MSMFT, LMFT
            Clinical Director
            PsychologyCT.com
          • stereoviews_com
            Vince, Shiitake and wine caps (Stropharia rugosoannulata) are pretty easy. Getting wine caps locally worked for me. They often hitch hike on landscaper wood
            Message 5 of 24 , Mar 19 1:41 PM
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              Vince,
               
              Shiitake and wine caps (Stropharia rugosoannulata) are pretty easy. Getting wine caps locally worked for me. They often hitch hike on landscaper wood chips. I got some chips and rhizomorphs from a friend's garden (who got them accidentally from landscapers chips) and put them in a baggie and brought them home and planted them. They grew fine. I tried Stamets spawn and thought it was poorly grown out and it didn't work.
               
               
               
              I wouldn't be surprised if you could go to a landscapers place and buy chips that have wine caps already in them. Give them enough chips some water and they are pretty low maintenance. I planted my stem butts and some chips in other locations and am hoping for a lot this year. Very tasty with unique flavor.
               
              You already know shiitake aren't difficult. I grew them well the past 7-8 years and then turkey tails infected my logs. I will need to start over.
               
              David Spahr
               
               
              In a message dated 3/19/2013 11:21:39 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, vince@... writes:

              Cultivated Morels - everyone keeps asking me how to do it.
              Inoculating hazelnut and oaks to produce truffles.

              Thanks
              Vince
            • candycap
              the natural wild morels that do not come from burn areas also have great flavor.......   I am only telling you my personal experience with the cultivated
              Message 6 of 24 , Mar 19 1:45 PM
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                the "natural" wild morels that do not come from burn areas also
                have great flavor.......
                 
                I am only telling you my personal experience with the cultivated ones....I"ve spoken of this before in that lengthy thread Dimitar refers to......I am speaking from first hand experience.....they were all  uniform in size (about that of a thimble - i.e. 1/2 inch to no larger than an inch in stature), and again, they had no flavor. 
                 
                If one wants the aesthetics of having a mushroom that looks like a "morel" on their plate, I guess they would fill the bill........and, a good chef, could probably suffocate them in a flavorful sauce.
                 
                There must be a reason this company is no longer in business.....but this does not mean that someone else cannot experiment and try to cultivate a better product......since it has, at least, been proven that the morel can be cultivated....which is more than can be said for most of our other favorite wild edibles.
                 
                cc
                 
                From: Sam Schaperow <sam.schaperow@...>
                To: MushroomTalk@yahoogroups.com
                Sent: Tuesday, March 19, 2013 1:16 PM
                Subject: Re: [MT] New Blood 3
                 
                Vince, The burn morels appear to not be much of an Eastern USA phenomenon, but west of the East they can ammount to huge #s of morels, as well as very large ones (not positive on the latter). 

                Mike, I've not only known Daniel W. to grow them outside through many steps, but also someone (in CT??) to grow them in his basement (or so I've heard).  I think Daniel's were of excellent flavor, but I don't know about he basement ones. 

                Sam
                On Tue, Mar 19, 2013 at 3:40 PM, George P. Macklin <junkrhythm@...> wrote:
                 
                Hey Vince,

                A burn morel is a morel that grows in an area that has been through the distress caused by a fire. You can research previous burn sites using the US Forest Service to find possible locations.
                Cheers, George P. Macklinhttp://www.granularmatter.blogspot.com/ | Eurorack Modules | http://www.toppobrillo.com/
                On Tue, Mar 19, 2013 at 12:31 PM, vincekirchner <vince@...> wrote:
                 
                Okay, ignorance speaking here. What is a burn morel?

                I read through the messages stating that the cultivated morels are tasteless, but is that because they are grown in a sawdust bed under specific light/moisture conditions, would they taste the same if I/we can produce a suitable wild condition in a forest garden structure?

                Vince

                PS. I also think it is cool to say you grew them.

                -- Sam Schaperow, MSMFT, LMFTClinical DirectorPsychologyCT.com
              • stereoviews_com
                Vince, No one guarantees morel kits. They will tell you it works but, like stump culture, your mileage may vary or not work at all. BTW, If anyone can show me
                Message 7 of 24 , Mar 19 1:53 PM
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                  Vince,
                   
                  No one guarantees morel kits. They will tell you it works but, like stump culture, your mileage may vary or not work at all.
                   
                  BTW, If anyone can show me a successful working stump culture farm online I'd like to see it. I have looked many times.
                   
                  One stump doesn't count. Talk doesn't count. Showing inoculation doesn't count. Real results.
                   
                  Why would I ask? I tried it on over 200 stumps and it worked on about 1% and even then not well.
                   
                  David Spahr
                   
                  In a message dated 3/19/2013 2:48:11 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, candycap2000@... writes:
                   

                  re cultivated morels........more than the price issue (people with money will pay almost any price  for something they want if it has the quality), the cultivated ones had zero flavor......kind of resembled eating the sole of a tennis shoe.
                   
                  cc

                  From: Dimitar Bojantchev <dimitar@...>
                  To: MushroomTalk@yahoogroups.com
                  Sent: Tuesday, March 19, 2013 11:41 AM
                  Subject: Re: [MT] New Blood 3
                   
                  Vince, welcome!! Very impressive site and field of study.
                   
                  We are mostly mushroomers here, but spread the spectrum of topics. Initially we started more on the fungal taxonomy and “where to find what” types of discussions. Lately there is a lot more culinary talk. Also lots of other general topics. But most fundamentally this forum serves as a medium where we can present contrarian views on various topics and feel comfortable in doing so...  Welcome.
                   
                  As far as the morel cultivation, this topic has been discussed extensively in the past. There used to be an operation that cultivated them, somewhere in the Midwest, but supposedly it went out of business as it couldn’t beat the prices of the burn morels that typically flood the west every spring.
                   
                      Dimitar
                   
                   
                  Sent: Tuesday, March 19, 2013 8:21 AM
                  Subject: [MT] New Blood 3
                   
                   
                  As suggested, a brief introduction about myself. I work in the automotive field as a designer for automotive parts, that pays the bills. My heart for the past few years has been deeply entrenched in writing articles and deepening my knowledge of Permaculture. I will be holding my first Permaculture Design Course in September of this year. My home is Tiffin Ohio, so I have easy access to the Great Lakes Area which is why I named my business Great Lakes Permaculture www.greatlakespermaculture.com). I am also an Ohio State Master Gardener.

                  My knowledge of mushrooming is limited, I was able to spend a day with Dr. Ken Mudge from Cornell when he presented a Forest Farming class this past year. We made our own mushroom logs (Shiitake) as part of the class. This year will be the first fruiting for me which I am looking forward to immensely. Because of the Permaculture work, I will be presenting a Forest Farming presentation (2 Hours) through our local community adult education program, so I have interests in the following areas to increase my knowledge.

                  Cultivated Morels - everyone keeps asking me how to do it.
                  Inoculating hazelnut and oaks to produce truffles.

                  Thanks
                  Vince

                • candycap
                  David; since  you are older than God  himself, according to Patrick, do you know of the company that used to be in business somewhere back east or mid-west?
                  Message 8 of 24 , Mar 19 2:20 PM
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                    David; since  you are older than God  himself, according to Patrick, do you know of the company that used to be in business somewhere back east or mid-west?
                     
                    I got the connection from Larry Stickney (who is no longer with us to verify their name) and ordered from them for a one time event where the Chef insisted he wanted morels (even though they were not yet in season). 
                     
                    I being the aesthetic when it comes to serving seasonal fare  tried to talk him out of it but kind of glad I could not since I was able to see and "taste" these cultivated pee-wees first hand.
                     
                    Irma
                    cc
                     

                    From: "DSPAHR3D@..." <DSPAHR3D@...>
                    To: MushroomTalk@yahoogroups.com
                    Sent: Tuesday, March 19, 2013 1:53 PM
                    Subject: Re: [MT] New Blood 3
                     
                    Vince,
                     
                    No one guarantees morel kits. They will tell you it works but, like stump culture, your mileage may vary or not work at all.
                     
                    BTW, If anyone can show me a successful working stump culture farm online I'd like to see it. I have looked many times.
                     
                    One stump doesn't count. Talk doesn't count. Showing inoculation doesn't count. Real results.
                     
                    Why would I ask? I tried it on over 200 stumps and it worked on about 1% and even then not well.
                     
                    David Spahr
                     
                    In a message dated 3/19/2013 2:48:11 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, candycap2000@... writes:
                     
                    re cultivated morels........more than the price issue (people with money will pay almost any price  for something they want if it has the quality), the cultivated ones had zero flavor......kind of resembled eating the sole of a tennis shoe.
                     
                    cc

                    From: Dimitar Bojantchev <dimitar@...>
                    To: MushroomTalk@yahoogroups.com
                    Sent: Tuesday, March 19, 2013 11:41 AM
                    Subject: Re: [MT] New Blood 3
                     
                    Vince, welcome!! Very impressive site and field of study.
                     
                    We are mostly mushroomers here, but spread the spectrum of topics. Initially we started more on the fungal taxonomy and “where to find what” types of discussions. Lately there is a lot more culinary talk. Also lots of other general topics. But most fundamentally this forum serves as a medium where we can present contrarian views on various topics and feel comfortable in doing so...  Welcome.
                     
                    As far as the morel cultivation, this topic has been discussed extensively in the past. There used to be an operation that cultivated them, somewhere in the Midwest, but supposedly it went out of business as it couldn’t beat the prices of the burn morels that typically flood the west every spring.
                     
                        Dimitar
                     
                     
                    Sent: Tuesday, March 19, 2013 8:21 AM
                    Subject: [MT] New Blood 3
                     
                     
                    As suggested, a brief introduction about myself. I work in the automotive field as a designer for automotive parts, that pays the bills. My heart for the past few years has been deeply entrenched in writing articles and deepening my knowledge of Permaculture. I will be holding my first Permaculture Design Course in September of this year. My home is Tiffin Ohio, so I have easy access to the Great Lakes Area which is why I named my business Great Lakes Permaculture www.greatlakespermaculture.com). I am also an Ohio State Master Gardener. My knowledge of mushrooming is limited, I was able to spend a day with Dr. Ken Mudge from Cornell when he presented a Forest Farming class this past year. We made our own mushroom logs (Shiitake) as part of the class. This year will be the first fruiting for me which I am looking forward to immensely. Because of the Permaculture work, I will be presenting a Forest Farming presentation (2 Hours) through our local community adult education program, so I have interests in the following areas to increase my knowledge. Cultivated Morels - everyone keeps asking me how to do it. Inoculating hazelnut and oaks to produce truffles. Thanks Vince
                  • Wine Way Inn
                    The Morel growing company was outside Lansing Michigan, I think it was called Morel Mountain. I personally looked at taking licenses for Europe. The issue
                    Message 9 of 24 , Mar 19 3:45 PM
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                      The Morel growing company was outside Lansing Michigan, I think it was called Morel Mountain. I personally looked at taking licenses for Europe. The issue economically was not competition from burn morels but inability to get consistent yields on a several week batch process. It was two phase. First corn was inoculated with the morel strain and put through a cycle to produce sclerotia. These were then introduced to the growing bed and went through a complex cycle which, if executed just right, produced great flushes of morels. If not just right, nothing at all to show for your time, money and effort.

                       

                      Flavors as I remember were pretty good and while there were many smalls there were also decent mediums.

                       

                      Last I heard the technology got sold to an outfit in I think Alabama but I have never seen it come to fruition (pun intended).

                       

                      Below is a little snippet I found from an old mushroom magazine.

                       

                      Cheers

                       

                      Nick

                      A VISIT TO MOREL MOUNTAIN, MICHIGAN

                      Spores Afield, April 1992

                      reprinted from the Detroit Free Press

                       

                      (Mason, Michigan) -It's a little hard to believe.  In Mason, Michigan, a

                      town of 7,000, one of the world's delicacies is growing inside a yellow-sided

                      building in an industrial park.  It's called Morel Mountain, and it's the

                      only place where morels are grown -- other than the woods of springtime.

                      Since March 1989, it has been home to this famous fungus and its smoky,

                      earthy flavors. The morels, growing in an unusual environment, seem to be the

                      most natural part of the operation.  The more unlikely discovery inside this

                      barracks of a building is that Morel Mountain is a high-tech, international

                      endeavor that promises hefty long-term profits for its owner, Domino's Pizza

                      Distribution Inc.  At $25 a pound, these morels aren't cheap.  At the peak of

                      the springtime harvest, wild morels are just $8 to $9 per pound.  Dried morels

                      cost $90 to $160 per pound, but one pound of dried equals 8 to 10 pounds

                      rehydrated.  Price really isn't an issue, said Perry Mulleavy, general

                      manager of this Domino's subsidiary.  Even though indoor cultivation takes

                      away a bit the wild morel's cachet, morels never will become a commodity like

                      white button mushrooms, he said.  "The morel is a special niche.  It's a

                      high-end gourmet product.  In our opinion, we have the Mercedes of the

                      cultivated mushrooms. We want to retain that."  Indeed, all mushrooms once

                      were found only in the wild, but the effort to cultivate morels didn't start

                      until 1982.  Mulleavy still calls it a pilot project, even though the company

                      is producing 350 pounds every week.  Increased yield and more plants are

                      planned. Mulleavy calls the 7,500 square-foot Mason plant too small and hopes

                      to be producing morels at a larger plant by the spring of 1992.  Its location

                      is what Mulleavy calls "proprietary."  Translation: None of your business.

                      How he explains cultivated morels:  "They're grown indoors, in a

                      greenhouse-like environment, where we actively control the growth

                      environment.  They're grown in soil."  No home growing tips here; details are

                      proprietary.  "People have been trying to cultivate morels for 100 years.  We

                      were able to put all the necessary pieces of the puzzle together to do just

                      that," Mulleavy said. Morel Mountain sells all it cultivates to hotels,

                      restaurants and gourmet retailers.  Ask how much the company could sell if

                      production were up to par, and Mulleavy uses the word "proprietary" again.  A

                      check with Balducci's, a New York City gourmet retailer, reveals that a

                      $39-per-pound price hasn't fazed any customers since Morel Mountain morels

                      started being offered.  The owners said only chefs notice any difference in

                      taste.  "They're not as intense as the wild ones in spring, not quite," said

                      Charlie Balducci.  "They're very close and very good."  Wild morels have a

                      stronger, more woody smell.  Scott Hershey of Hershey's Steak and Seafood, a M

                      ichigan restaurant, said Mason morels are just as good as wild, and he's

                      using been them for almost 10 months in appetizers and soups and to accompany

                      entrees. "I guess the fun is that they're available year-round.  The response

                      that you're able to get from your guests when you put fresh morels on a plate

                      in front of them . . . just kind of blows their mind."  To order from Morel

                      Mountain, call 1-800-926-6735 weekdays from 8 a.m. to 5 p.m. Central Standard

                      Time.

                       

                       

                       

                       

                      Nick and Gillian Kite - Innkeepers/Owners

                                       

                      Contact: Wine Way Inn at:

                      1019 Foothill Boulevard - Calistoga, CA 94515

                      Phone: 707 942 0680

                      Email: Winewayinn@...

                      Web: WWW.Winewayinn.com

                       

                    • stereoviews_com
                      Irma, I m not sure which company you are referring to. I Have seen a number of morel kits sold and tried one myself. No luck. I have tried morel slurries and
                      Message 10 of 24 , Mar 19 3:52 PM
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                        Irma,
                         
                        I'm not sure which company you are referring to. I Have seen a number of morel kits sold and tried one myself. No luck. I have tried morel slurries and other strategies.
                         
                        Patrick, that old fuddyduddy, is older than me BTW. He dated Wilma Flintstone.
                         
                        There is a place that sells trees you buy and plant too. Their evidence was weak with a whole bunch of trees and very few morels. Poorly photographed as well. I visited that site semi recently and noticed it had not changed since 2006. I wrote to ask if there were better pictures available. He copped an attitude and told me he was just selling franchises. Okaaaay... I suggested that better evidence would be useful. He got grumpier and things went downhill. I guess I suggested that a lively 14 year old could probably take better pictures in a few minutes and post them as well. That prompted vitriolic spasms. The truth is sometimes cruel.
                         
                        Anybody know anything good about this? I just asked "where's the beef?" (sorry for the archaic 80's reference...).
                         
                        Yes, that crotchety Patrick is older.....  He remembers when they invented dirt. Also funnier on a computer screen than most people. No pics necessary!
                         
                        David
                         
                        In a message dated 3/19/2013 5:20:37 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, candycap2000@... writes:
                        David; since  you are older than God  himself, according to Patrick, do you know of the company that used to be in business somewhere back east or mid-west?
                         
                        I got the connection from Larry Stickney (who is no longer with us to verify their name) and ordered from them for a one time event where the Chef insisted he wanted morels (even though they were not yet in season). 
                         
                        I being the aesthetic when it comes to serving seasonal fare  tried to talk him out of it but kind of glad I could not since I was able to see and "taste" these cultivated pee-wees first hand.
                         
                        Irma
                        cc
                         
                      • J H
                        It was in scottville...just outside of ludington. I called there several years ago and go Gary ,ills on the phone. He swears they are yellow esculent a type
                        Message 11 of 24 , Mar 19 3:59 PM
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                          It was in scottville...just outside of ludington. I called there several years ago and go Gary ,ills on the phone. He swears they are yellow esculent a type morels, I think that information was false and they are growing rufobrunnea.  I bought them fresh in local stores several times, you don't have to do a DNA study to see morphology is consistent with rufos, and looks nothing like the thousands of yellow and grey morels I have picked in my day.
                          I have attempted to develop a fruiting strain of rufobrunnea from a collection sent to me by Hugh smith. I have not had any success other than burning through about 400 Petri dishes trying to get something going. I was spore washing and cloning from dry material though...which is not the best route to go. I have had luck cloning yellow morels from fresh, and I used the American type culture libraries M11 black morel strain to make an outdoor bed, and got a weak fruiting.
                          The real problem for me is getting good sized sclerotium to form on grain spawn. With black morels, it seems as though everyone can get little sclerotia, but I haven't seen anyone outside of roger rabbit from shroomery.org get really consistent results with big sclerotia on grain spawn.

                           The Israelis and the Chinese are having some luck cultivating morels as well....it can be done, it's just not very easy and requires some tenacity....commercial ventures want to walk right in to predicable results, and I think we're still a few years away from that.

                          Jason Hauser
                          Aka greys

                          On Mar 19, 2013, at 6:45 PM, "Wine Way Inn" <winewayinn@...> wrote:

                           

                          The Morel growing company was outside Lansing Michigan, I think it was called Morel Mountain. I personally looked at taking licenses for Europe. The issue economically was not competition from burn morels but inability to get consistent yields on a several week batch process. It was two phase. First corn was inoculated with the morel strain and put through a cycle to produce sclerotia. These were then introduced to the growing bed and went through a complex cycle which, if executed just right, produced great flushes of morels. If not just right, nothing at all to show for your time, money and effort.

                           

                          Flavors as I remember were pretty good and while there were many smalls there were also decent mediums.

                           

                          Last I heard the technology got sold to an outfit in I think Alabama but I have never seen it come to fruition (pun intended).

                           

                          Below is a little snippet I found from an old mushroom magazine.

                           

                          Cheers

                           

                          Nick

                          A VISIT TO MOREL MOUNTAIN, MICHIGAN

                          Spores Afield, April 1992

                          reprinted from the Detroit Free Press

                           

                          (Mason, Michigan) -It's a little hard to believe.  In Mason, Michigan, a

                          town of 7,000, one of the world's delicacies is growing inside a yellow-sided

                          building in an industrial park.  It's called Morel Mountain, and it's the

                          only place where morels are grown -- other than the woods of springtime.

                          Since March 1989, it has been home to this famous fungus and its smoky,

                          earthy flavors. The morels, growing in an unusual environment, seem to be the

                          most natural part of the operation.  The more unlikely discovery inside this

                          barracks of a building is that Morel Mountain is a high-tech, international

                          endeavor that promises hefty long-term profits for its owner, Domino's Pizza

                          Distribution Inc.  At $25 a pound, these morels aren't cheap.  At the peak of

                          the springtime harvest, wild morels are just $8 to $9 per pound.  Dried morels

                          cost $90 to $160 per pound, but one pound of dried equals 8 to 10 pounds

                          rehydrated.  Price really isn't an issue, said Perry Mulleavy, general

                          manager of this Domino's subsidiary.  Even though indoor cultivation takes

                          away a bit the wild morel's cachet, morels never will become a commodity like

                          white button mushrooms, he said.  "The morel is a special niche.  It's a

                          high-end gourmet product.  In our opinion, we have the Mercedes of the

                          cultivated mushrooms. We want to retain that."  Indeed, all mushrooms once

                          were found only in the wild, but the effort to cultivate morels didn't start

                          until 1982.  Mulleavy still calls it a pilot project, even though the company

                          is producing 350 pounds every week.  Increased yield and more plants are

                          planned. Mulleavy calls the 7,500 square-foot Mason plant too small and hopes

                          to be producing morels at a larger plant by the spring of 1992.  Its location

                          is what Mulleavy calls "proprietary."  Translation: None of your business.

                          How he explains cultivated morels:  "They're grown indoors, in a

                          greenhouse-like environment, where we actively control the growth

                          environment.  They're grown in soil."  No home growing tips here; details are

                          proprietary.  "People have been trying to cultivate morels for 100 years.  We

                          were able to put all the necessary pieces of the puzzle together to do just

                          that," Mulleavy said. Morel Mountain sells all it cultivates to hotels,

                          restaurants and gourmet retailers.  Ask how much the company could sell if

                          production were up to par, and Mulleavy uses the word "proprietary" again.  A

                          check with Balducci's, a New York City gourmet retailer, reveals that a

                          $39-per-pound price hasn't fazed any customers since Morel Mountain morels

                          started being offered.  The owners said only chefs notice any difference in

                          taste.  "They're not as intense as the wild ones in spring, not quite," said

                          Charlie Balducci.  "They're very close and very good."  Wild morels have a

                          stronger, more woody smell.  Scott Hershey of Hershey's Steak and Seafood, a M

                          ichigan restaurant, said Mason morels are just as good as wild, and he's

                          using been them for almost 10 months in appetizers and soups and to accompany

                          entrees. "I guess the fun is that they're available year-round.  The response

                          that you're able to get from your guests when you put fresh morels on a plate

                          in front of them . . . just kind of blows their mind."  To order from Morel

                          Mountain, call 1-800-926-6735 weekdays from 8 a.m. to 5 p.m. Central Standard

                          Time.

                           

                           

                           

                           

                          Nick and Gillian Kite - Innkeepers/Owners

                                           

                          Contact: Wine Way Inn at:

                          1019 Foothill Boulevard - Calistoga, CA 94515

                          Phone: 707 942 0680

                          Email: Winewayinn@...

                          Web: WWW.Winewayinn.com

                           

                        • Dimitar Bojantchev
                          ... Wow -- is this real, or exaggerated?? 400? Holly molly, I thought only taxonomy was expensive (half-joking). These do look like M. rufobrunnea to my
                          Message 12 of 24 , Mar 19 4:21 PM
                          • 0 Attachment
                            >I have not had any success other than
                            burning through about 400 Petri dishes trying to get something going.
                             
                            Wow -- is this real, or exaggerated?? 400? Holly molly, I thought only taxonomy was expensive Smile (half-joking).
                             
                            These do look like M. rufobrunnea to my untrained eye – and yes, they are known from popping up in all kinds of spots where decay seems to happen..
                             
                            David A’s photo is spectacular..
                             
                            How come these guys were so successful and most other experienced folks have trouble repeating the result. Is there a secret? Apparently, there must be something...
                             
                                Dimitar
                             
                            From: J H
                            Sent: Tuesday, March 19, 2013 3:59 PM
                            Subject: Re: [MT] Re: New Blood 3
                             
                             

                            It was in scottville...just outside of ludington. I called there several years ago and go Gary ,ills on the phone. He swears they are yellow esculent a type morels, I think that information was false and they are growing rufobrunnea.  I bought them fresh in local stores several times, you don't have to do a DNA study to see morphology is consistent with rufos, and looks nothing like the thousands of yellow and grey morels I have picked in my day.
                            I have attempted to develop a fruiting strain of rufobrunnea from a collection sent to me by Hugh smith. I have not had any success other than burning through about 400 Petri dishes trying to get something going. I was spore washing and cloning from dry material though...which is not the best route to go. I have had luck cloning yellow morels from fresh, and I used the American type culture libraries M11 black morel strain to make an outdoor bed, and got a weak fruiting.
                            The real problem for me is getting good sized sclerotium to form on grain spawn. With black morels, it seems as though everyone can get little sclerotia, but I haven't seen anyone outside of roger rabbit from shroomery.org get really consistent results with big sclerotia on grain spawn.

                            The Israelis and the Chinese are having some luck cultivating morels as well....it can be done, it's just not very easy and requires some tenacity....commercial ventures want to walk right in to predicable results, and I think we're still a few years away from that.
                             
                            Jason Hauser
                            Aka greys

                            On Mar 19, 2013, at 6:45 PM, "Wine Way Inn" <winewayinn@...> wrote:

                             

                            The Morel growing company was outside Lansing Michigan, I think it was called Morel Mountain. I personally looked at taking licenses for Europe. The issue economically was not competition from burn morels but inability to get consistent yields on a several week batch process. It was two phase. First corn was inoculated with the morel strain and put through a cycle to produce sclerotia. These were then introduced to the growing bed and went through a complex cycle which, if executed just right, produced great flushes of morels. If not just right, nothing at all to show for your time, money and effort.

                            Flavors as I remember were pretty good and while there were many smalls there were also decent mediums.

                            Last I heard the technology got sold to an outfit in I think Alabama but I have never seen it come to fruition (pun intended).

                            Below is a little snippet I found from an old mushroom magazine.

                            Cheers

                            Nick

                            A VISIT TO MOREL MOUNTAIN, MICHIGAN

                            Spores Afield, April 1992

                            reprinted from the Detroit Free Press

                            (Mason, Michigan) -It's a little hard to believe.  In Mason, Michigan, a

                            town of 7,000, one of the world's delicacies is growing inside a yellow-sided

                            building in an industrial park.  It's called Morel Mountain, and it's the

                            only place where morels are grown -- other than the woods of springtime.

                            Since March 1989, it has been home to this famous fungus and its smoky,

                            earthy flavors. The morels, growing in an unusual environment, seem to be the

                            most natural part of the operation.  The more unlikely discovery inside this

                            barracks of a building is that Morel Mountain is a high-tech, international

                            endeavor that promises hefty long-term profits for its owner, Domino's Pizza

                            Distribution Inc.  At $25 a pound, these morels aren't cheap.  At the peak of

                            the springtime harvest, wild morels are just $8 to $9 per pound.  Dried morels

                            cost $90 to $160 per pound, but one pound of dried equals 8 to 10 pounds

                            rehydrated.  Price really isn't an issue, said Perry Mulleavy, general

                            manager of this Domino's subsidiary.  Even though indoor cultivation takes

                            away a bit the wild morel's cachet, morels never will become a commodity like

                            white button mushrooms, he said.  "The morel is a special niche.  It's a

                            high-end gourmet product.  In our opinion, we have the Mercedes of the

                            cultivated mushrooms. We want to retain that."  Indeed, all mushrooms once

                            were found only in the wild, but the effort to cultivate morels didn't start

                            until 1982.  Mulleavy still calls it a pilot project, even though the company

                            is producing 350 pounds every week.  Increased yield and more plants are

                            planned. Mulleavy calls the 7,500 square-foot Mason plant too small and hopes

                            to be producing morels at a larger plant by the spring of 1992.  Its location

                            is what Mulleavy calls "proprietary."  Translation: None of your business.

                            How he explains cultivated morels:  "They're grown indoors, in a

                            greenhouse-like environment, where we actively control the growth

                            environment.  They're grown in soil."  No home growing tips here; details are

                            proprietary.  "People have been trying to cultivate morels for 100 years.  We

                            were able to put all the necessary pieces of the puzzle together to do just

                            that," Mulleavy said. Morel Mountain sells all it cultivates to hotels,

                            restaurants and gourmet retailers.  Ask how much the company could sell if

                            production were up to par, and Mulleavy uses the word "proprietary" again.  A

                            check with Balducci's, a New York City gourmet retailer, reveals that a

                            $39-per-pound price hasn't fazed any customers since Morel Mountain morels

                            started being offered.  The owners said only chefs notice any difference in

                            taste.  "They're not as intense as the wild ones in spring, not quite," said

                            Charlie Balducci.  "They're very close and very good."  Wild morels have a

                            stronger, more woody smell.  Scott Hershey of Hershey's Steak and Seafood, a M

                            ichigan restaurant, said Mason morels are just as good as wild, and he's

                            using been them for almost 10 months in appetizers and soups and to accompany

                            entrees. "I guess the fun is that they're available year-round.  The response

                            that you're able to get from your guests when you put fresh morels on a plate

                            in front of them . . . just kind of blows their mind."  To order from Morel

                            Mountain, call 1-800-926-6735 weekdays from 8 a.m. to 5 p.m. Central Standard

                            Time.

                            Nick and Gillian Kite - Innkeepers/Owners

                                             

                            Contact: Wine Way Inn at:

                            1019 Foothill Boulevard - Calistoga, CA 94515

                            Phone: 707 942 0680

                            Email: Winewayinn@...

                            Web: WWW.Winewayinn.com

                          • J H
                            I went through 600 Petri dishes doing trials and transfers for my Spock strain white oyster. I would Havel say in terms of equipment that I actually bought ,
                            Message 13 of 24 , Mar 19 4:51 PM
                            • 0 Attachment
                              I went through 600 Petri dishes doing trials and transfers for my "Spock strain" white oyster.
                              I would Havel say in terms of equipment that I actually bought , rather than built...I probably invested 6 k in air filtration, grow room materials, grain. Jars. Syringes and scalpels etc. I did save a lot by scrounging up my blower from a friend that works in head, building my own incubators and stir plates etc.

                              ps don't tell mrs greys .


                              Jason Hauser

                              On Mar 19, 2013, at 7:21 PM, "Dimitar Bojantchev" <dimitar@...> wrote:

                               

                              >I have not had any success other than burning through about 400 Petri dishes trying to get something going.
                               
                              Wow -- is this real, or exaggerated?? 400? Holly molly, I thought only taxonomy was expensive <wlEmoticon-smile[1].png> (half-joking).
                               
                              These do look like M. rufobrunnea to my untrained eye – and yes, they are known from popping up in all kinds of spots where decay seems to happen..
                               
                              David A’s photo is spectacular..
                               
                              How come these guys were so successful and most other experienced folks have trouble repeating the result. Is there a secret? Apparently, there must be something...
                               
                                  Dimitar
                               
                              From: J H
                              Sent: Tuesday, March 19, 2013 3:59 PM
                              Subject: Re: [MT] Re: New Blood 3
                               
                               

                              It was in scottville...just outside of ludington. I called there several years ago and go Gary ,ills on the phone. He swears they are yellow esculent a type morels, I think that information was false and they are growing rufobrunnea.  I bought them fresh in local stores several times, you don't have to do a DNA study to see morphology is consistent with rufos, and looks nothing like the thousands of yellow and grey morels I have picked in my day.
                              I have attempted to develop a fruiting strain of rufobrunnea from a collection sent to me by Hugh smith. I have not had any success other than burning through about 400 Petri dishes trying to get something going. I was spore washing and cloning from dry material though...which is not the best route to go. I have had luck cloning yellow morels from fresh, and I used the American type culture libraries M11 black morel strain to make an outdoor bed, and got a weak fruiting.
                              The real problem for me is getting good sized sclerotium to form on grain spawn. With black morels, it seems as though everyone can get little sclerotia, but I haven't seen anyone outside of roger rabbit from shroomery.org get really consistent results with big sclerotia on grain spawn.

                              The Israelis and the Chinese are having some luck cultivating morels as well....it can be done, it's just not very easy and requires some tenacity....commercial ventures want to walk right in to predicable results, and I think we're still a few years away from that.
                               
                              Jason Hauser
                              Aka greys

                              On Mar 19, 2013, at 6:45 PM, "Wine Way Inn" <winewayinn@...> wrote:

                               

                              The Morel growing company was outside Lansing Michigan, I think it was called Morel Mountain. I personally looked at taking licenses for Europe. The issue economically was not competition from burn morels but inability to get consistent yields on a several week batch process. It was two phase. First corn was inoculated with the morel strain and put through a cycle to produce sclerotia. These were then introduced to the growing bed and went through a complex cycle which, if executed just right, produced great flushes of morels. If not just right, nothing at all to show for your time, money and effort.

                              Flavors as I remember were pretty good and while there were many smalls there were also decent mediums.

                              Last I heard the technology got sold to an outfit in I think Alabama but I have never seen it come to fruition (pun intended).

                              Below is a little snippet I found from an old mushroom magazine.

                              Cheers

                              Nick

                              A VISIT TO MOREL MOUNTAIN, MICHIGAN

                              Spores Afield, April 1992

                              reprinted from the Detroit Free Press

                              (Mason, Michigan) -It's a little hard to believe.  In Mason, Michigan, a

                              town of 7,000, one of the world's delicacies is growing inside a yellow-sided

                              building in an industrial park.  It's called Morel Mountain, and it's the

                              only place where morels are grown -- other than the woods of springtime.

                              Since March 1989, it has been home to this famous fungus and its smoky,

                              earthy flavors. The morels, growing in an unusual environment, seem to be the

                              most natural part of the operation.  The more unlikely discovery inside this

                              barracks of a building is that Morel Mountain is a high-tech, international

                              endeavor that promises hefty long-term profits for its owner, Domino's Pizza

                              Distribution Inc.  At $25 a pound, these morels aren't cheap.  At the peak of

                              the springtime harvest, wild morels are just $8 to $9 per pound.  Dried morels

                              cost $90 to $160 per pound, but one pound of dried equals 8 to 10 pounds

                              rehydrated.  Price really isn't an issue, said Perry Mulleavy, general

                              manager of this Domino's subsidiary.  Even though indoor cultivation takes

                              away a bit the wild morel's cachet, morels never will become a commodity like

                              white button mushrooms, he said.  "The morel is a special niche.  It's a

                              high-end gourmet product.  In our opinion, we have the Mercedes of the

                              cultivated mushrooms. We want to retain that."  Indeed, all mushrooms once

                              were found only in the wild, but the effort to cultivate morels didn't start

                              until 1982.  Mulleavy still calls it a pilot project, even though the company

                              is producing 350 pounds every week.  Increased yield and more plants are

                              planned. Mulleavy calls the 7,500 square-foot Mason plant too small and hopes

                              to be producing morels at a larger plant by the spring of 1992.  Its location

                              is what Mulleavy calls "proprietary."  Translation: None of your business.

                              How he explains cultivated morels:  "They're grown indoors, in a

                              greenhouse-like environment, where we actively control the growth

                              environment.  They're grown in soil."  No home growing tips here; details are

                              proprietary.  "People have been trying to cultivate morels for 100 years.  We

                              were able to put all the necessary pieces of the puzzle together to do just

                              that," Mulleavy said. Morel Mountain sells all it cultivates to hotels,

                              restaurants and gourmet retailers.  Ask how much the company could sell if

                              production were up to par, and Mulleavy uses the word "proprietary" again.  A

                              check with Balducci's, a New York City gourmet retailer, reveals that a

                              $39-per-pound price hasn't fazed any customers since Morel Mountain morels

                              started being offered.  The owners said only chefs notice any difference in

                              taste.  "They're not as intense as the wild ones in spring, not quite," said

                              Charlie Balducci.  "They're very close and very good."  Wild morels have a

                              stronger, more woody smell.  Scott Hershey of Hershey's Steak and Seafood, a M

                              ichigan restaurant, said Mason morels are just as good as wild, and he's

                              using been them for almost 10 months in appetizers and soups and to accompany

                              entrees. "I guess the fun is that they're available year-round.  The response

                              that you're able to get from your guests when you put fresh morels on a plate

                              in front of them . . . just kind of blows their mind."  To order from Morel

                              Mountain, call 1-800-926-6735 weekdays from 8 a.m. to 5 p.m. Central Standard

                              Time.

                              Nick and Gillian Kite - Innkeepers/Owners

                                               

                              Contact: Wine Way Inn at:

                              1019 Foothill Boulevard - Calistoga, CA 94515

                              Phone: 707 942 0680

                              Email: Winewayinn@...

                              Web: WWW.Winewayinn.com

                            • Darvin DeShazer
                              Here is ONE way to grow morels: http://www.gmushrooms.com/MHK.HTM I tried it and got about 80 morels over a three year period. Two flushes per year on drip
                              Message 14 of 24 , Mar 19 7:32 PM
                              • 0 Attachment
                                Here is ONE way to grow morels:

                                I tried it and got about 80 morels over a three year period.
                                Two flushes per year on drip irrigation.

                                The ad on the web site says that someone has kept their kit fruiting for 23 years!

                                Jim Malachowski, who produces these kits is on the patent.
                                Ower R, Mills G, Malachowski J. 1986. Cultivation of Morchella. U.S. Patent 4594809.

                                Darv
                                SOMA Science Advisor
                                http://SOMAmushrooms.org
                                http://MushroomObserver.org - 10,000 species with 300,000 photos & going up daily!
                                http://darv.typepad.com




                                On Mar 19, 2013, at 8:21 AM, vincekirchner wrote:

                                Cultivated Morels - everyone keeps asking me how to do it.
                                Vince

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