- Proposed Fox Hunt Rule Modification

________________________________

The current foxhunting rules fail to specify how total mileage is

computed, and it lacks a standard definition of common start and finish

points. Without this, we are all potentially running the race on a

different course.

Current rules state:

___________________

The winner is the the team which has... traveled the shortest

distance as determined by their automobile odometer and

trip meter.

Why this matters:

___________________

"Total mileage" implies a common start and finish for all contestants.

Any measurement used to determine the winner, should be the same,

standard measure for all contestants. The current rule fails to

specify the a single start and single finish point for all contestants.

Using different finish points can lead to unfairness. Without a

clearly and precisely defined finish point, we have no way to measure

mileage in the first place. Otherwise, we create an uneven playing field.

The current rule encourages hunters to hike the last x miles of the

course after they determine the precise location of the fox. But, not

all hunters are equally capable of hiking. Some hunters may not be able

to hike as far as others because they have medical or physical

limitations. No hunter should be penalized because another more agile,

adept hunter can out-hike him over the last part of the course.

Under the current rule, two teams can traverse exactly the same road

course, but if one hikes the last tenth of a mile, and the other team

drives right up to the Fox, the hikers will win - even though both

teams have, essentially, traveled exactly the same distance, over the

same course, to find the fox. Thus, the "winning" team will have fewer

miles on its odometer, even though they traveled essentially the same

total distance.

We are not conducting orienteering type hunts, where hiking on foot is

part of the game. Without defining a specific, standard, and common

finish point; winning is really defined as:

"how-far-away-from-the-fox-you-can-leave-your-car-and-still-

hike-to-the-fox-before-time-expires."

This is not a trivial matter. I understand the purported "winners" of

the Sept 15 hunt abandoned their vehicle more than 1/4 mile from the

fox, and traveled the balance of the way to the fox in another team's

car ! Otherwise, they would not have arrived at the fox's location

before time expired, and would have been disqualified.

During the last Muskegon Hunt in November, walking across the sandy

beach would save a team .8 mile. Team B elected to drive around to the

fox, while Team M elected to walk it. Clearly, the chance a team will

elect to hike the last part of the hunt to minimize odometer mileage is

real and substantial, and not merely an imaginary notion. This could

decide the winner in a close case.

Moreover, we need to standardize how odometer mileage is taken.

GPS-determined mileage must be total trip mileage, not just the best

route possible. A hunter must demonstrate it shows how many actual

miles were driven.

All members of a team must finish the run together. Otherwise, it

could become a footrace between single team members who make the best

sprint to the finish.

Proposed Rule Change:

_____________________

Refine the rule to define a common "finish line" or "finish point" in

advance of the hunt to assure all hunters travel from the same start, to

the same finish, place before the official score keeper measures total

mileage.

If a contestant uses anything other than a odometer, as specified in the

current rules, it must be proven that his method of measuring mileage is

accurate and reliable, such as proving that his GPS system did, in fact,

measure his entire trip from start to stop, and not just the best route

possible.

All team members must arrive at the finish line together.

Sidebar Observation:

_____________________

I am not objecting to any particular hunt. I merely suggest we modify

Rules now to avoid any issues or problems in the future.

_________________________________

Just my take. Happy Trails.

James / K8JHR

_________________________________ - Jeez....do you read minds or what???I didn't know the particulars as you mentioned but was wondering how walking vs. driving would impact the outcome of mileage based fox hunts. As you have pointed out, the current method has some flaws that time based hunting is exempt from. Technically, if a person could run fast enough, they could win a hunt with zero miles.I'm with you for the changes for mileage based hunts. I would also wouldn't mind seeing a resurgence of time based hunts.73Mark K8MHZ----- Original Message -----
**From:**Richards**Sent:**Thursday, January 13, 2011 1:09 PM**Subject:**[MichiganFoxHunter] Proposed Hunt Rule ChangeProposed Fox Hunt Rule Modification

________________________________

The current foxhunting rules fail to specify how total mileage is

computed, and it lacks a standard definition of common start and finish

points. Without this, we are all potentially running the race on a

different course.

Current rules state:

___________________

The winner is the the team which has... traveled the shortest

distance as determined by their automobile odometer and

trip meter.

Why this matters:

___________________

"Total mileage" implies a common start and finish for all contestants.

Any measurement used to determine the winner, should be the same,

standard measure for all contestants. The current rule fails to

specify the a single start and single finish point for all contestants.

Using different finish points can lead to unfairness. Without a

clearly and precisely defined finish point, we have no way to measure

mileage in the first place. Otherwise, we create an uneven playing field.

The current rule encourages hunters to hike the last x miles of the

course after they determine the precise location of the fox. But, not

all hunters are equally capable of hiking. Some hunters may not be able

to hike as far as others because they have medical or physical

limitations. No hunter should be penalized because another more agile,

adept hunter can out-hike him over the last part of the course.

Under the current rule, two teams can traverse exactly the same road

course, but if one hikes the last tenth of a mile, and the other team

drives right up to the Fox, the hikers will win - even though both

teams have, essentially, traveled exactly the same distance, over the

same course, to find the fox. Thus, the "winning" team will have fewer

miles on its odometer, even though they traveled essentially the same

total distance.

We are not conducting orienteering type hunts, where hiking on foot is

part of the game. Without defining a specific, standard, and common

finish point; winning is really defined as:

"how-far-away-from-the-fox-you-can-leave-your-car-and-still-

hike-to-the-fox-before-time-expires."

This is not a trivial matter. I understand the purported "winners" of

the Sept 15 hunt abandoned their vehicle more than 1/4 mile from the

fox, and traveled the balance of the way to the fox in another team's

car ! Otherwise, they would not have arrived at the fox's location

before time expired, and would have been disqualified.

During the last Muskegon Hunt in November, walking across the sandy

beach would save a team .8 mile. Team B elected to drive around to the

fox, while Team M elected to walk it. Clearly, the chance a team will

elect to hike the last part of the hunt to minimize odometer mileage is

real and substantial, and not merely an imaginary notion. This could

decide the winner in a close case.

Moreover, we need to standardize how odometer mileage is taken.

GPS-determined mileage must be total trip mileage, not just the best

route possible. A hunter must demonstrate it shows how many actual

miles were driven.

All members of a team must finish the run together. Otherwise, it

could become a footrace between single team members who make the best

sprint to the finish.

Proposed Rule Change:

_____________________

Refine the rule to define a common "finish line" or "finish point" in

advance of the hunt to assure all hunters travel from the same start, to

the same finish, place before the official score keeper measures total

mileage.

If a contestant uses anything other than a odometer, as specified in the

current rules, it must be proven that his method of measuring mileage is

accurate and reliable, such as proving that his GPS system did, in fact,

measure his entire trip from start to stop, and not just the best route

possible.

All team members must arrive at the finish line together.

Sidebar Observation:

_____________________

I am not objecting to any particular hunt. I merely suggest we modify

Rules now to avoid any issues or problems in the future.

_________________________________

Just my take. Happy Trails.

James / K8JHR

_________________________________