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RE: [Michalak] Re: Mayfly 14, Piccup Squared, or ?

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  • John Trussell
    There are many flat bottomed skiff designs available. Traditionally, these skiffs involved lapstrake sides and cross planked bottoms, all using natural wood.
    Message 1 of 28 , Jun 28, 2013
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      There are many flat bottomed skiff designs available. Traditionally, these
      skiffs involved lapstrake sides and cross planked bottoms, all using
      "natural wood. These boats were designed with the expectation that the boat
      would stay in the water and that the bottom planking would swell or "take
      up", making the boat water tight. Unfortunately, when such boats live on a
      trailer, they dry out and the planking shrinks. Such boats leak badly when
      they are placed in the water. There is a temptation to simply replace the
      bottom planking with plywood. However, plywood is much more flexible that
      the natural wood it replaces and I am of the opinion that a flat bottomed
      boat with a plywood bottom needs more framing than the equivalent cross
      planked boat. Michalak accomplishes this with bulkheads.



      For a modern interpretation of Heidi or Culler's Good Little Skiff, take a
      look at Michalaks Seal Cove Skiff-nail and glue construction with three
      intermediate frames. I suspect that if you asked, Jim would draw up a sail
      rig or you could take the leeboards, rudder, and sail from a Mayfly 12 and
      add it to the Seal Cove.



      JohnT



      _____

      From: Michalak@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Michalak@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
      Of john colley
      Sent: Friday, June 28, 2013 3:52 AM
      To: Michalak@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: Re: [Michalak] Re: Mayfly 14, Piccup Squared, or ?





      if you want a classic design.Nails and glue? give Heidi a look at.12'
      long,sail or row.
      http://www.flickr.com/photos/nomadboatbuilding/7844692616/in/set-72157631207
      839384/ or http://dartrac.customer.netspace.net.au/boats/skiff.html


      "There is magic in the feel of a paddle and the movement of a canoe, a magic
      compounded of distance, adventure, solitude, and peace."
      -Sigurd Olson

      ________________________________
      From: m1k3_0ynx <msingle5@...
      <mailto:msingle5%40tampabay.rr.com> >
      To: Michalak@yahoogroups.com <mailto:Michalak%40yahoogroups.com>
      Sent: Friday, 28 June 2013 4:09 AM
      Subject: [Michalak] Re: Mayfly 14, Piccup Squared, or ?



      I really appreciate all the comments! It keeps me thinking.

      I'm going to try very hard to keep away from using a trailer, but I do know
      they are getting kind of easy to find, if need be. I had decided not to buy
      one, but when I found an old 12" Craftsman band saw on Craig's List for $40.
      . . I grabbed it!

      No doubt in my mind that Mayfly 16 would require a trailer. The 14' version
      would probably work well for me as far as sailing goes, it's just launching
      her from a dolly could be a problem on some of the ramps I'd be using.

      The weight issue aside, I'd say that 16' would be about the longest boat I'd
      want to transport on my bed extension. The 15'+ pirogue made me a little
      nervous, I had to make certain to weight down the end in the truck as the
      bed length wide the tail gate down is only 7 feet. And that's one reason the
      longer the boat, the better off I'd be with a flat transom instead of a
      double-ender. The double-ended boat would be do-able, but I'd have to keep
      the balance thing in mind. (Also, I hate it when driving and the front end
      of the truck wants to lift!)

      I would like to stay with "nail & glue," for now. I can get long lumber from
      the local cypress mill, so no scarfing would be required for the chines.

      Kind of wish the Piccup Squared was available as a 14' design. Again, I'm
      thinking of the fact that the sailing scow is a traditional boat for the
      Gulf Coast of FL. Earlier, I mentioned that the dory was also, I got that
      wrong. The other traditional FL boat was actually a type of sailing sharpie.

      As far as the Goose goes, it does look pretty good. But the only plans I saw
      on the Goose Group seemed to be a mod plan on the Oz web site. You needed
      the original OZ version of the PDR and the mod plan. No problem with that,
      but it that the only source for the Goose variant of the PDR?

      I'm glad I have another build to do first, this sailboat design is going to
      take a lot more thinking!

      Mike S.
      Spring Hill, FL

      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • prairiedog2332
      In my view there is a heck of a lot of difference between an 8 boat and a 12 er of the same beam and pram/scow shape. And a 14 with pointy bow is not much
      Message 2 of 28 , Jun 28, 2013
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        In my view there is a heck of a lot of difference between an 8' boat and
        a 12'er of the same beam and pram/scow shape. And a 14 with pointy bow
        is not much bigger but has more flotation and lifting ability in the bow
        section when meeting waves, motorboat wakes, and when sailing downwind.

        Once you go to 16' you are getting into something that is much more of a
        handful especially if planning to solo a lot. First I think due to the
        bigger foils, you might want to add a mizzen for balance tweaking,
        reefing, heaving to etc. If you ever capsize or swamp you are dealing
        with more weight of water inside than perhaps one person can re-right
        standing on the leeboard. And for sure don't enclose those benches or it
        will probably remain up-side down.

        A 12 footer should carry 3 adults or 2 adults and 2 kids with not
        problem and a 14 - 4 adults. If going to 16' I think you may as well add
        a slot-top cuddy with room to store a porta-potty and cooler since you
        need a trailer anyway. Why an AF3 weighs 100 lb less than a Mayfly 16 is
        beyond me. Jim must be figuring different types of plywood.

        http://www.duckworksbbs.com/plans/jim/af3/index.htm
        <http://www.duckworksbbs.com/plans/jim/af3/index.htm>


        Then you have Mik Storer's GIS at 16' which he claims weighs 125 lb if
        using Gaboon (Okoume) Ply.


        http://www.duckworksbbs.com/plans/storer/gis/index.htm
        <http://www.duckworksbbs.com/plans/storer/gis/index.htm>


        One thing different with the GIS design is the flotation chambers are
        lower down at each end and double as seats. Then an additional open
        framed thwart amidships for sitting. This is the same as the 12'
        aluminum skiff I have and gives a lot more interior space without the
        decks at each end. But the sides are also deeper than the Mayfly and
        also likely a wetter boat in big waves. Mik has the mizzen option as
        well but I am not a fan of daggerboards in shallow water for reasons I
        will not go into.

        A GIS with Jim's leeboard and rudder design?

        Nels



        --- In Michalak@yahoogroups.com, "John Trussell" wrote:
        >
        > There are, of course, many constraints on the size of the boat you
        > build—cost, space, cartop/pu bed/trailer, and what kind of load
        you want to
        > carry.
        >
        > IMHO, an 8 ft boat is a little small for two people to relax in. Once
        you
        > get beyond 8 ft, you are looking at joining 2 length's of plywood
        together
        > (butt plate/Payson fg butt splice/scarf/finger joints). From a
        (roughly) 16
        > ft plywood panel, you can build a 15 to 15 ½ ft boat (often
        described as
        > being "16"). A 15 ft boat is a much more comfortable
        proposition for two
        > people than a 12 or 14 ft boat. If you wish to build a flat bottomed
        skiff a
        > Mayfly is as good as any and I would build the biggest one that I
        could
        > manage.
        >
        >
        >
        > Contemplating the design to choose is one of three worrisome parts of
        boat
        > building. The other two are picking a color scheme and picking a name!
        >
        >
        >
        > Have fun.
        >
        >
        >
        > JohnT




        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • prairiedog2332
        Realistically if you want to get lightness in a small dinghy you have to get familiar with stitch and tape multi-chine boat-building. And use marine-grade
        Message 3 of 28 , Jun 28, 2013
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          Realistically if you want to get lightness in a small dinghy you have to
          get familiar with stitch and tape multi-chine boat-building. And use
          marine-grade plywood like Mik suggests. Or at least test any cheaper
          stuff first.

          http://www.duckworksbbs.com/plans/jim/mixer/index.htm
          <http://www.duckworksbbs.com/plans/jim/mixer/index.htm>

          http://www.duckworksbbs.com/plans/jim/wooboto/index.htm
          <http://www.duckworksbbs.com/plans/jim/wooboto/index.htm>

          Nels

          --- In Michalak@yahoogroups.com, "prairiedog2332" wrote:
          >
          > In my view there is a heck of a lot of difference between an 8' boat
          and
          > a 12'er of the same beam and pram/scow shape.



          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • daniel brown
          i also struggle with the light weight- exotic ply issue. i m trying some sureply 3/16 on a canoe using stitch and glue, sort of. also dont forget skin on
          Message 4 of 28 , Jun 28, 2013
          • 0 Attachment
            i also struggle with the light weight- exotic ply issue. i'm trying some sureply 3/16 on a canoe using stitch and glue, sort of. also dont forget skin on frame, there are some interesting canoes, kayaks, and dinghys being built using skin on frame. see the new duckworks for a neat looking 10" dinghy

            http://www.duckworksmagazine.com/13/splash/jul/index.htm




            To: Michalak@yahoogroups.com
            From: nelsarv@...
            Date: Fri, 28 Jun 2013 15:15:04 +0000
            Subject: [Michalak] Re: Mayfly 14, Piccup Squared, or ?





            Realistically if you want to get lightness in a small dinghy you have to
            get familiar with stitch and tape multi-chine boat-building. And use
            marine-grade plywood like Mik suggests. Or at least test any cheaper
            stuff first.

            http://www.duckworksbbs.com/plans/jim/mixer/index.htm
            <http://www.duckworksbbs.com/plans/jim/mixer/index.htm>

            http://www.duckworksbbs.com/plans/jim/wooboto/index.htm
            <http://www.duckworksbbs.com/plans/jim/wooboto/index.htm>

            Nels

            --- In Michalak@yahoogroups.com, "prairiedog2332" wrote:
            >
            > In my view there is a heck of a lot of difference between an 8' boat
            and
            > a 12'er of the same beam and pram/scow shape.

            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]







            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • John Trussell
            My thoughts on boat size stem from the available floor space in different sized boats. Most 8 ft boats have the buoyancy to carry at least two people, but,
            Message 5 of 28 , Jun 28, 2013
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              My thoughts on boat size stem from the available floor space in different
              sized boats. Most 8 ft boats have the buoyancy to carry at least two people,
              but, particularly with decks on either end, they will be sitting on top of
              each other. Moving around the boat will be a hassle and sailors frequently
              find it useful to shift crew weight. A 12 ft pram obviously has 50 per cent
              more floor space than an 8 footer and about as much space as a 14 or 15 foot
              boat with a pointed end.



              One way to guesstimate how much a finished boat will weigh is to determine
              how many sheets of plywood it will use. A lot of shorter boats use up the
              same number of sheets as longer boats. If you’re going to use 4 sheets of
              plywood and join two sheets together, I think it makes sense to build the
              biggest boat you can manage.



              If it matters, flat bottomed boats, while simple to build, generally weigh
              more than comparable round bottomed boats and generally don’t use quite as
              much material. Flat bottomed boats tend to have more initial stability and
              are easier to run up on a beach.



              My first sailboat (40 some odd years ago) was a Boston Whaler Squall (9 ½ ft
              pram) and I used to car top it! I was a lot younger then (G). I am currently
              building a Scamp (12 ft pram) which I will trailer. There is some symmetry
              there…



              Look around and pick whichever boat design you like. And have fun.



              JohnT



              _____

              From: Michalak@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Michalak@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
              Of prairiedog2332
              Sent: Friday, June 28, 2013 10:53 AM
              To: Michalak@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: [Michalak] Re: Mayfly 14, Piccup Squared, or ?





              In my view there is a heck of a lot of difference between an 8' boat and
              a 12'er of the same beam and pram/scow shape. And a 14 with pointy bow
              is not much bigger but has more flotation and lifting ability in the bow
              section when meeting waves, motorboat wakes, and when sailing downwind.

              Once you go to 16' you are getting into something that is much more of a
              handful especially if planning to solo a lot. First I think due to the
              bigger foils, you might want to add a mizzen for balance tweaking,
              reefing, heaving to etc. If you ever capsize or swamp you are dealing
              with more weight of water inside than perhaps one person can re-right
              standing on the leeboard. And for sure don't enclose those benches or it
              will probably remain up-side down.

              A 12 footer should carry 3 adults or 2 adults and 2 kids with not
              problem and a 14 - 4 adults. If going to 16' I think you may as well add
              a slot-top cuddy with room to store a porta-potty and cooler since you
              need a trailer anyway. Why an AF3 weighs 100 lb less than a Mayfly 16 is
              beyond me. Jim must be figuring different types of plywood.

              http://www.duckworksbbs.com/plans/jim/af3/index.htm
              <http://www.duckworksbbs.com/plans/jim/af3/index.htm>

              Then you have Mik Storer's GIS at 16' which he claims weighs 125 lb if
              using Gaboon (Okoume) Ply.

              http://www.duckworksbbs.com/plans/storer/gis/index.htm
              <http://www.duckworksbbs.com/plans/storer/gis/index.htm>

              One thing different with the GIS design is the flotation chambers are
              lower down at each end and double as seats. Then an additional open
              framed thwart amidships for sitting. This is the same as the 12'
              aluminum skiff I have and gives a lot more interior space without the
              decks at each end. But the sides are also deeper than the Mayfly and
              also likely a wetter boat in big waves. Mik has the mizzen option as
              well but I am not a fan of daggerboards in shallow water for reasons I
              will not go into.

              A GIS with Jim's leeboard and rudder design?

              Nels

              --- In Michalak@yahoogroups.com <mailto:Michalak%40yahoogroups.com> , "John
              Trussell" wrote:
              >
              > There are, of course, many constraints on the size of the boat you
              > build—cost, space, cartop/pu bed/trailer, and what kind of load
              you want to
              > carry.
              >
              > IMHO, an 8 ft boat is a little small for two people to relax in. Once
              you
              > get beyond 8 ft, you are looking at joining 2 length's of plywood
              together
              > (butt plate/Payson fg butt splice/scarf/finger joints). From a
              (roughly) 16
              > ft plywood panel, you can build a 15 to 15 ½ ft boat (often
              described as
              > being "16"). A 15 ft boat is a much more comfortable
              proposition for two
              > people than a 12 or 14 ft boat. If you wish to build a flat bottomed
              skiff a
              > Mayfly is as good as any and I would build the biggest one that I
              could
              > manage.
              >
              >
              >
              > Contemplating the design to choose is one of three worrisome parts of
              boat
              > building. The other two are picking a color scheme and picking a name!
              >
              >
              >
              > Have fun.
              >
              >
              >
              > JohnT

              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • tosailok
              Michalac Has a design Called Bookie that is basicly a 14ft Piccup Squared. The plans are in the back of his self published book The Seceret Guide to Plywood
              Message 6 of 28 , Jun 28, 2013
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                Michalac Has a design Called Bookie that is basicly a 14ft Piccup Squared. The plans are in the back of his self published book The Seceret Guide to Plywood Boat Design. Built to specs it should be a little lighter than Mayfly 14.

                --- In Michalak@yahoogroups.com, "m1k3_0ynx" <msingle5@...> wrote:
                >
                > I really appreciate all the comments! It keeps me thinking.
                >
                > I'm going to try very hard to keep away from using a trailer, but I do know they are getting kind of easy to find, if need be. I had decided not to buy one, but when I found an old 12" Craftsman band saw on Craig's List for $40. . . I grabbed it!
                >
                > No doubt in my mind that Mayfly 16 would require a trailer. The 14' version would probably work well for me as far as sailing goes, it's just launching her from a dolly could be a problem on some of the ramps I'd be using.
                >
                > The weight issue aside, I'd say that 16' would be about the longest boat I'd want to transport on my bed extension. The 15'+ pirogue made me a little nervous, I had to make certain to weight down the end in the truck as the bed length wide the tail gate down is only 7 feet. And that's one reason the longer the boat, the better off I'd be with a flat transom instead of a double-ender. The double-ended boat would be do-able, but I'd have to keep the balance thing in mind. (Also, I hate it when driving and the front end of the truck wants to lift!)
                >
                > I would like to stay with "nail & glue," for now. I can get long lumber from the local cypress mill, so no scarfing would be required for the chines.
                >
                > Kind of wish the Piccup Squared was available as a 14' design. Again, I'm thinking of the fact that the sailing scow is a traditional boat for the Gulf Coast of FL. Earlier, I mentioned that the dory was also, I got that wrong. The other traditional FL boat was actually a type of sailing sharpie.
                >
                > As far as the Goose goes, it does look pretty good. But the only plans I saw on the Goose Group seemed to be a mod plan on the Oz web site. You needed the original OZ version of the PDR and the mod plan. No problem with that, but it that the only source for the Goose variant of the PDR?
                >
                > I'm glad I have another build to do first, this sailboat design is going to take a lot more thinking!
                >
                > Mike S.
                > Spring Hill, FL
                >
              • Frank
                Another consideration is the Mayfly 12. Frank Coletta ... [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                Message 7 of 28 , Jun 28, 2013
                • 0 Attachment
                  Another consideration is the Mayfly 12.

                  Frank Coletta

                  On Jun 27, 2013, at 2:09 PM, "m1k3_0ynx" <msingle5@...> wrote:

                  > I really appreciate all the comments! It keeps me thinking.
                  >
                  > I'm going to try very hard to keep away from using a trailer, but I do know they are getting kind of easy to find, if need be. I had decided not to buy one, but when I found an old 12" Craftsman band saw on Craig's List for $40. . . I grabbed it!
                  >
                  > No doubt in my mind that Mayfly 16 would require a trailer. The 14' version would probably work well for me as far as sailing goes, it's just launching her from a dolly could be a problem on some of the ramps I'd be using.
                  >
                  > The weight issue aside, I'd say that 16' would be about the longest boat I'd want to transport on my bed extension. The 15'+ pirogue made me a little nervous, I had to make certain to weight down the end in the truck as the bed length wide the tail gate down is only 7 feet. And that's one reason the longer the boat, the better off I'd be with a flat transom instead of a double-ender. The double-ended boat would be do-able, but I'd have to keep the balance thing in mind. (Also, I hate it when driving and the front end of the truck wants to lift!)
                  >
                  > I would like to stay with "nail & glue," for now. I can get long lumber from the local cypress mill, so no scarfing would be required for the chines.
                  >
                  > Kind of wish the Piccup Squared was available as a 14' design. Again, I'm thinking of the fact that the sailing scow is a traditional boat for the Gulf Coast of FL. Earlier, I mentioned that the dory was also, I got that wrong. The other traditional FL boat was actually a type of sailing sharpie.
                  >
                  > As far as the Goose goes, it does look pretty good. But the only plans I saw on the Goose Group seemed to be a mod plan on the Oz web site. You needed the original OZ version of the PDR and the mod plan. No problem with that, but it that the only source for the Goose variant of the PDR?
                  >
                  > I'm glad I have another build to do first, this sailboat design is going to take a lot more thinking!
                  >
                  > Mike S.
                  > Spring Hill, FL
                  >
                  >


                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • john colley
                  As the book explains,There are two options for Heidi s bottom.IF its to be left floating,use cross planking,If to be car topped or left on the hard,then use
                  Message 8 of 28 , Jun 28, 2013
                  • 0 Attachment
                    As the book explains,There are two options for Heidi's bottom.IF its to be left floating,use cross planking,If to be car topped or left on the hard,then use the plywood.At the end of the book,regarding crossplanked bottom,they advice swamping it for a longwhile to allow the timbers to swell and seal.I'm going to build this,but using marine ply strakes instead of the half inch cedar recommended.Again,the links showed one being totally glued together.I'm going with copper rivets.I've "done ply skin on frame,and stitch and glue.This at 59 will be my heirloom boat,,,LOL and to take to wooden boat fests.


                     
                    "There is magic in the feel of a paddle and the movement of a canoe, a magic compounded of distance, adventure, solitude, and peace."
                    -Sigurd Olson


                    ________________________________
                    From: John Trussell <jtrussell2@...>
                    To: Michalak@yahoogroups.com
                    Sent: Friday, 28 June 2013 9:50 PM
                    Subject: RE: [Michalak] Re: Mayfly 14, Piccup Squared, or ?



                     
                    There are many flat bottomed skiff designs available. Traditionally, these
                    skiffs involved lapstrake sides and cross planked bottoms, all using
                    "natural wood. These boats were designed with the expectation that the boat
                    would stay in the water and that the bottom planking would swell or "take
                    up", making the boat water tight. Unfortunately, when such boats live on a
                    trailer, they dry out and the planking shrinks. Such boats leak badly when
                    they are placed in the water. There is a temptation to simply replace the
                    bottom planking with plywood. However, plywood is much more flexible that
                    the natural wood it replaces and I am of the opinion that a flat bottomed
                    boat with a plywood bottom needs more framing than the equivalent cross
                    planked boat. Michalak accomplishes this with bulkheads.

                    For a modern interpretation of Heidi or Culler's Good Little Skiff, take a
                    look at Michalaks Seal Cove Skiff-nail and glue construction with three
                    intermediate frames. I suspect that if you asked, Jim would draw up a sail
                    rig or you could take the leeboards, rudder, and sail from a Mayfly 12 and
                    add it to the Seal Cove.

                    JohnT

                    _____

                    From: Michalak@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Michalak@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
                    Of john colley
                    Sent: Friday, June 28, 2013 3:52 AM
                    To: Michalak@yahoogroups.com
                    Subject: Re: [Michalak] Re: Mayfly 14, Piccup Squared, or ?

                    if you want a classic design.Nails and glue? give Heidi a look at.12'
                    long,sail or row.
                    http://www.flickr.com/photos/nomadboatbuilding/7844692616/in/set-72157631207
                    839384/ or http://dartrac.customer.netspace.net.au/boats/skiff.html

                    "There is magic in the feel of a paddle and the movement of a canoe, a magic
                    compounded of distance, adventure, solitude, and peace."
                    -Sigurd Olson

                    ________________________________
                    From: m1k3_0ynx <msingle5@...
                    <mailto:msingle5%40tampabay.rr.com> >
                    To: Michalak@yahoogroups.com <mailto:Michalak%40yahoogroups.com>
                    Sent: Friday, 28 June 2013 4:09 AM
                    Subject: [Michalak] Re: Mayfly 14, Piccup Squared, or ?

                    I really appreciate all the comments! It keeps me thinking.

                    I'm going to try very hard to keep away from using a trailer, but I do know
                    they are getting kind of easy to find, if need be. I had decided not to buy
                    one, but when I found an old 12" Craftsman band saw on Craig's List for $40.
                    . . I grabbed it!

                    No doubt in my mind that Mayfly 16 would require a trailer. The 14' version
                    would probably work well for me as far as sailing goes, it's just launching
                    her from a dolly could be a problem on some of the ramps I'd be using.

                    The weight issue aside, I'd say that 16' would be about the longest boat I'd
                    want to transport on my bed extension. The 15'+ pirogue made me a little
                    nervous, I had to make certain to weight down the end in the truck as the
                    bed length wide the tail gate down is only 7 feet. And that's one reason the
                    longer the boat, the better off I'd be with a flat transom instead of a
                    double-ender. The double-ended boat would be do-able, but I'd have to keep
                    the balance thing in mind. (Also, I hate it when driving and the front end
                    of the truck wants to lift!)

                    I would like to stay with "nail & glue," for now. I can get long lumber from
                    the local cypress mill, so no scarfing would be required for the chines.

                    Kind of wish the Piccup Squared was available as a 14' design. Again, I'm
                    thinking of the fact that the sailing scow is a traditional boat for the
                    Gulf Coast of FL. Earlier, I mentioned that the dory was also, I got that
                    wrong. The other traditional FL boat was actually a type of sailing sharpie.

                    As far as the Goose goes, it does look pretty good. But the only plans I saw
                    on the Goose Group seemed to be a mod plan on the Oz web site. You needed
                    the original OZ version of the PDR and the mod plan. No problem with that,
                    but it that the only source for the Goose variant of the PDR?

                    I'm glad I have another build to do first, this sailboat design is going to
                    take a lot more thinking!

                    Mike S.
                    Spring Hill, FL

                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • Tom Barclay
                    Yes, what about the Mayfly 16? I notice that relatively little mention in this group is made of the Mayfly 16. For the taller and heavier (!!!) among us, it
                    Message 9 of 28 , Jun 29, 2013
                    • 0 Attachment
                      Yes, what about the Mayfly 16?

                      I notice that relatively little mention in this group is made of the Mayfly
                      16. For the taller and heavier (!!!) among us, it seems like a good choice
                      for a second build, after something simpler to get used to Jim's materials
                      and methods.

                      What factors argue against Mayfly 16 for you? More boat than you need? More
                      trouble to transport? More cost of materials? Something else entirely?

                      Tom


                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    • prairiedog2332
                      Tom, There are photos of a Mayfly 16 in Jim s latest newsletter. http://jimsboats.com/ There may well be more of them out there and
                      Message 10 of 28 , Jun 29, 2013
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                        Tom,
                        There are photos of a Mayfly 16 in Jim's latest newsletter.

                        http://jimsboats.com/ <http://jimsboats.com/>

                        There may well be more of them out there and never get the builds
                        mentioned in this group. I am only surmising but perhaps the weight
                        throws some people off, if older and planning to solo quite often. As I
                        mentioned an AF3 is 100 lb lighter and has a cuddy that will match up
                        well with a small Bimini. And getting some sun/UV protection is
                        considered important these days. The AF3 has proven itself well in
                        knockdown recovery if the cuddy is closed up, shipping little water.

                        http://www.duckworksbbs.com/plans/jim/af3/index.htm
                        <http://www.duckworksbbs.com/plans/jim/af3/index.htm>

                        It and the AF4 Breve may be attractive for older folks when out fishing
                        or just lazing around, compared to a completely open hull for those
                        reasons and also the option of taking a porta-potti and have lock-up
                        security for it and a cooler.

                        http://www.duckworksbbs.com/plans/jim/af4/breve/index.htm
                        <http://www.duckworksbbs.com/plans/jim/af4/breve/index.htm>


                        Rene Vidmer designed a Bimini that doubles as a spray hood when folded
                        forward to the cuddy bulkhead, but I don't have the details how that is
                        done. But like I said I am just surmising. Many may still prefer an
                        open hull.

                        Nels


                        --- In Michalak@yahoogroups.com, Tom Barclay wrote:
                        >
                        > Yes, what about the Mayfly 16?
                        >
                        > I notice that relatively little mention in this group is made of the
                        Mayfly
                        > 16. For the taller and heavier (!!!) among us, it seems like a good
                        choice
                        > for a second build, after something simpler to get used to Jim's
                        materials
                        > and methods.
                        >
                        > What factors argue against Mayfly 16 for you? More boat than you need?
                        More
                        > trouble to transport? More cost of materials? Something else entirely?
                        >
                        > Tom
                        >
                        >
                        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        >



                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      • John Kohnen
                        The 350 lb. Jim lists for the Mayfly 16 ain t nothing, especially for such a roomy, comfortable looking boat. Nobody s gonna try to cartop a Mayfly 16, and 350
                        Message 11 of 28 , Jun 29, 2013
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                          The 350 lb. Jim lists for the Mayfly 16 ain't nothing, especially for such
                          a roomy, comfortable looking boat. Nobody's gonna try to cartop a Mayfly
                          16, and 350 lbs. on a trailer is gonna be awfully easy to handle. The rig
                          for the Mayfly 16 looks easy enough to handle too, without a tall, heavy
                          mast. In fact, Mayfly 16 looks like it'd be a great "geezer boat." <g>

                          350 lbs. is pretty light, but even so, properly setting up the trailer
                          will make getting a Mayfly 16 on and off the trailer easier. I've had a
                          couple of flat-bottom boats that came with trailers the previous owners
                          had set up with lengthwise bunks, matching the curvature of the bottom.
                          That setup works great. Rig up some side bunks, or something similar to
                          help guide the boat onto the trailer and loading and unloading will be a
                          snap. :o) With the longitudinal bunks, side bunks, and an extending
                          tongue, launching and retrieving my 1,500 lb. motorboat is easy as can be.
                          :o)

                          On Sat, 29 Jun 2013 17:31:14 -0700, Nels wrote:

                          > Tom,
                          > There are photos of a Mayfly 16 in Jim's latest newsletter.
                          >
                          > http://jimsboats.com/ <http://jimsboats.com/>
                          >
                          > There may well be more of them out there and never get the builds
                          > mentioned in this group. I am only surmising but perhaps the weight
                          > throws some people off, if older and planning to solo quite often.
                          > ...

                          --
                          John (jkohnen@...)
                          Man does not live by words alone, despite the fact that he sometimes has
                          to eat them. (Adlai Stevenson)
                        • john colley
                          we have nothing like messabouts here in ozz .I m envious of you all   There is magic in the feel of a paddle and the movement of a canoe, a magic compounded
                          Message 12 of 28 , Jun 30, 2013
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                            we have nothing like messabouts here in ozz .I'm envious of you all



                             
                            "There is magic in the feel of a paddle and the movement of a canoe, a magic compounded of distance, adventure, solitude, and peace."
                            -Sigurd Olson


                            ________________________________
                            From: prairiedog2332 <nelsarv@...>
                            To: Michalak@yahoogroups.com
                            Sent: Sunday, 30 June 2013 10:31 AM
                            Subject: [Michalak] Re: Mayfly 14, Piccup Squared, or ?



                             
                            Tom,
                            There are photos of a Mayfly 16 in Jim's latest newsletter.

                            http://jimsboats.com/ <http://jimsboats.com/>

                            There may well be more of them out there and never get the builds
                            mentioned in this group. I am only surmising but perhaps the weight
                            throws some people off, if older and planning to solo quite often. As I
                            mentioned an AF3 is 100 lb lighter and has a cuddy that will match up
                            well with a small Bimini. And getting some sun/UV protection is
                            considered important these days. The AF3 has proven itself well in
                            knockdown recovery if the cuddy is closed up, shipping little water.

                            http://www.duckworksbbs.com/plans/jim/af3/index.htm
                            <http://www.duckworksbbs.com/plans/jim/af3/index.htm>

                            It and the AF4 Breve may be attractive for older folks when out fishing
                            or just lazing around, compared to a completely open hull for those
                            reasons and also the option of taking a porta-potti and have lock-up
                            security for it and a cooler.

                            http://www.duckworksbbs.com/plans/jim/af4/breve/index.htm
                            <http://www.duckworksbbs.com/plans/jim/af4/breve/index.htm>

                            Rene Vidmer designed a Bimini that doubles as a spray hood when folded
                            forward to the cuddy bulkhead, but I don't have the details how that is
                            done. But like I said I am just surmising. Many may still prefer an
                            open hull.

                            Nels

                            --- In Michalak@yahoogroups.com, Tom Barclay wrote:
                            >
                            > Yes, what about the Mayfly 16?
                            >
                            > I notice that relatively little mention in this group is made of the
                            Mayfly
                            > 16. For the taller and heavier (!!!) among us, it seems like a good
                            choice
                            > for a second build, after something simpler to get used to Jim's
                            materials
                            > and methods.
                            >
                            > What factors argue against Mayfly 16 for you? More boat than you need?
                            More
                            > trouble to transport? More cost of materials? Something else entirely?
                            >
                            > Tom
                            >
                            >
                            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                            >

                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          • simonfbroad
                            ... John, That has always bugged me too - hoping to meet a few of you guys somewhere sometime so you can teach me how to sail :o) Doh! Found out this weekend
                            Message 13 of 28 , Jun 30, 2013
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                              --- In Michalak@yahoogroups.com, john colley <Helliconia54@...> wrote:
                              >
                              > we have nothing like messabouts here in ozz .I'm envious of you all
                              >
                              >

                              John,

                              That has always bugged me too - hoping to meet a few of you guys somewhere sometime so you can teach me how to sail :o)

                              Doh!
                              Found out this weekend that the Wooden Boat Association of Queensland had a messabout just up the road (Maroochydore) - last weekend!

                              But there is another one at Cabbage Tree Creek in July. Seems they have several in a year.

                              http://www.woodenboat.org.au/index.php/queensland

                              Simon.
                            • john colley
                              hmmm i m going to google wooden boats in victoria.We have plenty of lakes.   There is magic in the feel of a paddle and the movement of a canoe, a magic
                              Message 14 of 28 , Jul 1, 2013
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                                hmmm i'm going to google wooden boats in victoria.We have plenty of lakes.


                                 
                                "There is magic in the feel of a paddle and the movement of a canoe, a magic compounded of distance, adventure, solitude, and peace."
                                -Sigurd Olson


                                ________________________________
                                From: simonfbroad <simonfbroad@...>
                                To: Michalak@yahoogroups.com
                                Sent: Monday, 1 July 2013 1:08 PM
                                Subject: [Michalak] Re: Mayfly 14, Piccup Squared, or ?



                                 


                                --- In Michalak@yahoogroups.com, john colley <Helliconia54@...> wrote:
                                >
                                > we have nothing like messabouts here in ozz .I'm envious of you all
                                >
                                >

                                John,

                                That has always bugged me too - hoping to meet a few of you guys somewhere sometime so you can teach me how to sail :o)

                                Doh!
                                Found out this weekend that the Wooden Boat Association of Queensland had a messabout just up the road (Maroochydore) - last weekend!

                                But there is another one at Cabbage Tree Creek in July. Seems they have several in a year.

                                http://www.woodenboat.org.au/index.php/queensland

                                Simon.




                                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                              • simonfbroad
                                Looks like they are more active in the first half of the year.
                                Message 15 of 28 , Jul 1, 2013
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                                  Looks like they are more active in the first half of the year.

                                  http://www.woodenboat.asn.au/index.php?option=com_jevents&view=year&task=year.listevents&Itemid=108


                                  --- In Michalak@yahoogroups.com, john colley <Helliconia54@...> wrote:
                                  >
                                  > hmmm i'm going to google wooden boats in victoria.We have plenty of lakes.
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >  
                                  > "There is magic in the feel of a paddle and the movement of a canoe, a magic compounded of distance, adventure, solitude, and peace."
                                  > -Sigurd Olson
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > ________________________________
                                  > From: simonfbroad <simonfbroad@...>
                                  > To: Michalak@yahoogroups.com
                                  > Sent: Monday, 1 July 2013 1:08 PM
                                  > Subject: [Michalak] Re: Mayfly 14, Piccup Squared, or ?
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >  
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > --- In Michalak@yahoogroups.com, john colley <Helliconia54@> wrote:
                                  > >
                                  > > we have nothing like messabouts here in ozz .I'm envious of you all
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  >
                                  > John,
                                  >
                                  > That has always bugged me too - hoping to meet a few of you guys somewhere sometime so you can teach me how to sail :o)
                                  >
                                  > Doh!
                                  > Found out this weekend that the Wooden Boat Association of Queensland had a messabout just up the road (Maroochydore) - last weekend!
                                  >
                                  > But there is another one at Cabbage Tree Creek in July. Seems they have several in a year.
                                  >
                                  > http://www.woodenboat.org.au/index.php/queensland
                                  >
                                  > Simon.
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                  >
                                • john colley
                                  beat me to it thanx for that,i bookmarked it.   There is magic in the feel of a paddle and the movement of a canoe, a magic compounded of distance,
                                  Message 16 of 28 , Jul 2, 2013
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                                    beat me to it thanx for that,i bookmarked it.


                                     
                                    "There is magic in the feel of a paddle and the movement of a canoe, a magic compounded of distance, adventure, solitude, and peace."
                                    -Sigurd Olson


                                    ________________________________
                                    From: simonfbroad <simonfbroad@...>
                                    To: Michalak@yahoogroups.com
                                    Sent: Tuesday, 2 July 2013 9:36 AM
                                    Subject: [Michalak] Re: Mayfly 14, Piccup Squared, or ?



                                     
                                    Looks like they are more active in the first half of the year.

                                    http://www.woodenboat.asn.au/index.php?option=com_jevents&view=year&task=year.listevents&Itemid=108

                                    --- In Michalak@yahoogroups.com, john colley <Helliconia54@...> wrote:
                                    >
                                    > hmmm i'm going to google wooden boats in victoria.We have plenty of lakes.
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >  
                                    > "There is magic in the feel of a paddle and the movement of a canoe, a magic compounded of distance, adventure, solitude, and peace."
                                    > -Sigurd Olson
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > ________________________________
                                    > From: simonfbroad <simonfbroad@...>
                                    > To: Michalak@yahoogroups.com
                                    > Sent: Monday, 1 July 2013 1:08 PM
                                    > Subject: [Michalak] Re: Mayfly 14, Piccup Squared, or ?
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >  
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > --- In Michalak@yahoogroups.com, john colley <Helliconia54@> wrote:
                                    > >
                                    > > we have nothing like messabouts here in ozz .I'm envious of you all
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    >
                                    > John,
                                    >
                                    > That has always bugged me too - hoping to meet a few of you guys somewhere sometime so you can teach me how to sail :o)
                                    >
                                    > Doh!
                                    > Found out this weekend that the Wooden Boat Association of Queensland had a messabout just up the road (Maroochydore) - last weekend!
                                    >
                                    > But there is another one at Cabbage Tree Creek in July. Seems they have several in a year.
                                    >
                                    > http://www.woodenboat.org.au/index.php/queensland
                                    >
                                    > Simon.
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                    >




                                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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