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Re: Paddleplank!

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  • prairiedog2332
    I think Jim got the overall design pretty darn good, considering he is not that crazy about the idea of paddling standing on a plank! He did give enough space
    Message 1 of 22 , Feb 20, 2013
      I think Jim got the overall design pretty darn good, considering he is
      not that crazy about the idea of paddling standing on a plank! He did
      give enough space and capacity for two people to paddle it sitting down
      with double-bladed paddles as an option. If not requiring that option it
      could be shortened by removing 2 ft. from the central hull shape I'm
      thinking (The one at WB is 12 ft.) Then just a section of foam board
      between where the person stands to stiffen it there?

      I bought some of that Sureply and it failed my testing (6 dishwasher
      runs). The glue lines held up fine but one of the outer layers wrinkled.
      So I planned to use it for pattern making. I left a sheet out on my deck
      over outdoor carpet most of the summer in sun and rain and now winter
      and checking it out it still seems fine and never even warped! Would a
      layer of say 2 oz glass encapsulated with epoxy work I am wondering now?
      The inner layer of course should stay dry if built water-tight. That
      would make the weight maybe closer to 50 than 70lb and a lot more
      manageable to carry.

      The next challenge would be the paddle. Commercial ones are extremely
      expensive. This one might be an option for a beginner and converts to a
      double blade.

      http://www.rei.com/product/801104/carlisle-taboo-stand-up-paddle

      I have found Carlisle paddles to be very well built but heavy and not
      great blades for performance. Here in Canada we have to carry a 2nd
      paddle when canoeing and I always carry 2 when tandem paddling. And
      Carlisles are my choice. Wooden bent shafts for straight ahead
      performance and the Carlisles when in rocky waters.
      But I digress...

      Nels

      <br>--- In Michalak@yahoogroups.com, daniel brown <dannyb9@...>
      wrote:<br>><br>> <br>> i went to lowes yesterday and bought some
      'nominal' 1/4" sureply, got it home and weighed and measured... its more
      like 3/16" and 20 lbs per sheet...hmmm...


      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • daniel brown
      i like your 12 and foam block ideas, 70 lbs is just out of range for me. sunfish have been using foam blocks for stiffening for 50+ years. thanks for the
      Message 2 of 22 , Feb 20, 2013
        i like your 12' and foam block ideas, 70 lbs is just out of range for me. sunfish have been using foam blocks for stiffening for 50+ years. thanks for the alert about the sureply, looks like the outer veneers are paper thin. my friend david has used sureply for a larsboat and its holding up fine. extra sealing is a good idea.
        i have built a few kayak paddles, around 7' long, that weighed 27-35 oz. one had a cedar shaft and okoume ply blades, it was the lightest. i think a sup paddle would be just as light and easy to make as that one.




        To: Michalak@yahoogroups.com
        From: nelsarv@...
        Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2013 17:31:09 +0000
        Subject: [Michalak] Re: Paddleplank!





        I think Jim got the overall design pretty darn good, considering he is
        not that crazy about the idea of paddling standing on a plank! He did
        give enough space and capacity for two people to paddle it sitting down
        with double-bladed paddles as an option. If not requiring that option it
        could be shortened by removing 2 ft. from the central hull shape I'm
        thinking (The one at WB is 12 ft.) Then just a section of foam board
        between where the person stands to stiffen it there?

        I bought some of that Sureply and it failed my testing (6 dishwasher
        runs). The glue lines held up fine but one of the outer layers wrinkled.
        So I planned to use it for pattern making. I left a sheet out on my deck
        over outdoor carpet most of the summer in sun and rain and now winter
        and checking it out it still seems fine and never even warped! Would a
        layer of say 2 oz glass encapsulated with epoxy work I am wondering now?
        The inner layer of course should stay dry if built water-tight. That
        would make the weight maybe closer to 50 than 70lb and a lot more
        manageable to carry.

        The next challenge would be the paddle. Commercial ones are extremely
        expensive. This one might be an option for a beginner and converts to a
        double blade.

        http://www.rei.com/product/801104/carlisle-taboo-stand-up-paddle

        I have found Carlisle paddles to be very well built but heavy and not
        great blades for performance. Here in Canada we have to carry a 2nd
        paddle when canoeing and I always carry 2 when tandem paddling. And
        Carlisles are my choice. Wooden bent shafts for straight ahead
        performance and the Carlisles when in rocky waters.
        But I digress...

        Nels


        --- In Michalak@yahoogroups.com, daniel brown
        wrote:
        >
        >
        > i went to lowes yesterday and bought some
        'nominal' 1/4" sureply, got it home and weighed and measured... its more
        like 3/16" and 20 lbs per sheet...hmmm...

        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]






        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • prairiedog2332
        I am surprised a cedar shaft would be strong enough. But maybe a type not like the western (red) variety? My downriver paddles have laminated shafts and oval
        Message 3 of 22 , Feb 20, 2013
          I am surprised a cedar shaft would be strong enough. But maybe a type
          not like the western (red) variety?

          My downriver paddles have laminated shafts and oval in cross-section.
          Cedar and spruce maybe?

          I have tried making glassed foam-cored blades. But found them not that
          strong either. They broke at the shaft connection and too flexy in a
          wider shape.

          Nels



          <br>--- In Michalak@yahoogroups.com, daniel brown <dannyb9@...>
          wrote:<br>><br>> <br>> i like your 12' and foam block ideas, 70 lbs is
          just out of range for me. sunfish have been using foam blocks for
          stiffening for 50+ years. thanks for the alert about the sureply, looks
          like the outer veneers are paper thin. my friend david has used sureply
          for a larsboat and its holding up fine. extra sealing is a good idea.


          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • daniel brown
          you may be right about cedar being too brittle for a sup paddle. the forces on a kayak paddle are near the paddle blade so not as much torque... my latest gp
          Message 4 of 22 , Feb 20, 2013
            you may be right about cedar being too brittle for a sup paddle. the forces on a kayak paddle are near the paddle blade so not as much torque... my latest gp paddle is laminated wrc and cypress, it is going to be pretty stout at 34 oz. good for boat wake surfing i hope : )




            To: Michalak@yahoogroups.com
            From: nelsarv@...
            Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2013 18:35:32 +0000
            Subject: [Michalak] Re: Paddleplank!





            I am surprised a cedar shaft would be strong enough. But maybe a type
            not like the western (red) variety?

            My downriver paddles have laminated shafts and oval in cross-section.
            Cedar and spruce maybe?

            I have tried making glassed foam-cored blades. But found them not that
            strong either. They broke at the shaft connection and too flexy in a
            wider shape.

            Nels


            --- In Michalak@yahoogroups.com, daniel brown
            wrote:
            >
            >
            > i like your 12' and foam block ideas, 70 lbs is
            just out of range for me. sunfish have been using foam blocks for
            stiffening for 50+ years. thanks for the alert about the sureply, looks
            like the outer veneers are paper thin. my friend david has used sureply
            for a larsboat and its holding up fine. extra sealing is a good idea.

            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]






            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • Carl Volkwein
            Go to Duck works news letter on the web, and look up scullmatix and you l find something like what you re looking for ________________________________ From:
            Message 5 of 22 , Feb 20, 2013
              Go to Duck works news letter on the web, and look up "scullmatix" and you'l find something like what you're looking for




              ________________________________
              From: daniel brown <dannyb9@...>
              To: michalak@yahoogroups.com
              Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2013 1:46 PM
              Subject: RE: [Michalak] Re: Paddleplank!


              you may be right about cedar being too brittle for a sup paddle. the forces on a kayak paddle are near the paddle blade so not as much torque... my latest gp paddle is laminated wrc and cypress, it is going to be pretty stout at 34 oz. good for boat wake surfing i hope : )




              To: Michalak@yahoogroups.com
              From: nelsarv@...
              Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2013 18:35:32 +0000
              Subject: [Michalak] Re: Paddleplank!

               



              I am surprised a cedar shaft would be strong enough. But maybe a type
              not like the western (red) variety?

              My downriver paddles have laminated shafts and oval in cross-section.
              Cedar and spruce maybe?

              I have tried making glassed foam-cored blades. But found them not that
              strong either. They broke at the shaft connection and too flexy in a
              wider shape.

              Nels


              --- In Michalak@yahoogroups.com, daniel brown
              wrote:
              >
              >
              > i like your 12' and foam block ideas, 70 lbs is
              just out of range for me. sunfish have been using foam blocks for
              stiffening for 50+ years. thanks for the alert about the sureply, looks
              like the outer veneers are paper thin. my friend david has used sureply
              for a larsboat and its holding up fine. extra sealing is a good idea.

              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




                                     

              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



              ------------------------------------

              Yahoo! Groups Links



              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • john colley
              They are selling INFLATABLE ones over here now.Mind you,,,you d never guess it.They feel very solid.   There is magic in the feel of a paddle and the
              Message 6 of 22 , Feb 21, 2013
                They are selling INFLATABLE ones over here now.Mind you,,,you'd never guess it.They feel very solid.


                 
                "There is magic in the feel of a paddle and the movement of a canoe, a magic compounded of distance, adventure, solitude, and peace."
                -Sigurd Olson


                ________________________________
                From: prairiedog2332 <nelsarv@...>
                To: Michalak@yahoogroups.com
                Sent: Thursday, 21 February 2013 2:42 AM
                Subject: [Michalak] Re: Paddleplank!


                 
                Wonder how it would work carving one out of foam board and then thin
                plywood over and maybe some light glass on the bottom? The one in WB
                also had skegs.

                Nels

                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • pd_89415
                My main criteria for this project are cheap, functional, lightweight, and quick to build. The Paddleplank looks good but at 70lb (estimated), light it is not,
                Message 7 of 22 , Feb 21, 2013
                  My main criteria for this project are cheap, functional, lightweight, and quick to build. The Paddleplank looks good but at 70lb (estimated), light it is not, especially considering I would probably make it out of BC pine which isn't light. The CLC Koholo looks really nice but if made right, wouldn't be cheap or quick to build. Then I came across Dave Gentry's intriguing Boardyak. This seems to fit the bill best on all counts, but it doesn't seem long enough. I have read, however, that there is a longer design in the works.

                  Soooo, I have decided to design and build my own SOF SUP. It will have similar lines and overall dimensions to the longer 14 Koholo with pointy bow and fine entry leading back to a slight V shape in the middle and a deeper V shape at the flat transom. The thought behind the V bottom shape is to attempt to avoid adding an external skeg, though I will leave that option open if necessary.

                  There are a lot of new experiences with this project. Not only have I never tried my hand at boat design, but I have never built in SOF construction, or even stood for a moment on a stand up paddleboard. What are the odds that this turns out well? It should be a fun trip anyways...Wish me luck!




                  --- In Michalak@yahoogroups.com, john colley <Helliconia54@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > They are selling INFLATABLE ones over here now.Mind you,,,you'd never guess it.They feel very solid.
                  >
                  >
                  >  
                  > "There is magic in the feel of a paddle and the movement of a canoe, a magic compounded of distance, adventure, solitude, and peace."
                  > -Sigurd Olson
                  >
                  >
                  > ________________________________
                  > From: prairiedog2332 <nelsarv@...>
                  > To: Michalak@yahoogroups.com
                  > Sent: Thursday, 21 February 2013 2:42 AM
                  > Subject: [Michalak] Re: Paddleplank!
                  >
                  >
                  >  
                  > Wonder how it would work carving one out of foam board and then thin
                  > plywood over and maybe some light glass on the bottom? The one in WB
                  > also had skegs.
                  >
                  > Nels
                  >
                  > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  >
                • Dave Gentry
                  ... Yes, good luck! I would like to see Mr Michalak s Paddleplank get built, but I think it s great that you are venturing into creating your own - it s very
                  Message 8 of 22 , Feb 22, 2013
                    --- In Michalak@yahoogroups.com, "pd_89415" <mattpinkley@...> wrote:
                    > . . . Then I came across Dave Gentry's intriguing Boardyak. This seems to fit the bill best on all counts, but it doesn't seem long enough. I have read, however, that there is a longer design in the works.
                    >
                    > Soooo, I have decided to design and build my own SOF SUP.
                    > There are a lot of new experiences with this project. Not only have I never tried my hand at boat design, but I have never built in SOF construction, or even stood for a moment on a stand up paddleboard. What are the odds that this turns out well? It should be a fun trip anyways...Wish me luck!
                    >

                    Yes, good luck! I would like to see Mr Michalak's Paddleplank get built, but I think it's great that you are venturing into creating your own - it's very satisfying to design your own boat, and skin on frame is the perfect medium for experimentation, as it is so cheap and quick.
                    I will mention - since you brought it up - that my longer, dedicated SUP design is now finished and plans will be available as soon as I can update my site. I still think you should design and build your own, though!

                    Those inflatable boards are a great idea in my opinion - wish I'd thought of that! The ones I have examined (but not paddled) seem solid and just as functional as the hard shells.

                    Good luck!
                    Dave Gentry
                  • pd_89415
                    Thanks for the comments Dave Gentry! I must say that I am not going into this completely in the dark thanks to your descriptive posts and photos on other
                    Message 9 of 22 , Feb 22, 2013
                      Thanks for the comments Dave Gentry! I must say that I am not going into this completely in the dark thanks to your descriptive posts and photos on other forums. As of this morning, I have the details worked out and have plotted full scale layouts of the cross sectional frames. Will pick up some lumber this weekend and get rolling.

                      Looking forward to seeing your new design. Will bookmark it in case my design is a total flop.

                      Have you considered any type of built in flotation in your SUP designs? Pool noodles? Empty wine bags?



                      > >
                      >
                      > Yes, good luck! I would like to see Mr Michalak's Paddleplank get built, but I think it's great that you are venturing into creating your own - it's very satisfying to design your own boat, and skin on frame is the perfect medium for experimentation, as it is so cheap and quick.
                      > I will mention - since you brought it up - that my longer, dedicated SUP design is now finished and plans will be available as soon as I can update my site. I still think you should design and build your own, though!
                      >
                      > Those inflatable boards are a great idea in my opinion - wish I'd thought of that! The ones I have examined (but not paddled) seem solid and just as functional as the hard shells.
                      >
                      > Good luck!
                      > Dave Gentry
                      >
                    • prairiedog2332
                      I think a person could try a stand-up paddle in any small boat before making the big plunge. (Pun intended:-) Matt Layden did the around Florida Challenge
                      Message 10 of 22 , Feb 22, 2013
                        I think a person could try a stand-up paddle in any small boat before
                        making the big plunge. (Pun intended:-)

                        Matt Layden did the around Florida Challenge using one in his tiny
                        sailboat including running some fast waters. I'm thinking something like
                        a Mouse boat could be a test bed. Does it have to be a pointy bow if it
                        has some rocker which would also stiffen the hull bottom.

                        http://groups.yahoo.com/group/mouseboats/

                        Nels

                        --- In Michalak@yahoogroups.com, "pd_89415" <mattpinkley@...> wrote:
                        >
                        > Thanks for the comments Dave Gentry! I must say that I am not going
                        into this completely in the dark thanks to your descriptive posts and
                        photos on other forums. As of this morning, I have the details worked
                        out and have plotted full scale layouts of the cross sectional frames.
                        Will pick up some lumber this weekend and get rolling.
                        >
                        > Looking forward to seeing your new design. Will bookmark it in case
                        my design is a total flop.
                        >
                        > Have you considered any type of built in flotation in your SUP
                        designs? Pool noodles? Empty wine bags?




                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      • Mike Allison
                        ... Here is a pair of links that may help design a paddle plank. http://www.svensons.com/boat/?p=MechanixIllustrated/BattleSurfBoards
                        Message 11 of 22 , Feb 22, 2013
                          On 2/22/2013 11:30 AM, pd_89415 wrote:
                          >
                          > Thanks for the comments Dave Gentry! I must say that I am not going
                          > into this completely in the dark thanks to your descriptive posts and
                          > photos on other forums. As of this morning, I have the details worked
                          > out and have plotted full scale layouts of the cross sectional frames.
                          > Will pick up some lumber this weekend and get rolling.
                          >
                          > Looking forward to seeing your new design. Will bookmark it in case my
                          > design is a total flop.
                          >
                          > Have you considered any type of built in flotation in your SUP
                          > designs? Pool noodles? Empty wine bags?
                          >
                          Here is a pair of links that may help design a paddle plank.

                          http://www.svensons.com/boat/?p=MechanixIllustrated/BattleSurfBoards
                          http://www.svensons.com/boat/?p=Surfboards/Hollowsurf

                          Mike Allison (North of Kansas City Mo, USA)



                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        • billnolen66
                          Nels, that s good advice! Many of us older guys have lost a great deal of our ability to balance standing upright in a boat. How many of you...young and
                          Message 12 of 22 , Feb 22, 2013
                            Nels, that's good advice! Many of us older guys have lost a great deal of
                            our ability to balance standing upright in a boat.

                            How many of you...young and old...can now stand on one foot, on a solid
                            floor, for a minute? OK, now try doing it with your eyes closed!

                            Disclaimer: I'm not liable for injuries! <G>

                            Bill Nolen
                            OKC


                            In a message dated 2/22/2013 5:33:11 P.M. Central Standard Time,
                            nelsarv@... writes:




                            I think a person could try a stand-up paddle in any small boat before
                            making the big plunge. (Pun intended:-)

                            Matt Layden did the around Florida Challenge using one in his tiny
                            sailboat including running some fast waters. I'm thinking something like
                            a Mouse boat could be a test bed. Does it have to be a pointy bow if it
                            has some rocker which would also stiffen the hull bottom.

                            _http://groups.yahoo.com/group/mouseboats/_
                            (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/mouseboats/)

                            Nels

                            --- In _Michalak@yahoogroups.com_ (mailto:Michalak@yahoogroups.com) ,
                            "pd_89415" wrote:
                            >
                            > Thanks for the comments Dave Gentry! I must say that I am not going
                            into this completely in the dark thanks to your descriptive posts and
                            photos on other forums. As of this morning, I have the details worked
                            out and have plotted full scale layouts of the cross sectional frames.
                            Will pick up some lumber this weekend and get rolling.
                            >
                            > Looking forward to seeing your new design. Will bookmark it in case
                            my design is a total flop.
                            >
                            > Have you considered any type of built in flotation in your SUP
                            designs? Pool noodles? Empty wine bags?

                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]






                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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