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Re: [Michalak] Re: Paint is too soft

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  • Giuliano Girometta
    Cooking the painted surfaces on the soon may be the problem. The heat is causing a premature drying on the top of the surface creating a dry film that
    Message 1 of 10 , May 4, 2012
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      Cooking the painted surfaces on the soon may be the problem. The heat is causing a premature drying on the top of the surface creating a dry film that encapsule the wet paint.
      The better way to dry a coat of paint or finish is to expose the surface to a light air flow.
       
      Giuliano


      ________________________________
      From: Dean Herring <dfharing@...>
      To: Michalak@yahoogroups.com
      Sent: Friday, May 4, 2012 1:30 PM
      Subject: [Michalak] Re: Paint is too soft



       

      You have got to give that epoxy a good week or two to cure correctly then you must make absolutely sure there is no blush. Even the so called Amine blush free ones will show some when very humid out. You have got to give the paint time as well - i've had your issues and they go away with patience (a hard thing to do) when waiting for cure times. I have cooked a pair of oars with the issue for weeks to no avail - it was the epoxy under neath not fully cured that is the problem. Need to wash with a drop of soap in that water as well. Amine comes off with water and mechanical pressure applied I found it does not just wash off. Dean

      --- In Michalak@yahoogroups.com, "John" <goodman_clan@...> wrote:
      >
      > Well, I have a paint problem too.
      >
      > Sealed my Aquatek plywood with 1 coat of Marine Epoxy.
      > Waited 2 days. 80 grit sanded, washed with water, waited 1 day.
      > Primed with Glidden Latex Gripper. Waited 3 days to harder.
      > Painted with Glidden Exterior Latex House paint. Used a roller to get thin coat on. Added 2nd coat 4 hours later.
      >
      > Have cooked the boat in the sun for 5 days and paint can be scraped up with your finger nail.
      >
      > I have resigned myself to scrapping all the yellow off and starting over but, can I use any of the product I have and get better results?
      >
      > JDG
      >




      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Joe T
      I scrub cured epoxy with a Scotch Brite type abrasive pad and water with a bit of detergent added. Rinse. Joe T
      Message 2 of 10 , May 5, 2012
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        I scrub cured epoxy with a Scotch Brite type abrasive pad and water with a bit of detergent added. Rinse.

        Joe T

        --- In Michalak@yahoogroups.com, "Dean Herring" <dfharing@...> wrote:
        >
        > You have got to give that epoxy a good week or two to cure correctly > then you must make absolutely sure there is no blush....

        > Dean
      • Chris
        I had the same issue when I used house paint on my AF3. It never got very hard. That is just the way house paint is. I ended up just accepting it and used
        Message 3 of 10 , May 12, 2012
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          I had the same issue when I used house paint on my AF3. It never got very hard. That is just the way house paint is. I ended up just accepting it and used the boat with soft paint. It held up quite well.

          Since I have switched to Acrylic porch enamel. It cures much harder. I have been very satisfied with the results.

          It sounds like your surface prep and priming were done very well. I doubt if you had any amine blush left after such a through process.

          One point: Amine blush can prevent oil based paints from curing however water based paints are not effected in the same way. It will not effect the curing of water based paints although the paint may not adhere well and may peel off.

          Chris

          --- In Michalak@yahoogroups.com, "John" <goodman_clan@...> wrote:
          >
          > Well, I have a paint problem too.
          >
          > Sealed my Aquatek plywood with 1 coat of Marine Epoxy.
          > Waited 2 days. 80 grit sanded, washed with water, waited 1 day.
          > Primed with Glidden Latex Gripper. Waited 3 days to harder.
          > Painted with Glidden Exterior Latex House paint. Used a roller to get thin coat on. Added 2nd coat 4 hours later.
          >
          > Have cooked the boat in the sun for 5 days and paint can be scraped up with your finger nail.
          >
          > I have resigned myself to scrapping all the yellow off and starting over but, can I use any of the product I have and get better results?
          >
          > JDG
          >
        • Allan
          Painted my Ladybug with Wattyl Solagard here in Australia a year & a half ago & it is standing up great.My mission was to build the best boat for the least
          Message 4 of 10 , May 13, 2012
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            Painted my Ladybug with Wattyl Solagard here in Australia a year & a half ago & it is standing up great.My mission was to build the best boat for the least money & time without sacrificing structural integrity or finish.I feel I achieved both as no one can tell what sort of paint I used,unless they ask me,& the structure is way strong as I had a lot of 450gm double bias f/g tape on hand which was way stronger than Jim's plans call for,so she is built like the proverbial outhouse!

            The marine ply I used was meranti from Indonesia & was not bad quality except for the outer veneer which was very thin & grainy so I was reluctant to sand it before the first coat.Instead,I brushed on three coats....yep,no epoxy sealer!...( & no primer needed with modern acrylics) sanded lightly,then two more coats,sanded again then one final coat for six in total.....all no sooner than the specified minimum of two hours apart & spread over three days to allow adequate drying between coats.The manufacturer specifies at least 7days for drying,which for a house or fence etc is fine,but a boat that is going to take knocks & bumps I always allow at LEAST 6 weeks after which the paint is much harder & keeps on getting harder with age.

            While not as hard as single pack poly marine enamel like International (Interlux ) Brightsides,which I have used a lot & find it one of the easiest to apply using the roll/tip method for a fantastic finish,acrylics like Wattyl Solagard wear nearly as well .Areas such as the skeg & Chinese that get dragged over gravel beaches will abrade away regardless of the sort of paint you use & still need touching up periodically.

            If I were going to show a boat or was concerned with resale value,I would probably use a marine enamel,which is not much dearer than top quality acrylic house paint anyway,but in my experience in selling boats that I have made,I have yet to get back much more than half of what it cost to build,so I am happy to stay with acrylic house paint.

            My boats are all dry stored on a trailer & are mostly stitch & glue so the chances of dry rot getting hold anywhere in the main hull structure are remote.

            Oh & by the way I use low sheen ....about 30-40% gloss which is shiny enough to keep clean easily,but hides small imperfections in the finish & looks classier on most boats than a high gloss I feel.

            Finally,I can assure you this paint is not soft.

            Al Burke.

            --- In Michalak@yahoogroups.com, "Chris" <chrisbfeller@...> wrote:
            >
            > I had the same issue when I used house paint on my AF3. It never got very hard. That is just the way house paint is. I ended up just accepting it and used the boat with soft paint. It held up quite well.
            >
            > Since I have switched to Acrylic porch enamel. It cures much harder. I have been very satisfied with the results.
            >
            > It sounds like your surface prep and priming were done very well. I doubt if you had any amine blush left after such a through process.
            >
            > One point: Amine blush can prevent oil based paints from curing however water based paints are not effected in the same way. It will not effect the curing of water based paints although the paint may not adhere well and may peel off.
            >
            > Chris
            >
            > --- In Michalak@yahoogroups.com, "John" <goodman_clan@> wrote:
            > >
            > > Well, I have a paint problem too.
            > >
            > > Sealed my Aquatek plywood with 1 coat of Marine Epoxy.
            > > Waited 2 days. 80 grit sanded, washed with water, waited 1 day.
            > > Primed with Glidden Latex Gripper. Waited 3 days to harder.
            > > Painted with Glidden Exterior Latex House paint. Used a roller to get thin coat on. Added 2nd coat 4 hours later.
            > >
            > > Have cooked the boat in the sun for 5 days and paint can be scraped up with your finger nail.
            > >
            > > I have resigned myself to scrapping all the yellow off and starting over but, can I use any of the product I have and get better results?
            > >
            > > JDG
            > >
            >
          • Allan
            ....that should read skeg & chines of course but this sneaky Apple iPad keeps wanting to take control & insert what it feels is the correct spelling when it
            Message 5 of 10 , May 13, 2012
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              ....that should read "skeg & chines" of course but this sneaky Apple iPad keeps wanting to take control & insert what it feels is the correct spelling when it knows I' m not looking...I'm still coming to grips with all this new technology.

              Al

              --- In Michalak@yahoogroups.com, "Allan" <allanburke45@...> wrote:
              >
              >
              >
              > Painted my Ladybug with Wattyl Solagard here in Australia a year & a half ago & it is standing up great.My mission was to build the best boat for the least money & time without sacrificing structural integrity or finish.I feel I achieved both as no one can tell what sort of paint I used,unless they ask me,& the structure is way strong as I had a lot of 450gm double bias f/g tape on hand which was way stronger than Jim's plans call for,so she is built like the proverbial outhouse!
              >
              > The marine ply I used was meranti from Indonesia & was not bad quality except for the outer veneer which was very thin & grainy so I was reluctant to sand it before the first coat.Instead,I brushed on three coats....yep,no epoxy sealer!...( & no primer needed with modern acrylics) sanded lightly,then two more coats,sanded again then one final coat for six in total.....all no sooner than the specified minimum of two hours apart & spread over three days to allow adequate drying between coats.The manufacturer specifies at least 7days for drying,which for a house or fence etc is fine,but a boat that is going to take knocks & bumps I always allow at LEAST 6 weeks after which the paint is much harder & keeps on getting harder with age.
              >
              > While not as hard as single pack poly marine enamel like International (Interlux ) Brightsides,which I have used a lot & find it one of the easiest to apply using the roll/tip method for a fantastic finish,acrylics like Wattyl Solagard wear nearly as well .Areas such as the skeg & Chinese that get dragged over gravel beaches will abrade away regardless of the sort of paint you use & still need touching up periodically.
              >
              > If I were going to show a boat or was concerned with resale value,I would probably use a marine enamel,which is not much dearer than top quality acrylic house paint anyway,but in my experience in selling boats that I have made,I have yet to get back much more than half of what it cost to build,so I am happy to stay with acrylic house paint.
              >
              > My boats are all dry stored on a trailer & are mostly stitch & glue so the chances of dry rot getting hold anywhere in the main hull structure are remote.
              >
              > Oh & by the way I use low sheen ....about 30-40% gloss which is shiny enough to keep clean easily,but hides small imperfections in the finish & looks classier on most boats than a high gloss I feel.
              >
              > Finally,I can assure you this paint is not soft.
              >
              > Al Burke.
              >
              > --- In Michalak@yahoogroups.com, "Chris" <chrisbfeller@> wrote:
              > >
              > > I had the same issue when I used house paint on my AF3. It never got very hard. That is just the way house paint is. I ended up just accepting it and used the boat with soft paint. It held up quite well.
              > >
              > > Since I have switched to Acrylic porch enamel. It cures much harder. I have been very satisfied with the results.
              > >
              > > It sounds like your surface prep and priming were done very well. I doubt if you had any amine blush left after such a through process.
              > >
              > > One point: Amine blush can prevent oil based paints from curing however water based paints are not effected in the same way. It will not effect the curing of water based paints although the paint may not adhere well and may peel off.
              > >
              > > Chris
              > >
              > > --- In Michalak@yahoogroups.com, "John" <goodman_clan@> wrote:
              > > >
              > > > Well, I have a paint problem too.
              > > >
              > > > Sealed my Aquatek plywood with 1 coat of Marine Epoxy.
              > > > Waited 2 days. 80 grit sanded, washed with water, waited 1 day.
              > > > Primed with Glidden Latex Gripper. Waited 3 days to harder.
              > > > Painted with Glidden Exterior Latex House paint. Used a roller to get thin coat on. Added 2nd coat 4 hours later.
              > > >
              > > > Have cooked the boat in the sun for 5 days and paint can be scraped up with your finger nail.
              > > >
              > > > I have resigned myself to scrapping all the yellow off and starting over but, can I use any of the product I have and get better results?
              > > >
              > > > JDG
              > > >
              > >
              >
            • John
              Scraped all the yellow paint of the decks and the lilac off the floor. Sanded with 80grit, acetone wiped, waited overnight then cleaned with denatured
              Message 6 of 10 , May 16, 2012
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                Scraped all the yellow paint of the decks and the lilac off the floor. Sanded with 80grit, acetone wiped, waited overnight then cleaned with denatured alcohol, cooked boat in the sun for a day. Used Behr oil based primer and Behr latex porch paint for the yellow. It came out nice and is pretty hard after 3 days. Used oil based primer on the floors and the Glidden lilac and it is much better and can be walked on after 3 days of drying.

                Now it's time to go sailing.


                --- In Michalak@yahoogroups.com, "John" <goodman_clan@...> wrote:
                >
                > Well, I have a paint problem too.
                >
                > Sealed my Aquatek plywood with 1 coat of Marine Epoxy.
                > Waited 2 days. 80 grit sanded, washed with water, waited 1 day.
                > Primed with Glidden Latex Gripper. Waited 3 days to harder.
                > Painted with Glidden Exterior Latex House paint. Used a roller to get thin coat on. Added 2nd coat 4 hours later.
                >
                > Have cooked the boat in the sun for 5 days and paint can be scraped up with your finger nail.
                >
                > I have resigned myself to scrapping all the yellow off and starting over but, can I use any of the product I have and get better results?
                >
                > JDG
                >
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