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Re: [Michalak] Re: Hapscut

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  • john colley
    The pva s sold here are your typical white woodworking glue.the one that disolves in water,,,lol (weldbond is one)Sikaflex11FC is a polyurethane high strength
    Message 1 of 92 , Dec 3, 2011
      The pva's sold here are your typical white woodworking glue.the one that disolves in water,,,lol (weldbond is one)Sikaflex11FC is a polyurethane high strength adhesive sealant.(boil proof) but it stays flexable.The black sikaflex is used in the auto industry to stick parts of your car together.

      "There is magic in the feel of a paddle and the movement of a canoe, a magic compounded of distance, adventure, solitude, and peace."
      -Sigurd Olson

      From: John Boy <t1ro2003@...>
      To: "Michalak@yahoogroups.com" <Michalak@yahoogroups.com>
      Sent: Saturday, 3 December 2011 11:52 PM
      Subject: Re: [Michalak] Re: Hapscut

      Tite Bond is a brand of woodworking glues here in the States.  TB I, II, and III are PVA woodworking glues.  TB III is claimed by the manufacturer to be waterproof.  When dried, they're approved by the FDA for indirect food contact, ie cutting boards, etc.

      They also make just about every other type of construction adhesive known to man.  :-)
      John Boy

      You can trust me, I have a degree in science...

      From: john colley <Helliconia54@...>
      To: "Michalak@yahoogroups.com" <Michalak@yahoogroups.com>
      Sent: Saturday, December 3, 2011 3:33 AM
      Subject: Re: [Michalak] Re: Hapscut

      Down under here in Australia I can't find this tite bond you guys always talk about.I've used Sikaflex with some success.What exactly is titebond?

      "There is magic in the feel of a paddle and the movement of a canoe, a magic compounded of distance, adventure, solitude, and peace."
      -Sigurd Olson

      From: prairiedog2332 <nelsarv@...>
      To: Michalak@yahoogroups.com
      Sent: Saturday, 3 December 2011 2:35 PM
      Subject: [Michalak] Re: Hapscut


      Various glues were tested a few years ago and the regular TB proved to
      have superior adhesion strength to both TB2 andTB3. Water resistance was
      not tested however.

      Although Dynamite Payson used polyester resin to glass his hulls and in
      stitch and glue using glass tape, he never recommended it for gluing
      joints. He used Weldwood plastic resin glue for joints and "never had a
      failure". But in his latest book he suggested epoxy as having better
      gap filling characteristics.


      The chines are the most important joints on any hard-chined hull. So I
      think I would prefer epoxy for that important area. Michalak feels the
      same. Perhaps regular TB might work if protected by good quality paint?
      Then polyester resin to glass the bottom or using taped joints. Be sure
      to use laminating resin and NOT the usually available finishing resin,
      which is only used for the last fill coat. His latest book explains how
      to do it.

      Resorcinol is very strong expecially for gluing woods with acid content,
      but the joint must be tight and it requires clamping.


      I'm planning to build a couple Bolger Tortoises from Payson's book.
      "Building The New Instant Boats" for my grand daughters and to test the
      concept of using only epoxy for the chines. Undecided to use some
      regular TB or maybe TB2 or PL Premium for the rest.

      Payson was not impressed with Gorilla glue due to it's short shelf life
      and cost. But does work fine otherwise.


      --- In Michalak@yahoogroups.com, Gene Berry <meangenerok@...> wrote:
      > Hi John,
      > Â i built a 16' Jim Michalak Shanty with almost all TB3 (no epoxy
      at all) and it is still doing well. chuck linweber did tell me though
      once TB3 fillets shrink where as epoxy doesn't so you wont save anything
      using TB3 if that is what your after. hope this helps
      > P.S. i use TB3 in all my boats to a great degree and so far so good.
      > Gene
      > ________________________________
      > From: John goodman_clan@...
      > To: Michalak@yahoogroups.com
      > Sent: Friday, December 2, 2011 2:45 PM
      > Subject: [Michalak] Re: Hapscut
      > Â
      > How much of a boat this size can be built with Titebond 3? I am trying
      to decide if I can really build a boat this large using just glue verses
      epoxy. Any thoughts?
      > --- In Michalak@yahoogroups.com, "John" goodman_clan@ wrote:
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > Wow, what a great conversation about the Haps Cut design. I will
      bore the group with some of my sailing background so the group has a
      better understanding of why my wife and I selected Haps Cut and the
      adjustments we will make in the boat to satisfy our boating needs.
      > >
      > > My kids and I built a Michael Storer, Goat Island Skiff 2 years ago
      which I have sailed in the Texas 200 twice, once with my 12 year old son
      and once with Michael Storer. Both were great crews. I have sailed
      almost the whole 500 plus miles of Texas coast barring a small 75 mile
      section in my Goat, rowed down the Texas Colorado River and had plenty
      of fun day sails with my wife and kids aboard GIR. Way before that I
      raced the Olympic class 20' Tornado catamaran in the USA Olympic Trials
      in 1976, 1980 and 1984. Didn't make the USA sailing team but had a great
      time trying. Even before that my brother and I built a 14' catamaran
      called a Paper Tiger. So I love fast boats and cannot remember ever not
      having a family boat. We have even owned a 28' cabin cruiser power boat.
      > >
      > > Now for Haps Cut and discuss some of the comments in the thread.
      > > My wife and I are real close to becoming empty nesters and Haps Cut
      is a great cruising boat for us to start playing with. What attracted us
      to it? First was Jim's story of the place, Hap's Cut. I nearly lost my
      son in the mud there, it was that deep and we never did find his sandal.
      Just joking, but it was really muddy.
      > >
      > > It fits in our garage. I will be able to build the boat in our
      garage with our Goat still sitting on its trailer and out of the
      weather. So for us, size matters. It will also fit on the Goat's trailer
      so I will not have to buy another trailer anytime soon.
      > >
      > > Side Flare: The side flare on Haps Cut is similar to that of our
      Goat. It's a shape I have sailed many miles with and enjoy how it sails.
      The flared sides are great backrests because I usually sit on the floor.
      The cockpit depth is also very close to that of the Goat and offers
      plenty of protection from splashing water and cold winter wind.
      > >
      > > After I finished the Haps Cut model we took it out to the garage and
      compared the proportions and dimensions to our Goat. Haps Cut is BIG
      compared to the Goat but has a similar hull shape for about half the
      > >
      > > Seats: My wife does not like sitting in water for days on end. The
      transverse seats will also become permanent storage/air tanks. We will
      be able to snooze on the cockpit seats or go below and stretch out. I
      will make an infill panel to make the whole cockpit flat for sleeping.
      These seats will also provide (2) rowing stations for a forward or rear
      facing rower.
      > >
      > > Part of the Texas 200 challenge is being able to self rescue. These
      permanent air tanks and possible side air tanks like those in a Puddle
      Duck will help us self rescue in case we swamp the boat. I have built
      the side air tanks into the model and will have updated pictures soon.
      > >
      > > Cabin Forward Design: In hot weather an aft cabin makes for a hot
      cabin. With the open slot and forward cabin the breeze will get into the
      cabin more easily, assuming the wind is passing over the bow. We have
      anchored stern first to get the breeze into the cockpit and then switch
      the anchor line to the bow so the breeze blows into the cabin at night
      with our other boats. Any type of cabin or awning will help with sun
      protection and my wife likes real shade plus, I don't want skin cancer.
      > >
      > > In the model I have raised the cabin top 3". Jim M and I will
      discuss this, but it's mainly to get a little more head room for me and
      make it more comfortable for using a porti potty inside. (Wife
      > >
      > > Transom Drag: In the model you can see there is a sugar scoop stern.
      This is mainly to make reboarding the boat easier over the stern. The
      flared sides of my Goat are easy to pull myself up and over however,
      some have found it hard to do. We are just planning to climb up the
      rudder and sugar scoop transom to get back into the boat.
      > >
      > > What about the motor? I have a Nissan 9.9hp engine in the garage.
      It's way too big and heavy for a boat this size. (It's for sale by the
      way, so I can buy a small 2-4hp outboard) I have witnessed plenty of
      boats dragging their transoms. Some with engines too big or heavy, crew
      too far aft or the kitchen sink and every other heavy object stored in
      the rear compartment because it's the easiest to access. If we get a
      small engine I will rethink the motor well option, but I still have to
      fit the boat in my garage, so 19' is max length. Otherwise we will just
      row the boat.
      > >
      > > Suffering on the Texas 200: Just a comment here about this suffering
      concept. We have never suffered on any of our family adventures, whether
      its 2 weeks in a canoe, 2 weeks backpacking or a month of car camping,
      proper planning and conditioning makes a great family adventure.
      > >
      > > For sailing in Texas during the summer, it's just hot during June,
      but it's even hotter in July. We don't launch the boat until after 4pm
      during the months of July, and August down here in Texas.
      > >
      > > I will still have plenty of questions about how to build a Jim M
      boat. I really enjoyed listening to him at the Duck Worlds and want to
      build Haps Cut to his "lumberyard" philosophy. I just got to keep myself
      out of my favorite lumber yard verses the big box store. Well, maybe
      > >
      > > --- In Michalak@yahoogroups.com, "prairiedog2332" <nelsarv@> wrote:
      > > >
      > > > Reading some of the recent comments lead me to review the Hapscut
      > > > write-up again. I have pretty much ignored it as I have no
      > > > doing the TX200 but enjoy reading about the suffering... err, I
      > > > the experiences, of those who do it.
      > > >
      > > > http://www.duckworksbbs.com/plans/jim/hapscut/index.htm
      > > >
      > > > Hapscut presents a few departures from Jim's usual designs. It has
      > > > flare than usual as he was impressed how well the 12' SF Pelican
      did in
      > > > 2o10 - and it sure has more flare - almost a dory or maybe sampan
      > > > shape unlike the sharpie shape of most of Jim's. These flaring
      > > > are comfortable to lean back against when in the cabin (or
      cockpit) but
      > > > it also points out the disadvantage of a dory hull in that they
      > > > narrow on the bottom, so only one person can lie down comfortably
      in it
      > > > to sleep.
      > > >
      > > > The second point of interest is how the cockpit seating is
      arranged with
      > > > the two people facing each other and the forward person in a good
      > > > location for rowing while the crew steers. Or they can take turns.
      > > > one can lie down while the other rows or sails.
      > > >
      > > > The third item is the overhead sun shade over the cockpit. If
      > > > on curved support poles this would really bring home the sampan
      > > >
      > > > It is also kind of interesting that Jim forgot all about a
      motorwell. So
      > > > you have to add that yourself if purchasing the prototype plans.
      > > >
      > > > There are maybe 50 small stocked lakes not too far away in my area
      > > > do not allow motors, so maybe a couple of deep-cyle batteries
      > > > under the forward seat flat and a simple mount for a trolling
      motor. Set
      > > > of oars. Maybe a yuloh or how about a pedal drive? Plus the small
      > > > cat-yawl rig as drawn and good to go. And may be considered
      "green" to
      > > > boot!
      > > >
      > > > This is quite a long boat for a fishing skiff, but it also works
      > > > essentially an open day sailor for a family of four, with nice
      > > > sheltering from sun, rain and even bugs if roll-up net side
      > > > added. It has several advantages over what Jim refers to as using
      > > > "land tent". Nice walk-through cabin and able to run right up
      > > >
      > > > Any impressions or thoughts by other members?
      > > >
      > > > Nels
      > > >
      > > > PS of course considering a junk rig as well:-)
      > > >
      > >
      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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    • Patrick
      I am building the Farcat2 right now and am very happy with the volume of all the interior, I can lay down easily in the 6 ft. long cabind and even lay with my
      Message 92 of 92 , Dec 19, 2011
        I am building the Farcat2 right now and am very happy with the volume of all the interior, I can lay down easily in the 6 ft. long cabind and even lay with my knees pulled up in the cockpit and watch the birds fly by. I'll post some more pics when I get home from work tonight,, but study the Fatcat2 plan.

        --- In Michalak@yahoogroups.com, "chrispychrispy2000" <chrispychrispy2000@...> wrote:
        > Maybe then to you the Fatcat would be perfect. It is wider. The mast is positioned as in a catboat way forward in the bow. I believe the cabin is longer and the cockpit shorter on the Fatcat. Not sure if the cabin quite long enough though.
        > --- In Michalak@yahoogroups.com, John Boy <t1ro2003@> wrote:
        > >
        > > As the owner of a Toon2, I can tell you the cabin is too short by 6".   If it could be done again, I'd move the cabin bulkhead aft 6" and add 6" to the beam.  Then it would be a simple thing to add a vee berth to the cabin and the boat would be perfect.
        > > John Boy
        > >  
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > > You can trust me, I have a degree in science...
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > > ________________________________
        > > From: prairiedog2332 <nelsarv@>
        > > To: Michalak@yahoogroups.com
        > > Sent: Friday, December 16, 2011 7:04 PM
        > > Subject: [Michalak] Re: Hapscut
        > >
        > > ...
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